Donate Bitcoin

Donate Paypal


PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

For discussions of events and conditions not necessarily related to Peak Oil.

Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby dissident » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 18:04:03

https://consortiumnews.com/2015/12/02/o ... r-victims/

Obama Ignores Russian Terror Victims

Normally, when a country is hit by an act of terrorism, there is universal sympathy even if the country has engaged in actions that may have made it a target of the terrorists. After 9/11, for instance, any discussion of whether U.S. violent meddling in the Middle East may have precipitated the attack was ruled out of the public debate.

Similarly, the 7/7 attacks against London’s Underground in 2005 were not excused because the United Kingdom had joined in President George W. Bush’s aggressive war in Iraq. The same with the more recent terror strikes in Paris. No respectable politician or pundit gloated about the French getting what they deserved for their long history of imperialism in the Muslim world.

But a different set of rules apply to Russia. Along with other prominent Americans, President Barack Obama and New York Times columnist Thomas L. Friedman have expressed smug satisfaction over the murder of 224 people aboard a Russian charter flight blown up over the Sinai and in the slaying of a Russian pilot who had been shot down by a Turkish warplane and the killing of a Russian marine on a rescue mission.

Apparently, the political imperative to display disdain for Russian President Vladimir Putin trumps any normal sense of humanity. Both Obama on Tuesday and Friedman on Wednesday treated those Russian deaths at the hands of the Islamic State or other jihadists as Putin’s comeuppance for intervening against terrorist/jihadist gains in Syria.


Obama is a trash talking scumbag. People remember Nixon for being some sort of liar, but Nixon was a saint compared to Obama the serial liar. Here are some of Obama's howlers:

1) Kosovo had a UN monitored referendum on secession from Serbia.

2) Russia doesn't make anything.

3) http://www.wnd.com/2015/11/see-obamas-l ... bing-isis/

But he is smug and sanctimonious when Russian civilians die due to Wahabbi terror.
dissident
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 6458
Joined: Sat 08 Apr 2006, 03:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 18:56:53

Totally Diss, & just as Obama trades on being 'the first black president' if Billary comes next she will lie her guts out & get away with it because she 'is the first woman president'/ as if either of those things matter more than anything. Both are despicable excuses for human beings let alone leaders of the free world.
SeaGypsy
Master Prognosticator
Master Prognosticator
 
Posts: 9284
Joined: Wed 04 Feb 2009, 04:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Lore » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 19:00:57

And a President Trump would be better; just how?
The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.
... Theodore Roosevelt
User avatar
Lore
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 9021
Joined: Fri 26 Aug 2005, 03:00:00
Location: Fear Of A Blank Planet

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 19:03:21

An arrogant asshole who is what he appears to be beats a disgusting 2 faced conniving liar in my book. How about yours?
SeaGypsy
Master Prognosticator
Master Prognosticator
 
Posts: 9284
Joined: Wed 04 Feb 2009, 04:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Lore » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 19:08:42

SeaGypsy wrote:An arrogant asshole who is what he appears to be beats a disgusting 2 faced conniving liar in my book. How about yours?


So, you're saying one liar is better then another, but then aren't they both just liars and why then should Russia trust either?
The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.
... Theodore Roosevelt
User avatar
Lore
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 9021
Joined: Fri 26 Aug 2005, 03:00:00
Location: Fear Of A Blank Planet

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby ennui2 » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 19:16:22

SeaGypsy wrote:An arrogant asshole who is what he appears to be beats a disgusting 2 faced conniving liar in my book. How about yours?


You know when peak oil has fallen totally off the radar when people are more interested in fixating on hating politicians than discussion real issues.

Look, we've had year upon year of Obama-hate. He's on his way out of office after winning two elections, picking up a Nobel prize, and keeping us from entering, among other things, a war with Iran. Find a new strawman to externalize all your troubles onto.
"If the oil price crosses above the Etp maximum oil price curve within the next month, I will leave the forum." --SumYunGai (9/21/2016)
User avatar
ennui2
Permanently Banned
 
Posts: 3920
Joined: Tue 20 Sep 2011, 10:37:02
Location: Not on Homeworld

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Satori » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 20:17:20

SeaGypsy wrote:An arrogant asshole who is what he appears to be beats a disgusting 2 faced conniving liar in my book. How about yours?



