[mousepad]

anyone and everyone had rushed out in 1999 to upgrade because of the Y2K swindle. Oh yes it was a swindle alright, pushed by computer manufacturers

It had nothing to do with hardware as it was a software problem. I've never once seen somebody pushing to upgrade to a new computer because of it. User software was of no concern anyways. Concern were old systems from the 60's and 70's running the backbone of gov, aviation and banking.

Here's a bit of explanation for you:
https://time.com/5752129/y2k-bug-history/

The vast majority of people have absolutely no clue how computers work. So when someone comes along and says look we have a problem…[involving] a two-digit year rather than a four-digit year, their eyes start to glaze over

“The Y2K crisis didn’t happen precisely because people started preparing for it over a decade in advance. And the general public who was busy stocking up on supplies and stuff just didn’t have a sense that the programmers were on the job

Next one up BTW is:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_2038 ... %20integer.

The year 2038 problem (also known as Y2038,[1] Y2K38, Y2K38 superbug or the Epochalypse[2][3]) is a time formatting bug in computer systems with representing times after 03:14:07 UTC on 19 January 2038.

The potential for disruption here is way bigger because it affects billions of computers and embedded devices.

[Plantagenet]

Poeple who drive glass EVs shouldn't throw stones

this-chinese-electric-car-is-almost-entirely-windows

Cheers!

[theluckycountry]

I've never once seen somebody pushing to upgrade to a new computer because of it.
Here's a bit of explanation for you:
https://time.com/5752129/y2k-bug-history/

Well you need to get out more mousepad and see what's happening beyond the computer lab. And no thanks to the link, it's irreverent to my post, which is about people's behavior once the TV scares them. Tens of thousands of Aussies flocking to computer stores to upgrade, I saw it myself, armed security on the doors because of the volumes of cash being spent.

How do these stories jib with you?

Aug. 14, 2003
It’s been a long, lean stretch for personal computer makers since the Y2K spending frenzy. But after three years of disappointment, PC makers are cautiously hopeful that they’re seeing a return to the traditional pickup in sales for the back-to-school and holiday

https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna3072984

PC sales and Y2K help Microsoft's bottom line
CBC News ·Posted: Jan 20, 1999

Surging personal computer sales and the Y2K computer bug helped Microsoft Corp. post strong second-quarter earnings that easily beat analysts' expectations. The company reported net income of $1.98 billion US, for the quarter ended Dec. 31. That is up 72 per cent from the $1.13 billion the company earned for the same period last year.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/pc-sal ... e-1.187528

Personal computer sales through the roof, just as I said mousepad.

[theluckycountry]

Poeple who drive glass EVs shouldn't throw stones

this-chinese-electric-car-is-almost-entirely-windows

Cheers!

Look at the pompous tool in front of it, photo-shopped probably.

[theluckycountry]

It's Winter, think twice before leaving your metropolitan area

That should be a popup alert on every Tesla screen when cold conditions prevail.

WINTER TIP: What to Do Before Driving

Preheat. ...you’ll need to preheat your car and battery. Tesla suggests you schedule your drive time 30 to 45 minutes in advance to warm up the battery.

https://www.kbb.com/car-advice/tesla-co ... ing-guide/

Yes, you're a slave now, get about your chores.

Consumers Are Rejecting the Great Reset

A friend got a rental of a Tesla over the holidays. It’s undoubtedly the industry standard for EVs and a complete blast to drive. The problem: It’s not a practical car at all. He was driving in the cold, and the car was nearly drained after two hours. Searching for a charge was no easy task. The first one didn’t work. The second one stated that it would be charged in 10 hours, which he didn’t have. The third one charged in one hour but that was a full hour wasted.

His conclusion: This is indeed a glorified golf cart designed to keep you at home and under the thumb of the manufacturer. And this is just a test. The repairs are worse. Keep in mind that this is the best the industry has to offer. The other manufacturers of these things make products not nearly as high-rated, which is why so many of them are sitting on lots unsold and why orders for the machines are plummeting

It seems like the EV craze has peaked already. Growth in gas cars is now far higher than electrics, flipping a trend from 12 months ago. Finally, consumers are figuring it out. This is a good second car, provided you’re driving in your own town, you have a hook-up at home and can charge it overnight, and you don’t suddenly have to go out of town. It’s a toy, sometimes a fun one, but not a real car. For that, you need gas....

https://www.theepochtimes.com/opinion/c ... =ZeroHedge

Peak EV? Well now I'm not the only one saying it, it'll be mainstream soon

Now how much longer do we have to suffer under BS marketing passing itself off as "Science"? How many more people have to be mired in debt to these toys before we can get down to the serious business of a transition away from V6 and V8 American gas guzzlers into efficient modern engined cars. This has been the root of the problem all along and we see it extended into the EV-O-Sphere with the high powered race cars they chose to build. It's the have your cake and eat it too mentality, supposedly saving the planet as you go from zero to 60 in under 2 seconds.

