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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Fri 15 May 2020, 18:44:54

Not just Tesla but all of the working class that have been sent home and kept there long after the money ran short or out will take a long look at the politicians that kept them from going to work.
Perhaps some Blue states will turn Red.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 31 Jan 2021, 20:32:04

On paper it looks like Tesla made a healthy product selling EVs in 2020......but when you dive into the numbers it turns out that Tesla makes most of its money selling tax credits to other companies that don't sell EVs

tesla-dirty-little-secret-profitability-not-from-EVs

I'm a little bit surprised by this..... I thought Tesla had finally turned the corner and become a "real" car company with real sales and real profits.

The problem with Tesla relying on selling tax credits to earn money is that (1) other car companies are bringing out their own EVs, so won't need to buy tax credits and (2) the tax credit racket is based on government laws that force car companies to buy tax credits.....and those laws can be changed at any time.

Hopefully TESLA will continue to mature and will continue to sell more cars and will eventually make the bulk of its money from selling EV cars.

But they aren't there yet.

Image
Why Elon Musk likes EV tax credits....

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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Tue 02 Feb 2021, 18:03:05

I see that one of the annalist set a price target for Tesla at $1200/share based on the projection that the Giga factories in Germany and Texas would come on line as expected.
It is up $32.98 today to $872.79 and my tiny sliver bought at $609 is up 43.8%. :-D
Here is a link if you care for the details.
https://www.streetinsider.com/Analyst+C ... 91113.html
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Mon 08 Feb 2021, 19:19:27

Oh-oh. Story just out that multiple Chinese regulators have gone to TESLA's China factory and urged the US company to come into compliance with Chinese laws and regulations.

tesla-urged-operate-according-china-law-four-separate-ccp-agencies

Anyone who's been following China knows that the CCP in China demands that foreign companies who want to operate in China must take on Chinese partners. Then, sometimes, the foreign technology is rapidly duplicated by a Chinese competitor, and the foreign company is forced out of China and replaced by the local Chinese company, who has somehow incorporated the modern technology.

For instance, European high speed train companies started out selling high speed train equipment to China, but then the Chinese somehow duplicated the technology and now all Chinese high speed rail manufacturing is done in China exclusively by Chinese companies.

I was concerned when Tesla built their factory in China that this might happen to Tesla. And sure enough.....a purely Chinese EV manufacturer called NIO has sprung up to compete with Tesla.

I'm keeping an eye on this new development. I wouldn't be surprised to see China put more and more obstacles in Tesla's way to enable Chinese EV maker NIO to outcompete Tesla and shut them out of China.

Image
Now its TESLA vs. NIO to win the Chinese EV market......and I predict the CCP is going to help NIO win

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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Tue 16 Feb 2021, 05:08:54

Plantagenet wrote:Oh-oh. Story just out that multiple Chinese regulators have gone to TESLA's China factory and urged the US company to come into compliance with Chinese laws and regulations.

tesla-urged-operate-according-china-law-four-separate-ccp-agencies

Anyone who's been following China knows that the CCP in China demands that foreign companies who want to operate in China must take on Chinese partners. Then, sometimes, the foreign technology is rapidly duplicated by a Chinese competitor, and the foreign company is forced out of China and replaced by the local Chinese company, who has somehow incorporated the modern technology.

For instance, European high speed train companies started out selling high speed train equipment to China, but then the Chinese somehow duplicated the technology and now all Chinese high speed rail manufacturing is done in China exclusively by Chinese companies.

I was concerned when Tesla built their factory in China that this might happen to Tesla. And sure enough.....a purely Chinese EV manufacturer called NIO has sprung up to compete with Tesla.

I'm keeping an eye on this new development. I wouldn't be surprised to see China put more and more obstacles in Tesla's way to enable Chinese EV maker NIO to outcompete Tesla and shut them out of China.

Image
Now its TESLA vs. NIO to win the Chinese EV market......and I predict the CCP is going to help NIO win

Cheers!

When Tesla can't sell any cars in China, be SURE and get back to us. :roll:

When Tesla can't build any cars or batteries in China, be SURE and get back to us. :idea:

Meanwhile, in the real world, I'm glad to see the authorities SIT on Musk when he violates the laws and standards. The US authorities should be doing a much better job on that front, given his far less than sterliing track record in that area.

I predict Musk will do what needs to be done to comply in China, as China is important to at least the short to intermediate success of Tesla. Oh, and China has plenty of leverage to force compliance over time considering that the Tesla plant in Shanghai is leased vs. owned by Tesla. Clearly, Tesla having their lease terminated is NOT in Tesla's best interests.

No wild rumor mongering, conspiracy theories, trolling, or arm waving necessary, BTW.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

Unread postby dolanbaker » Tue 16 Feb 2021, 08:48:19

Ironic that the Chinese are now very safety conscious, some of their earliest cars were real death traps!

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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Tue 16 Feb 2021, 16:40:43

Outcast_Searcher wrote:I predict Musk will do what needs to be done to comply in China, as China is important to .... the .... success of Tesla.


Of course.

But is Tesla important to the success of China? Or would the Chinese rather see Tesla be replaced in China by a Chinese EV maker?

China has a bad record when it comes to stealing technology from western businesses and then using it to foster Chinese companies that wind up competing against the US companies. I don't think Tesla is immune to this kind of Chinese activity.

And even though you are blind to the risk that China may use their governmental power to tilt the playing field against Tesla in China, people in the business community see this risk quite clearly. For instance, consider this article in CNN:

Elon Musk's love-in with China may be over as regulators go after Tesla

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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Tue 16 Feb 2021, 21:47:51

Plantagenet wrote:
Outcast_Searcher wrote:I predict Musk will do what needs to be done to comply in China, as China is important to .... the .... success of Tesla.


Of course.

But is Tesla important to the success of China? Or would the Chinese rather see Tesla be replaced in China by a Chinese EV maker?

China has a bad record when it comes to stealing technology from western businesses and then using it to foster Chinese companies that wind up competing against the US companies. I don't think Tesla is immune to this kind of Chinese activity.

And even though you are blind to the risk that China may use their governmental power to tilt the playing field against Tesla in China, people in the business community see this risk quite clearly. For instance, consider this article in CNN:

Elon Musk's love-in with China may be over as regulators go after Tesla

Cheers!

Like I said, when Tesla can't sell any cars in China, be SURE and get back to us.

Not that I'd expect you to stop twisting facts and evading issues to try and make your political points, like that EV's cause cancer. :roll:
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 3 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Tue 16 Feb 2021, 22:11:53

Outcast_Searcher wrote:when Tesla can't sell any cars in China, be SURE and get back to us.


Your suggestion that Tesla won't be able to sell any cars in China is silly.

Outcast_Searcher wrote:Not that I'd expect you to stop twisting facts and evading issues to try and make your political points


You're the one making the bizarre suggestion that Tesla won't be able to sell any cars in China. No one ever said that but you, so clearly it is you who are twisting facts and evading issues in order to make your half-baked political points.

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China doesn't have to stop Tesla from selling any cars in order to hurt Tesla....all China has to do is aggressively enforce Chinese government regulations on Tesla enough to slow Tesla production and reduce Tesla sales so Chinese EV manufacturer NIO comes to dominate the internal Chinese market instead of Tesla.

If this idea is too complicated for you to understand, then I suggest you go to my post above and click on my link to the CNN-BUSINESS article on the Chinese threat to Tesla in China where this idea explained at greater length.

Image
Nio EV sales are growing fast and are now beating the pants off Tesla EV sales in China.....and this trend will accelerate if the Chinese government takes actions that help NIO.

Cheers!
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