Donate Bitcoin

Donate Paypal


PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Bitcoin & crypto?

Discussions about the economic and financial ramifications of PEAK OIL

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby EdwinSm » Sat 17 Feb 2018, 04:47:46

GHung wrote:A little investigating revealed that the crypto-currency miners are snatching up newer faster components about as fast as they can be manufactured.


And..... Crypto-currency craze 'hinders search for alien life'
Seti (Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence) researchers want to expand operations at two observatories.

However, they have found that key computer chips are in short supply.

"We'd like to use the latest GPUs [graphics processing units]... and we can't get 'em," said Dan Werthimer.

Demand for GPUs has soared recently thanks to crypto-currency mining.

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-43056744
EdwinSm
Coal
Coal
 
Posts: 414
Joined: Thu 07 Jun 2012, 03:23:59

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby Tanada » Sat 17 Feb 2018, 08:49:02

Oh come on, the search for ET? That is really a reach, implying that all the stuff already built and in use is suddenly useless because a newer slightly faster system is temporarily unavailable.

people need to chill, a shortage today leads to a surplus tomorrow. If you can't play the latest greatest (tm) computer game for several weeks while manufacturing catches up you will not suffer anything more than a very very unimportant inconvenience, and a temporary one at that.
I should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, write, balance accounts, build a wall, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, pitch manure, program a computer, cook, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
User avatar
Tanada
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 15123
Joined: Thu 28 Apr 2005, 02:00:00
Location: South West shore Lake Erie, OH, USA

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby GHung » Sat 17 Feb 2018, 11:13:55

Tanada wrote:Oh come on, the search for ET? That is really a reach, implying that all the stuff already built and in use is suddenly useless because a newer slightly faster system is temporarily unavailable.

people need to chill, a shortage today leads to a surplus tomorrow. If you can't play the latest greatest (tm) computer game for several weeks while manufacturing catches up you will not suffer anything more than a very very unimportant inconvenience, and a temporary one at that.


That's my strategy. This too shall pass and hopefully I can get what I want at a discount. Smart gun buyers do the same; wait for the hysteria over pending gun control to pass and get good prices on guns or ammo..... Oh,, wait!

And I don't need this stuff. It'll just speed things up a bit, and my weather/solar logging box is showing signs of age. I can re-task my current stuff for that and build a newer system for my photo/video hobby. The county recycling center won't allow me to scrounge through the old electronics for good stuff any more so I have to actually pay up. The horror!
Blessed are the Meek, for they shall inherit nothing but their Souls. - Anonymous Ghung Person
User avatar
GHung
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2584
Joined: Tue 08 Sep 2009, 15:06:11
Location: Moksha, Nearvana

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby onlooker » Wed 28 Feb 2018, 19:08:21

https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2018/02 ... asion.html

Bitcoin as Prosecution Futures: Coinbase Agrees to Turn Customer Records Over to Department of Justice for Possible Tax Evasion
Posted on February 28, 2018 by Yves Smith
Even in the US, which so far has been more lenient toward cryptocurrencies than China, the noose is tightening. Top Bitcoin exchange Coinbase has decided that trying to defy the law, in terms of not complying with a IRS summons requiring it to turn over information about customers who had engaged in more than $20,000 in Bitcoin transactions in a year, was not a viable position. Apparently Coinbase had had the Silicon Valley libertarian chutzpah to think the rules didn’t apply to them. The IRS does not regard “disruption” as a tax exemption.
"We are mortal beings doomed to die
User avatar
onlooker
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 9960
Joined: Sun 10 Nov 2013, 12:49:04
Location: NY, USA

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby vox_mundi » Wed 13 Jun 2018, 10:23:34

Tether Used to Manipulate Price of Bitcoin During 2017 Peak

Tether, one of the most-traded cryptocurrencies, shows a pattern of being spent on Bitcoin at pivotal moments, helping to drive the world’s first digital asset to a record price in December, according to research by a University of Texas professor known for flagging suspicious activity in the VIX benchmark.