This forum cheer-leaded the EV craze for the better part of a decade, based solely on industry hype. But anyone with a modicum of common sense could have seen that it was just an extension, an expensive extension, of the oil based consumption model we have grown to love and abuse for 100 years. Since these cars, these EV's, are made from oil and coal and in many cases charged by fossil fuels it's absurd to believe that they could have ever replaced gasoline powered cars. A picture paints a thousand words but I won't include one here because the only one that comes to mind is a group of men sitting in a circle masturbating. Far too gross for peakoil.com

[kublikhan]

Peak EV? Well now I'm not the only one saying it, it'll be mainstream soon

Yes you do keep saying that. However reality paints a different picture. It is not EV that peaked, it is ICE that has peaked:

The global market for ICE vehicles peaked in 2017 and has since entered a structural decline.

The changing landscape of vehicle sales
In 2017, 86 million ICE passenger vehicles were sold, with battery-electric and plug-in hybrid models accounting for a mere 1 million vehicles.

However, 2022 saw a drastically different picture, with ICE vehicle sales dropping by nearly 20 percent to 69 million and plug-in vehicles skyrocketing to 10.4 million.

Internal combustion engine car sales peaked in 2017

[mousepad]

Tens of thousands of Aussies flocking to computer stores to upgrade, I saw it myself, armed security on the doors because of the volumes of cash being spent.

How do these stories jib with you?

Crazy. I didn't think people are that dumb. But then again, am I really surprised?

[theluckycountry]

Crazy. I didn't think people are that dumb. But then again, am I really surprised?

I know exactly how you feel, some things you just think, "no that couldn't happen" and then it's revealed that it did. I was in construction (cottage) for a lot of years and in the 00's when people were renovating houses like crazy all over the nation I didn't think much of it, that's normal, I mean I'd been doing it for people since the 70's. But what was happening now was on a whole other scale.

Driven by half a dozen TV shows like "location Location Location" and "Fix this house", enabled by new "products" like home equity loans, and cheerleaded by the whole RE industry, people began spending hundreds of grand "Adding value" to old homes. It sort of make sense to me but I was seeing it from an industry insider's point of view. What it was doing though was enslaving people to years of extra debt, people who otherwise would be out of their mortgages free and clear, and all just so they could live in a nicer house like the rich and famous. It pushed up the price of RE across the nation too, I mean a $400k home + $250k reno is $650k. And at 7% interest compounded that's a lot more for a young couple to pay back.

So what the housing bubble debt prison did was take something (renos) which were formerly the purview of those on high incomes that could afford it, and turned it into a natural must have for anyone buying an old house. I see it all the time still, it's entrenched in the psyche of the nation now. My nephew is atypical, bought a rundown old house in a decent area and proceeded to gut it! New everything from walls to plumbing to fixtures. Then of course all new furniture. Well there's another 10 years out of his life whether he ultimately sells it to upgrade or not. Madness!

The consequences were obvious but are only now being spoken of in the mainstream.

More Australians set to retire in debt: AMP

The dream of debt-free homeownership at retirement is slipping away for more people despite increasing super balances, leaving older Australians increasingly exposed to interest rate changes.

Australians aged over 50 are expecting to retire with more debt than ever before, according to research to be released on Tuesday by AMP, with the Australian Bureau of Statistics showing a fourfold increase in household debt levels for those aged over 55 in the past 20 years.

An AMP survey of 1000 Australians aged 50 years and older indicated only one in seven people believed they would be mortgage-free when they retired, and one in nine expected to have more than $250,000 in unpaid debt. Data from the ABS shows average household debt ballooned from $62,000 in the 2003-04 financial years, to $242,000 in the 2021-22 financial years.

Not exactly a recipe for stress free retirement is it.

[kublikhan]

Dec 28, 2023 - The U.S. Department of Energy has made its second major lithium discovery this year, both of which promise to make the country self-sufficient in the critical battery metal for decades. The DoE has discovered a massive lithium deposit beneath California’s Salton Sea, holding an estimated 18 million tons of lithium.

