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Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby REAL Green » Sat 17 Oct 2020, 04:31:41

There is a glass half full or empty here to consider. Humans are doomed regardless and always have been but denial of death keeps us going day by day until it gets us. So, on an existential level of an individual an acceptance of death is essential if transformative meaning is to be found. Denial is bargaining and trying to bargain away death is futile. If the individual comes to this acceptance of death which is basically a wisdom of insecurity then the greater world of dread, we dwell in abstractly in a prefrontal cortex is easier to accept. I don't know if collective action is going to save us but I do know honest science is telling me we have forced the system and it has phased changed on multiple levels.

This being saved or not takes on less significance if the issue becomes one of journey over a destination. Our lives are a journey then we die. The real journey is getting up and living every day. If you scale this more local then the journey is more manageable. If the obsession with destination is muted the journey takes on more meaning. Daily tasks that are often of low value take on increased value as they combine to achieve a journey of discovery that is creative change. There is meaning in creative change that offsets the destructive change of decline that is abandonment, dysfunction, and the irrational. Meaning comes from the journey itself not the destination which is death abstractly or physically.

Our current civilization cannot embrace this only the individual or small groups can. Competitive cooperation of multiple points of view self-organize in a growth impulse. This will not change so collective change is not possible plus it is unrealistic to begin with. Civilization is obsessed with manifest destiny of expansion. Human civilization will bargain and deny reality and continue to try to grow. The planet is in succession so the logical human action is managed degrowth. This means civilization at its most basic is irrational now. This is inevitable and if the individual accepts this then he accepts the decline process instead of the social narrative of manifest destiny.

The greatest force driving acceptance should be planetary decline. Here we have physics of decline that are nonnegotiable and patterned. You cannot bargain with physics. The earth acquiesces our existence. So now we have the dual forces of human and planetary decline that cannot be overcome. This can and should lead to transformative change through acceptance if not then there is the consuming anxiety of death. Once accepted then the individual goes forth on his journey knowing the destination is death. The meaning of this transformation gives the individual morale. Keep in mind this is transformative not a transcendence. The trap is real and cannot be extricated. The trap is death which there is no transcendence from at least for the earthly body. Transcendence of the higher power is another discussion with a different journey.

Keep in mind I am speaking to those who can, those who are educated, and those with spiritual strength. The planet plays an essential part. This is one of my key points of REAL Green. It is why I point to a modern shamanism of meaning. Connecting and emulating the planet conveys its strength into and through you. This is extremely subtle and almost like static thus it must be carefully cultivated with proper lifestyle. The cultivation coming through the process of the journey of meaning. What this means is if the planet including humans are in a decline phase of succession then you must become part of that individually. Once part of that then your actions fit and are enhanced. Fight it and you are resisted and will tire eventually.

If you made it this far through this tossed salad of ideas then a salute you. These ideas are very limited in meaning because the real meaning is life itself not the thought of it. What I am talking about is for a few because many have not the luxury of these thoughts. They are living on the edge mentally, physically, or both. Yet, many can and those who can should. The reason they should is it is man’s deeper meaning. Become a modern shaman who bases his actions on emulation of the planet and its current gradient of abrupt change.

Get out of the denial of death of the human ego and distance yourself from the human collective narrative of manifest destiny. Use it as needed but leave it. Go forth and do good deeds for those in your local of people and place. You will create a microclime of growth in a niche of creative change. If that is all wiped away so be it. The modern shaman accepts his life is acquiesced to him by the planet. Life becomes absurd if you obsess over the destination. If you dive into the journey meaning will flow into you and enhance your efforts.
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 18 Oct 2020, 01:18:12

REAL Green wrote:If you made it this far through this tossed salad of ideas then a salute you.


Thank you. I enjoyed reading your philosophical comments.

REAL Green wrote: These ideas are very limited in meaning because the real meaning is life itself not the thought of it. What I am talking about is for a few because many have not the luxury of these thoughts. They are living on the edge mentally, physically, or both. Yet, many can and those who can should. The reason they should is it is man’s deeper meaning. Become a modern shaman who bases his actions on emulation of the planet and its current gradient of abrupt change.

Get out of the denial of death of the human ego and distance yourself from the human collective narrative of manifest destiny. Use it as needed but leave it. Go forth and do good deeds for those in your local of people and place. You will create a microclime of growth in a niche of creative change. If that is all wiped away so be it. The modern shaman accepts his life is acquiesced to him by the planet. Life becomes absurd if you obsess over the destination. If you dive into the journey meaning will flow into you and enhance your efforts.


