rowante wrote:Countries like the US do not have coal and nuclear electricity production on a big enough scale to replace petroleum with hydrogen as a transport fuel to my knowledge.
rowante wrote:Also clean coal burning is only in prototype stage in the US. Australia has made great in-roads in this technology but mass burning of coal will still result in tons of mercury and CO2 being released into the envirnoment. Not good.
Pops wrote:But as leanan said:
“Remember, the energy crisis won't be due to lack of oil. It will be due to lack of cheap oil. Cheap oil is what we've built our society on. Hydrogen will never be cheap energy.”
If the number given is true (I don’t know) – 6 gal of gas to produce 1 gal of gas equivalent, I fail to see the point.
If gas is 20 bucks per gallon and hydrogen is $120 or even makes it down to $60 or $30 after we built the conversion plants, pay off the nuke plants, update the electric grid, add hydrogen pumps at the gas stations – a scary thought on it’s face, and perfect a way to prevent the vehicle tanks from going up like the Hindenburg in a crash…
Why would I own a hydrogen car if it’s still $30 a gallon? Why would I still own a car for that matter - can you imagine what that car will cost to manufacture with “cheap” oil at $300/bbl?
Leaf wrote:university students, (and I'm sure well trained scientists) have actually demonstrated that the worlds, so called "energy crisis" is actually just bull ****. We have the tech power to use hydrogen atoms to fuel our civilization indefinitely. well at least until our sun runs out of it...........
k_semler wrote:Can I use hydrogen to produce Nitrogen to use in fertilizers
Ammonium Nitrate
The plants were able to form ammonia by using the the Haber-Bosch process developed by Nobel Prize winner, Fritz Haber and later industrialized by Nobel Prize winner, Carl Bosch. The process combined hydrogen and nitrogen under extreme high pressure to form ammonia.
http://www.dohacollege.com/ppoints/The%20Haber%20Process.pps
N2(g) + 3H2(g) = 2NH3(g) (NH3 being Ammonia)
Uses of Ammonia
1. Manufacture of nitric acid
2. Manufacture of polyamides such as NYLON
3. Manufacture of fertilisers such as ammonium nitrate and ammonium sulphate:
NH3 + HNO3 → NH4NO3
NH3 + H2SO4 → NH4SO4
MrPC wrote:k_semler wrote:Can I use hydrogen to produce Nitrogen to use in fertilizers
Actually, this is one thing that Hydrogen can and does do.Ammonium Nitrate
The plants were able to form ammonia by using the the Haber-Bosch process developed by Nobel Prize winner, Fritz Haber and later industrialized by Nobel Prize winner, Carl Bosch. The process combined hydrogen and nitrogen under extreme high pressure to form ammonia.http://www.dohacollege.com/ppoints/The%20Haber%20Process.pps
N2(g) + 3H2(g) = 2NH3(g) (NH3 being Ammonia)
Uses of Ammonia
1. Manufacture of nitric acid
2. Manufacture of polygamies such as NYLON
3. Manufacture of fertilizers such as ammonium nitrate and ammonium sulfate:
NH3 + HNO3 → NH4NO3
NH3 + H2SO4 → NH4SO4
However, yeah, the rest is pretty much true. I'm particularly interested in the Hydrogen equivalent of a Jerry-can. How do you refuel your vehicle when it's stranded remote from a gas station?
Hydrogen because it can be made from coal or nuclear. Ethanol comes from plant material which for industrial production consumes oil and natural gas.
Countries like the US do not have coal and nuclear electricity production on a big enough scale to replace petroleum with hydrogen as a transport fuel to my knowledge.
MrPC wrote:Yes, traditional soil nigrogenation means do exist and can improve crop yields above what would be achieved by planting in an otherwise untreated field. However, they can't compare with the yields achieved by artificial fertilizers, and certainly can't sustain such a high global population.
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