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Countdown To Impeachment

A forum for discussion of regional topics including oil depletion but also government, society, and the future.

how long before Trump is impeached?

Before swearing in
0
No votes
Before 100 days into term
0
No votes
Before 1 year
8
21%
Before 2018 mid-terms
5
13%
Before 2020 election
5
13%
hell freezes over
21
54%
 
Total votes : 39

Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Pops » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 09:55:43

The whistleblower is irrelevant, trump invited ukraine and china to investigate his opponents on live TV. He'll be impeached.

The old saw holds,
When process is against you argue the facts,
when facts are against you argue the process
when both are against you tune in FOX
The legitimate object of government, is to do for a community of people, whatever they need to have done, but can not do, at all, or can not, so well do, for themselves -- in their separate, and individual capacities.
-- Abraham Lincoln, Fragment on Government (July 1, 1854)
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Ibon » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 10:03:13

Cog wrote:
I guess if you want immunity from any crime just run for president on the Democrat side and you can't be touched. Hell, even better than that, just mention a Democrat might have committed a crime and you will find yourself the one in trouble.

.


Playing the victim card sounds hollow. Typical Trumpism.
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby rockdoc123 » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 10:11:25

Have the impeachment. The further the Dems go down this road, the more it will hurt them. It will also hurt the country as the partisan divide will become a chasm with a good chance of violence. But the Dems simply don't care about that either. Dems started a war back in 1860 over the election of a Republican president and I guess history will have to repeat itself with them.


what is astounding to me is that it seems the House has done pretty much nothing else than work 24/7 to get Trump removed from his elected position. It seems to me there is a lot of lost opportunity there, legislation that could have been formulated and likely passed. Instead they spend 80% of their time trying to come up with reasons why Trump should be impeached, 10% of their time playing one-upmanship with regard to completely insane fiscal policy as their platform and another 10% doing as much as they can to cover up all the interference the Democratic Party had with the last election.

The House can do what they want I suppose. Come up with an argument for impeachment that will be ridiculous (based on what is there now) and it will spend no more than a couple of weeks in front of Senate before it is thrown down. And that will be more than 3 years of wasted time. Way to go Democrats!
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 10:46:02

Pops wrote:The whistleblower is irrelevant, trump invited ukraine and china to investigate his opponents on live TV. He'll be impeached.

The old saw holds,
When process is against you argue the facts,
when facts are against you argue the process
when both are against you tune in FOX

And of course, let's pretend MSNBC is fair and balanced, since they are constantly screeching for the left, and against the right.

Also, let's pretend there is no one on FOX arguing against Trump or for impeachment.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/pol ... 854146002/

Funny thing about politics, bias is completely relative.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Pops » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 12:44:32

Outcast_Searcher wrote:Funny thing about politics, bias is completely relative.

Funny thing about bias, everyone thinks it's the other guy.
USA Today, monmouth poll shows 6 of 10 Rs don't believe trump even mentioned biden in the call.

Among consistently conservative respondents, 47 percent chose Fox News as their main source “for news about government and politics.” The next largest group, 11 percent, chose local radio. Responses among liberals, by contrast, were much more fragmented. Fifteen percent of consistently liberal respondents chose CNN, 13 percent chose NPR, 12 percent chose MSNBC and 10 percent chose the New York Times.
Pew also asked whether the respondents trusted a given news source (or hadn’t heard of it). Eighty eight percent of consistently conservative respondents said they trust Fox News, compared with 52 percent of consistent liberals who say they trust MSNBC. In fact, among consistently conservative respondents, only four news sources are trusted by at least half the respondents: Fox News, Hannity, Rush Limbaugh’s radio and Glenn Beck’s radio show. For consistently liberal respondents, there are nine: NPR, PBS, BBC, New York Times, NBC News, CNN, ABC News, MSNBC and CBS News.

And that was several years ago.
https://newrepublic.com/article/119922/ ... h-fox-news
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 14:02:53

Pops wrote:The whistleblower is irrelevant, trump invited ukraine and china to investigate his opponents on live TV. He'll be impeached.


And don't forget that Trump invited Russia on TV to investigate Hilary's emails just before he won the 2016 election. Whereas Hillary and the DNC in 2016 merely secretly paid Fusion GPS a million dollars to collude with Russian intelligence sources on a dossier of lies and misinformation about Trump.

I think we all see how this works now----its OK for a D to secretly contact a foreign country and collude with them to get a dossier filled with lies about an R in order to pass those on to the FBI and the media just before the election, but its impeachable for an R to publicly call on a foreign country to investigate corruption that involves a D.

Got it!

