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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby AdamB » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 08:43:37

GHung wrote:Planty has yet to show me where Teslas, or EVs in general, have a higher rate of fires than ICE cars in the metric that matters: number of vehicle fires per miles driven. Indeed, everything I've seen to date indicates that Teslas catch fire at a much lower rate than ICE vehicles.


And now Planty says that people sit in their Teslas and are incinerated with them when they burn. Apparently Tesla owners are too dumb to open the door to escape when these spontaneous ignitions happen? This is a far more interesting tidbit than the occurring every weekday spontaneous combustion claim, I've only helped put out 1 ICE fire on an interstate highway a few years back, and that person was smart enough to get out of their car. So Planty not only is bashing things Planty has no experience with (I've been through 3 Gen I hybids (NiMh) and 2 gen 2 pluggables (Li-Ion) now) but is pretending that Tesla owners just sit there in cars in wonderment while roasting alive.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 11:11:25

GHung wrote:Planty has yet to show me where Teslas, or EVs in general, have a higher rate of fires than ICE cars in the metric that matters: number of vehicle fires per miles driven. Indeed, everything I've seen to date indicates that Teslas catch fire at a much lower rate than ICE vehicles.


You missed the point Gungie.

The number of fires per mile driven isn't a valuable criteria to compare EVs vs. ICE vehicles because the character of the fires is so different.

Most ICE engine fires are small fires caused by small fuel leaks. Turn off the ignition key and they stop. Take the car to a mechanic and he'll locate the leak and fix it and the car.

In contrast, just about all EV fires are related to runaway thermal events in the battery and power train and just about all such EV fires tend to be catastrophic and destroy the car.

The fires tend to be very different in intensity.

Get it now?

CHEERS!
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby GHung » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 12:35:10

Plantagenet wrote:
GHung wrote:Planty has yet to show me where Teslas, or EVs in general, have a higher rate of fires than ICE cars in the metric that matters: number of vehicle fires per miles driven. Indeed, everything I've seen to date indicates that Teslas catch fire at a much lower rate than ICE vehicles.


You missed the point Gungie.

The number of fires per mile driven isn't a valuable criteria to compare EVs vs. ICE vehicles because the character of the fires is so different.

Most ICE engine fires are small fires caused by small fuel leaks. Turn off the ignition key and they stop. Take the car to a mechanic and he'll locate the leak and fix it and the car.

In contrast, just about all EV fires are related to runaway thermal events in the battery and power train and just about all such EV fires tend to be catastrophic and destroy the car.

The fires tend to be very different in intensity.

Get it now?

CHEERS!


I didn't miss the point at all. You keep saying that the batteries "spontaneously combust", but have not shown that to be other than a VERY rare occurrence. It seems that was generally in early generations of battery packs. On the other hand, I've seen many fires in ICE vehicles where the entire vehicle is involved and consumed, something you seem to suggest is rare. By the time emergency personnel get to the scene, the vehicle is usually destroyed.

So what's the difference? Gasoline fires apparently occur at a much higher rate. So what if battery fires are a bit more intense? About a year ago a major interstate in Atlanta was closed for months after some plastic pipe caught fire and damaged a bridge. So I suppose you think we should get rid of plastic pipe?

Time for you to move the goal posts again, as you usually do when it's clear you can't win an argument. Me? I look at the big picture and overall benefits vs. the drawbacks. All things considered, I'm not yet sure that EVs offer more benefits, but the fire argument is just silly.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 12:51:29

GHung wrote:You keep saying that the batteries "spontaneously combust"


Thats because EV batteries sometimes spontaneously combust.

GHung wrote: It seems that was generally in early generations of battery packs.


Thats obviously not true. An almost new top-of-the-line $175,000 Tesla model X just spontensouly combusted in Belgium last week.

GHung wrote:
So what if battery fires are a bit more intense?


An intense fire is more dangerous then a fire that isn't as intense. DO I have to explain everything to you?

Cheers!
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 13:45:28

AdamB wrote:
GHung wrote:Planty has yet to show me where Teslas, or EVs in general, have a higher rate of fires than ICE cars in the metric that matters: number of vehicle fires per miles driven. Indeed, everything I've seen to date indicates that Teslas catch fire at a much lower rate than ICE vehicles.


And now Planty says that people sit in their Teslas and are incinerated with them when they burn. Apparently Tesla owners are too dumb to open the door to escape when these spontaneous ignitions happen? This is a far more interesting tidbit than the occurring every weekday spontaneous combustion claim, I've only helped put out 1 ICE fire on an interstate highway a few years back, and that person was smart enough to get out of their car.

