Plantagenet wrote:The bottom line is that EVS AREN'T SUSTAINABLE.
Plantagenet wrote:People used to claim that EVs were sustainable, and the engines would last forever because they have so few moving parts.
Plantagenet wrote:Instead, EVs are actually going to the scrap heap at a FASTER rate than ICE cars.
Cheers!
Plantagenet wrote:Brand new Rivian pickup truck catches on fire while plugged in and charging at a public commercial charging station---the fire TOTALED the RIVIAN EV and took out part of the charging station too!!!
In electric vehicles, Li-ion batteries release toxic gases during fire primarily from combustion of the electrolyte. The electrolyte contains lithium hexafluorophosphate (LiPF6) and can also include other fluorine containing compounds...
A Colorado resident says their condo association banned charging or parking electric vehicles, or EVs, in their own parking garage, according to CleanTechnica.
"While both the state and county is looking seriously at the issue and understands that guidelines are needed for properties such as Decatur there are no such guidelines available yet," reads an email from the condo association obtained by CleanTechnica. "The Board of Managers has decided for the time being to prohibit any and all EVs from using the Decatur garage, either parked or charging."
The email doesn't say where owners are allowed to park their cars, although we're guessing there's some kind of street parking nearby. It also leaves the question of where EV drivers can charge their car to make it, you know, usable.
According to German publication InFranken, an underground parking garage located in Kulmbach, Germany has decided to outright ban battery-electric and hybrid vehicles. The decision was made following a five-month renovation following - you guessed it - a vehicle fire. "In the future, electric and hybrid cars will no longer be allowed to park in the underground car park," said Michael Kuhnlein from the civil engineering department.
Why EVs May Literally Be The Downfall Of Old Parking Garages
With the increase in the popularity of electric cars, governments need to ensure parking garages can withstand the extra weight of these vehicles... The Daily Mail underlines that the weight of electric vehicles is nearly two times greater than that of conventional cars. This means that the older parking facilities could be at risk of damage or even collapse.
April 20, 2023 The collapse of a parking garage in New York City on Tuesday that killed at least one person has put a new spotlight on aging structures and heavy electric vehicles.
The incident occurred after a recent study raised concerns that many older parking garages may need to be re-evaluated due to the increased weight of electric vehicles. If all the vehicles parked in a garage were electric, there is a decent chance the garage may collapse given how heavy electric vehicles are.
Chevrolet Bolt EV owners have have been banned from a San Francisco parking lot over concerns they might catch fire, even when not plugged in.
The ban follows the recent news that General Motors is recalling all Bolt EV and Bolt EUVs ever made, totalling more than 142,000 cars around the world, a move that will cost the automaker nearly $2 billion.
theluckycountry wrote: I could imagine the EV being banned from parking garages nation wide.
theluckycountry wrote:The ban follows the recent news that General Motors is recalling all Bolt EV and Bolt EUVs ever made, totalling more than 142,000 cars around the world, a move that will cost the automaker nearly $2 billion.
https://driveteslacanada.ca/news/san-fr ... -concerns/
Plantagenet wrote:What I worry about is an EV fire on a ferry boat.
Because I live in Alaska, I sometimes take long distance ferry boats where a couple hundred cars wind up parked down in the hold on the car deck while all the passengers are on the upper decks. Some of these ferry trips can take 3-4 days.
Plantagenet wrote:What I worry about is an EV fire on a ferry boat.
Because I live in Alaska, I sometimes take long distance ferry boats where a couple hundred cars wind up parked down in the hold on the car deck while all the passengers are on the upper decks. Some of these ferry trips can take 3-4 days. !
theluckycountry wrote:Plantagenet wrote:What I worry about is an EV fire on a ferry boat.
Because I live in Alaska, I sometimes take long distance ferry boats where a couple hundred cars wind up parked down in the hold on the car deck while all the passengers are on the upper decks. Some of these ferry trips can take 3-4 days. !
I wouldn't worry about it up there, EV's are next to useless for cold climates, the heater alone would suck the battery dry in a few hours.
theluckycountry wrote:Plantagenet wrote:Brand new Rivian pickup truck catches on fire while plugged in and charging at a public commercial charging station---the fire TOTALED the RIVIAN EV and took out part of the charging station too!!!
It's only a matter of time before municipalities take concerted action and start banning these recharge stations, or insisting they are sited out beyond a certain distance of the CBD.In electric vehicles, Li-ion batteries release toxic gases during fire primarily from combustion of the electrolyte. The electrolyte contains lithium hexafluorophosphate (LiPF6) and can also include other fluorine containing compounds...
Even now very little is in the published press about the dangers of these types of fires but the coverup will not last forever and then action will be taken, just as it was with the asbestos industry and its products. I could imagine the EV being banned from parking garages nation wide. Especially if insurance companies started jacking rates on such structures
theluckycountry wrote:I should feel a little guilty myself because Australia, along with all it's other treasures, is also one of the world's leading Lithium producers and our Nation and indirectly our lifestyles have been improved by shipping it across the globe. Fortune passes everywhere in times like these though.
Outcast_Searcher wrote:Not that your ilk cares about actual facts vs. myth spouting and arm waving.
It takes some time for enough energy to accumulate to trigger
thermal runaway in a battery. This makes them different from
ICEVs, which can be quickly ignited by a spark or flame. Fire
development in a LIB battery pack might not be obvious in the early
stages.
mousepad wrote:Does your ilk care about critical analysis?
Your source says the leading causes of vehicle fires were mechanic and electrical failures or malfunctions. Accidents represented only 4% of the causes of vehicle fires.mousepad wrote:It's probably not that simple. The danger about EV fires is it's intensity and randomness.
Gas cars usually catch on fire while driving, or in an accident. Rarely ever they spontaneously catch on fire at 3 am in the morning in your garage.
Here's the NFPA report on vehicle fires.
https://www.nfpa.org/-/media/Files/News ... efires.pdf
There are a few nuggets in the report, like:
* the majority of vehicle fires occurs in older cars (like 10 year and older). We don't have enough EV stock for apple2apple comparision.
* the majority of fires occur while driving and/or accident. Not with EV, they can combust anytime, anywhere without warning.It takes some time for enough energy to accumulate to trigger
thermal runaway in a battery. This makes them different from
ICEVs, which can be quickly ignited by a spark or flame. Fire
development in a LIB battery pack might not be obvious in the early
stages.
And that's exactly what makes them so dangerous.
Years and years of road use vibration will deteriorate every battery. Small abrasions on the isolators eventually will lead to shorts. Not sure if that fundamental weakness can ever be solved.
Does your ilk care about critical analysis?
Vehicle FiresThe leading causes of vehicle fires were mechanical failures or malfunctions and electrical failures or malfunctions.
Figure 9 shows that mechanical failures or malfunctions were the leading factors in all types of vehicle fires, followed by electrical failures or malfunctions.
Car fires by vehicle type
Type Fires per 100,000 sales
Hybrid 3,475
ICE 1,530
EV 25
Vehicle FiresTable 15. Car Fires by Property Use Where Fire Occurred
Vehicle parking area (17%)
kublikhan wrote:Your source says the leading causes of vehicle fires were mechanic and electrical failures or malfunctions.
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