[Revi]

Those little thought experiments can be devilish. Sometimes wrong, it sometimes profound. Good on you, that’s a sweet one.

Thanks!

[Revi]

This book is a really good read, and it leaves those of us who think a lot about climate change with a better understanding of the psychology of this age. We are pretending that everything is okay. Meanwhile there are things happening which belie our certainty. I think we are entering into a century of consequences. Those of us who know about peak oil are used to the ground shifting beneath our feet, but I guarantee that the vast majority of people aren't.

[dissident]

Now that all that rain has ended, and the Greatest California Drought Ever is over, I can get back to worrying about this habitable earth. Tough going.

Just fertilized the rhodies, artichokes and blueberries. Hopefully the latter will be uninhabitable to the robins this years. They just move in and inhabit my berries. Bastards

Your time frame is too short. Wait until the late 2030s to enjoy this "non issue".

[Newfie]

Exactly. Didn’t I make a long post about this time frame issue here somewhere recently? All these threads run together.

[Revi]

I think this will be a long hot summer in most places. Here in New England we are out of the track of most things (but we have had tornadoes and hurricanes, and even forest fires).

With El Nino acting up again we'll probably have a more subdued hurricane season, but it just takes one to wreak damage.

[vtsnowedin]

Now that all that rain has ended, and the Greatest California Drought Ever is over, I can get back to worrying about this habitable earth. Tough going.

Just fertilized the rhodies, artichokes and blueberries. Hopefully the latter will be uninhabitable to the robins this years. They just move in and inhabit my berries. Bastards

Bird netting, scarecrows and a twelve gauge. (don't pepper the berries with shot misdirect to safe backstop, it is the noise you want).

[Plantagenet]

I think this will be a long hot summer in most places.

UP here in central ALaska We’re running about 15-20° above normal all month long. The local ski are just closed down a month early due to the snow all melting off.

If this keeps up we’re going to see some unusually big forest fire action up here in Alaska this summer.........

Cheers!

[Revi]

I think this will be a long hot summer in most places.

UP here in central ALaska We’re running about 15-20° above normal all month long. The local ski are just closed down a month early due to the snow all melting off.

If this keeps up we’re going to see some unusually big forest fire action up here in Alaska this summer.........

Cheers!

Wow! We have been below normal and it looks like we are going to move to above normal very quickly, which doesn't bode well for the maple syrup season. We'll see...

[Revi]

Friends are reading the book and getting a little overwhelmed by the reality in it. I tell them take it one or two chapters at a time, or skip to the most interesting part of the book, about 2/3rds of the way through where he starts to talk about the psychology of what we're doing. We really are in some kind of strange trance. We fly around and consume vast amounts of fuel hoping that they'll do something about the problem. Good luck with that!

[Plantagenet]

One of the ironies of the current global warming problem is that, in the near term, most people are going to see their weather improve. We are going to get to THE UNINHABITABLE EARTH stage of things eventually, but first we're going to see warming summers and shorter winters.

I was just down in Antarctica, at the tail end of the summer season there, and the weather was unusually good. The sea ice was at record low extent, and days were mostly sunny and warm (by Antarctic standards...running just a bit above to a bit below freezing). Then I went to Tierra Del Fueugo and Patagonia and then central Chile. Everywhere I had sunny, warm weather. When I was on the island of Chiloe in the Chilean Fjords they were marveling at the weather. A place that always has rain was sunny and dry, and had an extremely warm summer. At Torre Del Paine National park, where its always cloudy and windy...same thing. Sunshine, beautiful mountains, and the Patagonia Icefield shining in the sun. And now I'm back in Alaska and its absolutely grand here. We're running about a month ahead of our usual spring warming temperatures.

So I'm guesting that most likely first we'll have warmer summers and nicer winters, and people will mostly like it...that will go on for some period of time. Perhaps we may see mostly warmer, better weather for the next 10-20 years or so....and only THEN does warming get intense enough that we get to the Uninhabilable earth issues.



Cheers!

[vtsnowedin]

. Then I went to Tierra Del Fueugo and Patagonia and then central Chile.

Funny, one of my daughters just sent us a postcard from Patagonia.The men in the group hunted red stag and wild boar. (no luck on the stag). You might have crossed paths.

[Revi]

One of the ironies of the current global warming problem is that, in the near term, most people are going to see their weather improve. We are going to get to THE UNINHABITABLE EARTH stage of things eventually, but first we're going to see warming summers and shorter winters.
And now I'm back in Alaska and its absolutely grand here. We're running about a month ahead of our usual spring warming temperatures.

So I'm guesting that most likely first we'll have warmer summers and nicer winters, and people will mostly like it...that will go on for some period of time. Perhaps we may see mostly warmer, better weather for the next 10-20 years or so....and only THEN does warming get intense enough that we get to the Uninhabilable earth issues.