To be fair, there was one publicized incident, via tweet from the celebrity owner - and then reported in the press, where a Tesla battery failed, and the manual door release would not operate. After awhile, the middle aged celebrity crawled out of the Tesla, through the trunk.

First, that SHOULD NEVER HAPPEN, and is an example of some of the egregious mechanical and safety failures inherent in an unreliable new brand like Tesla. Second, if it had been an elderly or infirm person, they could NOT have exited the car without assistance. So an emergency like a fire, smoking battery, etc. could have turned tragic.

I'm not saying Planty's tendency to exaggerate on such issues makes him right. I'm saying that in this case, Tesla doesn't get off unblemished as far as their ongoing rep. for serious, random, mechanical problems with their cars, and an apparent inability to truly fix them (vs. issuing vacuous claims, as per usual, as part of their apparent business model.)

I'm all for EV's of all types, especially HEV's in the early stages until BEV's are more proven, cheaper, better, the infrastructure is more mature, etc. But I expect ALL cars to have good safety and mechanical reliability in the modern era, if they're going to be deemed good or even credible offerings.

https://www.engadget.com/2019/04/09/ben ... a-model-x/

Baller, a longtime fan of Tesla, said he was locked inside his Model X P100D on a recent Saturday night for 47 minutes, having initially recorded the experience via an Instagram Story. "The electricity went into low power mode with 211 miles on the battery left and my driver side door wouldn't open," he said later on the app. "NO doors or windows would open." He says he was finally able to exit through the trunk. "Oh and No AC," he added.


And there are some legit concerns about Tesla door release safety, including NO mechanical way to get out of a Model 3 back seat. Not good with a car with dodgy reliability.

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/02/28/tes ... oor-locks/

The Tesla Model 3 does not have a mechanical latch for rear passengers at all. Tesla says front passengers are meant to use the physical latch on their doors to get out, then to open the door from the outside for the rear occupants in the event of a power loss. This design doesn't break any rules or regulations, the IIHS told us.

"A lot of these standards have been in place for many, many years and you have a push-button release and it wasn't something they were considering a possibility," Young says. "I think Tesla is relying on the fact that if you've got people in the backseat there's going to be at least one person in the front seat."


To be fair, this is partly the regulators' fault. I think lack of any regulations on this is outrageous.

"There is no federal regulation that regulates how a door handle works during a crash or for how it's constructed," Joe Young, IIHS media relations associate, told us. "There's no regulation requiring certain mechanics of a door handle."

Essentially, it's up to the manufacturers to figure out what's safest — and in case you don't remember FCA's rotary shift selector debacle, or the GM ignition fiasco, that's not a bulletproof strategy.


(Red font mine, for emphasis, in all quotes).
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 13:55:09

Plantagenet wrote:Fund Manager says Elon Musk is a Charleton!

Fund Manager says TESLA will be forced to declare bankruptcy and then will restructure!

elon-musk-charlatan-fund-manager-slams-tesla-cnbc-says-company-will-have-to-restructure

Cheers!

To be fair, fund managers and Tesla watchers are virtually all over the map regarding Tesla. Ark Invest, for example, believes all Musk's huge FSD level 5 robo-taxi fleet real soon malarkey, and assumes Tesla stock will be roughly 20X or more times its current price within a few years or so.

Disclosure: after having been more of a "wait and see" watcher of Tesla for a long time, I've moved into the longer term bearish camp on Tesla -- just too much bungling, bad service, poor quality, and ongoing losses, for me. That, in the face of rapidly approaching and arriving intense EV competition from many angles. I, of course, could be wrong, which is why I don't make big financial bets on such opinions for one stock.

I think Musk alternates between multiple phases, with clown, charleton, and incompetent business manager as common modes, with erratic genius thrown in for good, random, measure. Somehow, I prefer the staid Toyota or Honda by MILES, as far as betting on the long term success of a car company -- even when they take a cautious approach to vehicle electrification.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby AdamB » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 14:05:20

Plantagenet wrote:The fires tend to be very different in intensity.

Get it now?

CHEERS!


And your reference to how fires being different in EVs is trapping all their passengers inside and killing them? Or is that just one of those BS bias clues jumping off your keyboard accidentally?
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby GHung » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 17:43:49

Plantagenet wrote:....... Blah, blah, blah....

An intense fire is more dangerous then a fire that isn't as intense. DO I have to explain everything to you?