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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby jedrider » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 15:13:07

Plantagenet wrote:I think we all see how this works now----its OK for a D to secretly contact a foreign country and collude with them to get a dossier filled with lies about an R in order to pass those on to the FBI and the media just before the election, but its impeachable for an R to publicly call on a foreign country to investigate corruption that involves a D.

Got it!


Fox News has normalized a lie about the origins of the Russia investigation
https://www.vox.com/2019/3/22/18277089/fox-news-steele-dossier-lie-trump-witch-hunt

This is not about Hillary and we know you still harbor sentiments of 'Lock her Up'. The only question is what Trump did acceptable and to the letter of the law and what evidence do we have (a bunch, evidently)?
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 16:03:57

jedrider wrote:Fox News has normalized a lie about the origins of the Russia investigation
https://www.vox.com/2019/3/22/18277089/fox-news-steele-dossier-lie-trump-witch-hunt


The Steele report was used by the Obama DOJ to justify putting wiretaps into Trump Campaign headquarters based on what is obviously phony information. The FBI and several high level Obama DOJ officials committed a fraud on the FISA court by swearing that the information in the Steele dossier had been checked and verified by the FBI....when it hadn’t.

This whole farce is currently under investigation by the AG and a special investigator.

The Papadopolous affair is actually just as bizarre and questionable as the phony Steele dossier. Mifsud is not Russian—he’s a Maltese professor and a member of the Clinton Foundation. Papdopolous was invited to London —— all expenses paid ——by an American Professor named Stefan Halper. Halper introduced Papadopolous to his sexy young assistant named Azra Turk and eventually they invited Papadopolous to a party where he supposedly told an Australian diplomat about the story that Mifsud had told him about the Russians.

But why was Papadoplous even invited to London in the first place? Halper turns out to get millions in funding from the DOD. The money used to bring Papdoplous to London and pay him an honorarium was apparently from these US grants, ie. it was some kind of US project. Ms. Azra Turks turns out to be an FBI/CIA agent dispatched to London to meet Papadoplous.

So it appears an investigation of Papadopolous, involving DOD agent and a young sexy CIA/FBI agent was underway even before he said anything.

SOme think this means Papadopolous was set up, i.e. Mifsud told him the Russians had Hilalry’s email and then Halper and Turk worked to get him to talk about it after they brought him to London.

The bottom line is that Papadopolous was never in contract with any Russians. It would’ve been an easy matter for the FBI to check this out, but instead they launched an unprecedented investigation of a presidential candidate based on literally no evidence.

Again, Bar and a special investigator are looking into just how and why the FBI (and CIA and possibly the NSA) apparently colluded to set off this fake investigation. One possible motive would be to bug the Trump campaign, because that is what they did. And the tape recordings were then widely distributed in the Obama administration including to some very partisan Ds.

That investigatation is still underway. Its even possible the Ukraine impeachment frenzy is intended by the Ds and some in the CIA to detract from the internal FBI/CIA/DOJ invention that is still ongoing. Its against the law for the CIA to spy on Americans in the United States, but the CIA seems to have been involved from the beginning in this bizarre assault on the Trump Campagin.

CHEERS!
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Pops » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 16:38:35

Jeez, the conspiracies are as long and tortured as the 9/11 truther fever-dreams.
Facts are simple:
Trump solicited a foreign government (now 2) to 1. meddle in our election by exonerating Russia for meddling in our election 2. meddle in our election by dirtying his opponent, again.

No arguing this, he released the notes himself, did it again on TV, there are texts between a career civil servant and a trump donor/ political appointee.

All the: I'm not a puppet, whaddabout the emails, Rick made me do it, aw shucks it was a joke in the world ain't gonna fix it.
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 17:03:13

Pops wrote:Facts are simple:
Trump solicited a foreign government (now 2) to 1. meddle in our election by exonerating Russia for meddling in our election


Actually Trump wasn’t President in 2016 when the Russians meddled in the election....Obama was. And even though Obama was informed of the Russian meddling Obama said and did nothing to counter it or stop it.

Pops wrote: ....meddle in our election by dirtying his opponent, again.

No arguing this, he released the notes himself, did it again on TV.


Politics is a dirty business. Personally I don’t think it is surprising for trump to claim his opponent is corrupt and should be investigated, anymore then it is surprising for the Ds to call Trump corrupt and demand he be investigated and impeached.

I wish the Ds and Rs would talk about the issues instead of attacking each other, but politics in the US these days is largely about attacking your opponent.

Neither party has a monopoly on virtue. If the Ds are going spend all their time calling Trump corrupt and demanding he be investigated then it shouldn’t be surprising when the Ds are treated the same way by Trump.

