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The Only Way to Stop the Empire

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Dear friends,

The final days of US empire are fast approaching. Perhaps its end will pass slowly and gradually, or perhaps the event will unfold rapidly and catastrophically. Maybe chaos will break loose, or maybe its demise will be organized well and proceed smoothly. This nobody knows, but the end of empire is coming as surely as day follows night and sun follows rain. Overexpansion, overreach and over-indebtedness will take their toll—as all past empires have discovered. Empires are like bacteria in a Petrie dish; unthinking, unseeing, unfeeling, they expand until they run out of food or contaminate their environment with their waste, and then they die. They are automatons, and they just can’t help it: they are programmed to expand or die, expand or die, and, in the end, expand and die.

What does the empire feed on? It feeds on money and fear; your money and your fear, both obtained with your cooperation. It is bigger now than when it faced an actual adversary in the Soviet Union. Russia is no adversary; all it wants is to be a normal country, at peace with the world. But the empire won’t let it, will it? It must create enemies. Who are our enemies? According to the authors of endless war they are North Korea, Iran, Syria, and Islamic terrorists. Are any of them actually capable of threatening the US? Well, yes, but they are all quite easy to deter. But the plan of the authors of endless war is not to deter them; it is to back them into a corner with political instability and sanctions, while whipping up the population on both sides into fear-filled frenzy.

We all know that the US military-industrial complex has become a self-perpetuating and uncontrollable organism, just like Dwight D. Eisenhower warned us in 1961. Everyone knows the phrase and Eisenhower’s warning—it is part of our collective memory. At a trillion dollars a year and growing, with over 1000 bases ringing the planet, it has expanded far beyond what Eisenhower could have imagined in his worst nightmare. We can’t say we didn’t know: he warned us. After the National-Socialist episode in Germany, many good Germans voiced regrets at not speaking up, claiming that they didn’t know what was being done in their name. But we do not have that excuse: we all knew all along.

Nor was it the first time we were warned. General Smedley Butler told us before, in 1933, and his words are still with us, posted online. Why is it that everyone, generals included, suddenly gain wisdom immediately upon reaching retirement? Butler offered an explanation: his “mind was in suspended animation while serving as a soldier and following orders.” In 1933 Butler told us that he “was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism.” He said:

“I helped make Mexico, especially Tampico, safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefits of Wall Street. The record of racketeering is long. I helped purify Nicaragua for the international banking house of Brown Brothers in 1909-1912…I brought light to the Dominican Republic for American sugar interests in 1916. In China I helped to see to it that Standard Oil went its way unmolested.”

This empire is nothing new, and we knew what it is and what it does all along. We can’t say we didn’t know. We have watched throughout our lives as the US put down every popular uprising against local autocrats and oligarchs, placed countries under US control, then helped organize and train the death squads that killed off the opposition. Think of Indonesia, Argentina, or Honduras. We watched as the empire crushed every democratic government that threatened US business interests under the false pretext of “anti-communism,” starting with Iran in 1953, Guatemala in 1954, and proceeding to Congo, Haiti (numerous times), and most notably and infamously Chile in 1973 (assassinating president Salvador Allende on September 11, 1973), Nicaragua in the 1980’s, and many, many others. (For details see William Blum’s Killing Hope.) And of course, many of us lived through the epic lies and genocide of millions in Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia during the so-called “Vietnam War.” We knew, we watched, and we paid taxes that paid for the bullets and the bombs.

More recently we’ve seen the barefaced lies of empire laid out for all to see in Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, Somalia, Georgia, Pakistan, Yemen, Ukraine… they never end! But the trouble we stir up in other places never seems to come home and ring our doorbell, does it? Maybe that’s why it keeps on going. We think that we can just ignore it and go on with our lives—that it won’t affect us. Or does it?

Let’s leave aside the destruction of democracy that always accompanies a militarized, fascist police state that the US has gradually turned into. And let’s ignore the violence that pervades US society, or the vast gulag of incarceration that disposes of our useless eaters. Consider that the only military attack on US soil that actually scored a palpable hit since Pearl Harbor was 9/11. Pearl Harbor was on the periphery, way out in the Pacific, “A Day that will live in Infamy,” the more so since FDR knew it was coming and did all he could to provoke it by cutting Japan off from oil supplies, directly provoking it into launching the attack. But Hawaii is the periphery while 9/11 struck at the heart of the empire, the financial center in New York that drives the imperial wealth pump, and the Pentagon, which is charged with the mission of US world domination.

