Donate Bitcoin

Donate Paypal


PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby dohboi » Thu 01 Aug 2019, 21:29:52

Societies who have successfully integrated other groups generally are stronger and more resilient. Even at the corporate level, it has been pretty well proven that corporate boards and other decision making bodies make better decisions if they have a diversity of perspectives upon which to draw.

In biology and society, purity + death
User avatar
dohboi
Harmless Drudge
Harmless Drudge
 
Posts: 18458
Joined: Mon 05 Dec 2005, 03:00:00

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby asg70 » Thu 01 Aug 2019, 21:35:23

Come on, man. The US can't even handle the strain of two political parties without states threatening to secede into red vs. blue. Society in the US can't even avoid getting in arguments over our damn entertainment. Society is one huge Twitter dumpster-fire.

HALL OF SHAME:
-Short welched on a bet and should be shunned.
-Frequent-flyers should not cry crocodile-tears over climate-change.
asg70
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2883
Joined: Sun 05 Feb 2017, 13:17:28

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby dohboi » Thu 01 Aug 2019, 22:50:50

User avatar
dohboi
Harmless Drudge
Harmless Drudge
 
Posts: 18458
Joined: Mon 05 Dec 2005, 03:00:00

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Fri 02 Aug 2019, 16:47:49

asg70 wrote:You know, I come to a place like this, and I expect a less idealistic vision of humanity, considering that we're hurtling towards a malthusian catastrophe at full speed (not helped in the least by reckless muslim birthrates). But some people still cling to some fantasy kumbaya attitudes.

Don't whine about it (our civilization) going down the drain. You won't save it anyway.
All this humanity... equality... civility...
Such a joke these days.
And when I hear word "freedom" from mouth of *any* politician, I do not know, should I laugh or cry.
Let all of it go to hell, where it belongs. At this point there is nothing to miss.
Get over with it.
User avatar
EnergyUnlimited
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 5578
Joined: Mon 15 May 2006, 02:00:00

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby tire » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 16:21:15

Ibon wrote:Don't be duped. Wake up and think for yourself instead of regurgitating bullshit you read on the internet.


Wow. I expected more from you. I thought you're the philosopher around here. I hope that's not your standard answer for you guest in case one of them doesn't share your opinion.

Du kennst mich nicht, weisst nicht meinen Hntergrund, noch meine Herkunft. Weder meinen Wohnort noch meine Werte. Du weisst nicht was ich gelernt habe und wo ich gewesen war und was ich erlebt habe.

And despite of this you're quick with judgement. I think you can do better.

But I agree with you, small farm town is dying, but not only in the US, all over the world.
I based my comment regarding still active civic involvement of small town US on only 1 data point I have. That's my observation of small towns in Vermont. I experienced an extraordinary involvement of town activity and no-pay volunteering across the board. From fire fighting, to recreational committees, to libraries, school, etc. If it has anything to do with the town, you can be certain there's volunteers doing it for free. Old dairy farms have vanished, but they have been replaced by successful niche product farmers and processors. Heirloom vegetables, cheeses, beers, hemp, and many more.

Like in any other industry you have to innovate to be successful. Just because dairy was the name of the game 50 years ago doesn't mean it still is.

Relaying on cheap mexicans and playing the price game is a race to the bottom a small farm cannot win.

Those politicians today who talk of representing small farmers and then spew their racist anti immigrant bullshit are NOT representing the best interest of American farmers.


Politicians have nobody else on their mind but themselves, and then their religion of GROWTH. I hope you understand that.

But do you really think opening a border wide and letting millions of low skilled low educated people in is in the best interest of farmers? Best interest of the nation?

Hmmm. I have my doubt. I hope, you too.
We would first need to know what the best interest is. Is it GROWTH, MONEY for you? I'm saddened to hear that. For me it's not and I thought for you, too, "best interest" was a bit more intangible.
tire
Wood
Wood
 
Posts: 37
Joined: Tue 16 Jul 2019, 09:18:19

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby tire » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 16:29:59

dohboi wrote:Perhaps you find all of this inconceivable. I don't know and don't care.


Yes. I understand that you don't care. You seem to be a simpleton. But you also seem agitated easily. Are you sure that multi-kulti is good for you? I expected more ZEN out of you. After all you're embedded in a perfectly harmonious community. So you say, at least. :-)
tire
Wood
Wood
 
Posts: 37
Joined: Tue 16 Jul 2019, 09:18:19

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby Sys1 » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 17:10:28

Mouse Utopia Experiment is really interesting and we obviously have something worth at least a thread if not a philosophical analysis.
It reminds me the movie "Idiocracy", a satirical dystopia where stupid people breed like rabbits while clever ones tend to have less or no child. Ultimately, the movie reminds us that the ability for mankind to survive as a specie could paradoxaly promote dumb ones because our industrial civilisation filled with artificial assistance and way of living (drugs, processed food, stupid leisures) cancels natural selection.

