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Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Tue 27 Apr 2021, 14:51:43

dissident wrote:Bitcoin value is a bubble. People hear about clowns making billions so they buy in expecting to ride the wave. This drives up the price of this vapid "asset", which in turn draws more confidence in its "value". As noted above the current price (in fiat, LOL) of Bitcoin is too high for hordes of more buyers to be getting the windfalls of the early birds. This means that we are approaching the bubble burst stage.

Bitcoin is also a species of Ponzi scheme since its valuation is driven by new investor flux. Without this flux it could not have appreciated in fiat terms. As we enter the flux attenuation regime, the scheme will start to collapse.

If it weren't for your posting history and clear belief in random consipiracy theories, you might have a credible argument. As it is, why should your musings be trusted?

But you believe what you believe, so there's that. :idea:

Hint: I have NO IDEA re the future price of BTC or crypto currencies generally, is, and have a TINY percentage of my net worth (hint: well under 1%) tied into BTC, given my lack of confidence. So if BTC crashes or goes to zero, I really don't care.

But OTOH, I don't claim I know what the future holds frequently and get proven wrong quite a bit, like the conspiracy theory folks, or the "economic doom is nigh EVERY MONTH for decades" crowd, who being proven constantly wrong only has credibility in their own constantly flapping lips.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Ibon » Tue 27 Apr 2021, 17:35:04

Outcast_Searcher wrote:
But OTOH, I don't claim I know what the future holds frequently and get proven wrong quite a bit, like the conspiracy theory folks, or the "economic doom is nigh EVERY MONTH for decades" crowd, who being proven constantly wrong only has credibility in their own constantly flapping lips.


Conspiracy theory folks always seem to know exactly what is happening, every twist and turn of reality gets filtered through their certainty and they exhibit a constant of always knowing exactly what is happening! Ever notice that?

You will never see conspiracy theory folks frankly state like you did OS that they simply don't know what is going to happen, that they are not sure, that the future could go either way.

And therein lies the deep insecurity that is at the root of every conspiracy theorist on the planet. This need to have it all figured out, identifying the boogey man, always knowing.

Conspiracy theorists have no emotional maturity to hang in the unknown of NOT KNOWING.

They are scared little bunny rabbits at the end of the day.

There are many out there and they can be found across the political spectrum ideology wise. Trumpsters are classic examples by the way....so unwaveringly certain the election was stolen......
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Plantagenet » Wed 28 Apr 2021, 14:43:16

Ibon wrote:Conspiracy theory ......There are many out there and they can be found across the political spectrum ideology wise. Trumpsters are classic examples by the way....so unwaveringly certain the election was stolen......


Exactly right. They are on both sides of the political spectrum and they aren't just uneducated dolts in the backwoods or illiterate immigrants or poorly educated urban citizens..... many conspiracy theorists turn out to be are extremely well educated and very prominent and powerful people.

For instance, on the D side there were literally millions of D conspiracy theorists who believed that Trump was a Russian secret agent who conspired with the Russians to steal the 2016 election. Those conspiracy theories started at the top with Hillary and Obama, and came to permeate much of the left-leaning US mainstream media and the bulk of the D party, even though it was total nonsense.

A more recent D conspiracy theory which is having serious repercussions today was the nutty idea put forth by Cuomo and Whitmer and other D leaders in 2020 that the Trumpies were rushing vaccine development and testing in order to help Trump get re-elected, so the covid vaccine wasn't safe. The nutty Ds actually set up state boards in blue states like New York, California, Michigan etc. to independently review the vaccines to make sure they were safe. This kind of anti-vax conspiracy nonsense is probably one reason so many D voters in big cities are "vaccine hesitant." They made the mistake of buying into the nonsense being peddled by top D politicians who were spreading conspiracy theories and trying to discredit the covid vaccine.

Image
Prominent D politicans in blue states were spreading anti-vax conspiracy theories in 2020......and now we see a lot of "vaccine hesitancy" among their inner city D voters.