Whether you believe that 19 Arabs armed with box cutters who couldn’t fly propeller planes took down 3 World Trade buildings that plummeted straight down at the speed of freefall in what looked like controlled demolition (yes there were 3, look up “Building 7”), and destroyed a section of the Pentagon, or whether you believe it was an inside job, doesn’t matter. The point is, in that act of destruction, the wars of the empire finally came home.

What was the result? Did these events cause us to reconsider what we are doing? Of course not! Instead, we went all-in for war. Remember, the empire is an automaton, a self-perpetuating organism, living on money and fear. What better way to whip up fear than to stage, or to allow, or to simply fail to prevent, an attack on the “homeland”—which is, by the way, a Nazi propaganda term. The purpose of war is simply to cause more war, since it is so profitable for the badly misnamed “defense industry.” Butler told us in 1933 that “war is a racket,” and documented massive war profiteering during WWI. Do you know how much money Lockheed, Northrop-Grumman, Boeing, General Dynamics, Raytheon et al. are making from the “War on Terror”? The sums are astronomical.

As you read these words, the empire is busy doing its work in Ukraine. Here is how that works. First, it overthrows the elected government in a US-backed coup. Next, it directs its local puppet regime to unleash a military attack and organize death squads to deal with the population in the east that won’t go along with the US-backed coup, in this case using actual Nazi-branded death squads, complete with Nazi SS Insignias. (Anyone can verify these facts with the most cursory internet search.) And for the final, consummate imperialist touch, it votes in the UN (together with Canada) against a resolution condemning the Ukrainian Nazis and other racist murderers, while the Europeans shamefacedly abstain. This sort plan used to work really well, and so the empire keeps repeating it over and over again, even though the results are worse every time.

Vast numbers of Americans support the empire’s wars of conquest because they help maintain their lavish lifestyles. They bother some of us more than others. Many of us are adamantly against them, but only a few find it emotionally unbearable to countenance the destruction of millions of lives in our names and with our money. What makes them different? Who knows, you would have to ask a psychologist.

The question for those who oppose endless war is, What have we done about it? A mass movement in the 1960’s that added up to an uprising by a vast segment of society perhaps had something to do with ending the conflict in Vietnam. In spite of these protests, the empire was able to extend the war by an extra five years all the way to 1973, when it agreed to end it on the same terms that had been offered in 1968 to Nobel “peace laureate” Henry Kissinger. There has been no significant anti-war protest since then, and certainly none that succeeded in preventing or ending war. Why?

First, the draft was ended. This put an end to the involvement of average US families in the wars of empire, and therefore ending the requirement for consent of the governed. The strategists realized that the draft was a disaster for the empire. The new, much better and cheaper way to procure cannon fodder for the endless war is to enlist the children of the underclass, by using economic oppression in order to deprive them of any other means of advancement except military service.

Second, the military has been outsourced and privatized, requiring even less involvement by US families in the military, and less need for their consent. “You’re all volunteers, so shut up” is the attitude.

Third, the vastly increased scope of domestic spying by the NSA and other government agencies has helped keep everyone under control and stifle dissent.

Fourth is the tight government/corporate control of the US media, which has become consummately successful in brainwashing and propagandizing the population.