Cheers!


You can't explain anything to me. I don't consider your arrogant faux-explanations, or thought processes, valid.

Get it now?
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 18:54:42

GHung wrote:
Plantagenet wrote:....... Blah, blah, blah....


Dude....its pretty obvious you modified that quote. Why post lies like that? I never posted those words.

Its bad enough when people lie in what they are saying in their own posts, but its particularly dishonest for you to use the quote function to alter the words in a quote box so you can lie about what I posted. Whats the point?....all you did is demonstrate that you are a liar and your posts can't be trusted....even when you are seemingly directly quoting another poster you are actually lying about what that other person said.

IMHO,it basically destroys any possibility of having conversation on these interesting topics if you're going to just lie about what other people say in their posts. Now rather then discuss the issue we have to waste time on your lies.

Please don't do it anymore.

I suggest you take a deep breath and get yourself straight and just tell the truth when you post here. Stop lying about what other people post. If you've got something to say then say it. If you disagree with something I post then quote me honestly and say why you disagree. There is no need for you to lie about what other people are posting to make your point. Its an utter waste of time and it doesn't reflect well on you.

Cheers!
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby asg70 » Fri 07 Jun 2019, 22:10:50

Plantagenet wrote:Most ICE engine fires are small fires caused by small fuel leaks


O really?

GHung wrote:You can't explain anything to me. I don't consider your arrogant faux-explanations, or thought processes, valid.
Get it now?


GHung is bashing Plant. Glorious. I must have been wrong about you all along.

Outcast_Searcher wrote:And there are some legit concerns about Tesla door release safety, including NO mechanical way to get out of a Model 3 back seat.


Yes, this is a case of Tesla favoring form over function which is ultimately life-threatening. Tesla should follow the KISS principle. Cars are built the way they are for a reason. They're time-tested.

Hopefully we can stop jousting with Plant because all he wants to do is hijack the thread for his own trollish amusement.

HALL OF SHAME:
-Short welched on a bet and should be shunned.
-Frequent-flyers should not cry crocodile-tears over climate-change.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 08 Jun 2019, 12:59:56

Tesla in fatal crash into construction site in Europe..........was it on AUTOPILOT?

tesla-model-x-reportedly-autopilot-slams-construction-truck-killing-driver-

TESLA is already being sued for a similar fatal crash in the US where autopilot allegedly caused the fatal crash

tesla-autopilot-lawsuit-model-x-crash

On the bright side, at least the TESLA didn't explode into flames after these crashes, so only the AUTOPILOT system is of concern.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby GHung » Sun 09 Jun 2019, 13:02:14

Plantagenet wrote:
GHung wrote:
Plantagenet wrote:....... Blah, blah, blah....


Dude....its pretty obvious you modified that quote. Why post lies like that? I never posted those words.

...............

Cheers!


I didn't modify that quote. I translated it.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 09 Jun 2019, 18:12:52

GHung wrote: I didn't modify that quote.


Yes you did.

You quoted something with the quote function and then you modified the quote.

Its bad enough you are such a liar you will lie about what other people post.

Now you lying about the fact you lied.

How about you just stop lying?

Its that even possible for you?

CHEERS!
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Fri 28 Jun 2019, 11:24:12

Tesla finally admits their battery caused the spontaneous Model S fire caught on video in China

tesla-admits-battery-malfunction-caused-spontaneous-combustion-model-s-

Image
Snap! Crackle! Pop!

Normally, honesty is the best policy. But by admitting that their batteries can spontaneously combust, Tesla has just raised more questions about the safety of their product.

Cheers!
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby GHung » Tue 02 Jul 2019, 17:43:17

Planty needs to call all of the proud new Tesla owners and warn them how much danger they are in!

Tesla sets a record for sales, and its stock jumps 7%

Tesla delivered 95,200 cars in its second quarter, a record for the company.
The numbers, released Tuesday, met the company's own goal and easily outpaced the 63,000 cars delivered in the first three months of the year. They also far surpassed the 40,740 cars delivered to customers in the year-ago quarter, when Tesla was still struggling to ramp up production of the Model 3, its best-selling car.
Shares of Tesla (TSLA) jumped roughly 7% in after-hours trading.
..........
https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/02/tech/tes ... index.html
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Tue 02 Jul 2019, 19:04:08

GHung wrote:Planty needs to call all of the proud new Tesla owners and warn them how much danger they are in!


Try to keep up, Gungie.

Tesla has admitted fault in the Model S battery fire caught on video in China. They also say they've corrected the problem and there won't be any more runaway thermal events in Tesla battery systems.

