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THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

How to save energy through both societal and individual actions.

Re: Free Plug-in Hybrid Refueling (for how long?)

Unread postby Hawkcreek » Mon 17 Apr 2017, 19:23:14

Plantagenet wrote:Here's a similar deal for hybrids that is coming to an end:

Right now you can drive in the car pool lane in California if you drive a hybrid.

Its gonna stop.

solo drivers in hybrids to be booted from car pool lanes

That is kinda dumb. Most of them get about the same mileage or better on the highway as my motorcycle (around 45mpg) , and motorcycles are still allowed.
"It don't make no sense that common sense don't make no sense no more"
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby AdamB » Wed 26 Apr 2017, 09:52:53

Outcast_Searcher wrote:
Tanada wrote:
AP wrote:Ford says hybrid police car catches bad guys, saves gas too


https://apnews.com/295bbfe0f9f64fbea758 ... es-gas-too


This is interesting. It illustrates the fact that hybrids are viable for a WIDE range of vehicles, until EV's are truly ready for prime time and mass adoption.


Going on now as we speak. And I hate to say "I told you so"...but I did, and did it here, and it is now making the front news page of po.com no less!!

http://peakoil.com/consumption/electric ... d-in-2030s
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby asg70 » Wed 26 Apr 2017, 15:48:19

The negativity in the comments underneath is telling. This sort of projection should be met with joy by peakers as it's like watching Hirsch Report style adaptation happen without having to first convince the public about the dangers of peak-oil. But since so many people are so attached to the idea of collapse they can't abide any good news.

BOLD PREDICTIONS
-Billions are on the verge of starvation as the lockdown continues. (yoshua, 5/20/20)

HALL OF SHAME:
-Short welched on a bet and should be shunned.
-Frequent-flyers should not cry crocodile-tears over climate-change.
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby AdamB » Wed 26 Apr 2017, 20:57:28

asg70 wrote: But since so many people are so attached to the idea of collapse they can't abide any good news.


Those attached to "collapse", doomers for lack of a better term really, can't SEE good news. Peak oil caused glut and low prices, rejoice! "Nah...we're all gonna die." New technologies and power for your transport means that even if peak oil happens, you won't have to give up drag racing away from street lights, cruising the burger joints of commuting to work! Rejoice! "Nah...as soon as it costs more than $40 to fillup my Suburban that I really need to get potting soil at Lowes to build my food forest in my backyard..we're all gonna die." Peak demand is right around the corner, we aren't even going to be using as much oil in the near future, so it can peak and it won't bother anybody. Rejoice! "Nah..if we solve peak oil than <climate change, comet collisions, Carrington events, gamma bursts, alien overlords> will fill in for it, and we're all gonna die."

I think the reason for the fascination is that they are facing their own mortality, and they project it into the world around them rather than accept reality. It isn't the world or humans that are going to die, but each of us, individually, at some point in time. And that is hard to think about, so it manifests itself in collapse belief. Which is why no facts are required, history doesn't matter, critical thinking must be abandoned in favor of ....belief.
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby AdamB » Wed 26 Apr 2017, 21:00:57

pstarr wrote:I know asg. We are so doomy gloomy. Must hate America, huh?


More likely misanthropy.
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby EdwinSm » Sun 27 Aug 2017, 07:15:54

Picture here of our local Hybrid Transportation system:- http://www.laivabongari.fi/elektra/

"Elektra" has an electric drive with diesel backup. I has a gigantic plug in system (that's the box on middle top of the side of the centre superstructure), as well as about 40 solar panels facing each direction. It is 90 metres long and 16 metres broad, and is rated to carry 90 passanger cars.


This is the only hybrid I have been using - it runs on a 10 minute crossing, and replaced a smaller (60 car) diesel ferry.
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby Tanada » Fri 17 Aug 2018, 11:56:09

Now that fuel prices are back up from the 2015-16 lows hybrid car sales are rebounding.

Image
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Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby Newfie » Sun 13 Jan 2019, 09:21:40

A new kind of hybrid just got approval to go into full production.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.busine ... ons-2018-7
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby theluckycountry » Thu 22 Jul 2021, 17:11:26

asg70 wrote:The negativity in the comments underneath is telling. This sort of projection should be met with joy by peakers as it's like watching Hirsch Report style adaptation happen without having to first convince the public about the dangers of peak-oil. But since so many people are so attached to the idea of collapse they can't abide any good news.


This thread is old and the user I have quoted is now banned but I thought that 4 years on it would be good to revisit this since these things typically get pushed under the rug. I'm thinking of things like the mass uptake of the Segway, which will revolutionize inner city transport. Remember that one?

I am a realist and base my decisions on what's happening in the real world, not the corporate/ Government promises world. I looked into buying a Nissan Leaf recently, what a great saving that would be for me over the course of 20 years driving. Then I discovered the batteries only last 8 years, only have a usable range, for my needs, of 3-4 years, and cost an absolute fortune to replace. I couldn't make the equation work so shelved it. I thought though about the future and about what would happen at 8 years when they all start coming up for sale because of dying batteries? Who will buy them knowing they have to pony up $10k or so for a new battery?