Cheers!
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Pops » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 17:26:43

Plantagenet wrote:Politics is a dirty business.

that's your excuse? anything goes?
a manchurian candidate is better than a Democratic one?

we're in trouble
.
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Newfie » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 19:40:56

I wish the Ds and Rs would talk about the issues instead of attacking each other, but politics in the US these days is largely about attacking your opponent.


Ahmen to that.
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Cog » Sun 06 Oct 2019, 23:50:22

Pops wrote:
Plantagenet wrote:Politics is a dirty business.

that's your excuse? anything goes?
a manchurian candidate is better than a Democratic one?

we're in trouble
.


The only ones who are in trouble are those who didn't read the Mueller report. It concluded that NO American colluded or conspired with Russia to affect the outcome of the 2016 election. A finding I was promised for two years by partisan Democrats, that would show the opposite. Where is the beef homie?

I do not find Pops as Cid Yama 2.0, as entertaining as the original. It's like he doesn't even try.
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Plantagenet » Mon 07 Oct 2019, 11:29:20

Pops wrote:[
.....a manchurian candidate is better than a Democratic one?


I have to agree with Cog on this one. The D claim that Trump was a "manchurian candidate" controlled by Russia turned out to be a fraud. Adam Schiff claimed he had seen evidence that proved Trump was a Russian spy but evidently he just made it up. The Mueller Report (and extensive intelligence investigations) found no such evidence. Its time to face two key facts--- (1) Trump isn't a Russian agent and (2) Adam Schiff is a shameless liar.

----------

This is relevant to the Impeachment investigation in that it proves that Schiff lies and can't be trusted. We now know that Schiff lied about having no contact with the whistleblower. We know the whistleblower lied in his report by claiming he never met Schiff or his staff. We also know that the claims in the whistleblower report that Trump offered a quid pro quo over the phone to Ukraine are just more lies.

The common element in all these lies seems to be Adam Schiff. That man is dishonest and his statements can't be trusted.

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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Mon 07 Oct 2019, 12:06:20

Plantagenet wrote: We also know that the claims in the whistleblower report that Trump offered a quid pro quo over the phone to Ukraine are just more lies.

Well, apparently the quid pro quo thing re the phone conversation (which was disclosed by the white house summary) is entirely a matter of perception.

To dems, it's "obviously" a bribe attempt. To Trump supporters, it's "obviously" an attempt to investigate Hunter Biden, and has nothing to do with Biden running for POTUS.

Similar to the Mueller report, it's about what you can PROVE, and no one can prove what was in Trump's mind. Obviously, the impeachment attempt will try to dig around to try to find supporting evidence.

Obviously both sides will continue to put their own spin on things, same as it ever was.

I have no dog in the fight, so I'm just viewing the show. Overall, it does nothing to impress me re modern American national politics, however.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby jedrider » Mon 07 Oct 2019, 12:10:19

The House appears to have enough impeachable evidence already. The only question is will the Senate eventually abandon being a toady to Trump and redevelop an identity of their own? If Trump is deposed, then who would take his place? Is it worth replacing a lame duck President?
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Mon 07 Oct 2019, 12:17:23

jedrider wrote:The House appears to have enough impeachable evidence already. The only question is will the Senate eventually abandon being a toady to Trump and redevelop an identity of their own? If Trump is deposed, then who would take his place? Is it worth replacing a lame duck President?

Says who? What evidence is that? What CNBC believes isn't evidence, by the way.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby jedrider » Mon 07 Oct 2019, 12:55:06

Outcast_Searcher wrote:
jedrider wrote:The House appears to have enough impeachable evidence already. The only question is will the Senate eventually abandon being a toady to Trump and redevelop an identity of their own? If Trump is deposed, then who would take his place? Is it worth replacing a lame duck President?

Says who? What evidence is that? What CNBC believes isn't evidence, by the way.


Well, from what we know: Has anybody refuted 'what we know' already? Please, without mentioning that Biden, Pelosi, or Schiff, nor Hillary, committed any criminal offence? Of course, it can be all lies, but is it?
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby Cog » Mon 07 Oct 2019, 14:19:52

But what do we know? We know that Trump asked a foreign government to investigate an American citizen for any illegal acts they may have done there. That is not only not illegal for a president to do so, it is well within the executive's authority and responsibility to do so.
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Re: Countdown To Impeachment

Unread postby jedrider » Mon 07 Oct 2019, 14:27:06

Cog wrote:But what do we know? We know that Trump asked a foreign government to investigate an American citizen for any illegal acts they may have done there. That is not only not illegal for a president to do so, it is well within the executive's authority and responsibility to do so.


There are 'procedures' for all of these things. The procedures ought to be followed. If it looks like a political vendetta, then maybe it is. Colluding with a foreign government is enough for me.

One procedure to follow is to abide by Congress' perogative to subpoena evidence.
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