You have to wonder why they didn't fix the problem earlier, but if they've fixed it now as they say then good for them.

Cheers!
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby GHung » Tue 02 Jul 2019, 19:28:23

Plantagenet wrote:
Try to keep up, Gungie. .......!


Jeez. I'm out front, moving ahead. You just don't know when you've been lapped. And I'm not the one who's been beating the same dead horse for a month or two.
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Re: Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Wed 03 Jul 2019, 09:40:02

Plant, you display all signs of a hatred for Tesla, or the company founder Elon Musk, or both. I don't know what your problem is - perhaps you "invested" some cash in Tesla stock as I did an eternity ago in the Cape Wind offshore wind farm. Eventually I got over the sting of losing $7500.

So what is it, anyway? I understand that EVs are not truly competitive with ICE vehicles. Clearly they will be when gas surpasses $5/g again. Within my 35-year history in Silicon Valley, I remember the sting of $5.659/g, Regular grade. There is a reason so many EVs are sold in the valley, and they even encourage their use with single-occupancy EVs in the HOV lanes during rush hour.

Never-the-less, EVs are necessary to preservce the lifestyles of the Middle Class in the USA. Rural and suburban EVs, specificly. The cities and large towns should ban private vehicles, frankly, and encourage Uber/etc, electric bikes/scooters, and really good mass transit.

From the perspective of a retired EE, there is nothing close to Tesla vehicles, in terms of sophistication. Musk still has a lead on other EV vendors.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby kublikhan » Wed 03 Jul 2019, 17:32:46

KaiserJeep wrote:Plant, you display all signs of a hatred for Tesla, or the company founder Elon Musk, or both. I don't know what your problem is - perhaps you "invested" some cash in Tesla stock as I did an eternity ago in the Cape Wind offshore wind farm. Eventually I got over the sting of losing $7500.

So what is it, anyway?
I'm curious myself. Plant, you have consistently been anti-EV from the get go. And it's not like you have one particular thing you dislike about EVs. Instead you seem to spread FUD about anything you can find on EVs. And if someone brings up a logical counter to an argument you made you ignore them, snipe at them personally, and/or revert to spreading FUD. So what is it? Did Grandma get run over by an EV? Or perhaps is it something like this:

Today I want to come clean about something I feel very badly about. I cannot undo some of the things I have done, but hopefully this message will prevent other such occurrences in the future.

I am a paid basher.

Yes, it is true. Today is my last day at this company; I'm moving on to a new job. I've realized that there are more dignifying jobs out there that can pay me equally as well. But before I go, I want to explain a few things because this just isn't right and I won't feel good about myself until I expose this sham. It's hurt too many people and I don't want it on my conscience anymore. I can no longer live with a lie.

There are several companies engaged in the bashing business, ours is not the only one. However, I can tell you that not every basher in here is a paid basher. Having done this for a year, I can usually tell who is a paid basher and who is merely someone having a little fun. While unpaid bashers have a different motive than someone like me, they can be unwilling accomplices to helping me achieve my ultimate goal and they also spread rumor and confusion throughout a room, which also helps me.

There are three types of bashers here at Global Calumny Funds: Advanced, Intermediate and Beginner. An Advanced-level basher (also known as a Silver Tongued Devil) would spread false or misleading information about the company. They would deal in facts, countering every longs post with articles, news reports and opinion surveys that gave a negative impression about the company.

Finally, a Beginner-level basher (also known as a Pitchfork) would attempt to create confusion in the room by distracting other posters with satire, name calling and pointless arguments. The idea was to make sure no serious discussion of the stock could take place. A Pitchfork was usually a basher, but not always. Sometimes, we would throw in a hypster Pitchfork such as MONEYMADE and laptop and a pumper like Datatech to create the illusion of an argument going on. What was really funny (in a perverse way, I guess) was that Datatech and I sat next to each other, laughing the whole time.
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Re: THE Tesla Thread Pt. 2 (merged)

Unread postby Plantagenet » Fri 12 Jul 2019, 15:22:26

Tesla Model S spontaneously self-combusts while sitting in a parking garage in San Francisco

another-tesla-model-s-randomly-catches-fire-in-san-francisco-garage-report

The car wasn't charging or even plugged in. It just self-combusted.

I must confess I'm disappointed to read this since TESLA recently announced they had "fixed" the self-combustion problem. Maybe they will now issue a fix to correct their latest fix and really fix it.

Cheers!
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