[Keith_McClary]

So you suggesting that Ethiopia breeding itself from 20 mln in 1960 to current 84 mln, Somali breeding itself from 2.8m to 10mln, Kenya breeding from 8 mln to 40 mln had nothing to do with rendering their land uninhabitable?

Where are the right-wing cornies (of the bible-thumping persuasion - "go forth and multiply" - the Bushies were full of it) who claimed population growth is a Good Thing? This is a perfect opportunity for you guys to chime in.

[clif]

Aside of third world non-existing until 1940s/1950s or so

Yes because a vast majority of what we call the third world today was called COLONIES before WW2,
IE even MORE exploited then after WW2.

[Pretorian]

Aside of third world non-existing until 1940s/1950s or so

Yes because a vast majority of what we call the third world today was called COLONIES before WW2,
IE even MORE exploited then after WW2.

Ok, so? Now their great-grandkids get to have a free pass to public housing, welfare, medicaid, opra shows and buckets of fried chicken?

[dohboi]

Keep up, P--Oprah had her last show weeks ago now.

[clif]

Now their great-grandkids get to have a free pass to public housing, welfare, medicaid, opra shows and buckets of fried chicken?

I never said that, just filled out the historical record.

Too bad you showed your predisposed ideology against asking the people and countries which exploited a entire set of continents for at least a century to help fix the enormous damage they did to it.

Too bad the ideology of it's their problem NOW that we were forced to leave, doesn't work very well with the exploitive IMF-world Bank style of neo-colonialism of ever increasing debt based on the previous damage from exploitation combined with the severe damage most fight for freedom from colonialism created.

Want a classic example;

Vietnam, they had to fight off the French 1947 until 1954, and THEN fight off the USA until 1975 who refused to accept the Vietnamese led by Ho won. The Vietnam war was cast when Eisenhower and the Dulles Brothers blocked democratic elections (which EVERYONE admits Ho would have won by about 90% of the vote). PS that 90% pro Ho vote is why the US could never pacify the south.

Or how the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_AjaxBritish and USA overthrew a democratically elected government in Iran circa 1953 to reestablish a neo-colonial Shah, so that the oil corp known as Anglo-Iranian Oil Company (AIOC) could resume their operations in Iran (after the Operation Ajax they renamed themselves to British Petroleum) which operated in Iran freely until 1979. The revolution in 1979 was to get rid of the Shah, which included the USA wasn't able to run a revolution against the people of Iran from their embassy like Kermit Roosevelt had done in 1953, (which is why the students took the US embassy after the ayatollah seized power after the Shah abdicated.

Probably not the real historical facts you wanted to see, but they are how the western capitalists democracies used their power to try to subjugate the former colonies, and have fought numerous wars to that effect.

Just think IF Eisenhower hadn't chosen the Oil corps over the Iranian people's right to their own democracy, and allowed the Vietnamese to vote for their own future all the things we wouldn't have gone through.

The 20 year long Vietnam military debacle, with all that cost us in blood and money.

If Iran had been left alone, no 1979 revolt, no siding with Saddam all through the 80's, so no Desert Storm or stupid Bush II invasion. Lots more blood and money lost because we could not allow others the rights we demand.

But some claim we are exceptional, the way I see it,

Exceptional in the short yellow bus way, if your look at the historical fiascoes we have gone all in on, aka Don Quixote, ignoring the rights of others and our own historical fight against others telling us what we had to do.

BTW Afghanistan is the place The Russian Empire and British Empire in the 1800's wasted lots of blood and money. !980's the USSR wasted even more in a decade long attempt the build a nation in their own terms, Zbigniew Brzezinski, knew that would happen which is why he got Jimmy Carter to allow the CIA to arm and aid the resistance against the Soviet invasion, see Operation Cyclone. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone

For some reason, instead of allowing the US Army Rangers to go after Osama in Nov 2001 while he was trapped in Tora Bora, http://seekerblog.com/2011/05/15/what-really-happened-at-tora-bora/ the Bush II Administration stupidly decided to follow the 1980's Soviet example. (Now Osama is dead< we need to leave). We cannot any more control the middle east any more then we could control Vietnam.

[clif]

Dude, you are arguing with an avowed racist. (they still exits )

I know, I was stationed In Louisiana, Alabama, Florida and Kentucky during my years in the service. Even knew some when I lived in New York, met racists in Europe and Panama while stationed there. Even saw then during my time in the middle east, in fact that time allowed some of them to openly express their racism.

But the one thing racists can't handle is FACTS because their racists beliefs fail when faced with the facts;

Yes, I know, they still believe in their childish fantasy of their racist creed.

However they look like the mental eunuchs they are when others see how foolish they act, and the crap they spout when faced with facts. The more daylight they face the more they fail in pushing their childish fantasies of the racism they cling to to have make themselves feel better about their deep felt inadequacies. Most racists project on to others the deepest insecurities they have in themselves.