Tether seems to be used both to stabilize and manipulate Bitcoin prices,” finance professor John Griffin and co-author Amin Shams wrote in a paper released Wednesday.

Griffin and Shams -- in a paper titled “Is Bitcoin Really Un-Tethered?” -- set out to understand how the 2.5 billion Tether coins in existence have flowed through markets. While little public information exists about how Tether is created, it generally trades for around $1 because each coin is supposed to be backed by $1 of fiat money in a bank. The currency, which started trading in 2015, is pitched as a stable alternative to Bitcoin’s volatility, acting as a haven for crypto investors.

The data analyzed by the academics includes Bitcoin’s meteoric rise to a record high of almost $20,000 last December, before it crashed this year. It fell 1.4 percent Wednesday to $6,441.17, according to price data compiled by Bloomberg.

The analysis showed a pattern of Bitcoin price support, Griffin said. First, Tethers are created by the parent company Tether Ltd., often in large chunks such as 200 million. Almost all new coins then move to Bitfinex, he said. When Bitcoin prices drop soon after the issuance, Tethers at Bitfinex and other exchanges are used to buy Bitcoin “in a coordinated way that drives the price,” Griffin said in an interview.

“I’ve looked at a lot of markets,” he said. “If there’s fraud or manipulation in a market it can leave tracks in the data. The tracks in the data here are very consistent with a manipulation hypothesis.”

Image

Griffin’s paper describes several patterns uncovered in a yearlong period. First it found that flows weren’t symmetric. When Bitcoin’s price fell, purchases with Tether tended to increase, helping to reverse the decline. But during times when Bitcoin rose, Griffin said he didn’t see the reverse occur. That’s “suggestive of Tether being used to protect Bitcoin prices during downturns,” he wrote.

He zeroed in on 87 of the largest purchases of Bitcoin with Tether from March 2017 to March 2018. In the cases examined, new Tether had been issued within the prior three days, and Bitcoin’s price had fallen in the prior hour. What followed were increases in Bitcoin’s price -- and those gains added up.

Even though the 87 examples account for less than 1 percent of the time period examined, they amounted to about 50 percent of Bitcoin’s compounded return over that year. In comparison, 10,000 simulations Griffin and Shams ran demonstrated “that this behavior never occurs randomly,” they wrote.

Griffin said one of the most notable trends he saw in the data was when Bitcoin traded near certain price thresholds, denominated in $500 increments.

Bitcoin purchases with Tether “strongly increase just below multiples of 500. This pattern is only present in periods following printing of Tether and not observed by other exchanges,” he wrote in the paper. To other investors, it gives the impression of a “price floor,” providing a signal for them to buy as well.

“If it was random behavior you wouldn’t see it cluster around the thresholds,” he said in the interview. “It indicates it’s a conscious strategy to provide price support.”
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

Insensible before the wave so soon released by callous fate. Affected most, they understand the least, and understanding, when it comes, invariably arrives too late.
User avatar
vox_mundi
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 3940
Joined: Wed 27 Sep 2006, 02:00:00

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 29 Jun 2018, 11:53:57

So is there a point where the bulls maybe admit this idea isn't like buying a lottery ticket with a very high probability of hitting the Powerball?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/cbovaird/2 ... 42889e3285

Bitcoin prices dipped below $5,800 today, falling past this price level for the second time this week and nearing its lowest since November 2017.

The digital currency reached $5,799.62 at 05:00 UTC (1:00 a.m. EST), according to the CoinDesk Bitcoin Price Index (BPI).

At this point, Bitcoin was down roughly 41.7% from the recent high of $9,954.95 reached in early May and approximately 70.7% from its all-time high of $19,783.21 attained in December, additional BPI figures show.