Hybrids suffer similar issues though not on the same scale and that because they use a lot more gasoline than battery, at least down here where we have long driving distances. The technology is great and I would love to see it take off but it doesn't make economic sense unless you live in the inner rings of a major city, and especially not for the millions here in Australia on low incomes. They can afford an old 4-cly banger and that's about it.

These hybrids are selling well though and the sales people at toyota for one are really pushing them over the standard model. I know because my sister got talked into getting one. It was a silly decision since she lives in a remote area 40km from town and regularly makes 300km trips otherwise. At least her battery pack wont degrade in a hurry.
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby AdamB » Thu 22 Jul 2021, 17:35:53

theluckycountry wrote:I am a realist and base my decisions on what's happening in the real world, not the corporate/ Government promises world. I looked into buying a Nissan Leaf recently, what a great saving that would be for me over the course of 20 years driving. Then I discovered the batteries only last 8 years, only have a usable range, for my needs, of 3-4 years, and cost an absolute fortune to replace. I couldn't make the equation work so shelved it.


Wrong tool for the job perhaps? I bought that Leaf, already 6 years old and with battery degradation of about 12%, and short of some manufacturing fault, it will certainly make it 8 years. Range in that model year is only about 70 miles, which means it works great in suburbia. And you don't replace the battery, you junk the car. Considering I paid minor duckketts for it, factor in fueling it and calculate $/mile and it beats out the boys college junker within 30K miles. I expect to do far better than just beating a cheap ICE machine.

theluckycountry wrote:Hybrids suffer similar issues though not on the same scale and that because they use a lot more gasoline than battery, at least down here where we have long driving distances. The technology is great and I would love to see it take off but it doesn't make economic sense unless you live in the inner rings of a major city, and especially not for the millions here in Australia on low incomes. They can afford an old 4-cly banger and that's about it.


I have one of these as well. Sits at 150k miles in the driveway right now. Around town it is an electric. On the highway it gets 44 mpg ( 19 km/liter?). I use it to drive cross continent when the urge strikes. A bit weird, that kind of efficiency being only useful in a major city. Does major cities fine of course, as it has about 20 miles of EV range, so in-town I don't need to put fuel it in but every 6 months. Assuming the wife drives it rather than the Leaf of course. I'm an ST1100 guy. I'll put another 2400km on this car before the weekend is half over. What kind of wankers are Australians to think they are the only ones using vehicles over long distances? :)
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 23 Jul 2021, 16:27:35

theluckycountry wrote:These hybrids are selling well though and the sales people at toyota for one are really pushing them over the standard model. I know because my sister got talked into getting one. It was a silly decision since she lives in a remote area 40km from town and regularly makes 300km trips otherwise. At least her battery pack wont degrade in a hurry.

Given that Toyotas tend to last at least 200K miles, and that the Toyota Hybrid system has a 150K mile warranty in the US, when Toyota can't sell Toyota HEV's to new car buyers when gas is near $3 a gallon, or more, be SURE and get back to us.

In the real world, the HEV's are likely to be a GREAT transitional vehicle until BEV's mature, along with the charging systems for them.

Increasingly, more and more people live in or near cities, so just because HEV's don't work in, say, remote Australia, don't pretend that means there is no place for HEV's, and expect to be taken seriously. :roll:

Seriously.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: THE Hybrid Transportation Thread pt 2(merged)

Unread postby theluckycountry » Tue 12 Apr 2022, 17:22:42

Outcast_Searcher wrote:
theluckycountry wrote:These hybrids are selling well though and the sales people at toyota for one are really pushing them over the standard model.


Increasingly, more and more people live in or near cities, so just because HEV's don't work in, say, remote Australia, don't pretend that means there is no place for HEV's, and expect to be taken seriously. :roll:

Seriously.


I reread my post above OS and looked for the part where I 'pretended there was no place for HEV's', I didn't, but you, in your slavish defense of these overpriced products conjured up a sentence where I said "There in no place for HEV's" If YOU want to be taken seriously here, just comment on what other people ACTUALLY say. Seriously :roll:

As for HEV's being a good thing for the city cockroaches, well no doubt, they will certainly cut down the pollution, a little bit, but as far as them being any sort of aid to the efforts to get away from fossil fuels I have my serious doubts. After all, the oil used to mine and process the lithium and other elements used in their manufacture is not negligible, and then there is the prodigious amounts of oil used to transport these minerals around the globe.

But as with all re-buildable solutions though, it's more about profits and market share than any real concern for the consequences of oil depletion. The fact that you techno dreamers swallow every new product that advertises itself as a step forward is half of the problem too. You are being spoon-fed bullshite every step of the way, and as you eagerly buy up these non-solutions, you thereby hinder any real hope for a transition to a sustainable future. One and a half ton personal vehicles is not the future, yet they get heavier every year as more batteries are packed in to give them the range consumers demand.
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