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Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Plantagenet » Wed 04 Sep 2019, 16:11:37

Canadian political leader attacks Greta Thunber as "mentally unstable."

berniers-vitriol-toward-greta-thunberg-showcases-a-wider-trend-of-politics

Canada now has their own "Trump-style" political leader who is a climate change denier, and uses twitter to issue hundreds of demeaning and insulting tweets about his political opponents and about people like Greta Thunberg whose views he disagrees with.

Of course, to people who deny the science of climate change the views of people like Greta Thunberg must be totally incomprehensible. I was hoping Trump and others in the US who deny the reality of climate change might eventually come to their senses and change their minds and accept the facts. But instead, "trump-style" climate change denialism seems to be spreading to Canada and other countries.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby rockdoc123 » Wed 04 Sep 2019, 16:55:25

Of course, to people who deny the science of climate change the views of people like Greta Thunberg must be totally incomprehensible.


exactly what do the views of a 16 year old who doesn't attend school, hasn't taken grade levels in science and actually believes she can see CO2 in the air have to do with science? Perhaps the "science" alarmists have bought into, which apparently they get from their newspaper. :roll:
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Newfie » Wed 04 Sep 2019, 17:30:31

This article bothers me as much as anything Trump has done yet.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/beta.washi ... utType=amp

He’s looking really Fxxxing stupid about now.
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Plantagenet » Wed 04 Sep 2019, 21:43:09

what do the views of a 16 year old who doesn't attend school, hasn't taken grade levels in science ... have to do with science?


I already explained this to you just a few days ago, but I know you forget things pretty quickly, so I'll repeat the explanation for you again.

The scientists in the IPCC have been predicting for years now that the planet will warm significantly, with concomitant knock-on effects in sea level rise, increases in storm intensity and flood frequent, an ice-free arctic etc.

Greta Thunberg isn't a scientist herself. Her point is that people should believe what the vast majority of scientists are saying about global warming, including the scientists in the IPCC.

That seems reasonable to me. People like Trump who pretend there is no climate change are just idiots----the global increase in temperature since anthropogenic CO2 began to accumulate in the atmosphere is pretty clear to see.

Do you get it now?

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 10:03:42

Plantagenet wrote:Greta Thunberg isn't a scientist herself. Her point is that people should believe what the vast majority of scientists are saying about global warming, including the scientists in the IPCC.

Lets say they (mean "people") believe.
What would that change?
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby asg70 » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 11:58:55

EnergyUnlimited wrote:
Plantagenet wrote:Greta Thunberg isn't a scientist herself. Her point is that people should believe what the vast majority of scientists are saying about global warming, including the scientists in the IPCC.

Lets say they (mean "people") believe.
What would that change?


Nothing, as evidenced by Plant's own lifestyle.

Plantagenet wrote:I was hoping Trump and others in the US who deny the reality of climate change might eventually come to their senses and change their minds and accept the facts.


Is that why you went out of your way to defend him during the Russia investigation?

HALL OF SHAME:
-Short welched on a bet and should be shunned.
-Frequent-flyers should not cry crocodile-tears over climate-change.
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Plantagenet » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 12:49:56

EnergyUnlimited wrote:Lets say ..."people" believe.
What would that change?


Greta Thunberg has a very simple message....believe what the science says.

If people comprehended and believed what the science is saying about the coming effects of climate change, then logically they would pressure their governments through voting and other methods to take action to mitigate the coming disaster due to climate change. This would require adoption of real UN climate treaties with real teeth to enforce real global reductions in CO2 emissions.

Instead we got the farcial and toothless Kyoto Accords, under which global CO2 emissions steadily increased, and now we've got the farcial and toothless Paris Accords, and once again global CO2 emissions are continuing to increase and global temperatures are continuing to rise and ice continues to be lost and oceans continue to rise.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby rockdoc123 » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 13:04:48

If people comprehended and believed what the science is saying about the coming effects of climate change, then logically they would pressure their governments through voting and other methods to take action to mitigate the coming disaster due to climate change. This would require adoption of real UN climate treaties with real teeth to enforce real global reductions in CO2 emissions.


so you are telling us Greta comprehends the science? Exactly how does she do that? Reading newspaper articles written by journalists with no science background? Being told what to think by her parents? Obviously a schoolteacher can't tell her what to think given she doesn't go to school and given she hasn't taken any science I suspect she can't go and read it from the source (the science journals). But maybe the ability to see CO2 in the air transcends all that.

You are making a joke of the morass of climate change arguments by pushing this agenda I'm afraid.
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Ibon » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 14:34:59

In a perfect world scientists do the science.
Journalists, celebrities, politicians then work on communicating to the public the findings and actions required. In a perfect world all of that would be done with no bias and with the science being impeccable.

The reality on almost all issues scientific and social is that science is not perfect, not free of bias. The media is not perfect, not free of bias. The government is not perfect, not free of bias, the celebrities are not perfect, not free of bias.

That none of these entities are perfect sums up 100% of RockDoc's position on why they can be ignored.

Seems like a pretty weak basis for his position considering that no where out there on the academic landscape, on the social landscape, on the cultural landscape, does there exist a perfect world.

Rockdoc, I don't confront you very often, but let me take the opportunity this once and you will not get a follow up comment from me.

Your an idiot.
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby rockdoc123 » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 19:17:30

The reality on almost all issues scientific and social is that science is not perfect, not free of bias. The media is not perfect, not free of bias. The government is not perfect, not free of bias, the celebrities are not perfect, not free of bias.