Finally, there is the war on whistleblowers and journalists who expose the truth, from Tom Drake to William Binney, Sibel Simons, Jesselyn Radack, Bradley Manning and Julian Assange. If necessary, the police, who are vastly more militarized than in the past, together with national guard troops, can squash any dissent like a bug. All these measures ensure that efforts at reform pursued through legal, nonviolent means such as voting, protest, civil disobedience, civil resistance, etc. will have absolutely no effect. The only action that can possibly stop the empire in its tracks is cutting off its food supply—the tax money on which it lives. We have to starve the beast through divestment, capital expatriation, tax resistance, tax refusal and tax revolt. Former Secretary of State Alexander Haig told us this flat out in the 1980’s when, being confronted with huge protests over US Central American policy, he said: “Let them protest all they want as long as they pay their taxes.” Truer words were never uttered by a US official. Is there any evidence to contradict his statement? Has any other measure had any impact on the war machine? The honest answer is no. Millions of people around the world protested before the 2003 invasion of Iraq. These protests were ignored. No amount of protest or other efforts can stop it, because it doesn’t cut off the empire’s food supply of money and fear. Only by cutting off its funds by not paying taxes can we stop the empire.

Many have said that the US doesn’t need tax money as it survives on endless debt. Yes, the empire lives on debt, but the ability to sell debt is based on the bond rating of US treasury bonds. Most recently in June, 2014 S&P gave the US a AA+ rating with “stable outlook.”

If there is any doubt about the US credit rating, the ability to sell debt to continue financing the empire comes into question. The ability to collect taxes is what maintains the US bond rating. Any reduction of the US bond rating, and interest rates have to go up in order to continue attracting more investment. Then the interest on the debt balloons out of control and becomes unrepayable—never mind the principal, which they have no intention of ever paying back. By the way, the Tea Party’s efforts to shut down government by refusing to raise the debt ceiling was helping this effort for a time, although for different reasons. They thought that the welfare system is bankrupting the country. This is a laughable claim, because welfare spending looks negligible when compared to military spending. Still, they did manage to lower the bond rating for a time. Shutting down the federal government is a step in the right direction, and since in recent years only the Tea Party has managed to do it, lets give them some credit

If the US became unable to reliably collect taxes, then its ability to finance the empire with debt would be diminished, and the US would have to turn to increasing taxes—another politically unpalatable choice, especially in the age of the Tea Party, when the empire’s main constituency is dead-set against more taxes. So it is absolutely clear that the only thing that could stop the empire is a tax revolt. It wouldn’t even have to be that big; the slightest question about the ability of the federal government to collect taxes could reduce the bond rating. Even a minor reduction could raise interest rates enough to make the US debt unrepayable.

Let’s get down to brass tacks: How do you avoid paying taxes, when the IRS withholds our salaries, and the tables are rigged to withhold about 15% more than necessary on average, so 80% of people get a refund? Did you think that this is a coincidence? No, this is a one-year interest-free loan to the empire from taxpayers. But it’s actually quite simple not to pay taxes. Get a W-4 form, write EXEMPT in the space provided, and turn it in to your friendly HR office. Your employer is not allowed to change it unless directed by the IRS. Normally they have no reason to question it.

Here’s what happened last time it was tried on a big scale. In 2007, Code Pink joined the War Resisters League to organize a national project for war tax refusal, to “Stop Bush’s Wars.” This was not a true tax revolt, just more or less a referendum on how many people would potentially support withholding a portion of their taxes owed, even a token amount. The online petition asked people if they would be willing to commit to withhold some of their taxes, even $1, if 100,000 other people would agree to do the same. Out of the US population of 316 million, how many people do you think signed it? About 2,000. So you see, there is not much evidence that people will do the only thing that could stop the empire: a true Tea Party tax revolt.

What this implies is that the empire will continue to churn along, and debt will continue to build up, because any other approach to paying for it is not feasible, and therefore collapse is inevitable. The aftermath of collapse is unpredictable; maybe there will be a soft landing, maybe not. But unless you are willing to engage in some form of tax revolt, collapse is inevitable. You will get to live with the results: stage a tax revolt now, or face collapse later.

Are you sure you want to take your chances on collapse? The results of a personal tax revolt are predictable: retribution with penalties and interest from the IRS; living in fear of having your salary, your property, even your house seized, or worse, your door broken down by federal agents (although these extreme measures don’t happen too often, they happen often enough to instill fear). Perhaps there would be loss of income, or even your job. Losing one’s job often leads to depression, divorce, drug or alcohol abuse, etc. So you may prefer collapse after all: loss of your savings, no heat, electricity or trash removal, shops looted or closed, armed gangs roaming the streets… Your choice!