Again, you are thinking about some very profound things. Its very hard to write about such things, and you're doing a very good job of it.

Personally, I just find global warming and the growing litany of climate catastrophes very entertaining.

When I was young I always was slightly disappointed that real life wasn't as exciting as the movies.

Well, now real life IS as exciting as the movies.

The world has become very much like a BIG BUDGET DISASTER MOVIE.........we're basically living in a CLIMATE CHANGE DISASTER MOVIE now....

I can't wait to see what happens next.

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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby REAL Green » Sun 18 Oct 2020, 06:30:47

Plantagenet wrote:Personally, I just find global warming and the growing litany of climate catastrophes very entertaining. When I was young I always was slightly disappointed that real life wasn't as exciting as the movies.
Cheers!


I think a better word for it is exciting. Entertaining is a bit detached in enjoyment when the reality is difficult adaptation and mitigation is ahead with price to pay. It is just a matter of time before the cost mount and the real economic pain begin. At some point the pain may go beyond economic and at this point be manifested in climate migration. I am not sure how long that will be for me.

I am here in the Ozarks of Missouri. Our climate has actually been cooler and wetter although we are in a building drought and pleasant temps is now a possible pattern inflection. This cooler and wetter is the result of the meandering of weather patterns from Arctic warming in my opinion. This two-year period of an embedded pattern is not normal or stable in my opinion with constant wet and cool conditions. My reading on the future is extremes of temps and precip. I am planning on hot dry summer periods in the future of drought and extreme temps plus wet cool winters punctuated with blast of cold from an unstable Arctic. That my take on it all. Keep in mind I am more sensitive to weather being a permaculturist.
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby REAL Green » Sun 18 Oct 2020, 06:58:36

I am adapting my operation and fortifying my life with green prepping in a REAL Green lifestyle. I am an expert prepper and have all the basic assets. I am green with my animal operation and habitat restoration efforts. I am low carbon focused with conservation and efficiency strategies. I call it REAL Green because these efforts are relative and realistic. My operation does not support me although it supports itself. The wildlife management efforts are drenched in fossil fuels. I have to still participate in consumerism and modern mobility.

Where REAL Green comes into this is acceptance behavior. I am accepting humans are trapped and the lies of both the greens and browns are a result of this trap and path dependencies. Human civilization will fail as we know it but the process might be a slow boil which is a decline process. I am sure about failure because the planet has tipped into phase change. That is the key. Human civilization will not adapt as-is to this tipping IMO. My life will suffer decline also both the natural one of old age decline but also decreased affluence as overall affluence declines because of planetary phase change.

REAL Green is a journey to meaning in all this. It is not a religion of meaning. Keep your higher power of beliefs. These metaphysical aspects of your life are too personal and abstract to be dealt with by REAL Green but you can REAL Green them by incorporating the planetary situation into your higher power. What this means is turbo charging spiritual meaning to offset declining physical conditions of lower affluence. Seek spiritual assets to offset increased poverty of the decline process. If you are following the planetary trend then the planet will support you. Fight this trend and you will be resisted. This concept is simple and evident like spending time in a strong current. You can flow with it or against it.

REAL Green reluctantly resist the current as needed because a REAL Green lifestyle is relative and realistic. An adapted life is only adapted so much. The REAL Green lives in the Anthropocene trap like everyone else. REAL Green the trap by discovering your limitations. Too much change is detrimental so fine tune change to what your local of people and place can adapt to. Localism is another key variable. Low carbon is no longer low carbon when it is mobile. Scale is disrupted when greater lifestyle ranges are lived.

There are some interesting ways to adapt consumerism and tech into the old ways of low carbon capture and localism. Use triage to get the dead wood out. Be a hybrid with the best practices of the old ways leveraged with the modern. Use salvage where possible. Huge amount of embedded carbon is already spent with many modern items. Many times, using an existing asset is lower carbon than building out a high efficiency new product. A REAL green realizes diminishing returns to tech and efficiency is rapidly rising these days because of cost/benefits. Debt and marketing are obscuring this fact. Honest science is no longer honest with the solutions because of this. So, keep it simple but robust. Generally high performance is lower REAL Green.