According to the DoE, with expected technology advances, the Salton Sea region’s total resources could produce more than 3,400 kilotons of lithium, worth up to $540 billion and enough to support over 375 million batteries for electric vehicles (EV)—more than the total number of vehicles currently on U.S. roads.

The Salton Sea lithium deposit appears to be a real goldmine. After all, the DoE has revealed its Known Geothermal Resource Area (KGRA) has about 400 megawatts (MW) of geothermal electricity-generation capacity currently installed but has the potential for up to 2,950 MW. The DoE notes that the combined subsurface geology and geothermal activity in the Salton Sea’s KGRA result in high concentrations of lithium, among the highest concentrations of lithium contained in geothermal brines across the globe.

Bad News For Lithium Bulls
The U.S. could soon become self-sufficient in lithium, thanks to an upcoming technology: direct lithium extraction (DLE). DLE technologies aim to extract ~90% of lithium in brine water compared to 50% extraction rates using conventional ponds. Their biggest advantage is that they are capable of harvesting the metal in a matter of days, way faster than upwards of one year required to extract lithium carbonate from conventional evaporation ponds and open-pit mines. Direct lithium extraction also comes with an ESG/sustainability bonus because not only are DLE mines portable, but they are also able to recycle their fresh water and limit the use of hydrochloric acid. Advancements in direct lithium extraction might be great news for the EV sector, but are, unfortunately, certainly not the kind of news lithium bulls will rejoice over.

Fastmarkets has forecasted that commercial-scale DLE projects could start coming online as soon as 2025 and could supply 13% of global lithium demand by 2030.

Overall, The DLE industry could bring in more than $10 billion in annual revenue within the next decade. One of the lithium bears, Goldman Sachs, has forecast that lithium carbonate supply will grow at a brisk 33% annual clip, considerably faster than lithium demand which is expected to only grow at 25% p.a. If this prediction turns out to be accurate, we can expect lithium carbonate to remain depressed in the foreseeable future.

World's Largest Lithium Reserve Discovered Beneath California's Salton Sea

April 27, 2023 - The implementation of Direct Lithium Extraction (DLE) technologies has the potential to significantly increase the supply of lithium from brine projects (much like shale did for oil), nearly doubling lithium production on higher recoveries and improving project returns, though with the added bonus of offering ESG/sustainability benefits, while also widening rather than steepening the lithium cost curve.

Potential game changing technology: A number of proven DLE technologies are emerging and being tested at scale, with a handful of projects already in commercial construction. While there may still be challenges around scalability and water consumption/ brine reinjection, with the ongoing efforts, DLE could be implemented between 2025-2030 in both Chile and Argentina, in our view (compared with market skepticism on development by 2030). We estimate on scenarios/ benchmarking the capital intensity range of DLE is comparable with a traditional pond project, where risk of a higher upfront capital intensity is potentially offset by lower unit costs.

Direct Lithium Extraction: A potential game changing technology

[kublikhan]

JAC Group’s Yiwei, a new EV brand in China backed by Volkswagen, debuted the first sodium-ion battery-powered electric car. The new JAC Yiwei EV rolled off the assembly line Wednesday. The new EV features sodium-ion cylindrical cells from HiNa Battery.

First sodium-ion battery-powered EV rolls out
The automaker also revealed the sodium-ion-battery-powered Sehol E10X, featuring 25 kWh of capacity and 120 Wh/kg of energy density. With 3C to 4C charging, the electric hatchback could recharge from 10% to 80% in 20 minutes.

Although sodium-ion batteries have a lower energy density than lithium-ion ones, they do offer several advantages. According to JAC, they have better low-temperature performance, faster charging speeds, longer lifespans, and increased durability over time. Perhaps most importantly, the batteries use cheaper raw materials, which can enable lower EV prices.

Volkswagen-backed EV maker rolls out first sodium-ion battery powered electric car

Yiwei, a new EV subsidiary of JAC Group and backed by Volkswagen, debuted the first sodium-ion battery-powered electric car on Wednesday.

The sodium-ion-battery features 25 kWh of capacity and 120 Wh/kg of energy density.[Lead acid batteries have an energy density of 30-50 Wh/kg] According to the manufacturer, the electric hatchback could recharge from 10% to 80% in 20 minutes with 3C to 4C charging. In comparison, Tesla current Model 3 battery comes with an energy density of about 260 Wh/kg; Model 3 Rear-Wheel Drive has a 57.5 kWh usable battery capacity, topping out at 75 kWh for both the Model 3 Long Range and Model 3 Performance.