On the other hand, collapse might go well! Hope springs eternal in the optimistic American heart. We are (or used to be) the “can-do” people. Maybe we can-do collapse better than anyone else? Doubtful though if you read Dmitry Orlov’s Collapse Gap presentation.

The results of collapse later are likely to be worse then the effects of tax revolt now. Especially, since the IRS takes years to catch up to exempt W-4 forms, and it would be even harder to crack down if it were being was done en masse. But it’s perfectly understandable if you opt to do nothing now and suffer no consequences, while engaging in ineffective protest to assuage your conscience. You probably have a family to support, an expensive hobby, or some other excuse. So you decide to take your chances with collapse later. After all, collapse might turn out OK for you! This psychology is quite understandable. I truly hope that collapse will be as painless as you wish it will be, but somehow I doubt it. Good luck though! Whatever happens, you will have to live with your decision for the rest of your life—be it long or short.

Signed, expat and long-time conscientious tax refuser, Gary Flomenhoft.

ClubOrlov by Dmitry Orlov 

33 Comments on "The Only Way to Stop the Empire"

  1. Jerry McManus on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 11:00 am 

    Wouldn’t it be easier to just drink beer, eat pizza, and watch it all on TV?

    Oh, wait… We’re already doing that.

  2. Plantagenet on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 11:19 am 

    Orlov is a trooofer?

    Jeez—he’s even more wacked out than I thought.

  3. Chad on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 12:08 pm 

    This can be done perfectly legally.

    Itemize your deductions, give generously to charity, have a family, don’t make over 100K, get HR to adjust your deductions so they don’t take any income taxes out, and you will very likely not owe any federal income tax.

    I do this with a family of four with a household income of 60K and even get a sizeable tax refund despite owing no federal income tax.

  4. Lawfish on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 12:28 pm 

    I’ll take my chances with collapse. Doing what the author suggests is purely Quixotic. And the pain would be immediate.

  5. GregT on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 12:38 pm 


    This article was not written by Orlov. As usual, reading comprehension is not one of your stronger points.

    There is nothing in this article that isn’t true.

    The truth hurts, and denial won’t make it go away.

  6. Northwest Resident on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 12:51 pm 

    Yes, war is ugly and America excels at war. But when has there ever NOT been war?

    I studied a lot of history in college and have read a lot of history since then. It seems to me that any civilization that ever existed depended on war to grow their wealth and empire.

    Ever since primordial bacteria in the ocean depths mutated to eat their fellow bacteria instead of waiting for little bits of minerals to float their way, life on planet earth has been a fight-to-the-death competition.

    Humans have just taken it to a whole creative new level, and the really big “winners” on planet earth are those nations that have excelled at war.

    We can be moralists. And we can be peaceniks. And we can all get together and really condemn not just America but so many other countries of atrocities and slaughters against other humans, but in the end, it is humans being humans.

    We aspire to become something better and maybe someday we’ll evolve to a point where all humans renounce violence and stick to it. But until then, the world is what it has always been — a dog eat dog fight to the death for survival. I’m pretty sure that’s how top military commanders see it too.

    The whole world is just one big shifting RISK board game, with temporary alliances formed to accomplish strategic goals against real or imagined enemies. Then world events turn everything upside down and all the players must go scrambling to forge new alliances with common interests.

    But always, the war and the violence and the killing continues. It’s just the way it goes. This is God’s creation.

  7. GregT on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 1:05 pm 


    If I was your neighbour, I wouldn’t steal from your vegetable garden, and I wouldn’t threaten your right to have as much of the pie as I have. Even though it is in our nature, greed is not necessary for our survival. In the end it will probably be what causes our own extinction as a species.

    Curiosity killed the cat, greed killed the humans…….

  8. Northwest Resident on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 1:14 pm 

    GregT — True, where reasonable and altruistic people are concerned, there is always a better path than war and violence. Problem is, there aren’t a lot of reasonable and altruistic people in the world. And certainly, the people who are driven by greed and other motivations to attain wealth and power would not fit in with what you and I consider “reasonable and altruistic” people. The defect in humans is that we give birth to so many power and wealth seekers. Probably, early in our evolution, those personality types played a role in survival, and maybe they still do. The human race is exceptionally young when compared to other life forms, and that is just on planet earth. Who knows what we’ll eventually evolve into if we survive our inherent greed and lust for power. And yeah, that is a big “if”.