Real Green on the basic level of green prepping is for everyone. Everyone can green and prep up locally. Where REAL Green becomes more advanced is the lifeboat/hospice journey combined with monastic elements of gathering and organizing elements of best practices and things. The life boat analogy is evident but the hospice one is the behavioral part. Decline is death so offer palliative care of spiritual meaning. If an individual has what it takes by nature, nurture, and luck then he can go forth to become a modern shaman of REAL Green. This is not meant to be bizarre. I use the word Shaman because you will be taping into the power of the planet and the gradient of change. Again, keep in mind this is not a cult or religion. It is not saying you must have a particular belief or faith but you must be honest with science and systems. REAL Green is just saying emulate the planet in succession. Do it locally in realistic and relative change that is shaped by the trap of your local of significant others and the place that is your home.

One size does not fit all. I am a permaculturist doing animals and a homestead. You can be an artisan or a craftsman adapting your skills to this new planetary and social tend. What ties all this together though is adapted behavior of acceptance of decline with localism. Scale properly and adapt your behavior to reality of decline.

A REAL Green master is for a few. A REAL Green master is humbled by this. The humility comes from being subservient to the planet. Living in its ecosystem instead of above it. A REAL Green master has the time and money to change and likely has found a satisfactory local to grow his green prepping effort. He will be blessed with good significant others. He will have the time and money to do this. We are talking lots of work. Low carbon is time consuming with low returns so if you want to remain modern you will need resources often times from abstract sources. In my case I am living off investments. My low carbon green prepping operation could not support what I am doing plus the modest way of life I live.

Keep in mind a lot can be done with a little in REAL Green because you are downsizing into localism and managing low carbon. So even though it is a subsidy it is smaller than trying to keep up with the Jones. A master REAL Green finds meaning in all this and even if it is all washed away in violent destructive change some of the monestary will be a beacon of change to those who come afterwards seeking the truth. In the end it is the journey into truth that man finds his true self.
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 18 Oct 2020, 16:32:47

REAL Green wrote:
I am here in the Ozarks of Missouri. Our climate has actually been cooler and wetter although we are in a building drought and pleasant temps is now a possible pattern inflection. This cooler and wetter is the result of the meandering of weather patterns from Arctic warming in my opinion. This two-year period of an embedded pattern is not normal or stable in my opinion with constant wet and cool conditions. My reading on the future is extremes of temps and precip. I am planning on hot dry summer periods in the future of drought and extreme temps plus wet cool winters punctuated with blast of cold from an unstable Arctic. That my take on it all. Keep in mind I am more sensitive to weather being a permaculturist.


My personal experience is quite different.

Living in central Alaska the effects of global warming are very very clear. Our average annual temps are significantly warmer, and our summers are longer. Our rainfall/snowfall is more variable and depends on La Nina/El Nino oscillations, but the clear pattern is to more warming. And all around me here in central Alaska I know the Arctic Ocean sea ice is melting more and more in the summer, and the Bering Se is taking later to freeze up each fall, and the glaciers are retreating and the permafrost is starting to melt right under me. In fact I had a huge thermokarst pit open up under my greenhouse, and I spent a few years jacking up the greenhouse and putting wood blocks under it each spring until the front end was perched on pilings four feet above the ground. And that was nothing....some people are seeing the permafrost melt right under their house.........

Its extremely interesting to see it all happening so quickly, year after year.

Image
Thawing permafrost under a house in Shishmareff, Alaska

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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby ralfy » Mon 19 Oct 2020, 06:58:37

A slow-moving train wreck is now seen as entertaining and yet unexciting. So much for logic.
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby dissident » Mon 19 Oct 2020, 11:18:14

ralfy wrote:A slow-moving train wreck is now seen as entertaining and yet unexciting. So much for logic.


Humans are not adapted to respond to slow processes. Their brains only engage if the change is rapid. This is why humans will die out as a species. They have not adapted to their environment to the necessary level.
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby mousepad » Mon 19 Oct 2020, 11:33:52

Plantagenet wrote:
Image
Thawing permafrost under a house in Shishmareff, Alaska



Shishmareff is a small place. Only a handful of houses. I looked at it on google maps, but couldn't find the one in the picture. Where exactly is it?
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby Azothius » Mon 19 Oct 2020, 12:08:24

mousepad wrote:Shishmareff is a small place. Only a handful of houses. I looked at it on google maps, but couldn't find the one in the picture. Where exactly is it?



I think that it's the one on the very northwest corner of the village, right on the coast, where main street turns from going north to east.

you can't make out the "sunken" building, but the one behind it. you can see the added wing, its chimney, the other small outbuildings, etc. The "sunken" building seems to be completely gone, washed away or removed.