Do you want to know more?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTMybQuRZ6E
User avatar
Sys1
Tar Sands
Tar Sands
 
Posts: 962
Joined: Fri 25 Feb 2005, 03:00:00

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby Newfie » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 17:31:07

I’ve seen this discussed, not in much detail, in a variety of books including Jared Diamond. I recently read our brains have decreased in volume about 20% from the high point. Not sure when that was.
User avatar
Newfie
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 13245
Joined: Thu 15 Nov 2007, 03:00:00
Location: Between Canada and Carribean

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby Ibon » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 17:47:28

tire wrote:But do you really think opening a border wide and letting millions of low skilled low educated people in is in the best interest of farmers? Best interest of the nation?
.


Erstens, entschuldigung die tone meiner vorherige antwort. selten aber machmals mache Ich die Falsche Einschaetzung, hoffentlich in deiner fall du werdst mich beweisen dass Ich tatsaechlich die falsche einschaetzung von dir gemacht habe, wir werden sehen.

Anyway, my father grew up on a farm in Eastern Pennsylvania, I have an Anabaptist background, you know like the Amish and Mennonites. When my fathers family ran their farm they had another family that lived with them in a small wooden house out behind the barn. The father of this other family was a farm laborer that worked for my grandfather. He raised his family and worked almost 30 years for my grandfather as a laborer. It isn't really relevant but just to not confuse any pre conceived notions anyone might have, this family who provided labor on my dads farm where Irish white immigrants. Back then in the first half of the 20th century it was not uncommon for farms to hire out laborers and also invite them to live on their farms and build them homes and help support their families.
From WWII forwards this arrangement shifted since the economy provided so many good jobs there were no longer any resident white legal immigrants who chose to do this labor. They all found better opportunities working in factories and moving into towns that supported rust belt industries. Of course the need for this farm labor did not disappear, it was replaced slowly through the decades mainly with Mexican immigrant farm workers, undocumented.

To answer you question, yes I do believe that the millions of immigrants right now today are an indispensable part of American agriculture.

Some links to consider:

https://www.farmprogress.com/dairy/how- ... rant-labor

https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2019/05 ... 557177342/

I am the first to support a guest worker program to legalize this important labor force that is so vital to many American farms. The fact that they are "illegal" is a legacy of intentional policy where blame is pretty equal with both main political parties.

We own a lodge and coffee farm in Panama. I have over 6 staff who earn between $ 15 and $ 20 a day. Without their help we could not financially function growing coffee. These workers are not exploited. They are well paid and are quite happy.

Most immigrant farm workers in America are treated very well by the farmers who hire them. Contrary to what many may think here on this site, these relationships often go back decades just like the family who worked 30 years for my grandfather on his farm.

We currently have an asshole president whose racism is politicizing this whole topic and using immigrants as scapegoats to prop up support with his racist base.

Many American farmers are suffering as a result and contrary to what many may think rural america is not a monolithic red Trump territory. An ex dairy farmer friend of mine from Wisconsin is a case in point.

I have little patience for the racist assholes on this site.

I love finishing a well reasoned post with emotional barbs.

I make no apologies to asshole racists.
Our resiliency resembles an invasive weed. We are the Kudzu Ape
blog: http://blog.mounttotumas.com/
website: http://www.mounttotumas.com
User avatar
Ibon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 7574
Joined: Fri 03 Dec 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Volcan, Panama

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby onlooker » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 18:11:22

"We are mortal beings doomed to die
User avatar
onlooker
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 10510
Joined: Sun 10 Nov 2013, 12:49:04
Location: NY, USA

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby Cog » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 19:25:05

The last refuge of a committed leftist is to play the racist card whenever the discussion goes against him. Comical and so predictable.
User avatar
Cog
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 12771
Joined: Sat 17 May 2008, 02:00:00
Location: Northern Kekistan

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby dohboi » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 19:31:02

Well said, again, Ibon.

And thanks for the German, folks. Mine's a bit rusty, but I managed to get most of that without resorting to google translate (which is usually sh!t anyway :) ).

These days it is more and more important to call people out on racism and bigotry. And of course we know ahead of time that they are going to clog up the discussion with tired, hackneyed accusations of playing the 'race card' etc. :)

Predictably pathetic, as usual...