Cheers!

Of course you are talking about places that are usually uninhabitable because the weather is so cold and snowy. I agree, northern and far southern places will become much more habitable, but places nearer the equator become uninhabitable. For example a lot of these Central American migrants come from the dry corridor of Guatemala and Honduras which has really become uninhabitable because their seasonal rains haven't happened. Most of them lived off a corn harvest that hasn't happened in a couple of years now. They form caravans to head north to avoid starvation. Their lands were barely useable, and now they aren't getting any harvest at all. I used to live in Guatemala and saw how people live. They are Mayan farmers and have lived there for thousands of years. It's going to be a calamity for a lot of people in the global south. Even the southwest of the US will be affected.

[Newfie]

And it will fuel the immigration issue.

[Revi]

And it will fuel the immigration issue.

I think it already has. Unfortunately these people are not getting here where we need them. They are Mayans, so they are great workers, family people and they would fit in well around here. Acadia Park has 3.5 million visitors and they could use the help. I wonder why they don't start to issue H1B visas? People freak out, but they are one of the best groups to get. They do the blueberry harvest every year and they don't cause any problems here in Maine. I was in Washington County at the Four Corners Shopping Center and I realized that I was in a big group of Mayans, who were all there after work. Places like this need people. They have a great Mexican restaurant down there now. Here's the population record for the town where I met all those people:

[Cog]

We don't want them here voting because they will turn the United States into the socialist hell that they came from. They can work hard in the home country to make it a utopia. THE USA is full.

[Newfie]

Revi,

I don’t fear the “socialist hell hole”. Nor do I think it’s likely many will be given the right to vote, some surely, how many? And there is no guarantee they will vote left. It’s the gate keeper thing, once last the exclusionary gate folks then want to defend it so it’s advantages are not further diluted.

I do wish to halt immigration because the country is over populated already. That your sample town is drying up is a symptom of internal problems. There is not guarantee those folks who immigrate will be coming to your town to settle. It’s far more likely they will settle in an urban setting and your town will continue to wither.

That piece you posted by Gail was spot on. It also applies to the USA. We are just not as far advanced in the decay. Their is another book, Tropic of Chaos, that fills in the picture a good bit.

In short you are not necessicarialy doing the immigrants any good, they are just delaying the battle. Might as well face it now on home turf than push it on your children in a foreign country.

From Africa to Asia and Latin America, the era of climate wars has begun. Extreme weather is breeding banditry, humanitarian crisis, and state failure.
In Tropic of Chaos, investigative journalist Christian Parenti travels along the front lines of this gathering catastrophe--the belt of economically and politically battered postcolonial nations and war zones girding the planet's midlatitudes. Here he finds failed states amid climatic disasters. But he also reveals the unsettling presence of Western military forces and explains how they see an opportunity in the crisis to prepare for open-ended global counterinsurgency.

Parenti argues that this incipient "climate fascism"--a political hardening of wealthy states-- is bound to fail. The struggling states of the developing world cannot be allowed to collapse, as they will take other nations down as well. Instead, we must work to meet the challenge of climate-driven violence with a very different set of sustainable economic and development policies

[Revi]

We don't want them here voting because they will turn the United States into the socialist hell that they came from. They can work hard in the home country to make it a utopia. THE USA is full.

Or is it just that we hire these people as guest workers? Look around, see who's doing the landscaping, washing the dishes at the local restaurant. You may be surprised.

It's really difficult to get US citizens to work at low wage jobs. They need cars, insurance, etc. The undocumented have been the work force for many years now. Look around, you may see them.

[Cog]

I see them. I see them stealing identities from Americans. I see them overloading the medical system. I see them sending money out of the country. I see the crime of MS-13.
And I see the push of the Democrat party to make them voters. You are going to be in for a rude shock when the demographics change enough. Hopefully you can keep your head attached to your body.

[Revi]

I see them. I see them stealing identities from Americans. I see them overloading the medical system. I see them sending money out of the country. I see the crime of MS-13.
And I see the push of the Democrat party to make them voters. You are going to be in for a rude shock when the demographics change enough. Hopefully you can keep your head attached to your body.

Do you really find them to be threatening? They mostly seem to live fairly quiet lives and take busses out to the wealthy suburbs to trim their hedges and wash their clothes. What's your plan? Where do we find people to do this work?

Also, it's the Democratic Party. Just like we don't call yours the Republic Party. And those people are sending money out of the country to support people back at home, like a lot of our immigrant forefathers did back in the day. I think we should offer a lot more H1B visas. People could work where they are needed and go home. What's the matter with that?