66°15'20.1"N 166°04'32.0"W
66.255569, -166.075560
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby mousepad » Mon 19 Oct 2020, 12:25:11

Azothius wrote:
mousepad wrote:Shishmareff is a small place. Only a handful of houses. I looked at it on google maps, but couldn't find the one in the picture. Where exactly is it?



I think that it's the one on the very northwest corner of the village, right on the coast, where main street turns from going north to east.

you can't make out the "sunken" building, but the one behind it. you can see the added wing, its chimney, the other small outbuildings, etc. The "sunken" building seems to be completely gone, washed away or removed.

66°15'20.1"N 166°04'32.0"W
66.255569, -166.075560


I agree. That's probably the one. Good find, how did you do it?
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby REAL Green » Mon 19 Oct 2020, 12:38:10

mousepad wrote:
I agree. That's probably the one. Good find, how did you do it?


I have been disappointed with google earth at least with its maps of my area. I have been using this site to look at my farm:

https://earthstreetview.net

I have not joined it so if I want to get pics I have to do some maneuvering between the marketing boxes on the screen. I can find what I want then snip and sketch what I need in a pic. Earth street views are much more up to date than google earth.
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby Azothius » Mon 19 Oct 2020, 13:28:06

mousepad wrote:
Azothius wrote:
mousepad wrote:Shishmareff is a small place. Only a handful of houses. I looked at it on google maps, but couldn't find the one in the picture. Where exactly is it?



I think that it's the one on the very northwest corner of the village, right on the coast, where main street turns from going north to east.

you can't make out the "sunken" building, but the one behind it. you can see the added wing, its chimney, the other small outbuildings, etc. The "sunken" building seems to be completely gone, washed away or removed.

66°15'20.1"N 166°04'32.0"W
66.255569, -166.075560


I agree. That's probably the one. Good find, how did you do it?


I just plugged "Shishmareff, Alaska" into maps.google and visually scanned the village - the whole time being very self aware of how my OCD completely controls me when it comes to finding things, but it was a fun little scavenger hunt. :)

- I should add that I just looked for buildings that had the added "wing".
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby JuanP » Tue 20 Oct 2020, 21:50:57

"Large scale permafrost thawing"
https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/10/20 ... t-thawing/

"In the Canadian High Arctic: “Observed maximum thaw depths at our sites are already exceeding those projected to occur by 2090.”"
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby Plantagenet » Tue 20 Oct 2020, 22:42:03

Shishmareff actually has two different global warming problems. First of all, (1) the permafrost is thawing under the village and roads, house, the airstrip and everything else are at risk. And (2) sea ice forms much later in the Bering Sea, and winter storms now send heavy surf up again the coastline, causing the island to erode away....

Its so bad the village voted to relocate to the mainland, as soon as the Feds are willing to pay for it....

alaskan-village-falling-into-sea

Image
No sea ice means very rapid coastal erosion for Shishmareff

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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby diemos » Sun 25 Oct 2020, 10:24:53

REAL Green wrote:
I think a better word for it is exciting. Entertaining is a bit detached in enjoyment when the reality is difficult adaptation and mitigation is ahead with price to pay.


As Mr. Spock would say, "Fascinating."

And as I always say, "It's like driving by a car wreck. You feel guilty for looking ... but you just can't stop yourself."

The whole COVID thing has driven home that there is absolutely no possibility that the human race will do anything other than drive over whatever cliff they're headed for.
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby Newfie » Sun 25 Oct 2020, 12:41:52

The whole COVID thing has driven home that there is absolutely no possibility that the human race will do anything other than drive over whatever cliff they're headed for.


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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby Ibon » Sun 25 Oct 2020, 14:32:04

As much as I like to join in the driving over the cliff mantra I think we all forget that there are young generations rising to their formative years and they are not much appreciating a meme without a steering wheel.
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby Newfie » Sun 25 Oct 2020, 15:05:30

I get that, but it is what it is.
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Re: Global Warming / Climate Changes Pt. 22

Unread postby Ibon » Sun 25 Oct 2020, 17:34:29

Newfie wrote:I get that, but it is what it is.


Yes, having known a stable biosphere our narratives are all about the coming bad times. What about the narratives of those who were born into an unstable biosphere with increasing disruptive consequences. Will they remain as passive as we have been?

Humans are adaptive, a lot like urban rats and cockroaches.
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