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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Polybius » Mon 17 May 2021, 16:12:20

Now that the scam is complete and Tesla cars have been subsidized by all the bitcoin suckers, CIA agent Elon Musk have come out in the open to declare he has sold his CIAcoins.... (and Tesla is now no longer accepting coins for cars)

What else is new?
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Wed 19 May 2021, 12:56:06

Polybius wrote:Now that the scam is complete and Tesla cars have been subsidized by all the bitcoin suckers, CIA agent Elon Musk have come out in the open to declare he has sold his CIAcoins.... (and Tesla is now no longer accepting coins for cars)

What else is new?

As usual, every single thing you type is credible. :roll:

And no, I'm NO fan of Musk or his antics, especially his attention span of a gnat, and is prevarication on MANY subjects over time.

But acting like an idiot, whether it be about FSD that isn't remotely close to true FSD, claims about Covid-19 which were utter nonsense, BTC BS, "420 funding secured", etc. doesn't make him any more a CIA agent than you are a wise prophet.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Polybius » Sat 22 May 2021, 00:47:31

Outcast_Searcher wrote:
Polybius wrote:Now that the scam is complete and Tesla cars have been subsidized by all the bitcoin suckers, CIA agent Elon Musk have come out in the open to declare he has sold his CIAcoins.... (and Tesla is now no longer accepting coins for cars)

What else is new?

As usual, every single thing you type is credible. :roll:

And no, I'm NO fan of Musk or his antics, especially his attention span of a gnat, and is prevarication on MANY subjects over time.

But acting like an idiot, whether it be about FSD that isn't remotely close to true FSD, claims about Covid-19 which were utter nonsense, BTC BS, "420 funding secured", etc. doesn't make him any more a CIA agent than you are a wise prophet.


https://youtu.be/iomRREashI0
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby dissident » Sat 22 May 2021, 14:21:44

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/elon- ... currencies

Crypto is a currency like a roll of toilet paper or any other such token of agreed exchange. But crypto does not exist without fiat since people only see the "value" of crypto if it is priced and sold in fiat. If someone was peddling objects without regular currency pricing, nobody would care. At least gold has some form of intrinsic attraction aside from its exchange medium usage.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sun 23 May 2021, 13:26:20

dissident wrote:https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/elon-musk-declares-support-crypto-over-fiat-currencies

Crypto is a currency like a roll of toilet paper or any other such token of agreed exchange. But crypto does not exist without fiat since people only see the "value" of crypto if it is priced and sold in fiat. If someone was peddling objects without regular currency pricing, nobody would care. At least gold has some form of intrinsic attraction aside from its exchange medium usage.

Good point as far as it goes.

But I think that if there were, say, a gold standard, we could possibly have crypto, and have it valued in units of gold. And people could hold, say, gold, silver, the "better" cryptos, conventional financial assets like stocks, and bonds, other assets like commodities, real estate, and art, etc. -- just like they do today.

I still think the big challenge for BTC is how slow, expensive, energy using, etc. it is. Unless that could be changed to compete with the most efficient cryptos CAN'T be used for all transactions, unlike say credit cards, stablecoins, etc.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sun 23 May 2021, 13:32:14


Wow. So a Youtuber has an opinion. :roll:

In the real world, chipped credit cards do JUST FINE as far as handling massive amounts of payments, rapidly and reliably, efficiently. So if that's the only issue, stablecoins aren't needed.

And stablecoins don't fix the idea of fiat that can be infinitely created at ALL. The strict limit on BTC is one of the main reasons true believers think it is "the answer" to fiat.

Fiat, and the risk of inflation / hyperinflation is the big problem -- NOT the inability to make quick payments. Stablecoins will help with the quick payment thing (like credit cards already do), but so what?