[Pretorian]

But the one thing racists can't handle is FACTS because their racists beliefs fail when faced with the facts;

Yes, I know, they still believe in their childish fantasy of their racist creed.

However they look like the mental eunuchs they are when others see how foolish they act, and the crap they spout when faced with facts.

First of all I dont remember "avowing" myself as a racist, but, I looked up the definition in a few dictionaries and sure, of course I am a racist by one part of the meaning or another. Or should I say, I'm just an honest man and that is what differs me from the most people you know?

Anyway, you keep talking about "the facts" that supposed to be really thrilling and fascinating. What are those facts that do magic with foolish racists? Most of "anti-racists" that I've met, including on this board, do not even know what a race is, let alone what races are out there and how they differ one from another. When I shove their ignorance into their faces, they usually start holding hands and singing " We are the world" and " Kumbaya" along with throwing ad hominems at me.
I'd be thrilled if you were any different.

[vision-master]

Are good Christians racist?

Just look at all the pale faces.

Looks like the GOP, no?

[AgentR11]

Are good Christians racist?
Just look at all the pale faces.

And a black Baptist congregation would look opposite and equally uniform...

Looks like the GOP, no?

And would look the the Dems.

So what.
Self selection in social groups is not a crime for either.

Uniform groups creep me out personally, but that's a different story altogether.

[dohboi]

I will attempt to get this thread back on topic, though likely it will be in vain:

http://www.desdemonadespair.net/2011/07/east-africa-famine-crisis-of.html

East Africa famine crisis of ‘unimaginable proportions’ looms – ‘My 3-year-old was the first in our group to die. We buried her and kept on walking.’...
Back home all the animals are dead. There is nothing to eat at all

[Umber]

I will attempt to get this thread back on topic, though likely it will be in vain:

http://www.desdemonadespair.net/2011/07/east-africa-famine-crisis-of.html

East Africa famine crisis of ‘unimaginable proportions’ looms – ‘My 3-year-old was the first in our group to die. We buried her and kept on walking.’...
Back home all the animals are dead. There is nothing to eat at all

I frequently read posts on this forum that conclude "Population MUST be reduced". And now it's about to BE reduced and you want to complain about that, too?

[dohboi]

I did not write any comment at all on that post, so I'm not sure where you got 'complain' from.

But for the record, I do find it sad that it has come to this. (But apparently, pictures of starving people have no emotional effect on you?)

I have long argued that effective policies (whatever the incentives) of one child postponed till late in life could rapidly reduce population levels immediately. Neither this nor any other policy to effectively reduce population humanely has happened, and the die off is going to start in those places with the biggest population runup in the areas least able to support it, especially where GW, local ecological disaster, corporate piracy, civil war...have taken a big toll.

I can't see how MENA and South Asia are going to be able to avoid similar scenes before long.

Ever increasing numbers of refugees will further destabilize neighboring countries and regions.

There is no good answer to this mess that I can see.

[Pretorian]

I will attempt to get this thread back on topic, though likely it will be in vain:

http://www.desdemonadespair.net/2011/07/east-africa-famine-crisis-of.html

East Africa famine crisis of ‘unimaginable proportions’ looms – ‘My 3-year-old was the first in our group to die. We buried her and kept on walking.’...
Back home all the animals are dead. There is nothing to eat at all

It's amazing that even after this bleeding heart liberals ( or should I say " progressives" ? since liberal is an insult these days) will say that sterilizing these creatures is not a good idea.

PS Btw I just loved the unskippable Bud-light commercial before the video there

[Pretorian]

PPS BBy the way there is a man in the video who came from 50 miles away to the refugee camp, leaving his kids behind with nothing to eat or drink.

[dohboi]

Is Russia's wheat harvest going to be wiped out again, leading to world wide food shortages?


http://news.yahoo.com/russia-battles-wildfires-heatwave-145627269.html

Russia battles wildfires in new heat wave

War-time shells exploded and Moscow subway passengers fainted on Wednesday as Russia again sizzled in the summer heat and battled dozens of blazes, officials said.

A major fire started in the southern Rostov region on Tuesday causing two days of explosions of World War II-era shells embedded in a local forest, a local spokeswoman for the emergencies ministry said.

[Pretorian]

Is Russia's wheat harvest going to be wiped out again, leading to world wide food shortages?

let's hold our fingers crossed

[dohboi]

http://www.desdemonadespair.net/2011/07/pasture-land-completely-depleted-in.html

Pasture land completely depleted in Kenya drought – ‘The cows are trying to eat sand’

With pasture land completely depleted in Mandera and Wajir, pastoralists have taken their herds to Ethiopia hoping to find some grazing land and water.

"But their animals are too weak - they will all probably die before they can even get there,"

[Lore]

Wait till you see the price this coming spring on quarter pounders with cheese!

[Pretorian]

Wait till you see the price this coming spring on quarter pounders with cheese!

Are you suggesting we eat cows from over there? No, and they don't eat ours. If the price will go up it will have little to do with that region, since they are not real buyers anyway.