  9. penury on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 1:22 pm 

    The Empire will die. I have no idea when, and I have have no idea what will replace it. My personal opinion is that economics will be the fatal bullet. Yes, the business of the Empire is war. Without a constant demand for military equipment and supplies by both sides in the fracas the industrial base would be non-existant. And while it is true that the Empire owes most of the debt to themselves, even a slave requires some form of payment. Debt must be paid or reneged upon and even empires require that trading partners retain some faith in the value of the currency.

  10. dave thompson on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 1:29 pm 

    Make as little money as it is possible to get by. Some do this already by default, however, the life of living with less by choice gets you ready for the inevitable.

  11. Dredd on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 1:33 pm 

    Empires are like bacteria in a Petrie dish; unthinking, unseeing, unfeeling …”

    The author did not have to include scientific ignorance in this post:

    Something scientists have come to understand is that slime molds are much smarter than they look. One species in particular … yellow Physarum polycephalum, can solve mazes, mimic the layout of man-made transportation networks and choose the healthiest food from a diverse menu—and all this without a brain or nervous system. “Slime molds are redefining what you need to have to qualify as intelligent,” Reid says.
    (On The Peak of Intelligence – 2).

    Human intelligence is said to be the real problem on this planet (What Kind of Intelligence Is A Lethal Mutation?).

  12. Dredd on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 1:42 pm 

    Northwest Resident on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 12:51 pm

    “Yes, war is ugly and America excels at war. But when has there ever NOT been war?

    I studied a lot of history in college and have read a lot of history since then. It seems to me that any civilization that ever existed depended on war to grow their wealth and empire.”
    That is one view.

    The other is that war is the primary tool used by society to commit suicide:

    In other words, a society does not ever die ‘from natural causes’, but always dies from suicide or murder — and nearly always from the former, as this chapter has shown.

    (A Decline Of The American Republic – 4, quoting Arnold J. Toynbee).

    What existing empire would you point me to that still exists and is ancient (Assyrian, Babylonian, Persian, Greco-Macadonian, Roman, British)?

    The American Empire is also committing suicide, and it may take out civilization itself because of the idea that “any civilization that ever existed depended on war to grow their wealth and empire.”

    So, the answer to your question “any civilization that ever existed depended on war” is that they are all dead.

    And America will be too if it continues as they did.

    Exceptionalism in that context is not only myth, it is a dead wrong myth.

  13. Northwest Resident on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 1:48 pm 

    Dredd — So true. I also had that same thought as I was writing my post that you quoted — that every “great” civilization that has ever existed on planet earth ended up collapsing. It isn’t likely that America is or will be any different, in the long scheme of things.

    If anyone ever read “The Mote In God’s Eye” by Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle, then you know the inherent flaw — the suicidal genetic makeup — of the human race.

  14. mike on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 2:23 pm 

    Drivel. Drivel item. Drivel comments. Drivel.

  15. paulo1 on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 2:32 pm 

    This site loses a lot of credibility with shit articles like this. I usually just go elsewhere or turn off the computer when ‘Club Orlov’ arrives, but I mistakenly read most of this over lunch.

    A few more times and many won’t be back, including me.


  16. GregT on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 2:37 pm 


    Somewhat off topic I guess; My wife and myself spent 3 1/2 hours waiting for a connecting flight in Portland yesterday. There was a recording that played over the PA system about every 15 minutes or so. Something to the effect of ‘active military personnel get priority boarding privileges, we thank you for your service’. Another recording reminded everyone to be vigilant, and to report suspicious activities to security personnel.

    We both found this to be rather bizarre, as we in Canada have not been subjected to military indoctrination, and everyone by this point had already been subjected to everything short of cavity searches by minimum wage earning ‘security officials’. I couldn’t help but think of Orwell’s 1984, or Hitler’s Germany.