Chinese Carmakers Launch Sodium-Ion Battery-Powered EVs

Today, sodium ion batteries have roughly half the energy density of lithium ion batteries. That means shorter range, which is the opposite of what most people want in their electric cars. However, there are many markets in which people are more than happy to have lower range, especially if the price is right. China is one such market where low priced, no frills cars are welcome. One of its most popular electric cars is the Wuling Mini.

JMEV, an EV brand owned by Jiangling Motors Group, will offer a version of its EV3 fitted with sodium ion batteries from Farasis Energy next year. The first of those cars rolled of the assembly line on December 28, 2023.

The current EV3 uses lithium batteries and has a 31 kWh battery pack and a range of 301 km, using the very optimistic CLTC standard. The sodium battery pack will be rated at 21.4 kWh and will have a range of 251 km. List price will be 58,800 RMB ($8,306), which is about $500 less than the EV3. Is that enough of a difference to make up for the loss of about 50 km of range? For some, the answer will be yes.

The sodium ion batteries from Farasis Energy have energy densities in the range of 140-160 Wh/kg, and the battery cells have passed tests including pin-prick, overcharging, and extrusion, according to the company. It says it will launch its second generation sodium ion battery with an energy density of 160-180 Wh/kg later in 2024. By 2026, it expects its sodium ion battery products will have an energy density of 180-200 Wh/kg.

Electric Cars Powered By Sodium Ion Batteries Go On Sale In China

Sodium-ion battery safety
While it is often claimed that sodium-ion batteries are safer than lithium-ion batteries, only little data is currently available on the potential safety risks of sodium-ion batteries. The use of flammable organic electrolytes carries the same safety risk as lithium-ion batteries. Some research groups have started looking at the effect of thermal abuse of sodium-ion batteries, and it has been shown that during a thermal runaway, flammable gases from the electrolyte are emitted. However, the use of different cathode and anode materials in sodium-ion batteries might also allow for the use of different electrolyte solvents with higher safety.

It also needs to be differentiated between the various cathode materials used in sodium-ion batteries. Polyanionic materials might behave differently to the layered oxides - similarly to the observations made for lithium-ion batteries, where, for instance, LiFePO4 (LFP) presents higher thermal stability than LiNiMnCoO2 (NMC) materials. More in-depth studies are needed to understand the effect of the various failure mechanisms (thermal, electrical, mechanical) on chemical reactions happening in sodium-ion batteries and the related safety implications.

Guide to Sodium-Ion Batteries: Are They Ready to Replace Lithium?

[kublikhan]

At the moment, lithium ion (Li-ion) is the top choice for solar batteries, as this type is very reliable and can be found in leading battery storage products, including the Tesla Powerwall, Generac PWRcell, and LG Chem. However, sodium ion batteries are a promising technology, because they will be safer to use and theoretically cheaper to produce.

Key takeaways
* Sodium ion batteries are rechargeable batteries that use similar technology to lithium ion batteries.
* Compared to lithium, sodium batteries are cheaper to produce, safer to use, and operate better in extreme temperatures, but sodium batteries of equal capacity are heavier and larger than their lithium equivalents.

Code: Select all

Table 1. Sodium ion vs. NMC vs. LFP batteries
                Sodium ion                  NMC                LFP
Availability    Still under development     Widely available   Widely available
Cost           Cheapest                     Cheaper            Most expensive
Energy density  Lowest                      Highest            Moderate
Safety          Safest                      Least safe         Safer than NMC
efficiency      92%                         90-95%             92-98%



Are sodium ion batteries the next big thing in solar storage?

[theluckycountry]

Most New technologies now are pumped up in the media as being game changers but they invariable turn out to be white elephants. The purpose of the hype is to lure investment capital, to push up share prices, to get the whole thing on the paper money whirligig so profits can be extracted without labor or sales of real things. That's where the biggest profits come from now, not manufacturing or mining or construction, but from the manipulation of Money.

These scams can, and often do, take years to play out and over that period hundreds of Billions can be milked from investors. The IT bubble and collapse was the first wake-up call of our modern era but hardly anyone it seems learned the lesson. "Don't believe the Hype."