The more news I see on crypto, the more I think my earlier main point stands. Even if crypto and blockchain take off in some form for currency -- how does one have ANY assurance the crypto-currency they choose to invest in isn't worth zero after the government/banks decide on the official, legal, sanctioned version to use?
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
User avatar
Outcast_Searcher
COB
COB
 
Posts: 5916
Joined: Sat 27 Jun 2009, 20:26:42

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby Zarquon » Sat 28 Jul 2018, 16:31:47

If you're interested in the whole crypto-currency thing, here's a good read. It's a long piece, but worth the time IMO.

"Inside the Crypto World's Biggest Scandal

Arthur and Kathleen Breitman thought they held the secret to building a new decentralized utopia. On the way, they plunged into a new kind of hell. A crypto-tragedy in three acts."

https://www.wired.com/story/tezos-block ... ror-story/
Zarquon
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 242
Joined: Fri 06 May 2016, 19:53:46

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby Newfie » Mon 13 Aug 2018, 18:10:30

http://gcaptain.com/maersk-ibm-say-94-o ... -platform/

COPENHAGEN, Aug 9 (Reuters) – Shipping group Maersk said on Thursday 94 companies and organizations have so far joined a blockchain platform developed with IBM aimed at boosting efficiency and limiting the enormous paper trail of global container shipping.

The industry has seen little innovation since the container was invented in the 1950s, and cross-border trade still leaves an enormous trail of paperwork and bureaucracy.

Under its new strategy, which includes the creation of an industry-wide blockchain-based trading platform, Maersk aims to expand its transport and logistics business in areas such as freight forwarding and trade finance.
User avatar
Newfie
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 11318
Joined: Thu 15 Nov 2007, 03:00:00
Location: Between Canada and Carribean

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby vox_mundi » Fri 26 Oct 2018, 09:56:22

Image
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

Insensible before the wave so soon released by callous fate. Affected most, they understand the least, and understanding, when it comes, invariably arrives too late.
User avatar
vox_mundi
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 3940
Joined: Wed 27 Sep 2006, 02:00:00

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sat 27 Oct 2018, 11:35:59

Newfie wrote:http://gcaptain.com/maersk-ibm-say-94-organizations-have-joined-blockchain-trade-platform/

COPENHAGEN, Aug 9 (Reuters) – Shipping group Maersk said on Thursday 94 companies and organizations have so far joined a blockchain platform developed with IBM aimed at boosting efficiency and limiting the enormous paper trail of global container shipping.

The industry has seen little innovation since the container was invented in the 1950s, and cross-border trade still leaves an enormous trail of paperwork and bureaucracy.

Under its new strategy, which includes the creation of an industry-wide blockchain-based trading platform, Maersk aims to expand its transport and logistics business in areas such as freight forwarding and trade finance.

I'm not buying some huge efficiency gains claims here. Just because the paper trail can have a public (or chosen-audience wide) verified access on a new type of ledger, does NOT mean all the tracking doesn't need to be done. It doesn't change the legal requirements. It doesn't change the need for security, safety, and all the other regulatory framework needed with international shipping of freight containers.

I think the marketing folks are getting way over-enthusiastic re blockchain magically changing the world, or tracking events that occur in the world.

...

Which, IMO, is the fundamental issue with crypto-currency, generally. It's not as if modern day credit cards (and various phone payment systems, still in relative infancy) don't already handle cashless payments to the tune of many billions a day, just fine.

In fact, for most people, cash is becoming increasingly obsolete as a practical matter, in the first world. If the government had tried to force that, people would have been extremely upset. But just let technology and convenience and success work for a few decades, and the process takes care of itself. WITHOUT all the risk, complexity, volatility, fraud, etc. of crypto-currencies. Imagine that. :!:
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
User avatar
Outcast_Searcher
COB
COB
 
Posts: 5916
Joined: Sat 27 Jun 2009, 20:26:42

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby vox_mundi » Mon 29 Oct 2018, 17:48:06

No free lunch ...