  17. Northwest Resident on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 2:49 pm 

    GregT — Sorry to hear you had a bad layover at PDX. That “be vigilant, report suspicious activities” announcement has been playing nonstop for as long as I can remember at PDX. Truly monotonous, for sure. I hadn’t heard the “active military personnel” announcement yet — that’s a new one that started some time in the last few months, which was the last time I flew in/out of PDX. I personally hate flying, if for no other reason than I just really dislike the “lock down” security, not to mention frequent late flights, delays and obnoxious fellow travelers. And it reminds me, vividly, that yes, there are bad guys looking to kill people — something I’d rather not be reminded of, for now.

    But hey, at least you had a great vacation in a tropical paradise! After the pain of the long flights, the memories of humiliating security procedures and the long layovers fade away, only the joyful memories of fun and relaxation in the sun will remain!!

    Welcome back!

  18. GregT on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 2:58 pm 


    Hawaii was wonderful. Other than some of the indigenous ‘Hawaiians’ the American people were, as usual, exceptional. Friendly, helpful, and courteous. What I have come to expect from most Americans that I have met everywhere. It wasn’t that we found PDX any different, just that we found the PA ‘announcements’ almost to be like a form of brainwashing. It was a very ‘surreal’ experience for us. Maybe it was just from lack of sleep.

  19. PrestonSturges on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 4:52 pm 

    >>This article was not written by Orlov. As usual, reading comprehension is not one of your stronger points.

    Well writing comprehension is not one of Orlov’s strong points.

  20. Norm on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 7:57 pm 

    Maybe the answer is to participate fully in the Empire, make tons of money, and have a 12,000 sq ft house with a bowling alley and a movie theater in the basement. Got your own helicopter… the 8 car garage with the Ferrari the Bentley the Tesla …

    Well, its as good a solution as these guys saying ‘dont earn much money and dont pay your taxes’. Isn’t that also a ridiculous viewpoint for solving anything?

  21. Makati1 on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 8:58 pm 

    WOW! This one hit some nerves! Some people don’t want truth, especially in such big doses. Some cannot accept that other people, especially those outside the Western countries, can have a better, or at least different, view of the world. Too bad.

    I can only ask: “Is it better to voluntarily step down the ladder or have it pulled out from under you?

  22. Makati1 on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 10:05 pm 

    “When you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing; when you see that money is flowing to those who deal, not in goods, but in favors; when you see that men get richer by graft and by pull than by work, and your laws don’t protect you against them, but protect them against you; when you see corruption being rewarded and honesty becoming a self-sacrifice; you may know that your society is doomed.” – Ayn Rand; Atlas Shrugged, 1957

  23. Davy on Mon, 24th Nov 2014 10:18 pm 

    Mak, you been out on ZH weren’t you. That is where you got that quote. Shame on you. You routinely call ZH western propaganda but use them when it serves your purpose.

  24. Richard Ralph Roehl on Tue, 25th Nov 2014 12:41 am 

    No population on Earth is more manipulated and ill informed… than faster poo-food consumer-citizens in capitalist-fascist Amerika, a violent plutocratic police-$tate, a collapsing empire that indulges in perpetual war profiteering… and bullies all the peoples of the world.

    Needless to say… no population on Earth is more hated and reviled than the Amerikans sheeple. Amerikans should anticipate radical and fundamental changes to their collective lifestyle… beginning with the denouement of the petro-dollar in 2015.


  25. Makati1 on Tue, 25th Nov 2014 2:03 am 

    RRR, you are sooooo right!

  26. baptised on Tue, 25th Nov 2014 2:58 am 

    GregT In the USA the ex-military get first chance at better paying manufacturing jobs. Problem is they can’t do the work. Most are strung out on free drugs.

  27. Davy on Tue, 25th Nov 2014 6:07 am 

    Ralf from dumbass, I call you dumbass because you will not indicate what part of the world you are from. If you did we could pick apart your dumbass country. At this point all countries are a part of the same sin. This is a global society that you dumbass propagandist can’t reach your small, brains around. You are on the same level as the board propaganda bitch Mak. The both of you are the reason this world may crash and burn. Your attitudes and inflammatory ideology may bring on our end as a species. If you think your dumbass country is significantly better than the US man up and broadcast it. At least the propaganda bitch Mak tries to glorify Asia. It is easy to show Mak is engaged in propaganda because the facts show what is going on in Asia. I despise your type Ralfie. You are a coward.

