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Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2018, 03:08:48
by careinke
asg70 wrote:I think he'll be fighting an indictment by 2020.


Gee, how many times have I heard that? It seems the call for Trumps downfall never materialize. Though if it happens, it will certainly be entertaining.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2018, 10:08:07
by asg70
careinke wrote:
asg70 wrote:I think he'll be fighting an indictment by 2020.


Gee, how many times have I heard that? It seems the call for Trumps downfall never materialize. Though if it happens, it will certainly be entertaining.


Loss of the loyalty of the hawk wing of the GOP due to these moves won't help his chances of avoiding impeachment.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2018, 10:36:17
by Pops
I thought the Cheney/Bush wars were imperialism from the start, Syria was just an extension. Two of my kids did 3 tours over there and luckily came home whole.

The thing to worry about is Mattis, maybe the first Secty Defense to resign in protest, was the stabilizing force in the civilian command who slow rolled Individual 1's military parades, posse comitatus, internment camps, campaign border stunts, and command by tweet without the slightest consultation or advisement of allies or even his own government.

In '14 Mattis said of retiring in protest over unethical orders and other situations:
“you have to be very careful about doing that. The lance corporals can’t retire. They’re going. You abandon him only under the most dire circumstances, where the message you have to send can be sent no other way.”


But hey, all's well and running like a well oiled twitter machine and besides pootie approves.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2018, 10:57:31
by jedrider
I applaud Trump for doing what his instincts tell him to do (in this case).

Maybe, we needed a petulant ignoramus in office all along?

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2018, 12:31:29
by Newfie
Since I see no stated logical reason for being in Syria, I think a pull out is a good thing.

I also suspect Trump is posturing for 2020.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2018, 14:21:16
by Plantagenet
Pops wrote: Syria was just an extension....


Not really. Syria is clearly Obama's war.

For some reason Obama decided he wanted regime change in Syria---and he said this explicitly in multiple speeches. Beginning in 2012 Obama approved a large covert CIA program in Syria to fund, arm and train jihadi groups, including groups affiliated with al Qaida, who were fighting the Assad regime. The code name for this program was TIMBER SYCAMORE. BY some estimates the US was spending over a billion dollars a year on this covert program in Syria during the last four years of the Obama administration.

Timber_Sycamore

In hindsight, it was idiotic for the Obama administration to be funding, arming and training jihadists in Syria. Its estimated that the US-backed jihadis killed about 100,000 Syrian soldiers, along with huge numbers of civilians, and totally destroyed civil society in Syria. The islamists that Obama was supporting targeted Shia and christian villages in particular for destruction, because the Assad regime had protected them in the past. And then, to makes things worse, some of the US trained fighters with their US supplied weapons hooked up with a little group called ISIL, that was headed by an Iraqi. This group became the most powerful military force in easternmost Syria and booted out almost all the Syrian government forces, much to the Obama administration's delight. But then they did something the CIA handlers and the idiots in the Obama administration never anticipated---they launched an invasion of Iraq. The Obama administration responded by sending US troops BACK to Iraq for a THIRD time for Iraq War 3. Then Obama ordered US troops and air strikes into Syria as well---the first time US troops had been in Syria.

The third Iraq War and the new war in Syria that Obama got the US involved in dragged on through the end of the Obama administration, and only now are ending. When Trump took office he intensified the bombing and finally defeated IS---first in Iraq and now in Syria. One can only hope now Trump has the guts to ignore the caterwauling amoung the media and the Ds and the neocons and take the next step and actually get our troops out of Syria.

Cheers!

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2018, 16:22:26
by Pops
Colbert said,
"Kind of scary when everyone says, 'There goes the voice of reason: Mad Dog.'”.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2018, 18:03:50
by Cog
Most Democrats get their talking points from Colbert. Not a surprise really.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2018, 22:58:10
by asg70
Plantagenet wrote:Syria is clearly * Obama's war.


Another day another game of pin-the-blame-on-Obama from Plant complete with * weasel-words.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2018, 00:02:43
by Plantagenet
asg70 wrote:.... pin-the-blame-on-Obama


As you wish....

We know that Obama gave multiple speeches calling for regime change in Syria in 2010 and 2011 and then secretly authorized the CIA to fund, arm and train opposition forces within Syria. Much about the CIA operation (code-named Timber Sycamore) intended to topple the Assad regime remains classified, but we do know the CIA funneled huge numbers of guns and a great deal of money to the Islamist groups fighting a civil war with the Assad regime, and we know that CIA operatives trained Islamist fighters in Syria, and we know the civil war between the regime and the Islamist militias destroyed villages and towns across Syria, and resulted in hundreds of thousands of deaths.

And we know Obama specifically gave the go ahead for this secret CIA operation in 2012, and expanded it's scope in 2013. We know Obama ordered US military forces back into Iraq in 2014, and sent US forces into Syria in 2015. We know that Obama severely restricted the scale of US airstrikes against ISIS in Syria out of fear of causing environmental damage. We know the wars against ISIS in Iraq and Syria were unresolved when Obama left office, forcing his successor to deal with the mess he created.