Bitcoin Can Push Global Warming Above 2 C In a Couple Decades

A new study published in the peer-reviewed journal Nature Climate Change finds that if Bitcoin is implemented at similar rates at which other technologies have been incorporated, it alone could produce enough emissions to raise global temperatures by 2°C as soon as 2033.

"Bitcoin is a cryptocurrency with heavy hardware requirements, and this obviously translates into large electricity demands," said Randi Rollins, a master's student at the University of Hawaii at Manoa and coauthor of the paper.

A team of UH Manoa researchers analyzed information such as the power efficiency of computers used by Bitcoin mining, the geographic location of the miners who likely computed the Bitcoin, and the CO2 emissions of producing electricity in those countries. Based on the data, the researchers estimated that the use of bitcoins in the year 2017 emitted 69 million metric tons of CO2.

Researchers also studied how other technologies have been adopted by society, and created scenarios to estimate the cumulative emissions of Bitcoin should it grow at the rate that other technologies have been incorporated.

The team found that if Bitcoin is incorporated, even at the slowest rate at which other technologies have been incorporated, its cumulative emissions will be enough to warm the planet above 2°C in just 22 years. If incorporated at the average rate of other technologies, it is closer to 16 years.
“There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see.” ― Leonardo da Vinci

Insensible before the wave so soon released by callous fate. Affected most, they understand the least, and understanding, when it comes, invariably arrives too late.
User avatar
vox_mundi
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 3940
Joined: Wed 27 Sep 2006, 02:00:00

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby onlooker » Wed 05 Dec 2018, 17:25:42

"We are mortal beings doomed to die
User avatar
onlooker
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 9960
Joined: Sun 10 Nov 2013, 12:49:04
Location: NY, USA

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby Cog » Wed 05 Dec 2018, 18:10:07

onlooker wrote:Forking hell, crypto is collapsing!
https://ftalphaville.ft.com/2018/11/15/ ... llapsing-/


Congrats. You have successfully called a real crash in something.
User avatar
Cog
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 11239
Joined: Sat 17 May 2008, 02:00:00
Location: Northern Kekistan

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby onlooker » Wed 05 Dec 2018, 18:14:00

Cog wrote:
onlooker wrote:Forking hell, crypto is collapsing!
https://ftalphaville.ft.com/2018/11/15/ ... llapsing-/


Congrats. You have successfully called a real crash in something.


[smilie=5bouncy.gif] [smilie=5bouncy.gif] [smilie=5bouncy.gif] [smilie=5bouncy.gif]
"We are mortal beings doomed to die
User avatar
onlooker
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 9960
Joined: Sun 10 Nov 2013, 12:49:04
Location: NY, USA

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby pstarr » Wed 05 Dec 2018, 20:42:28

Keep on an eye on the stock market, Cog. Keep your money in there and never never lose the faith. Your money is safe, trust me. There is no worry. There is no doom. It's just another normal business cycle.

Stay fresh my friend :) You can always move it to bonds or real estate. Or Andy Warhol art? More guns and gold?
SA has peaked. OPEC has peaked. So goes the world.
pstarr
NeoMaster
NeoMaster
 
Posts: 27727
Joined: Mon 27 Sep 2004, 02:00:00
Location: Behind the Redwood Curtain

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby Cog » Wed 05 Dec 2018, 21:25:33

The thing about doomers is they never define what a stock market crash looks like. Every stock goes to zero? By my count I've lived through four recessions, while owning stocks. Stock value recovers if you don't panic as people are encouraged to do.

In the meantime I'll collect those sweet dividends and not worry about paper losses.
User avatar
Cog
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 11239
Joined: Sat 17 May 2008, 02:00:00
Location: Northern Kekistan

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby onlooker » Wed 05 Dec 2018, 23:40:24

pstarr wrote:Keep on an eye on the stock market, Cog. Keep your money in there and never never lose the faith. Your money is safe, trust me. There is no worry. There is no doom. It's just another normal business cycle.