That none of these entities are perfect sums up 100% of RockDoc's position on why they can be ignored.


obviously you have had trouble comprehending what it is that I've actually said. To reiterate, the actual science that is being done is published in journals that are peer-reviewed. Although not without its flaws peer review and editorial oversight generally avoid authors wildly speculating about topics without evidence either in the way of measurements, models etc or review of existing publications (internal consistency and data support is required). It is, without doubt, the best source for what is the level of current scientific understanding. Press releases, interviews and coverage by non-science journalists (some with an axe to grind) do not have any level of scrutiny and as a consequence, all sorts of crap is published. A good example of the discrepancy is found in the Summary for Policy Makers that was issued along with AR5 versus the actual working group publication of research in AR5. The two couldn't be more different with the SPM wildly overplaying its hand to the extent of making claims that were not supported by the working group publication. If you want the actual science go to the publications if you want something that will enhance your membership in your "tribe" of alarmists with no data then stick with the BS that appears in the press, or worse yet, something you were told by someone who saw something in the press.

Rockdoc, I don't confront you very often, but let me take the opportunity this once and you will not get a follow up comment from me.

Your an idiot.


that's funny, I'm not the one getting my understanding of climate change science from the newspaper or a 16 year old girl with no schooling. :roll:
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby dohboi » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 20:17:14

Ibon wrote: "Your an idiot."

Glad that someone else sees this now, too. Can we all not ignore him and get back to discussing more serious issues (and there are plenty of them)?
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby rockdoc123 » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 22:06:06

Ibon wrote: "Your an idiot."

Glad that someone else sees this now, too. Can we all not ignore him and get back to discussing more serious issues (and there are plenty of them)


well, as usual, you show up with insults and nothing of substance. My comments in this thread have been on topic, whereas you have contributed nothing, zero, nada....pretty much as expected. But feel free to start another thread about all the serious issues you think nobody here except you discusses. :roll:
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Cog » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 22:41:28

The proper word, used in a sentence above, should have been you're an idiot, instead of the improper word your that was used. Grammar is important men. It is one of the things that seperate us from the beasts of the field and the lower classes.
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Plantagenet » Thu 05 Sep 2019, 23:39:35

Cog wrote:The proper word, used in a sentence above, should have been you're an idiot, instead of the improper word your that was used. Grammar is important men. It is one of the things that seperate us from the beasts of the field and the lower classes.


Normally your point would be well taken, but in this case I think it distracts from the very important point that Ibon was making, i.e. that rocdoc is clearly, irrefutably, and demonstrably an idiot.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Newfie » Fri 06 Sep 2019, 06:27:18

OK guys, enough.
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Revi » Fri 06 Sep 2019, 07:28:56

Back to Greta. Are you participating in the events from Sept.20-27th? I am going to "work to rule" on the 20th. I'm going to sit outside my workplace with a sign until it's time to go in. I know it's kinda wimpy, but I am afraid of having my pay docked...

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby asg70 » Fri 06 Sep 2019, 09:37:07

Plantagenet wrote:This would require adoption of real UN climate treaties with real teeth to enforce real global reductions in CO2 emissions.


Note that any treaty with real teeth would put a crimp on personal air-travel. So be careful what you wish for.

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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Revi » Fri 06 Sep 2019, 12:11:09

asg70 wrote:
Plantagenet wrote:This would require adoption of real UN climate treaties with real teeth to enforce real global reductions in CO2 emissions.


Note that any treaty with real teeth would put a crimp on personal air-travel. So be careful what you wish for.


We all know that a sensible policy would have most flying gone and severe restrictions on what we use fossil fuel for in order to have a bare minimum for the future. I talked to a scientist who seemed to know what is going on with climate change. When I asked him if he was doing anything about climate change he said that he wasn't giving up flying. He's going to Hong Kong and to India for a wedding this winter. He has kids, so it's a weird thing. Nobody is giving up any of their frivolous energy use even though we are accelerating towards the cliff!
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby Ibon » Fri 06 Sep 2019, 12:25:45

We want to have our cake and eat it to. Almost every body.

We want the freedom to fly like a swallow, to fuck like rabbits, to eat red meat like lions, to build like termites and yet we also want to mitigate climate change.

In other words what we really want is the freedom to have our cake and eat it too.

We want the freedom to defy logic, to rationalize and twist the obvious.

What we really want is for our shit to smell like roses.

Shit smells bad for a reason otherwise we would want to eat it too!

Which is exactly what we are doing.

Bunch of shit eating Kudzu Apes.
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Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Fri 06 Sep 2019, 15:06:34

Ibon wrote:We want to have our cake and eat it to. Almost every body.

We want the freedom to fly like a swallow, to fuck like rabbits, to eat red meat like lions, to build like termites and yet we also want to mitigate climate change.

In other words what we really want is the freedom to have our cake and eat it too.

We want the freedom to defy logic, to rationalize and twist the obvious.

What we really want is for our shit to smell like roses.

Shit smells bad for a reason otherwise we would want to eat it too!

Which is exactly what we are doing.

Bunch of shit eating Kudzu Apes.

I have heard arguments that 2nd Law of Thermodynamic is:
1. Unduly pessimistic.
2. Against human spirit.
3. Anti-progress.
4. Inhumane.
5. Antichristian and against all other religions, so not a creation of God and void as such.
6. Antisocial.
etc.

Then people claiming all above have moved towards arguments that it is certain that further scientific progress will allow to get around it somehow, so it won't be applicable to humanity.

I believe that this kind of people are in charge of dealing with climate change...
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