[TonyPrep]

Case closed.

I think that, in effect, you're right. If nuclear build starts in earnest, I'm sure that the operators will assume there there will be enough uranium, at whatever the required rate will be, for the life of however many reactors are built. I think it's unlikely that fuel longevity will even be a consideration.

I hope that full consideration of other factors takes place.

[Starvid]

He's quite simply a troll whos goal is to bloat this thread with as much crap as possible.

It only took you 91 pages to figure that out?

Anyway, it seems the uranium question can now be closed and filed somewhere, and we can come back and review it again in 40 years or so.

[M_B_S]

He's quite simply a troll whos goal is to bloat this thread with as much crap as possible.

It only took you 91 pages to figure that out?

Anyway, it seems the uranium question can now be closed and filed somewhere, and we can come back and review it again in 40 years or so.

Its not over!

Peak Oil = Peak Uranium

We are just over the top of the mountain.

Now energy decline rules!

The fossile fuel oil needed so deeply in uranium production runs out.

No Oil => No Uranium !

Its so simple.........try to mine uranium or build / run a nuclear reactor without oil ..... its impossible.



M_B_S

[Dezakin]

Its so simple.........try to mine uranium or build / run a nuclear reactor without oil ..... its impossible.

Impossible is a bit strong; it would be more correct to say that we dont rather than we cant. Fortunately you can make oil from uranium.

[TheAntiDoomer]

usage.How long can Uranium last for nuclear power ? 5 billion years at double current world electricity

[Starvid]

Uranium seems to have stabilized around $65. This might be the new long term price now that the speculative bubble seems to have gone away.

[Tanada]

Uranium seems to have stabilized around $65. This might be the new long term price now that the speculative bubble seems to have gone away.

Long term IMO of course, this price is high enough to ensure exploration to replace use while at the same time low enough to not have much impact on the price of Fission power.

As far as I can tell western Europe is still exporting moderatly depleated tails to Russia for upgrading, anyone have any recent news on that? I was trying to track it down the other day in reguards to world excess processing capacity. The American Centerfuge project is reportedly proceeding on schedual so that will add to world processing capacity unless the old gasseus diffusion plants are actually scrapped out, which could very well happen at current prices for the materials which make up these systems.

[copious.abundance]

--> Bloomberg <--

Paladin Energy Forecasts Doubling of Uranium Output This Year
By Angela Macdonald-Smith

Aug. 27 (Bloomberg) -- Paladin Energy Ltd., the Australian producer of uranium in Africa, said output is set to more than double this year as volumes increase at the Langer Heinrich mine in Namibia and a new project starts in Malawi.

Production should rise to 3.6 million pounds of uranium oxide in the year ending June 30, 2009, from 1.71 million in the preceding 12 months, Managing Director John Borshoff said on a conference call. Output should increase to 6.8 million pounds the following year, to 7.4 million in 2010-11 and 9.3 million in 2011-12, he said.

[...]

[copious.abundance]

Here's an event which promises to allow more uranium on the market:

--> Bloomberg <--

Liberal Party Wins Government in Western Australia
By Robert Fenner

Sept. 14 (Bloomberg) -- Colin Barnett will become the next premier of Western Australia after his Liberal Party won National Party support for a coalition government, opening the way for uranium mining and genetically modified crops in the state.

The National Party received ``very good'' proposals from the Liberals and incumbent Labor Party before making its decision, Nationals Leader Brendon Grylls told reporters in Perth today. The Liberals won 24 seats in the 59-seat lower house and will form a government with the support of four Nationals and two independent members, ending a week of uncertainty after the Sept. 6 poll left no party with a majority.

Barnett, who promised to open up uranium mines and allow genetically modified crops, will head a state that accounts for a third of the nation's exports with 10 percent of its population.

``Those key policies of uranium and genetically modified crops will come through very quickly,'' said Peter Van Onselen, associate professor in political science at Perth's Edith Cowan University. ``Between them they also control the upper house.''

[...]

[Tanada]

Their biggest fear has been over supply causing the price to drop too low, Canada and Australia really are like Sudi Arabia and Kuwait except for Uranium. Now that world demand is starting to pick up they feel safe producing more, however with the next generation RMWR in Japan undergoing detailed simulation prior to deciscion to build their window of opertunity is short. If they keep the price low enough they can kill the RMWR, if they guess wrong the RMWR will cut Uranium demand significantly even if we go all nuclear for 75% baseload electricity production.

[InToWishin]

Around here (Sweden), landfills are not used anymore and has not been for severeal [sic] years. They just created problems.

So where does the trash go instead? Also where does all the spent nuclear fuel that starvid keeps going on about go?

[Gorm]

Around here (Sweden), landfills are not used anymore and has not been for severeal [sic] years. They just created problems.

So where does the trash go instead? Also where does all the spent nuclear fuel that starvid keeps going on about go?

Trash is sorted, what can be recycled is or it is bunrt for heating or electrcity. Foodvaste and that kind waste is made to bio-fuels. Landfills are an enormus waste and we have decided to not have them. So we dont.

