[dissident]

The accuracy of the Iranian strike was nothing to sneeze at:



That is why the number of deaths was controlled. If the accuracy of the missiles was poor as assorted chest thumping chauvinist idiots are claiming, then the collateral damage would have been higher.

[Newfie]

Or a FedEx truck?

When you have the nicest house in a shitty neighborhood there is a good chance it will be vandalized while you are on vacation, just because.

So you worry and sweat and take measures to protect your pretty house. But you become a slave to protecting the house.

That’s asymmetric warfare on a simple level. We have a lot of assets to protect, including our population. Iran, maybe not so much?

Indeed, the key to asymmetric warfare has always been the same tactic. Make your powerful enemy waste their treasure and lives while you survive to annoy them. Being annoying is easy peasy, it doesn't take a lot of money or a lot of manpower.

The biggest fear about dealing with fanatics is that, for example, infiltrators attack American infrastructure like transformer farms scattered everywhere and never guarded. The USA is Cris-crossed with utility pipelines, high tension power lines, and so on and so forth. The idea of defending more than a tiny percentage of that is a fantasy and any infiltrators worth the name would wreck havoc until they were caught.

2 minds with one thought. If you had a dozen 2 man squads, each with a 50 cal, you could make a massive mess of the country in short order.

[EnergyUnlimited]

Trump have decided not to retaliate further at least at the moment.
Hence it have been decided that a number of american casualties is zero.

This is an interesting development.
Trump have certainly got his cassus belli which he was longing for.
So he could easily declare 10-20-100 casualties and proceed with retaliation for these.
But he didn't.

But again, all these widely advertised missile defences obviously have failed despite of iranian missiles being not very advanced.
Russians and Chinese are meanwhile deploying hypersonic missiles which are not following ballistic trajectory.

[Outcast_Searcher]

2 minds with one thought. If you had a dozen 2 man squads, each with a 50 cal, you could make a massive mess of the country in short order.

Yup. Imagine 90% of the population being afraid to go to Walmart, their grocery store, out to eat, send their kids to school, etc. etc. because of a significant risk of such squads being proven over time.

Not hard to see why, for example, the Israelis built a big fence and take security VERY seriously, given their situation.

[Outcast_Searcher]

Trump have decided not to retaliate further at least at the moment.
Hence it have been decided that a number of american casualties is zero.

This is an interesting development.
Trump have certainly got his cassus belli which he was longing for.
So he could easily declare 10-20-100 casualties and proceed with retaliation for these.
But he didn't.

But again, all these widely advertised missile defences obviously have failed.

Trump is claiming more economic sanctions against Iran in the offing. There are more ways to retailiate than strictly military escalation.

And to the best of my knowledge, no one credible has come close to claiming there are impenetrable missile defences at every base, etc.

Oh, and he might claim some arbitrary number of casualties, but if it's a false claim, as much as many folks around here are paranoid about the MSM, etc., I wouldn't expect such a claim to hold up over time. So I wouldn't expect the US military apparatus to go along with Trump on such a claim.

[Outcast_Searcher]

The accuracy of the Iranian strike was nothing to sneeze at:



That is why the number of deaths was controlled. If the accuracy of the missiles was poor as assorted chest thumping chauvinist idiots are claiming, then the collateral damage would have been higher.

Yes, as ineffective as missiles and bombs are at eliminating all need for "boots on the ground", just like computer power, their accuracy has improved tremendously over time. Little wonder why they're so popular for military adventures.

[EnergyUnlimited]

And to the best of my knowledge, no one credible has come close to claiming there are impenetrable missile defences at every base, etc.

Nevertheless Iran is not very advanced with its tech. Overwhelming success of the strike in terms of missiles reaching their target uninterrupted demonstrates poor quality of missile defences

Oh, and he might claim some arbitrary number of casualties, but if it's a false claim, as much as many folks around here are paranoid about the MSM, etc., I wouldn't expect such a claim to hold up over time. So I wouldn't expect the US military apparatus to go along with Trump on such a claim.