  28. MKohnen on Tue, 25th Nov 2014 6:48 pm 

    So many act as if a collapse of the American Empire would lead to a gold age of enlightenment and truth. A world without war! Except, if the US is gone, who’s going to replace them? Russia? China? …Canada (hahahahaha):)

    I would love to see a world where there is true democracy, no war, and a balance between nations, if we actually need to have nations. But, as of yet, this is pie-in-the-sky. I think the American Empire is doomed, but I harbor no excitement over it.

  29. James on Tue, 25th Nov 2014 10:23 pm 

    Buy farmland now. You should be able to weather a collapse because you will be growing your own food and fiber.

  30. Davy on Wed, 26th Nov 2014 5:52 am 

    James it is not that easy but yes buy land period that has potential to give you gainful employment producing food or something with a postindustrial application. This can be a hybrid operation. We know much will remain from BAU. The need for a back to the land movement is huge. The amount needed to move to the land is huge. The logistics of that are enormous. Most people don’t have a clue of what to do.

    I can tell you from my own experience with several years of effort at farming, gardening, and animal husbandry it is an ass kicker. My ass gets kicked on a regular basis. The work is tedious, time consuming, with uncomfortable weather exposure. Many people dwell in cubicles with maintained climate and light. Try working outside year round cubicles cave dwellers. This Ag effort is expensive to do in time effort and resources. There are so many things that effect your effort that are discouraging. Weather, pests, and animal predation are among a few. Then there is the market and return on your effort which is often unprofitable.

    You have to remain healthy. If I were to become disabled much of what I need to do is done for. I will remind you AG, forestry, equipment, animals, and buildings are among the highest on the list of dangerous activities. My body is routinely subjected to painful experiences. I work out to try to maintain strength to maintain my productivity. You have to be strong mentally and physically.

    With that said of the business of AG. You can start a small garden or a few animals. Do something anything to get this process started. Some of you will have the opportunity to grow the effort because circumstances will be right for growth. We are facing the largest migration of people in the history of man. The vast population centers that were constructed with cheap fossil energy will be abandoned to a large extent. Many of this mass of people will die but many will relocate to small farms and try to eke out a living. If we don’t make an effort to adjust and mitigate this process the wasted effort and reduced productivity will be great IOW we will see an effort that will be piece meal and destructive. We saw this in the 19 century when hordes of people settled the US west and raped and pillaged the land. We will see this same process with a land that is already raped and pillaged in many cases.

    We have to start the process now with direction and resources. Will that happen in time? NO. Yet, it is possible if we have a manageable descent we can get some of this process going enough to plant the seeds of success that will breed upon itself. Then we must pray AGW does not destroy these efforts which I am afraid is going to complicate the whole effort in just a few years. We know that vast stretches of highly productive coastal areas will be submerged. This mega shift in human habitation requirements of the end of BAU is not a pretty picture. Yet, it is the only picture that is possible.

  31. GregT on Wed, 26th Nov 2014 10:39 am 

    “Well writing comprehension is not one of Orlov’s strong points.”

    Orlov is a great writer. He has a great sense of humour, and his perspective is much broader than most. He has witnessed collapse first hand.

    Just because you don’t agree with him does not make his message less worthy. Shooting the messenger has never been a wise choice.

  32. Davy on Wed, 26th Nov 2014 10:50 am 

    Greg I agree but I find him drifting into neurosis which I think occurs in dedicated doomers in the lime light. If he was not such a propaganda bitch I would enjoy his writing. He reminds me of Mak and you know what I think of him. Orloss has valid points that are distorted by horrible bias.

  33. jmb on Wed, 26th Nov 2014 5:03 pm 

    NWR said, “But always, the war and the violence and the killing continues. It’s just the way it goes. This is God’s creation.”

    Joseph Campbell said, “Life feeds on life, get used to it.”

    It’s better to be the one doing the feeding, however… there is no guarantee that will always be the case.

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