In reality, no one knows the future of Crypto-currencies, especially re any details, any more than anyone knows the details on the future of gold or oil or stocks or anything else.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Polybius » Mon 24 May 2021, 20:03:35

Outcast_Searcher wrote:

Wow. So a Youtuber has an opinion. :roll:

In the real world, chipped credit cards do JUST FINE as far as handling massive amounts of payments, rapidly and reliably, efficiently. So if that's the only issue, stablecoins aren't needed.

And stablecoins don't fix the idea of fiat that can be infinitely created at ALL. The strict limit on BTC is one of the main reasons true believers think it is "the answer" to fiat.

Fiat, and the risk of inflation / hyperinflation is the big problem -- NOT the inability to make quick payments. Stablecoins will help with the quick payment thing (like credit cards already do), but so what?

In reality, no one knows the future of Crypto-currencies, especially re any details, any more than anyone knows the details on the future of gold or oil or stocks or anything else.


China kills the CIAcoin

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/202 ... on-mining/
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby mousepad » Tue 25 May 2021, 07:04:00

Outcast_Searcher wrote:

Wow. So a Youtuber has an opinion. :roll:


I think traceability and control a pretty good argument.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Wed 26 May 2021, 12:57:43

mousepad wrote:
Outcast_Searcher wrote:

Wow. So a Youtuber has an opinion. :roll:


I think traceability and control a pretty good argument.

You can find many thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, arguing BOTH sides of the argument, re whether crypto is a fantastic investment, or a joke which will inevitably plunge to roughly zero value in time. And of course, many are vociferous, insisting they "know" they are right, etc.

I don't think throwing concepts like traceability and control around (which I would agree are good things to have) will in any way settle the argument. I think what unfolds in the fullness of time will settle the argument as we experience the reality -- just like for the prices of ANY volatile market.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby mousepad » Wed 26 May 2021, 16:25:59

Outcast_Searcher wrote:
mousepad wrote:
Outcast_Searcher wrote:

Wow. So a Youtuber has an opinion. :roll:


I think traceability and control a pretty good argument.

You can find many thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, arguing BOTH sides of the argument, re whether crypto is a fantastic investment, or a joke which will inevitably plunge to roughly zero value in time.


Yes. my comment was in reference to your dismissive remark about the youtuber's opinion.
I just remarked that in my opinion he made good arguments regarding traceability. I would think that's a major feature any government wants to have. And if btc can't deliver, its future as a gov backed currency is limited. But then again, what do I know? I've been wrong more than once before.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sun 30 May 2021, 23:14:15

mousepad wrote:Yes. my comment was in reference to your dismissive remark about the youtuber's opinion.
I just remarked that in my opinion he made good arguments regarding traceability. I would think that's a major feature any government wants to have. And if btc can't deliver, its future as a gov backed currency is limited. But then again, what do I know? I've been wrong more than once before.

OK. But that's a feature of the public distributed network provided by the blockchain. ANY application using blockchain technology can provide such traceability. Including ANY cryptocurrency, including Fedcoin, what the Chinese are doing, etc.

What BTC can't deliver at all in its current form (and even some big BTC pumpers on Youtube admit this), is high volume transactions needed to make it "the currency of choice". So more and more, the pumpers are calling it a "store of value" or an asset, and saying it's NOT A CURRENCY, but of course, still claiming it will zoom to the heavens (because it's the one they pump). Here's a classic example by a huge BTC pumper.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-XuMhOZo-Q

My objection is NOT that blockchain technology has no value. It's that just because someone puts something on a blockchain doesn't mean that the original event is accurate -- that would still need to be audited. All it means is that the miners agreed the event was recorded in the way stated. But a useful currency needs to consistently be able to handle quite a few BILLIONS of transactions a day, like, say, VIsa cards do. Etherium, for example, might be able to do that with the changes planned re using proof of stake instead of proof of work, as planned by the end of 2021.

https://fortune.com/2021/05/27/ethereum ... nt-carbon/
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby evilgenius » Mon 31 May 2021, 08:31:13

Plantagenet wrote:
Ibon wrote:Conspiracy theory ......There are many out there and they can be found across the political spectrum ideology wise. Trumpsters are classic examples by the way....so unwaveringly certain the election was stolen......


