I'm back. It seems to have worked.
To ESpin--Congratulations, you've pretty much got it all right. I commend you, being an MD and all
.
Before I forget, if anyone would like to attend the October ammonia meeting, let me know (I'm not sure how to do that, exchange emails or what, but you all probably do).
Some comments on your comments:
* Peter Feibelman is part of our Ammonia Network, along with 3 or 4 other Sandia Laboratory staffers.
* I'm surprised you didn't mention a big advantage of ammonia--no stinking carbon. In fact oxidation of ammonia in a fuel cell (first done in 1968) or in an ICE can be made virtually emission free, no greenhouse gases and essentially no NOx. It's not quite true that oxidation of ammonia produces only nitrogen and water. That is true if pure oxygen is used. But autos will be using plain old air. It's been shown many times that NOx production is a fraction of that with gasoline, but still there.
* von Blarigan's (Sandia) engine as far as I know has never been operated with ammonia. On the other hand ammonia has been burned in numerous ICEs dating back to Norsk Hydro in 1933. My colleague Ted Hollinger of the Hydrogen Engine Center in Iowa told me a couple days ago that he will run one of his engines on ammonia before the October meeting and be able to discuss the results.
* OTEC is not dead, just sleeping.
* DOE HQ (Hydrogen Initiative Office) are just now establishing their position on ammonia as a hydrogen carrier. One case might be to deliver liquid ammonia to a fueling station where it will be cracked and the hydrogen pressurized for feeding to PEM fuel cell autos. Another suggestion (and one that DOE has not endorsed) is that ammonia might be carried on board an auto and cracked to hydrogen on its way to the fuel cell.
* Yes, ammonia is toxic, but so is gasoline fumes, and can you imagine driving around with a high pressure hydrogen gas tank? In the US midwest, there has been decades of experience handling ammonia. Iowa alone puts 1 billion pounds of liquid ammonia into the soil a year. The US consumes 15 million tons of ammonia a year (mostly as fertilizer, essentially zero as a fuel) and every liter of that ammonia is transferred at least two times. Besides, the water solubility of ammonia gives you the safeguard you need. A fog of water will capture a cloud of ammonia and carry it to the ground.
* I also don't know where you got the idea that ammonia has been produced by the Haber-Bosch process using some sort of electrolysis. Low temperature usually means inefficient. I'm open to education, but as far as I know it's always been N2 from the air and H2 from some cracked (steam reformed) fossil fuel. Primarily natual gas. Today, worldwide the majority of ammonia is produced from natural gas, with coal in 2nd place, largely because of China and India. Because 90% of the cost of ammonia is the cost of the natural gas, the US is moving toward coal to produce ammonia using clean coal technology. Cheap natural gas prices offshore have led to the US producing only half of the ammonia it consumes, and importing the rest. About a third of the US ammonia production capacity is currently demobilized. The wind (or hydro, or solar, or nuclear) to elecrolysis to hydrogen to ammonia (for transport) is extremely viable (a main topic at the October meeting), but nothing operating at this point.
To Caoimhan--Ammonia is the world's second best solvent after water, particularly for organics. So, ammonia could certainly be mixed with ethanol, etc. But, I don't know why you'd want to. A key idea for ammonia is that it is carbon free (provided the central production facility is sequestering its carbon). If you can produce ethanol or methanol (e.g. biomass), you can produce ammonia. I'm a fan of keeping carbonaceous fuels off of vehicles altogether.
To strider3700--I think the meth worry is a red herring. I've looked at Iowa data for "emergency releases" of ammonia and for sure the frequency of releases caused by meth manufacturers has been on the rise. I won't give you the details, but it would be straightforward to "poison" the ammonia so it couldn't be used safely to produce meth.
To Devil--I like your questions, but you
do come off sounding a bit like pessimist. The Haber-Bosch process for producing ammonia has been one of the success stories of the 20th century. Today, conversion of natural gas to ammonia is in the order of 80 percent or more. Advanced catalysts could even improve that, if there were an economic driver. Ammonia is sold as a commodity, even with natural gas being the feedstock. Current prices are in the vicinity of $350 per ton, which gives 180kg of hydrogen (equivalent to a gallon of gasoline) so ammonia energy is less than $2 per gallon compared to gasoline.
* I've kinda already answered your comment about NOx. If you go to terraindustries.com and select NOx treatment, you'll see that the chemical needed to treat NOx is urea (1 urea gives 2 ammonias). So, NOx treatment would be already "on-board".
* Your comment about interaction with humidity in the airis simply not true. Ammonia in water solution is a
weak base, pH 10 or so. Because of the remarkable chemical properties of ammonia, only a tiny, tiny amount of ionization. 99.99 or more percent of the ammonia exists in water as NH3 gas, not as the strong base NH4OH. You can dissolve 530 g of ammonia in 1 liter of water at room temperature, and only a tiny bit of that ammonia ionizes. The hygroscopic nature is a good thing, it can grab fugitive ammonia and trap it.
* That's not to say we should be cavalier with ammonia. Ammonia can kill. Good news is that you can smell it long before it's a hazard. I hear that farm workers in California have to wear gas masks because of the ammonia produced from animal wastes.
To Oily Bill--Why isn't it being pursued? Good question. I wish I could answer it. Ammonia as a fuel has surfaced every 10 to 20 years since 1933. I believe it is usually shouted down because of the toxicity, we call it the "grandma will die fueling her car" attitude. Also, remember that whenever the US gets serious about alternate fuels, oil supply pressures diminish. Go figure.
Let's keep talking, we're on to something. Ammonia-guy
