[dbruning]

When you think about it, we reallllllly need to lose some convenience in order to save a little extra for the future.

[Rod_Cloutier]

Maybe so! When you consider the energy required to manufacture the dishwasher, heat and pump the water, and the electricity to run the dishwasher. Not to mention the cost to mine and refine the metals for the cutlery and fire the machine to mould the ceramics- it might very well be a net positive for everyone to stop using normal dishes and switch to disposibles?

[Lore]

The conundrum is a sustainable future is one in which there will be fewer jobs. It is antithetical to the capitalist growth system by which all forms of human endeavor are now valued and compensated for. Until the very nature of human beings is altered and they treasure the less tangible things in life as opposed to physical property and adolescent leisure, this will not change, or is it likely to.

[vision-master]

All things must pass...

[careinke]

The conundrum is a sustainable future is one in which there will be fewer jobs. It is antithetical to the capitalist growth system by which all forms of human endeavor are now valued and compensated for. Until the very nature of human beings is altered and they treasure the less tangible things in life as opposed to physical property and adolescent leisure, this will not change, or is it likely to.

Of course this does not dissolve the individual from taking responsibility for their own actions. You can slowly separate yourself from the dying system. Start by growing a garden, get out of debt, think before you buy.....

[dorlomin]

When you think about it, we reallllllly need to lose some convenience in order to save a little extra for the future.

Who uses plastic spoons at home. We dont go to a shop to buy one plastic spoon. If we did buy disposable spoons it would be hundreds at a time. Almost all of the effort is done by fossilised sunshine from another aeon. So its understandable that we substitute human labour for buring fossil energy. Its less labour for us.

Its a metaphor for 250 years of engineering progress.

[careinke]

Its a metaphor for 250 years of engineering progress.

Yes truly amazing, in only 250 years we have developed something that will continue to hurt the environment for thousands of years, all for less than thirty minutes of use.

However, I think the plastic fresh produce bags are even a greater accomplishment.

[Newfie]

The same thing the Easter Islander's did when they cut down the last palm.

[dbruning]

Maybe so! When you consider the energy required to manufacture the dishwasher, heat and pump the water, and the electricity to run the dishwasher. Not to mention the cost to mine and refine the metals for the cutlery and fire the machine to mould the ceramics- it might very well be a net positive for everyone to stop using normal dishes and switch to disposibles?

Who said anything about a dishwasher? hot water and a little soap? (not being 100% honest, I use one at home)

Actually I heard some companies are doing the disposable container thing, maybe it would be less galling to me if the plastic degraded after getting wet or something.

Main point of the post was my agreement that our society has become really dependent on a complex ways of doing things, and that perhaps there will be benefits to stepping back to something a little simpler.

And I thought it was a little funny.

[careinke]

There are biodegradable "plastic" tableware. It is made out of cellulose, and is just as good, though more expensive, than traditional plastic ware.

[dinopello]

I recall moving into an apartment in college, getting an order of fried chicken and sides with my roommates and we realized they didn't give us utensils and we had no kitchenware. We ate the drumsticks first and used the bone to scoop up slaw and mashed potatos. Bonin' the slaw, we called it. I dislike plastic utensils anyway. Rather use disposable chopsticks -made in usa-

[Newfie]

I heard somewhere that China had banned wood chopsticks because they were not reusable and their use was leading to deforestation.

Urban legend?

[dinopello]

I heard somewhere that China had banned wood chopsticks because they were not reusable and their use was leading to deforestation.

Urban legend?

Maybe that's why they are making them in the USA with American trees? This video says China consumes 50 Billion chopsticks a year.

[vtsnowedin]

Maybe so! When you consider the energy required to manufacture the dishwasher, heat and pump the water, and the electricity to run the dishwasher. Not to mention the cost to mine and refine the metals for the cutlery and fire the machine to mould the ceramics- it might very well be a net positive for everyone to stop using normal dishes and switch to disposibles?

Who said anything about a dishwasher? hot water and a little soap? (not being 100% honest, I use one at home)

Actually I heard some companies are doing the disposable container thing, maybe it would be less galling to me if the plastic degraded after getting wet or something.

Main point of the post was my agreement that our society has become really dependent on a complex ways of doing things, and that perhaps there will be benefits to stepping back to something a little simpler.

And I thought it was a little funny.

At least a bit ironic but I think it would be a good question for some number crunchers to work through. Considering the cost of hot water to wash dishes either in a dish washer or a conventional sink system the stainless steel spoon used for say thirty years is not without costs but the plastic spoons (and there would be thousands of them ) would add up especially when you consider the cost of recycling them or even worse hauling them to a land fill and paying the tipping fee.
I wonder what the bottom line really says. ??

[Newfie]

Good grief, lick it and lay it on the counter.

Really, we don't have a dish washer and things work just fine.

We have a cabin with running water, I run up the hill to get a bucket and come back. A little dip i'll do ya.

Long term cruisers on short water get by well with a water budget of under a gallon a day. One guy says "Use all you want, just use it out of a spray bottle."

[vtsnowedin]

Good grief, lick it and lay it on the counter.

"

You might do that but will your wife and daughters go along? (If you have them as I do ). I'm considering the two likely scenarios of plastic spoons used once and disposed of vs. traditional flatware used in modern manner, IE. washed dried and stored between uses. There are lots of other cases you could consider such as using the plastic spoon three times before discarding it etc. but that just muddles the issue.
I use both strategies. At home we use flatware the American way both sink washing and using a modern dishwasher. When I am at hunting camp or summer RVing we use one time plastic as washing facilities are at a premium and the time budget is crowded.
I expect the plastic is a waste but I can't prove it out of hand without computing the cost of the hot water used to clean the steel flatware.
And at any rate your not going to get a plastic knife to carve your steak.

[kublikhan]

Yes truly amazing, in only 250 years we have developed something that will continue to hurt the environment for thousands of years, all for less than thirty minutes of use.

However, I think the plastic fresh produce bags are even a greater accomplishment.

Indeed, it's why Mother Earth made us in the first place: Plastic

[Newfie]

Good grief, lick it and lay it on the counter.

"

You might do that but will your wife and daughters go along? (If you have them as I do ).

I do, and they do.

[Serial_Worrier]

The same thing the Easter Islander's did when they cut down the last palm.

You liberals are fascinated with Easter Island. One data point does not mean much in the broad sweep of civilization.

[Lore]

The same thing the Easter Islander's did when they cut down the last palm.

You liberals are fascinated with Easter Island. One data point does not mean much in the broad sweep of civilization.

A great many immigrants first came to the US for the same reasons. The difference is they found a boat.