LOL
oh good
things are looking up for the 2016 election :-D
now we have a REAL choice !
User avatar
Satori
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 393
Joined: Mon 29 Oct 2007, 03:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 20:27:06

Lore wrote:And a President Trump would be better; just how?


The Russians would probably be mezmerized by Trump. *He'd pay attention to them*.

After the first bit of trouble with Russia, Trump would declare "I love the Russians! Look at all the Russians I have working in Trump Tower, Trump Organization is full of Russians!"

And then Trump would put together a Russians That Love Trump committee, with an office in Trump Tower right next to Black Pastors For Trump.

Would probably be a hoot, old Trump would go right over to Moscow and go on all their tv shows and talk to the Russian people. Putin would have to issue an "anti foreign influences" decree just to get Trump off of Russian tv.

Like everyone else, they wouldn't know whether to love him or hate him.

Seriously, Trump's a big unknown about how he'd handle Russia. I think he'd be more INTERESTED in it -- maybe Putin would see another leader cut from the same cloth and they could make deals and the Russians would finally stick to their end of the bargain too.

Or -- maybe Trump would just ignore NATO and actually be anti nato, he's said a lot of things like that, and then the world watches saying "wtf" as nato falls apart and a new Russian bloc grows and "President Trump" doesn't care.

Trump's a big unknown.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 20:44:42

dissident wrote:But he is smug and sanctimonious when Russian civilians die due to Wahabbi terror.


Obama should have expressed condolences for the airliner that went down in Egypt.

So I agree with that; human tragedy is human tragedy.

You have to see the point though that Putin is the one that got Russia into the middle east, and sided Russia with Iran and Syria. Putin has Russia "going it alone," rather than being in the international coalition.

It's not worth it to Russians, in my opinion. THERE IS NOTHING to be gained from alliance with Iran, that is worth it.

And radical Iranians are hardly any better than radical sunnis. The whole thing is a big mess, and Putin is trying to expand a bloc and sphere of influence in the ME and that's all chess BUT NOT WORTH IT and not helpful to the situation. He should have joined the international coalition.

Russia is trying to fight radical islam on its own, but also backing radical shia militias and radical Iranians at the same time which just makes it all worse, the real threat is OVERALL radical islam.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Lore » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 20:52:34

Sixstrings wrote:
Lore wrote:And a President Trump would be better; just how?


The Russians would probably be mezmerized by Trump. *He'd pay attention to them*.

Trump's a big unknown.


You must think the Russians are children, or else pretty dopey like our right-wing extremists to believe they would be impressed by Trump.

Trump is no more a mystery then P.T. Barnum was a showman.
The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.
... Theodore Roosevelt
User avatar
Lore
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 9021
Joined: Fri 26 Aug 2005, 03:00:00
Location: Fear Of A Blank Planet

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 20:55:17

BY THE WAY I just want to note that Putin and Russia deserves credit for showing restraint after the Turkey incident.

It wasn't the USA's fault, other than Obama not paying attention and being disinterested and Putin was right when he said "America isn't controlling its allies the way it should be."

But anyhow, I'm an independent thinker and objective and I noticed the restraint Putin showed and Russia deserves credit for that.

Honestly a lot of people would give Russia credit, based on what it DOES and doesn't do.

That Ukraine stuff really rattled all of east europe, and all the bomber flights did too and submarines in Swedish harbors.

Russia has to recognize that its got some responsibility of its own to simply get along better with people. People in east europe have long memories. And I guess Russia does too, but this stuff doesn't help anything, it just makes more adversaries for Russia which is COUNTER to Russia's defense.

The bear doesn't like to be poked, but yet the bear growls and it makes other bears poke, and then they growl back.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 21:05:55

Lore wrote:You must think the Russians are children, or else pretty dopey like our right-wing extremists to believe they would be impressed by Trump.

Trump is no more a mystery then P.T. Barnum was a showman.


Trump does seem to be popular in much of the world. He's big in Indonesia, considered a "friend of Indonesia."

Some of this Trump stuff is akin to how populist DICTATORS are -- which is popular in much of the world, and resonates there. More traditional cultures with less developed democratic institutions.

I can imagine Trump being popular in much the world, simply because he's so engaging and such a big populist. Put Trump in a room with Russians and Trump would make them feel like he cares about them.

Also, Trump seems to like east europeans. He keeps marrying women from Slovenia.

P.S. I'm NOT putting Russia down, any more than I'd put my native American South down, but I'm just saying there are cultural differences in the world and how people are. East Europe (and I've never been to Russia but from afar it seems the same as east europe to me) is actually a lot like the American South / red states. I'm talking about the culture, the people, and it's not a bad thing -- it's actually a good thing.

But these kind of cultures have some differences. Trump plays well in the American red states, I don't know if he'd be interested in Russia or east europe as president, but just on a personal level I think he'd be quite engaging and they'd probably all like him.

The BIGGEST QUESTION about Trump, regarding Russia, is just what his views are. If anything, he's got a lot of views that line up with Russian views. And that could be concerning, because nobody wants WWIII but yet an American president does need to be caring about democracy in east europe and NATO.

edit: lol that's you Lore, I thought Dissident had posted that and I was responding to Dissident.

It's not that Russians are "children," but cultures are just different.

It's the same thing as how the red states here are different, how the South is different.

Populists do better in some cultures, versus others. I wouldn't call any culture "chidlish" but I guess one could say "gullable" or naive. Or as I posted, places that have less developed democratic institutions.

Wherever it is, in whatever country, populists always get their base of support from the working class rather than intelligentsia. Populist leaders communicate emotionally, rather than deep thinking dissertations on policy.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Subjectivist » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 22:41:53

Sixstrings Russia and Syria have been allies since the 1960's so you can hardly blame Putin for continuing their relationship and expect anyone to take you seriously.
II Chronicles 7:14 if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land.
Subjectivist
Volunteer
Volunteer
 
Posts: 4701
Joined: Sat 28 Aug 2010, 07:38:26
Location: Northwest Ohio

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby ralfy » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 22:49:35

It was never a matter of personalities but realpolitik based on deceit, economic and other arrangements, etc., and the phenomenon cut across all military powers.
User avatar
ralfy
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 5600
Joined: Sat 28 Mar 2009, 11:36:38
Location: The Wasteland

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby ennui2 » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 22:55:23

Sixstrings wrote:Russia is trying to fight radical islam on its own, but also backing radical shia militias and radical Iranians at the same time which just makes it all worse, the real threat is OVERALL radical islam.


Russia has dealt with extremism closer to home--namely Chechnya. The marathon bombings near me was collateral damage due to the situation in Chechnya, as implausible a it may sound. Putin can't behave as if this isn't his problem too. The problem is Putin is too busy trying to treat Russia's battered self-esteem with useless chest-beating nationalism to actually lead responsibly. He's just mastered the usual despot's trick of finger-pointing at the West and portraying yourself as a victim, something lots of these Middle-Eastern countries (like Iran) do as well.
"If the oil price crosses above the Etp maximum oil price curve within the next month, I will leave the forum." --SumYunGai (9/21/2016)
User avatar
ennui2
Permanently Banned
 
Posts: 3920
Joined: Tue 20 Sep 2011, 10:37:02
Location: Not on Homeworld

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 22:58:45

Subjectivist wrote:Sixstrings Russia and Syria have been allies since the 1960's so you can hardly blame Putin for continuing their relationship and expect anyone to take you seriously.


The closest I will come to the pro-Russia position is just that I actually do wonder "how bad" "Assad" really is.

It would be nice if there were some good objective journalism on it. Like how Anthony Bourdain can go to a country and in a one hour show really let you know what's what, over there. His Turkey episode was very good. And he went to Iran, then the Iranians threw the people he talked to into prison. (those are the American citizens being held there)

So yeah Subjectivist, I guess Russia has rights, and I guess there are American citizens being held in Iran against their will, too.

And I guess Russia is allied to Iran, and I guess Iran is funding proxy wars in Yemen and all over, and Iran buys russian gear and missiles, and Iran funds hezbollah which non-stop rocket attacks Israeli people in Israel.

Yep you're right, everyone has rights, and non-Russian bloc people have rights too.

Again though -- I WONDER how bad Assad really is, and I just don't know. I looked up the wiki one time, "human rights abuses in Syria," and that thing goes back literally hundreds of years and it's just a big mess and hard to figure out who's the good guy.

All I know is the WESTERN GOVERNMENTS POSITION -- and they all say that propping up Assad is what is fueling this war in the middle east and is preventing it from ever ending.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby AgentR11 » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 23:04:39

Six.. There are no good guys in Syria.
Yes we are, as we are,
And so shall we remain,
Until the end.
AgentR11
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 6372
Joined: Tue 22 Mar 2011, 09:15:51
Location: East Texas

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 23:16:38

ennui2 wrote:Russia has dealt with extremism closer to home--namely Chechnya. The marathon bombings near me was collateral damage due to the situation in Chechnya, as implausible a it may sound. Putin can't behave as if this isn't his problem too. The problem is Putin is too busy trying to treat Russia's battered self-esteem with useless chest-beating nationalism to actually lead responsibly.


Yep you're right.

About the Chechnya strategy: Putin proved he's able to handle something like that, but yet that heavy-handed "level it all" policy isn't workable in the ME at large. Russia simply does not have the capability, even if it wanted to and even if the West backed out of the ME. Not even the USSR with all its might could have quelled the ME.

It's honestly only the USA that's ever been able to be hegemon in the region and do the best job at it that anyone could do.

Yet it costs a fortune, brings us no money back, and Americans are tired of fighting in the dessert.

Yet if we ignore it, we get a caliphate that goes unchecked and is attacking us at home and all our allies too.

My take on this whole situation is that there's a geopolitical sphere of influence struggle in the ME. The US used to be top dog, but we left. That created a power vaccum. Into which stepped Russia, backing Iran. And Iran is pushing out wanting to be a rising regional power -- and Iran is funding proxy wars in yemen and all over and in Iraq to push the sunni out.

And then Turkey wants to be a rising regional power as well, and is funding poxies too, and is clashing with rising power Russia.

It all leads back to the fact that things were better with the US in charge of the region. Which nobody on this forum wants to hear.

I guess everyone just wants Russia and Iran to take over the ME -- but the very big problem with that is that those two can make a big messy neverending regional war but they actually *do not have the capability to ever win it and end it*.

It was better off under US and Western leadership, and I hate to say it but Russia staying out of the ME, and then Iran being contained.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Why Obama and friends are making Russians hate America

Unread postby AgentR11 » Thu 03 Dec 2015, 23:27:22

Sixstrings wrote:It would be nice if there were some good objective journalism on it. Like how Anthony Bourdain can go to a country and in a one hour show really let you know what's what, over there. His Turkey episode was very good. And he went to Iran, then the Iranians threw the people he talked to into prison. (those are the American citizens being held there)


Turkey on two seas
Tony shows you what is what.
In an hours time.

Arguably one of the most complicated, nuanced, and unpredictable countries on the planet, and you think you saw "what's what" in an hour.

I know this is Diss' OP thread, and Turkey and Russia are having a little tiff at the moment; but seriously Six... an hour?

Maybe you could do "what's what" for the Dardenels in an hour, or more broadly the Mantreux convention; but sheesh, that place has been a major player during the entire history of Western and Central Asian history; and its all mixed up there; tangled in magnificent complexity.

an hour.
yeah.
and you have the gall to be giving world leaders instructions on what they should be doing.

Just stop and enjoy the show.

nb.. .for nitpicks.. yes I left out aegean and mamara
Yes we are, as we are,
And so shall we remain,
Until the end.
AgentR11
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 6372
Joined: Tue 22 Mar 2011, 09:15:51
Location: East Texas

Next

Return to Geopolitics & Global Economics

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 55 guests