Can we now get back on some kind of semblance of the topic, please?
User avatar
dohboi
Harmless Drudge
Harmless Drudge
 
Posts: 18458
Joined: Mon 05 Dec 2005, 03:00:00

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby Ibon » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 19:36:01

Cog wrote:The last refuge of a committed leftist is to play the racist card whenever the discussion goes against him. Comical and so predictable.


Trump is not the only one who knows how to bait. It took you less than two hours.
Our resiliency resembles an invasive weed. We are the Kudzu Ape
blog: http://blog.mounttotumas.com/
website: http://www.mounttotumas.com
User avatar
Ibon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 7574
Joined: Fri 03 Dec 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Volcan, Panama

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby Cog » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 20:24:37

Ibon wrote:
Cog wrote:The last refuge of a committed leftist is to play the racist card whenever the discussion goes against him. Comical and so predictable.


Trump is not the only one who knows how to bait. It took you less than two hours.


But it's so easy with you on the left. :lol: Since you think everything is about identity politics, you literally can't see the world any other way.
User avatar
Cog
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 12771
Joined: Sat 17 May 2008, 02:00:00
Location: Northern Kekistan

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby asg70 » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 20:32:52

I was grocery shopping today and they didn't even have ANY checkout staff. It was all self-serve. I was shocked. I had to punch in the produce and everything. Point being it's only a matter of time before farm work is completely automated.

HALL OF SHAME:
-Short welched on a bet and should be shunned.
-Frequent-flyers should not cry crocodile-tears over climate-change.
asg70
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2883
Joined: Sun 05 Feb 2017, 13:17:28

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby diemos » Sun 04 Aug 2019, 21:49:50

Guess again. Everything in farmwork that can be automated already has been.

Self checkout isn't automation. It's you volunteering to be an unpaid checkout clerk.
User avatar
diemos
Tar Sands
Tar Sands
 
Posts: 851
Joined: Fri 23 Sep 2005, 02:00:00

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby clif » Mon 05 Aug 2019, 01:23:42

so easy with you on the left. :lol: Since you think everything is about identity politics


Annnnnd ...... Cog has another of his clueless pot kettle moments.
How cathartic it is to give voice to your fury, to wallow in self-righteousness, in helplessness, in self-serving self-pity.
User avatar
clif
Tar Sands
Tar Sands
 
Posts: 597
Joined: Tue 11 Aug 2009, 12:04:10

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby Ibon » Mon 05 Aug 2019, 07:03:22

Cog wrote:
Ibon wrote:
Cog wrote:The last refuge of a committed leftist is to play the racist card whenever the discussion goes against him. Comical and so predictable.


Trump is not the only one who knows how to bait. It took you less than two hours.


But it's so easy with you on the left. :lol: Since you think everything is about identity politics, you literally can't see the world any other way.


I think you really didn't get it did you? So allow me to spell it out clearly. I wasn't suggesting that you were also baiting like Trump and came along 2 hours later chiming in. My emotional barb at the end of my post was a wiggly worm, a shiny lure. Yes I was baiting. And you took the hook in less than two hours.

It is not necessary to accuse anyone of being a racist. Just let them take the bait!
Our resiliency resembles an invasive weed. We are the Kudzu Ape
blog: http://blog.mounttotumas.com/
website: http://www.mounttotumas.com
User avatar
Ibon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 7574
Joined: Fri 03 Dec 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Volcan, Panama

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby asg70 » Mon 05 Aug 2019, 08:07:38

diemos wrote:Everything in farmwork that can be automated already has been.


Famous last words. The march for greater and greater automation never ends.

HALL OF SHAME:
-Short welched on a bet and should be shunned.
-Frequent-flyers should not cry crocodile-tears over climate-change.
asg70
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2883
Joined: Sun 05 Feb 2017, 13:17:28

Re: Are We Running the Mouse Utopia Experiment?

Unread postby Ibon » Mon 05 Aug 2019, 09:33:19

asg70 wrote:
diemos wrote:Everything in farmwork that can be automated already has been.


Famous last words. The march for greater and greater automation never ends.


Coffee, from the beginning planting seedlings through harvest is all human labor. There are many reasons having mainly to do with the botanical characteristics of the coffee tree that make automation prohibitive. Specialty cofee, the higher end of the market that we are dedicated to is especially dependent on trained human labor......

Commodity grains are one thing. Vegetables and picking fruit is something else.

Especially if your looking for quality.

Read the 2nd link on my above post regarding the sectors of agriculture that still require human labor
Our resiliency resembles an invasive weed. We are the Kudzu Ape
blog: http://blog.mounttotumas.com/
website: http://www.mounttotumas.com
User avatar
Ibon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 7574
Joined: Fri 03 Dec 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Volcan, Panama

PreviousNext

Return to Environment, Weather & Climate

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests