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Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby onlooker » Wed 11 Dec 2019, 14:12:51

Newfie wrote:Paywall. But no matter I think we have passed that point a looong time ago. Not because of the physical processes but because of our inability to react to it.

It’s not gonna kill us this century, but it will sure make life miserable in the future.

Bssically saying the Arctic is now releasing massive amounts of carbon. A truly catastrophic feedback 8O
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Newfie » Wed 11 Dec 2019, 20:19:41

If you can find a synopsis please post it in the run away global warming thread where Cid used to post so heavily.

He deserves a “good ya so” or three.
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby asg70 » Wed 11 Dec 2019, 20:37:45

Newfie wrote:If you can find a synopsis please post it in the run away global warming thread where Cid used to post so heavily.

He deserves a “good ya so” or three.


Seconded. Oh, and Plant, please stop flying around the world already. Enough is enough with your hypocrisy.

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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Keith_McClary » Sun 15 Dec 2019, 02:27:12

asg70 wrote:Plant, please stop flying around the world already. Enough is enough with your hypocrisy.
Alaskans travel by kayak.
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 15 Dec 2019, 02:59:05

Keith_McClary wrote: Alaskans travel by kayak.


True enough. Are you a kayaker, Keith?

I'm pretty sure I did the first kayak circumnavigation around Augustine Island in lower Cook inlet, among other Kayak adventures in Alaska.

I used to have a Klepper folding kayak (sold it) and for a while I had a Feathercraft folding kayak (sold it). Now I've got a fleet of kayaks, with 2 hard-shells and about 3 inflatable kayaks, with a German Metzler inflatable kayak being my go-to boat. A high quality inflatable boat can carry a lot of gear and the skin is very tough....you can run them up on beaches even in pretty heavy surf.....and when deflated they pack down to about nothing so they're very easy to take on trips. I just about always took one along with me when I was doing scientific work in various remote parts of Alaska where there where no roads or trails, and used them to traverse across rivers or work my way around lakes, like Imuruk Lake on the Seward Peninsula.

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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Sun 15 Dec 2019, 09:19:33

I would add one personal observation.
This autumn in the area of Poland where I live there was not a single day (or night) where temperature have dropped below 0*C. Not even on one moment.
The lowest temperature recorded in my area was 3*C on one morning and this is absolutely unheard of.
It is expected that before New Year nothing will change.
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Azothius » Sat 21 Dec 2019, 09:57:46

The Amazon rainforest is about to cross an irreversible threshold that will turn it into a savanna, top scientists say

https://www.yahoo.com/news/amazon-rainf ... 00648.html


The Amazon rainforest is "teetering on the edge" of an irreversible threshold that would turn it into a savanna, a group of top scientists warn.

That's because humans have been cutting and burning the forest, which allows moisture to escape the ecosystem.

Enough deforestation could trigger a process called "dieback," in which the rainforest would dry up, burn, and become a savanna-like landscape, releasing up to 140 billion tons of carbon into the atmosphere.

Experts fear the Amazon rainforest has reached a catastrophic tipping point.

Leading rainforest scientists Thomas Lovejoy and Carlos Nobre warned in an editorial published Thursday that deforestation in the world's largest rainforest has led the Amazon to the brink of an irreversible process called "dieback."

That scenario would turn the Amazon into an African-savanna-type landscape. The tropical trees — and the fauna they support — would disappear, releasing up to 140 billion tons of stored carbon into the atmosphere, causing an uptick in already rising global temperatures.


not to mention that the planet would also lose a major carbon sink
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 21 Dec 2019, 19:39:19

German Green party says the EU should take in 140 million climate refugees

german-green-party-urges-allowing-140-million-climate-refugees-migrate-west

There's going to be a lot more climate refugees then that. I wonder why the racists in the German green party want to set a limit at 140 million refugees? Shouldn't they be willing to take in 200 million? Or 300 million?

And if Germans are so concerned about climate refugees, why don't they stop burning coal immediately? Its not like there aren't other ways to generate electricity? It seems like they haven't entirely thought this through.

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One of the Massive German coal-fired power plants----shouldn't they all be shut down immediately?

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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Sun 22 Dec 2019, 12:00:55

Plantagenet wrote:German Green party says the EU should take in 140 million climate refugees

I support this as long as all of of them will go to Germany.
Of course Germans will need to go somewhere to make space... compost pile comes to mind.

One way or another weak and impoverished Germany are in long term in the best interest of Poland.
So I do support these German lefties. Good luck for them and fingers crossed.

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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby dohboi » Thu 23 Jan 2020, 23:12:19

a potential cascade of climate change tipping points aren’t a far-off catastrophe—we’re already living them.

Our Planet May Be Barreling Toward a Tipping Point

https://www.wired.com/story/climate-tipping-point/

Today in the journal Nature, a group of researchers argues that we're closer to tipping nine climate demons than previously believed, and that we're already starting to see some associated effects.

“We argue that the intervention time left to prevent tipping could already have shrunk towards zero, whereas the reaction time to achieve net zero emissions is 30 years at best,” they write. “Hence we might already have lost control of whether tipping happens.”

… these researchers have built a solid case that tipping points aren’t a far-off catastrophe—we’re already living them.

“The evidence that it might actually be happening, that it might be true, is so high, that honestly this is just another very big reason why we need to get our act together and do everything that we could possibly do to fix the problem,” he says. “This is an article that just pulls together many, many good reasons why there is a real emergency, a real urgency here.”
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Cog » Fri 24 Jan 2020, 03:55:00

I'll be glad once we are past this tipping point we are endlessly warned about. Will make social engineering sort of pointless. Then we can get back to the business of unrestrained capitalism.
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby jedrider » Fri 24 Jan 2020, 12:36:30

Cog wrote:I'll be glad once we are past this tipping point we are endlessly warned about. Will make social engineering sort of pointless. Then we can get back to the business of unrestrained capitalism.


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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Heineken » Sat 25 Jan 2020, 09:19:50

Years and years ago on this website I said that global warming would be a far more important issue in the longer run than peak oil (which at the time appeared to be happening, but wasn't). Since then, what we know about global warming has become relentlessly more dire, and the worst-case scenarios keep getting worse. I do think we have the beginnings of runaway global warming. And I do believe that this is the thing that gets us, our civilization. It is perfectly designed by nature to destroy us. For one thing, even with a clear picture of what's coming, we keep doing the same thing about it that we've done all along---nothing. How could we do much, when our civilization EVOLVED on the grubby back of hydrocarbons? CO2 concentrations continue to rise, exponentially I think. For that matter, it's probably too late to do anything to stop or possibly even slow the juggernaut of warming, as more and more positive-feedback loops get entrained. We've released the tiger and now it's going to eat us, thrash around as we may. And . . . what happens when real panic sets in? When the dim bulb in the mass mind lights up? When the population of, say, Pakistan swarms across its northern borders? We will probably destroy ourselves even faster than unlivable temperatures do. I think that by 2100 the civilization is dead, we are largely barbarians, and the population is reduced to well under 1 billion, possibly to just a few million (esp. if there's nuclear war). "Sad."
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby jedrider » Sat 25 Jan 2020, 12:40:47

Heineken wrote:"Sad"


I agreed with everything you said until that point. If I think 'plastic bag' versus no humankind, the choice is clear to me. However, "Sad" is what we have done to the biosphere. "Oh, well!"

I'm a technologist: It sure is fun. However, it is not nature. We are in direct contempt of nature, and this will be enforced (unlike the Senate and Trump's impeachment) :-)
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby jupiters_release » Sat 25 Jan 2020, 17:33:38

Heineken wrote:I think that by 2100 the civilization is dead


Such an optimist!

You think disappearance of Arctic albedo will be a minor slow feedback process?
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Heineken » Sun 26 Jan 2020, 07:23:32

I do?
Replacement of Arctic ice by dark water is an obvious feedback loop and is anything but "slow." It's another big fat nail in our coffin.
I don't see the whole thing as an optimist/pessimist argument. It's more of an eyes open/eyes closed matter. The facts are very clear to those willing to look at them.
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Heineken » Sun 26 Jan 2020, 07:31:21

jedrider wrote:
Heineken wrote:"Sad"


I agreed with everything you said until that point. If I think 'plastic bag' versus no humankind, the choice is clear to me. However, "Sad" is what we have done to the biosphere. "Oh, well!"

I'm a technologist: It sure is fun. However, it is not nature. We are in direct contempt of nature, and this will be enforced (unlike the Senate and Trump's impeachment) :-)

I meant "sad" sarcastically. That's why I put it in quotation marks. As if our good buddy Trump were saying it. One of his signature remarks. Of course, as a sociopath, he doesn't feel or mean any sadness when he says it.
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby Cog » Sun 26 Jan 2020, 09:25:30

jedrider wrote:
Cog wrote:I'll be glad once we are past this tipping point we are endlessly warned about. Will make social engineering sort of pointless. Then we can get back to the business of unrestrained capitalism.


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Saving your doomed, but yet valuable soul while making a profit. See how easy that is? But vote for Bernie. He will surely save you. LOL
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby asg70 » Sun 26 Jan 2020, 12:25:31

Heineken's analysis is spot-on.

The current socio-political scheme we're entering into is what will characterize the 21st century.

I feel that a mass die-off is already fully baked into the cake. Who becomes the loser in this game of musical chairs and how death is meted out are unknown, just that it's gonna happen, and long before people die, quality of life will degrade for most.

The question of mitigation therefore is no longer a matter of avoiding the above but merely blunting the maximum impact by some unknown amount. It's hard to fight for increasingly right-hand-list measures (ala Al Bartlett) when generally apocalyptic and soul-crushing conditions are still inevitable.

But I think this is where we already stand due to our inaction and climate scientists/acivists don't want to level with the public for fear of demotivating us.

This explains why the goalposts keep shifting (remember 350.org?) and language carefully spun. This is why we're always on the cusp of passing tipping-points rather than having already passed tipping points despite the fact icemelt is now occuring far faster than even the most dire climate scientists were warning us of. To anyone who has followed the news over the last, let's say, 10 years, this sort of spin becomes patently obvious.

Denialists don't want to do anything and activists don't want to concede that apocalyptic conditions of some magnitude are now inevitable. As such, both sides are now locked into a form of denial, although I suspect many activists know the score but just can't bring themselves to speak it. Either way it's not helping matters.

But the end result is that further debate over mitigation loses its meaning and stakes as climate feedbacks kick in and just washes over us. The world will simply react to crises one by one and not be able to really cope. Seawalls will be erected and fail. The coastlines will be flooded. Crops will fail. Mass migrations will occur. Wealth will be destroyed. Conflict of all sorts will escalate. And it's quite likely that society as a whole will fail to connect the dots and simply see these things as a series of isolated issues.

BOLD PREDICTIONS
-Billions are on the verge of starvation as the lockdown continues. (yoshua, 5/20/20)

HALL OF SHAME:
-Short welched on a bet and should be shunned.
-Frequent-flyers should not cry crocodile-tears over climate-change.
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Re: Runaway Global Warming - Has Arrived pt 15

Unread postby jawagord » Sun 26 Jan 2020, 19:16:01

asg70 wrote:Heineken's analysis is spot-on.

The current socio-political scheme we're entering into is what will characterize the 21st century.

I feel that a mass die-off is already fully baked into the cake. Who becomes the loser in this game of musical chairs and how death is meted out are unknown, just that it's gonna happen, and long before people die, quality of life will degrade for most.

The question of mitigation therefore is no longer a matter of avoiding the above but merely blunting the maximum impact by some unknown amount. It's hard to fight for increasingly right-hand-list measures (ala Al Bartlett) when generally apocalyptic and soul-crushing conditions are still inevitable.

But I think this is where we already stand due to our inaction and climate scientists/acivists don't want to level with the public for fear of demotivating us.

This explains why the goalposts keep shifting (remember 350.org?) and language carefully spun. This is why we're always on the cusp of passing tipping-points rather than having already passed tipping points despite the fact icemelt is now occuring far faster than even the most dire climate scientists were warning us of. To anyone who has followed the news over the last, let's say, 10 years, this sort of spin becomes patently obvious.

Denialists don't want to do anything and activists don't want to concede that apocalyptic conditions of some magnitude are now inevitable. As such, both sides are now locked into a form of denial, although I suspect many activists know the score but just can't bring themselves to speak it. Either way it's not helping matters.

But the end result is that further debate over mitigation loses its meaning and stakes as climate feedbacks kick in and just washes over us. The world will simply react to crises one by one and not be able to really cope. Seawalls will be erected and fail. The coastlines will be flooded. Crops will fail. Mass migrations will occur. Wealth will be destroyed. Conflict of all sorts will escalate. And it's quite likely that society as a whole will fail to connect the dots and simply see these things as a series of isolated issues.


OK Doomer. Seriously none of this climate apocalypse will happen. But there is help for you, for your level of climate-itis I’d suggest starting with finger painting.

University offers students struggling with anxiety about climate change THERAPY to tackle their feelings of 'anger, guilt and grief'
* Sessions being held at the University of Derby by Dr Jamie Bird
* They involve participants trying to express feelings through art and poetry

University of Derby are running art therapy sessions for those suffering 'eco-anxiety' -an issue brought to the forefront of public attention by 17-year-old activist Greta Thunberg.
Participants are encouraged to express their feelings about climate change through 'poetry and movement'. 


https://indigopsychology.com/?gclid=EAI ... gKTlvD_BwE
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