2017-- How The Shale Boom Turned The World Upside Down https://www.forbes.com/sites/rrapier/20 ... b18fe077d2

2019-- The US shale revolution has reshaped the energy landscape https://www.iea.org/news/the-us-shale-r ... icy-review

2020-- With U.S. shale peaking & having “never made money,” investors lose billions https://priceofoil.org/2020/06/26/with- ... -billions/

2020-- U.S. Shale Has Lost $300 Billion In 15 Years https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-Gene ... Years.html

2022-- Is the U.S. shale oil revolution over? https://www.reuters.com/markets/commodi ... 022-11-22/

We could look at the mortgage mill housing scam of the 00's, the crypto bubble, the SPAC swindle, they all have the same fingerprints, Experts, politicians and academia telling us that the world has changed and we'll be left behind if we don't buy into this new financial scheme or technology.

[kublikhan]

Yeah I generally don't like to get the first generation of a product for exactly that reason. I'm going to wait until these have been out for awhile, purchased, reviewed, tested, destroyed, etc. There are some parallels here to the thin film solar cell debacle. All these companies had a product cheaper than traditional silicon solar cells. Then the price of silicon solar panels fell like a rock. Oops, there goes thin film's biggest advantage over the competition. Cue bankruptcies.

Not too long ago we saw skyrocketing prices for lithium, cobalt, and nickel, all key ingredients in lithium ion batteries. High prices cause people to begin looking for alternatives and sodium ion's cheap price looked promising. But now we see the price of lithium, cobalt, and nickel cratering. Oops, sodium ion batteries may have just lost some of their shine. Well time will tell how this one plays out.

[ralfy]

EVs require combinations of material resources and energy, and they include significant inputs of fossil fuels. The same applies not only to renewable energy components but even consumer goods that people need or like to have.

Overall, such a lifestyle would require an ecological footprint of four global hectares or higher per capita, or way above what the biosphere allows. Meanwhile, the drive to access more resources include more environmental damage.

None of these things are factored into for-profit corporations that want to maximize profits by maximizing sales by maximizing production which also leads to more environmental damage. Most people don't mind because 70 pct live on less than $10 daily and want to earn and spend more, and the other 30 pct are counting on them to earn and spend more because maximized profits can be used to increase mining operations further.

[theluckycountry]

EVs require combinations of material resources and energy, and they include significant inputs of fossil fuels. ...Overall, such a lifestyle would require an ecological footprint of four global hectares or higher per capita...

At this point in time ALL technology is a threat to mankind and his habitat. The newer the tech the more complex, the more complex the greater the amount of materials and mining and the greater the amount of transportation needed to put it together package and deliver it. EV's are just one more step in the wrong direction. An ecological disaster as are household LIPO battery units.

[mousepad]

None of these things are factored into for-profit corporations that want to maximize profits by maximizing sales by maximizing production which also leads to more environmental damage.

What about non-profit operations? If I changed my oil company into a non-profit, would that help?
Or what about communism? Do you think a lithium mine under communism doesn't degrade nature?

Do you think the former soviet union was a good steward of nature and the environment?

What about north korea? Do you think deforestation because of demand for fuel is acceptable because they are communist, and therefore "good" in your eyes?

[ralfy]

None of these things are factored into for-profit corporations that want to maximize profits by maximizing sales by maximizing production which also leads to more environmental damage.

What about non-profit operations? If I changed my oil company into a non-profit, would that help?
Or what about communism? Do you think a lithium mine under communism doesn't degrade nature?

Do you think the former soviet union was a good steward of nature and the environment?

What about north korea? Do you think deforestation because of demand for fuel is acceptable because they are communist, and therefore "good" in your eyes?

It won't matter because most people have basic needs and wants. The amount to provide the first will require the equivalent of one more earth and the second up to four more.

[theluckycountry]

Even pre-industrial societies doomed themselves, typically by irrigation of crop lands which led to salts building up or by breeding up huge populations only to see their precious edifices abandoned when the droughts came. I think the Mongols had the only viable system but they more like a plague of locusts than a civilization. Our 'technologies' have allowed us to go much farther than all the prior civilizations but all that has done has guaranteed that the collapse will be off the charts when the food fails. An EV and a roof covered in solar won't help when the supermarkets are empty.

[theluckycountry]

Only 13 EVs Now Eligible For $7,500 Tax Credit Due To New Biden Admin Rules

Just as EV demand appeared to be nearing super-saturation, incentives for buying electric vehicles are starting to fall by the wayside.

There are now just 13 EV models that are eligible for a consumer tax credit of as much as $7,500 thanks to new Biden administration rules that took effect on January 1, according to Bloomberg. Previously, the number had stood closer to 24 models, but for the new year the tax credit excludes vehicles that use battery components manufactured by Chinese companies, the report says.

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/only- ... dmin-rules

[theluckycountry]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dnN82DsQ2k
Electric Vehicles' Battery Problem