Exactly right. They are on both sides of the political spectrum and they aren't just uneducated dolts in the backwoods or illiterate immigrants or poorly educated urban citizens..... many conspiracy theorists turn out to be are extremely well educated and very prominent and powerful people.

For instance, on the D side there were literally millions of D conspiracy theorists who believed that Trump was a Russian secret agent who conspired with the Russians to steal the 2016 election. Those conspiracy theories started at the top with Hillary and Obama, and came to permeate much of the left-leaning US mainstream media and the bulk of the D party, even though it was total nonsense.

A more recent D conspiracy theory which is having serious repercussions today was the nutty idea put forth by Cuomo and Whitmer and other D leaders in 2020 that the Trumpies were rushing vaccine development and testing in order to help Trump get re-elected, so the covid vaccine wasn't safe. The nutty Ds actually set up state boards in blue states like New York, California, Michigan etc. to independently review the vaccines to make sure they were safe. This kind of anti-vax conspiracy nonsense is probably one reason so many D voters in big cities are "vaccine hesitant." They made the mistake of buying into the nonsense being peddled by top D politicians who were spreading conspiracy theories and trying to discredit the covid vaccine.

Image
Prominent D politicans in blue states were spreading anti-vax conspiracy theories in 2020......and now we see a lot of "vaccine hesitancy" among their inner city D voters.

Cheers!

You might be right about voter hesitancy when it come to the vaccine. I've noticed at my work that many people are hesitant. Most of them don't spend their time repeating conspiracies. Some of them do. The number that is hesitant, though, seems larger than the number of kooks.

When I got my second shot I expected to get sick. Everybody laid into me like that was what would happen. It seemed like I was on the threshold, potentially, of one of those tribe like experiences, where people graduate to manhood or whatever. My arm wasn't even as sore the second time around as the first.
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Re: Why Bitcoin is a CIA scam to extend the petrodollar

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Thu 03 Jun 2021, 13:23:48

evilgenius wrote:You might be right about voter hesitancy when it come to the vaccine. I've noticed at my work that many people are hesitant. Most of them don't spend their time repeating conspiracies. Some of them do. The number that is hesitant, though, seems larger than the number of kooks.

When I got my second shot I expected to get sick. Everybody laid into me like that was what would happen. It seemed like I was on the threshold, potentially, of one of those tribe like experiences, where people graduate to manhood or whatever. My arm wasn't even as sore the second time around as the first.

Sounds consistent with my experience with the shots, and my reading.

I myself was vaccine hesitant, re going very early. I wanted to wait about a month and see what came out in the news, with millions of people getting vaccinated, just to be a bit more cautious. Holed up in the house and being very careful anyway, it's not like waiting a bit would be very likely to hurt me.

There's a BIG difference, IMO, between being a bit hesitant or cautious, than spewing conspiracy theories about vaccines, as though "all vaccines are BAD", like an anti-vaxxer, IMO. Once I saw how good the news was for many millions of people, including elderly people and sickly people for the popular US MRNA vaccine risk compared to getting Covid-19, I was 100% sure getting an MRNA vaccine was the right choice in the US. (Credible data -- it's a thing).

What's a bit disappointing to me is that more people, as far more evidence rolls in, are unwilling or unable to look at the trade-offs re relative risk to themselves and the benefit to society of reaching herd immunity (or even close to that), and become less hesitant, over time. But I suppose culture, religion, politics, and an alarmingly poor level of K-12 math education (including often little to no statistics or probability education) leads to unfortunate results. Even if 10% of people didn't get vaccinated due to "valid" reasons re medical issues, serious religious issues, etc., we could likely reach quite decent herd immunity. But if it's 30% or closer to half, then all of society has to live with Covid-19 for quite a while, if not "forever".
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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