Stay fresh my friend :) You can always move it to bonds or real estate. Or Andy Warhol art? More guns and gold?

I guess P, Cog didn't get the memo, which explains that the peak oil dynamic encompasses steep stock market declines. Investing in the era of contraction may not be the smartest thing to do :razz:
"We are mortal beings doomed to die
User avatar
onlooker
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 9960
Joined: Sun 10 Nov 2013, 12:49:04
Location: NY, USA

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby careinke » Thu 06 Dec 2018, 00:25:28

vox_mundi wrote:No free lunch ...

Bitcoin Can Push Global Warming Above 2 C In a Couple Decades

A new study published in the peer-reviewed journal Nature Climate Change finds that if Bitcoin is implemented at similar rates at which other technologies have been incorporated, it alone could produce enough emissions to raise global temperatures by 2°C as soon as 2033.

"Bitcoin is a cryptocurrency with heavy hardware requirements, and this obviously translates into large electricity demands," said Randi Rollins, a master's student at the University of Hawaii at Manoa and coauthor of the paper.

A team of UH Manoa researchers analyzed information such as the power efficiency of computers used by Bitcoin mining, the geographic location of the miners who likely computed the Bitcoin, and the CO2 emissions of producing electricity in those countries. Based on the data, the researchers estimated that the use of bitcoins in the year 2017 emitted 69 million metric tons of CO2.

Researchers also studied how other technologies have been adopted by society, and created scenarios to estimate the cumulative emissions of Bitcoin should it grow at the rate that other technologies have been incorporated.

The team found that if Bitcoin is incorporated, even at the slowest rate at which other technologies have been incorporated, its cumulative emissions will be enough to warm the planet above 2°C in just 22 years. If incorporated at the average rate of other technologies, it is closer to 16 years.


EOS just became the first carbon neutral cryptocurrency.
https://eosauthority.com/green/
Cliff (Start a rEVOLution, grow a garden)
User avatar
careinke
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 3529
Joined: Mon 01 Jan 2007, 03:00:00
Location: Pacific Northwest

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Thu 06 Dec 2018, 20:59:56

careinke wrote:EOS just became the first carbon neutral cryptocurrency.
https://eosauthority.com/green/

That's nice. So if we ever actually NEED cryptocurrencies (vs. say chipped credit cards), then perhaps they don't need to be energy hogs.

I still don't see why anyone "needs" them, unless they're trying to do very nasty illegal things like serious tax evasion or money laundering, terrorism funding. Frankly, I don't WANT it to be easy for criminals to do that stuff, as a non-criminal who does his best to pay his taxes owed.

And if we do "need" them, I still think government will likely dictate what gets used, so they can ensure taxes are paid, etc.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
User avatar
Outcast_Searcher
COB
COB
 
Posts: 5916
Joined: Sat 27 Jun 2009, 20:26:42

Re: Bitcoin & crypto?

Unread postby evilgenius » Fri 07 Dec 2018, 13:01:32

In what sort of an emergency are crypto currencies any good? They certainly cannot function across the wide range of emergencies which gold can. They will never be physically transferable in that same way, in which technology could cease to exist and a person could still transfer wealth. People trade gold that sits in bank vaults, for sure, but they can do it with the certainty they do because of that inherent characteristic. Aren't they mostly a hedge against your own government moving against you? They require a certain level of technology to prevail. That technology can exist across a wide spread of governmental dystopias, from tax abuse to declaration of persona non grata. Don't you need at least the threat of a dystopia along one of those dimensions in order for crypto to bounce? Is it a coincidence that it thrived under the Obama administration, when conservatives also enjoyed panic over guns and drove up gun stocks? As much as liberals view Trump as dystopian, maybe liberals aren't the sort to prop up crypto prices?
User avatar
evilgenius
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2515
Joined: Tue 06 Dec 2005, 03:00:00
Location: Stopped at the border.

PreviousNext

Return to Economics & Finance

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 21 guests