I'm sure there is more to blame Obama for in the Syrian disaster, but thats all I can think of right off the top of my head.

Cheers!

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2018, 00:20:06
by Cog
LOL. The left seems to think Trump has been POTUS for the last twenty years instead of the last two. Funny how memory works. The MSM is having a case of the vapors that Trump is doing what he campaigned on. To remove our troops from Syria and Afghanistan.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2018, 07:58:39
by asg70
Plantagenet wrote:We know that Obama...


And despite me suggesting you're suffering from an acute case of ODS you just keep blindly blathering on like a broken record.

Plantagenet wrote:thats all I can think of right off the top of my head.


I'm sure you'll think of more. You always do.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2018, 12:15:13
by Plantagenet
Cog wrote: The MSM is having a case of the vapors that Trump is doing what he campaigned on. To remove our troops from Syria and Afghanistan.


The MSM sees everything through the eye of partisanship. If a D were getting us out of Syria, the MSM would be over the moon with joy and full of praise for the President. Talk of a Nobel Peace Prize would be in the air.

But since its an R who is pulling US troops out of Syria, the press suddenly is all in favor of endless foreign wars. Even Rachel Maddow and the crew at MSNBC have turned into chickenhawks and now support US military intervention and occupation of foreign countries.

Fortunately, some of us can rise above partisanship and have the intellectual integrity to objectively view the political scene no matter what political party is in power. I was against US intervention in Syria when Obama and the Ds were sending in the CIA to fund, train and arm the Islamist rebels to destabilize the government there, and I'm still against US intervention in Syria now that we have an R president.

Cheers!

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2018, 17:43:39
by Cog
Image

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2018, 20:14:21
by Plantagenet
Cog wrote:Image


I wonder why there wasn't this kind of hysteria over Gen. Mattis in the media back in 2013?

mattis-and-syria-get-a-grip-on-the-hysteria

In 2013 Obama fired Mattis and ended his military career, and the MSM didn't waste days hyperventilating over the bad relationship between Obama and Mattis back then. In fact it hardly made the news.

Cheers!

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sun 23 Dec 2018, 10:59:12
by asg70
"Fortunately, some of us can rise above partisanship"

And that "some" excludes you.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sun 23 Dec 2018, 13:42:39
by Cog
You only thought you were giving two months notice. You are out now. Pack up your bags and get thee out. This happened to me when I left my last job. Gave them the standard two week notice and they escorted me out the door that day. Common business practice now.

https://www.militarytimes.com/news/pent ... ver-jan-1/

WASHINGTON — Just days after Defense Secretary Jim Mattis announced he would step down from that post in late February, President Donald Trump announced he would push the popular Cabinet member out even earlier.

In a tweet Sunday morning, Trump announced that Deputy Secretary of Defense Patrick Shanahan will become acting secretary of defense starting Jan. 1. He praised the Pentagon’s second-in-command as having “a long list of accomplishments” and added, “He will be great!”

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sun 23 Dec 2018, 17:46:13
by Plantagenet
Gen. Mattis just signed the order to pull US forces out of Syria

Mattis-syria-withdrawal-pentagon-signed-order

Good to see Mattis being a good soldier and participating in the Syrian withdrawal process. The fact that he signed the withdrawal order shows that his disagreement with Trump's decision to withdraw isn't so great that Mattis is refusing to participate in the withdrawal process.

By signing the DOD order to carry out Trump's strategic decision to declare victory and pull out of Syria, Mattis is now complicit in the decision. This makes it seem like his resignation wasn't triggered by the decision to withdraw, but instead reflects the WAY Trump unilaterally decided to pull out, without consulting with our allies or with his own staff (and mainly not consulting with Gen. Mattis).

Cheers!

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sun 23 Dec 2018, 20:25:07
by Pops
Looks like state television informed the head of state that all the big words in Mattis' letter meant he, trump, is a threat to the “security, prosperity and values,” of the US. Having been so advised, corporal bone-spur twitter-dismissed him early.

Re: Trump pulls US troops out of Syria

Unread postPosted: Sun 23 Dec 2018, 21:17:25
by rockdoc123
Looks like state television informed the head of state that all the big words in Mattis' letter meant he, trump, is a threat to the “security, prosperity and values,” of the US. Having been so advised, corporal bone-spur twitter-dismissed him early.


as Cog noted it is standard practice in businesses that when someone turns in their notice they are asked to leave immediately. There are many reasons for that but the main one is having a disgruntled employee hanging around for a couple of weeks doesn't get you anywhere, sows dissent and is basically uncomfortable. The security risk is also significant. Hence Mattis being shown the door. I think it is a totally reasonable response.

You folks need to get over your Trump derangement syndrome. Not everything he does is incorrect.