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Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Discussions about the economic and financial ramifications of PEAK OIL

Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 11 Jul 2020, 19:41:40

vtsnowedin wrote:The odds are we will have a fully Democrat government come January and Covid and the economy will then be fully in their hands. The establishment Dems will realize that if they let the far left have free reign they will create a backlash that will hand back the house or Senate in 2022 and house, senate and white house in 2024.
For the first two years the struggle will be within the party mostly behind closed doors and it will be how to hand the far left enough to keep their votes while not messing up everything else to the point they lose the voters in the center.
It's going to be like herding cats.


Thats one scenario.

Another scenario is that Biden will choose someone from the far left of the D party as his VP, and then in short order Biden will be shunted aside due to senility and/or lack of mental capacity and the far left VP will assume the presidency and the far left of the D party will then be in total control of the US government. I expect this happen after 6 months of so of Biden's first term....i.e. just about the same time as street mobs in DC will be tearing down the Jefferson and Washington Monuments because the Ds the Ds have told the police to stand aside and do nothing...

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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby shortonoil » Sat 11 Jul 2020, 19:46:16

Mass vaccination is at least a year away—if a workable vaccine can be produced.

https://www.resilience.org/stories/2020 ... avalanche/

Image
If anyone believes that the data shown represents the growth of a virus I have a bridge to sell you. This data represents the growth of a fictitious pathogen, and is as corrupt as the political system that has sat back an watched the most vulnerable die, and did nothing to protect them while they bailed out the banks and zombie companies with $trillions in fake money.

Mass vaccination depends on where you are. Russia will be initiating theirs in the next two months.

Volunteers who received a Russian-made Covid-19 vaccine have developed immunity to the virus, according to the country’s Ministry of Defense. Clinical trials for the drug are now in their final stage.


At the end of June, Russian Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu reported that trials should be over by the end of July. If completed successfully, it is planned that the vaccine will be registered in August and immediately put into mass production.

https://www.rt.com/russia/494361-covid1 ... nal-stage/

While the $trillion US pharm industry has spent the last 20 years attempting to produce a vaccine for the SARS virus, tiny little Russia has produced one in 8 months, and will deliver it in 10. The US economy is in taters, and will likely never recover, while Russia, and its allies have barely been touched. The incredibly corrupt US political system has used the yearly flu to further enrich the elite, while it destroyed the nation's economy, and trampled over the Constitution and everyone's individual rights. Millions have been left destitute with no avenue of escape but to beg at the federal money trough for a meager handout. COVID-19 has been another weapons of mass destruction, or 9/11 fake attack to strip the US of its wealth, and power. When the $ goes down, which is next on the schedule, the empire will fall. Civilization will then move east of Berlin, and the West will be left to muddle in its shit pile of a dystopian night mare.

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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby JuanP » Sat 11 Jul 2020, 20:57:28

"The pandemic reveals the real disease of our societies" Moon of Alabama
https://www.moonofalabama.org/2020/07/t ... eties.html

A good read on the relation between pandemic effects and social classes with some interesting maps that reveal some very interesting overlaps between miles driven, black population, and pandemic effects in the USA. I know correlation doesn't prove causation, but the correlations are remarkable and difficult to ignore.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Sat 11 Jul 2020, 21:01:37

Plantagenet wrote:Thats one scenario.

Another scenario is that Biden will choose someone from the far left of the D party as his VP, and then in short order Biden will be shunted aside due to senility and/or lack of mental capacity and the far left VP will assume the presidency and the far left of the D party will then be in total control of the US government. I expect this happen after 6 months of so of Biden's first term....i.e. just about the same time as street mobs in DC will be tearing down the Jefferson and Washington Monuments because the Ds the Ds have told the police to stand aside and do nothing...

Cheers!