Hey, for such an occasion RDPC (Refrigerators Division of Propaganda Corps) of US Army certainly has casualties in store ready to be deployed anywhere on the world.

Regarding economic sanctions - there are hardly any possible american sanctions against Iran, which are not deployed yet. So this sounds like an empty move.

[Cog]

There are no Patriot AA batteries at the airfield that the Iranians hit. Why should there have been? We're we supposed to predict that the Iranians would go full retard and launch missiles from their own soil into Iraq?

Basically if you think modern day Persians are any better war fighters than Arabs, you have no knowledge of military history in the last 50 years. Just ask the Israelis.

[Plantagenet]

Iranian state radio within Iran is boasting (in Farsi) that their missile attack caused ca. 80 US casualties.


This proves that it is not only the US media that engages in broadcasting "fake news."

Cheers!

[EnergyUnlimited]

There are no Patriot AA batteries at the airfield that the Iranians hit. Why should there have been? We're we supposed to predict that the Iranians would go full retard and launch missiles from their own soil into Iraq?

Basically if you think modern day Persians are any better war fighters than Arabs, you have no knowledge of military history in the last 50 years. Just ask the Israelis.

Israelis had substantial problems with Iran sponsored Hezbollah several years ago.
They were defeated in Lebanon.

Regarding presence of Patriot AA missiles on particular airfield - don't know were they deployed or not so won't argue about it.
Lets hope they will be deployed after these events.

[Plantagenet]

Its not over yet.

Iran backed Hezbollah (Iraq) just fired three missiles at the US embassy compound in the Green Zone of Baghdad

stocks-suddenly-tumble-after-green-zone-explosion-headline

Most likely Solemanni supplied the Katyusha missiles to them.

Cheers!

[asg70]

It's funny to see how quickly the discussion seems to pivot over to something indistinguishable to color commentary during a football game. Human nature...

[Plantagenet]

It's funny to see how quickly the discussion seems to pivot over to something indistinguishable to color commentary during a football game. Human nature...

The news is the news.

When something new happens interested people take note that something new has happened.

The analysis and discussion and critiques generally come later

Human nature........

Cheers!

[careinke]

It's funny to see how quickly the discussion seems to pivot over to something indistinguishable to color commentary during a football game. Human nature...

Why not? Like you or I can do anything about it. Some can help shed light on some of it, through actual experiences. Others, also voice their viewpoint through a less experienced lens. But it's all data....

The humans job is to apply critical thinking to everything.

I'm glad to see congress trying to take some powers back that they foolishly gave to the Executive Branch. Maybe the next step will be bringing our Warriors home.

[EnergyUnlimited]

Maybe the next step will be bringing our Warriors home.

That would be a great disservice for them.
Once brought back they are often ending up homeless on a street... fentanyl addiction follows soon and the rest you know.

[derhundistlos]

Once brought back they (vets) are often ending up homeless on a street... fentanyl addiction follows soon and the rest you know.

Do you have facts to substantiate your claim?

Booze is many times more destructive than fentanyl. You've been listening to too much scaremongering. The numbers killed by alcohol dwarfs by many multiples deaths by fentanyl or prescription pills as reported by the CDC.

The people really being hurt by this inflammatory and jingoistic talk are those suffering from chronic pain due to industrial accidents or disease. I've now known two people who committed suicide (a mother suffering from MS and a man ravaged by pain due to work-related injuries) after their docs. arbitrarily discontinued their pain therapy due to dumb draconian laws that threatened their medical licenses.

Fortunately, the insanity (those who require pain meds. can't access treatment while those abusing the privilege have no problems finding sources) surrounding pain medication is confined to the United States.

[Newfie]

Following the crash discussion in a professional pilots site, although not all are aviation professionals. Someone posted the following:

According to the decision of the President of Ukraine Volodymyr Zelensky, the State Commission for Investigation of the Boeing Accident arrived at Tehran tonight. The group consists of 45 people, representing 12 ministries and agencies.