Nuclear waste are never ever dumped on a landfill. Not even in the USA I guess.

[vaseline2008]

Around here (Sweden), landfills are not used anymore and has not been for severeal [sic] years. They just created problems.

So where does the trash go instead? Also where does all the spent nuclear fuel that starvid keeps going on about go?

Trash is sorted, what can be recycled is or it is bunrt for heating or electrcity. Foodvaste and that kind waste is made to bio-fuels. Landfills are an enormus waste and we have decided to not have them. So we dont. Nuclear waste are never ever dumped on a landfill. Not even in the USA I guess.

They have a "special" landfill for that...it's called Yucca Mountain, wait...that's in Nevada too!

[the48thronin]

Nuclear waste are never ever dumped on a landfill. Not even in the USA I guess.

Really... Hmmm check out the HUGE nuclear waste land fill at Barnwell, SC. There is another in Hanford Washington. I used to haul nuclear waste and I have been to both of them.

FWIW Even Sweden has nuclear waste dumps somewhere. Your uranium fluoride gas is stored ( at your expense) in stainless steel containers at Sargents Ohio. It is so corrosive the containers are pumped out into NEW containers on a regular schedule while science tries to find a safe way to dispose of or recycle that gas.

There was an experimental Fluoride gas recycling plant built back in the early 70s in Morris Ill. we spent over a year hauling the building, machinery and even the first 20 feet of foundation dirt to the dump in Barnwell, SC after a leak contaminated the place in 1977.

The dumps all over the world are run by a company called Chem-nuclear. The trucks hauling the waste used to belong to Home Transportation Company of Marietta Ga while Jimmie was president, now those same cannister trailers are hauled by Chem-Nuclear trucks or by Tri-state motor transport. There are long term costs of nuclear energy that have yet to be factored in. The dump at Barnwell was supposed to have room for another 100 years, but had to be doubled in size 3 years ago as it was full.

Imagine thousands of acres of land with placards saying do not allow human occupation or digging before the year 5000.

[the48thronin]

They have a "special" landfill for that...it's called Yucca Mountain, wait...that's in Nevada too!

To date there is no nuclear waste in residence at Yucca Mountain. The two low level sites, Barnwell, Sc and Hanford, Washington are still the only receiving nuclear waste sites.
All spent fuel and high level waste is stored at site of use ( in pools at reactor sites. NONE is at this time being transported.

Weapons grade is not waste, but is not stored in Nevada but either at Hanford where it is generated or at the assembly plant as always.

Fuel rods are transported by Tri State from Hanford by land to ports and air ports that have over water departure sites. ( Yes I also did that for years before the contract was moved back to tri state.)

Yucca flats is supposed to one day begin receiving the waste in temporary storage on site and even possibly the plant at Sargents Ohio will move there. If it happens the trucking will be an immense project needing many more times the "cannisters" that exist at present. Those Cannisters are built by Chem Nuclear and can survive a train collision at 100 MPH head on. They were in fact tested at 200 MPH collision the film is impressive.
So far legal opposition has succeeded in preventing the movement of spent fuel to Yucca. There are a limited number of truck drivers certified to move these fuel and spent fuel rods. The amount of spent fuel on hand right now would make all of them work for the rest of their lives.

[JPL]

Thanks 'the48thronin', this (the disposal issue) is possibly the most powerful arguement against further development of fission plants in the future.

It has been said before, but it's worth re-stating, namely that the 'safe disposal' arguement is still reliant on future generations having a society with a sufficient level of technological advancement to keep looking after the stuff (our toxic waste) safely.

It may happen. No-one is saying it's impossible that the world 'say' 50 years in the future might be able to shoot the stuff into the sun or something. But we can also, all, envisage futures in which this might no be do-able. I personally think these latter scenarios are more likely.

Even with our current level of technology we are still not considering sensible solutions like (for example) digging a big shaft in Antartica and dropping it in, sealing it off and also making a big resolutions like not creating any more of the stuff. This is not a perfect solution but it is a practical one right now and may not be do-able in 20 years time. The only alternative as I see it is praying to our gods (once again) that the great alter of 'technological progress' will deliver us from these horrible problems.

Just some thoughts.

JP

[Gorm]

This is not an unmanagebel problem. You whine like frigthend children. LOL

Are we not men? We can deal with this.

[cipi604]

And usually men go to war. I'm not so sure that in the near future there's going to be somebody to change those tanks for the uranium fluoride gas, or keep the actual n.power plants working safely, mostly in a collapsing society.

Murphy's laws:

* If anything can go wrong, it will

* If there is a possibility of several things going wrong, the one that will cause the most damage will be the one to go wrong

[Gorm]

When it goes wrong, fix it. Better then whining about it and stating that everything is going to fail no matter what.

[Gazzatrone]

Is it to simplistic to ask why Nuclear waste isn't encased in concrete and dumped in a Volcano?