I think yours is less likely. Candidates once nominated usually turn toward the center as that is the wisest path to victory. Biden's stated positions are already so far left as to hand Trump ample ammunition especially on taxes. It makes a nice movie plot to have them contrive a stroke or heart attack for Biden to put in the VP but if the VP is a radical leftist it might cost them the election.
Unless they get a very big crane the BLMs will have quite a time tearing down the Washington monument. It is built of heavy granite marble and gneiss blocks and weighs 40,000 tons.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 11 Jul 2020, 22:36:10

vtsnowedin wrote: It makes a nice movie plot to have them contrive a stroke or heart attack for Biden to put in the VP ...


The D leftists don't have to "contrive a stroke or heart attack" for Biden. All they have to do is demonstrate Biden is in cognitive decline and can't do the job of President........and IMHO its already clear that Biden is in cognitive decline. Yes...Biden can still read a teleprompter but if Biden has to do something has hand't been prepped for... like answer unscripted questions or walk across a stage .... then he explodes in anger or forgets what the question was in mis answer or gets lost right on the stage. Its pretty pathetic.

if Biden selects Kamala Harris or some other far left D as his VP, then I suggest he get a taster for his food.

vtsnowedin wrote: Unless they get a very big crane the BLMs will have quite a time tearing down the Washington monument. It is built of heavy granite marble and gneiss blocks and weighs 40,000 tons.


Then they'll start with the Jefferson statue in the Jefferson monument. Its already on the list to be vandalized and removed.

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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby shortonoil » Sun 12 Jul 2020, 15:22:27

Russian University Successfully Completes First COVID-19 Vaccine Trials

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ ... ine-trials

The story comes with a caveat. The trials were solely intended to show that the vaccine is safe for human consumption and use. Several trials for therapeutics and vaccines in the west have also completed at least some trials proving safety. According to Alexander Lukashev, the director of the Institute of Medical Parasitology, Tropical, and Vector-Borne Diseases at Sechenov University, the safety objective was successfully achieved.


The Western press is still attempting to down play the amazing feat now being dispalyed by the Russian medical industry. The $trillion Western pharmacutcal industry has been attempting to develop a vaccine against the SARS coronavirus for the last 20 years, with litttle to nothing to show for it.

On June 30, Russian Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu reported to President Vladimir Putin that trials should be over by the end of July. It’s expected that the vaccine will be registered in August and be put into mass production as early as possible.


The Russians will have developed a vaccine, mass produced it, and distributed it in less than a year. If the US had an equally competent medical community it might still have an economy, and there would have been no reason for voodoo science like lock downs and face masks. Sleazy little bureaucrats like Dr. FrankenFaucci wouldn't have been playing pimp for the pharmaceutical industry, and footsie with the WHO while our elderly needlessly died.

https://www.rt.com/russia/494361-covid1 ... nal-stage/
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby JuanP » Sun 12 Jul 2020, 16:37:16

"With COVID-19 vaccine almost ready, Russia intends to create special version - just for kids."
https://www.rt.com/russia/494490-russia ... s-vaccine/
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby shortonoil » Wed 15 Jul 2020, 14:37:45

OPENING UP THE ECONOMY IN RUSSIA

Opening up the economy is going to be a push over if you are a Russian; they have a vaccine. All of this irrational fear of the flu is going to pay off big for Russia. The rich and famous of the world will be flocking there for their vacations; get the shot, spend two weeks touring its many ancient and beautiful cities, and get the booster before leaving piles of money and going home. Russia will become the vacation spot of the world. Vlad is going to need an extra piggy bank to stuff all the money into. COVID-19 in Russian means piles of loot!
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby JuanP » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 10:44:43

"Unemployed Americans are spending more than when they had jobs, thanks to COVID-19 benefits - JPMorgan"
https://www.rt.com/business/494905-jobl ... -spending/

These confirms several stories I've heard and other evidence I've seen here in Miami. If and when those benefits end, the US economy could experience a deeper crisis.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby REAL Green » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 11:54:26

JuanP wrote:These confirms several stories I've heard and other evidence I've seen here in Miami. If and when those benefits end, the US economy could experience a deeper crisis.


Well, JuanP, that would sure fill you with joy. The one issue to consider is the US is more likely to recognize and rationalize losses where China and Europe kick the can down the road with the the result being a zombie economy held together by duct tape.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby dirtyharry » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 12:50:25

REAL Green wrote:
JuanP wrote:These confirms several stories I've heard and other evidence I've seen here in Miami. If and when those benefits end, the US economy could experience a deeper crisis.


Well, JuanP, that would sure fill you with joy. The one issue to consider is the US is more likely to recognize and rationalize losses where China and Europe kick the can down the road with the the result being a zombie economy held together by duct tape.

Real, kicking the can down the road was started by the Lyndon Johnson administration when it went blazing in the Vietnam war and started the printing presses to promise the American public ^Guns and Butter^ . So don't pass the buck to EU, Chinese and Japanese who are only playing ^follow the leader ^ . As to rationalizing and recognizing the losses and zombie companies ,you must be joking . Running QE infinity ,ZIRP and running a deficit of +$ 22 Trillion (official) ,giving funds to Boeing ,American Airlines ,Amtrak etc all zombies . The treasury in collusion with the Congress and the Senate will keep funding them until it all falls apart . From where I come we have a saying ^ When you point a finger at someone ,remember the other three are pointing towards you .^
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Plantagenet » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 13:01:09

dirtyharry wrote: When you point a finger at someone ,remember the other three are pointing towards you .


Thats a silly saying.....in reality all fingers are not the same.

We point with the pointing finger. Thats why its called the pointing finger.

The other fingers aren't used for pointing.

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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby dirtyharry » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 13:13:27

Plantagenet wrote:
dirtyharry wrote: When you point a finger at someone ,remember the other three are pointing towards you .


Thats a silly saying.....in reality all fingers are not the same.

We point with the pointing finger. Thats why its called the pointing finger.

The other fingers aren't used for pointing.

Image

Cheers!

Read carefully . I said ^ From where I come from ^ and definitely you are not from there . To each his own customs and traditions . We agree to disagree . No offence taken or given .
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Plantagenet » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 13:21:56

dirtyharry wrote: Read carefully . I said ^ From where I come from ^ and definitely you are not from there . To each his own customs and traditions . We agree to disagree . No offence taken or given .


Thank you for your courteous replay.

I always read carefully. In fact, I noted what you said about where you come from and before I made my post above I googled up the phrase in question to see where it "came from."

Google brought up several examples of the phrase being used in the English language but I couldn't find any indication that the phrase question was borrowed or in any way associated with another culture or some wonderful foreign country.

So, just out of curiousity, where precisely do you come from?

Cheers!

PS: I must also note that you were "pointing a finger" at LBJ when you blamed him for all the ills of modern monetary policy in all countries around the world. My point is that its just human nature to point the finger and try to find out what has caused certain things to happen and then to lay blame on the appropriate people.

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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby shortonoil » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 13:23:54

UK Accuses Russia-Backed Hackers Of Trying To Steal COVID-19 Vaccine Research
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ ... e-research

Things that make you go Hummm! Ain't that rich. The Russians already have a working vaccine. The UK doesn't, so the Russians are getting blamed for stealing something from the UK that it doesn't have. If this bug loses any more credibility they will have to scrap it off the Queens windshield with a putty knife. Maybe the UK got its hand stuck in the Russian cookie jar again, and the media can not spit, stutter, or grunt that the Russians have a working vaccine. Hope they choke on it.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Plantagenet » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 13:53:12

shortonoil wrote:UK Accuses Russia-Backed Hackers Of Trying To Steal COVID-19 Vaccine Research
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ ... e-research

Things that make you go Hummm! Ain't that rich. The Russians already have a working vaccine. .


Perhaps they are trying to hack the Brits to get one that actually works.

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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby REAL Green » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 15:16:04

dirtyharry wrote:Real, kicking the can down the road was started by the Lyndon Johnson administration when it went blazing in the Vietnam war and started the printing presses to promise the American public ^Guns and Butter^ .


Wow, dirty, you are reaching back in time there. Why not keep it a little bit more current events. We are in a new century or are you one of those Euros lost in the past?

dirtyharry wrote:As to rationalizing and recognizing the losses and zombie companies ,you must be joking . Running QE infinity ,ZIRP and running a deficit of +$ 22 Trillion (official) ,giving funds to Boeing ,American Airlines ,Amtrak etc all zombies .


LOL, dirty, you are confusing subsidies for the national champions with the economic systems. There are no comparisons with subsidies. Hands down the Chinese are the most vigorous with the Euros a close second. The US does it too but much more indirectly. Yet, my point is how the US economy is more open to bankruptcies than China or Europe. China has just started allowing big firms to go bust. In the past especially with state industries it rarely happened. Europe is a little bit better but in Europe companies have a much greater social responsibility than in the states. This has pluses and negatives but eventually pain has to be realized or the systematic rot is worse.

dirtyharry wrote: The treasury in collusion with the Congress and the Senate will keep funding them until it all falls apart .


LOL, again, dirty, They all do the collusion of fiscal and monetary policy. You do realize that don't you?

dirtyharry wrote:From where I come we have a saying ^ When you point a finger at someone ,remember the other three are pointing towards you .^


Dirty, the finger pointing was to the finger pointer JuanP who is constantly bombarding this forum with anti-Americanism. You are just enabling this bad behavior by your comment. Go back a comment and see where he started it then get back to me about finger pointing.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby shortonoil » Thu 16 Jul 2020, 16:31:49

Perhaps they are trying to hack the Brits to get one that actually works.


It is more likely that the Brits don't want to spend another 20 years looking for something that they aren't smart enough to find. The SARS vaccine has been slipping through their fingers since the early 2000's. The Brits are working hand in hand with Moderna that has a history of producing vaccines that make more people sick than they cure. In the meantime the Russians are planning on producing 200 million doses in collaboration with several other countries. There should be about 1,000 companies in the immediate future who will be scheduling visits to foreign countries where Americans and Brits can get vaccinated. The US pharmaceutical industry is gong to make sure over your dead body that it isn't going to happen here, and even if it does it still might be over your dead body, and maybe an RFID chip for good measure.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby REAL Green » Fri 17 Jul 2020, 05:14:11

I posted a longish article that indicates a tech cold war between the US and China is going to be very disruptive to high tech. High tech is currently critical for growth. The numbers thrown around indicate another huge hit to global growth. The reason this is a hit is the world does not have that kind of cash with all the other disruptions. Remember, this is not an investment that will yield more growth these costs are retrenchment costs. Some sectors and regions will see construction growth but overall this is a recessionary force. This means renewables, AI, and automation will be cut back. The money has to come from somewhere. This is just yet another headwind and weight on global growth that is critical to maintain affluence everyone has become habituated to.

There is a disconnect because of the Ponzi financialization of the global system that the money will be found. This is mainly because financial wealth is created and in the past this has maintained liquidity. Physical of factories and the abstract of knowledge and skills of the global tech supply chains cannot be created in the same instant way. This article is talking huge numbers and a relatively longish timeframe in the modern sense to adapt a new global supply network for tech to a cold war divided economic world. This will involve redundancies which will further hamper new efficient growth. It may be the case a restructuring creates more security and less systematic risk but the key point is less affluence at a time when the pandemic has already crippled healthy growth. It is the summation of these negative global economic conditions that will converge and weigh heavily on future growth. Techno optimist wishing upon new technologies to save mankind might be a bit misplaced until these issues correct. IOW this won’t end well for development but instead points to an economic degrowth period.

“The Tech Cold War Between The US And China Will Cost $3.5 Trillion In Just The Next Five Years”
https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/tech- ... five-years

“How much would a Tech Cold War Cost? That's the question DB's new tech strategist Apjit Walia asks in a new research report, in which he looks at the interplay between the Post Covid Tech Rally and the Tech Cold War, which have emerged as two of the most salient aspects of the current market dynamic. And with tensions between US and China continuing to rise and spread to other parts of the world, the strategist conducts a top-down analysis of the impact on the Global Information & Communications Technology sector from a full-blown cold war. The report finds that the ensuing demand disruption, supply chain upheaval and resultant “Tech Wall” that would delineate the world into rivaling tech standards could cost the sector more than $3.5 Trillion over the next five years…US and China have been engaging in an increasing capacity since the 1970s and the level of integration between the two global tech regimes is unprecedented. The integration is a complex demand and labyrinthine supply chain network that has taken 40 years to develop. DB uses a top down approach to ascertain the level of revenues and supply chain links across the global ICT industries to China. To analyze and quantify this complex co-dependent Tech relationship between the two countries is a challenging task…Globally, China has about 13% of revenues of the ICT sector amounting to around $730 Billion per annum. However, a significant part of this is demand from the Chinese tech sector that is re-exported after some value-add, assembly and packaging (“re-export demand”) - this constitutes supply chain risk…Supply Chain Risk A transition out of Mainland China could take 5-8 years to achieve successfully. Lack of infrastructure, clustered networks and skilled labor in other countries versus China are major obstacles. Vietnam, India, Malaysia, Indonesia and Philippines are the primary targets for this transition but most of them would need significant infrastructure upgrades to catch up with the Chinese supply chain cluster strength. In most categories, exports outstrip imports, except for electronic components, where imports are 3x of exports. Electronic components, such as semiconductors are imported and used as inputs in consumer goods and communication equipment and exported out of China…The average cost of rebuilding the supply chain will be approximately 1.5 to 2x of the book value based on feedback from Tech managements and supply chain experts. Using a sustainable capex rate, it would take 5-8 years to relocate the supply chains. The cost of a transition over a five year period would come to around $1 Trillion. Tech Wall Risk On top of the demand disruption and supply chain upheaval, it would be unavoidable for Tech companies to operate efficiently in a large part of the "Non Aligned" world without complying with the two rivaling global standards that would come up as the cold war heats up. The Tech Wall would entail rival internet platforms, satellite communication networks, telecom infrastructure regimes, CPU architectures, operating systems, IOT networks and payment systems with very little inter-operability or interaction. It would mean having to deploy two different communication and networking standards across several geographies to ensure inter-operability. In this new world order, these non-aligned countries would require companies to have dual standard compliance to operate there. A divergence in standards could increase costs in multiple ways. Increased R&D, design, product development and related costs for manufacturers. Increased costs of compliance to different IP, networking, data privacy/localization regimes for corporates. Loss of interoperability of devices across geographies for consumer…The hardware industries which predominantly have both revenue and supply chain dependence on China respond sharply to escalations. Industries with lower revenue exposure to China display defensive characteristics during rising tensions, and fall in the top left quadrant. Software and service display defensive characteristics as they have very limited revenue exposure to China. Telecom service providers have limited revenue exposure and their returns appear to be uncorrelated to escalation events…Anticipated policy support from governments given the centrality of the sector to nation states in geopolitical tech relevance is also touted as a driving factor in multiples. Clearly, Semis are key to retaining tech supremacy and form the backbone of any AI or Software enhancements to institutions and countries. However, there remains one tail case scenario and that is in the event of disengagement and escalation of the cold war, Semiconductors will see significant market share and supply chain disruption that will be too big to be offset by government policy support and central bank liquidity. This scenario does not seem to have been factored in the current market.”
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sun 19 Jul 2020, 01:36:10

Plantagenet wrote:
shortonoil wrote:UK Accuses Russia-Backed Hackers Of Trying To Steal COVID-19 Vaccine Research
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ ... e-research

Things that make you go Hummm! Ain't that rich. The Russians already have a working vaccine. .


Perhaps they are trying to hack the Brits to get one that actually works.

Cheers!

Good old shorty. Per Google, I see no credible indication the Russians already have a working vaccine.

I'm shocked he would state pure BS. SHOCKED I tell you! :roll:

The closest thing I see is to that is that a Russian official claims that they COULD roll out a vaccine as soon as September. And if that happens, the implication is that they're being VERY risky, re the needed testing protocols (per how long the needed testing takes, from various comments by the medical experts on vaccines).
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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