A meeting is currently underway with the participation of representatives of the competent authorities of Iran, including Iran's ICAO, an international civil aviation organization. Different versions of a sudden plane crash are studied, among the main ones:

- the defeat of the aircraft by an anti-aircraft missile (SAM), in particular, "Thor" SAM, as information on the detection of fragments of a Russian missile near the crash site has already appeared on the Internet;

- collision with a UAV or other flying object;

- destruction and explosion of the engine for technical reasons;

- explosion inside the plane as a result of a terrorist attack.

The commission includes experts involved in an international investigation into the attack by Russian servicemen on the Malaysian Boeing MN-17 on July 17, 2014 in the airspace of Ukraine, as well as the examination of fragments of the Russian anti-aircraft missile "Buk" that shot down a Malaysian aircraft. As you know, our experts have shown a high level of professionalism in this matter.

Our commission is currently agreeing with the Iranian authorities on the issue of the site of the disaster, and intends to search the fragments of the Russian anti-aircraft rocket "Thor" according to the data that was published on the Internet. We use all the experience of investigating the attack on the Boeing MN-17 to establish the truth in the case of the death of a Ukrainian aircraft in Tehran.

We are currently conducting effective diplomatic talks with the Iranian side, there is every reason to hope for cooperation on all issues, including the participation of our commission in deciphering the "black boxes" of our aircraft. The investigation into the deaths of Ukrainian citizens is under the personal control of the President of Ukraine, and we will immediately inform the Ukrainian society and the media of any data that may be published. "

( I am not permitted to post the link, it is on censor net )
Reply

Someone else noted that perhaps there was a two fold problem; first there was an engine failure and the plane turned to deal with that but it then presented a very unusual aspect to the ground who miss too it and fired a missile. Just one of the abounding theories.

Something else to note that the airport is at 3,500’ ASL, the plane incident occurred at 8,000’ ASL, or 4,500’ AGL. And it takes at least about 14 seconds to fall from that level, so the short videos everyone (but me) are watching show just the final little bit of the descent.

[Newfie]

Here is a hopeful NY Post piece, Trumps edit strategy from Iraq.

His word in Gods ear.

https://nypost.com/2020/01/07/offing-so ... exit-iraq/

[EnergyUnlimited]

Once brought back they (vets) are often ending up homeless on a street... fentanyl addiction follows soon and the rest you know.

Do you have facts to substantiate your claim?

For example here:
https://addictionresource.com/guides/ve ... nce-abuse/
Here:
https://justbelieverecoverypa.com/veter ... elessness/
Here:
https://www.addictioncenter.com/addiction/veterans/
Or here:
https://www.rehabcenter.net/veterans-an ... nce-abuse/

Booze is many times more destructive than fentanyl.

Any evidence to support this claim?

You've been listening to too much scaremongering. The numbers killed by alcohol dwarfs by many multiples deaths by fentanyl or prescription pills as reported by the CDC.

Alcoholism is still more popular but drug addiction begin to compete well.
~2% of death in the US is drug abuse related.

The people really being hurt by this inflammatory and jingoistic talk are those suffering from chronic pain due to industrial accidents or disease. I've now known two people who committed suicide (a mother suffering from MS and a man ravaged by pain due to work-related injuries) after their docs. arbitrarily discontinued their pain therapy due to dumb draconian laws that threatened their medical licenses.

These people most likely would still commit suicide.
After all heroin and fentanyl, which are very efficient painkillers are freely available from your local street dealer and rather inexpensive these days.

Fortunately, the insanity (those who require pain meds. can't access treatment while those abusing the privilege have no problems finding sources) surrounding pain medication is confined to the United States.

The same situation we have in China and ASEAN, in Russia, in most of Europe etc.
It is not without a reason.
American experiment with freely prescribed opiates for headaches, joint pains and other everyday pains where no treatment or an ibuprofen tablet would do have failed.

[asg70]

Why not?

Watch Dr. Strangelove for why not. It turns the prospects of war into little more than a game.