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The global system of our fathers and mothers is killing us NOW

You cannot build a new "better" system without killing the old! M_B_S

So forgive me father/mother

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ma81lHmaQkM

Yes this is a call for a (r)evolution
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KUjq2NIu8k
M_B_S

Background reading
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/it ... 69a786cb2c

Most of the youth spend their time staring at the spam on their iPhones and doing FACETIME on their iPads and wasting time posting on chat sites like this when they're not working boring jobs at minimal wages to pay off the huge college loans the system loads on them.


Who's got time to kill the old system? I've got to update my FACEBOOK page again!

Plantagenet wrote:Most of the youth spend their time staring at the spam on their iPhones and doing FACETIME on their iPads and wasting time posting on chat sites like this when they're not working boring jobs at minimal wages to pay off the huge college loans the system loads on them.


Who's got time to kill the old system? I've got to update my FACEBOOK page again!

Exactly Plant. I was about to point that out. As long as their lifestyles don't have to suffer, the vast majority of folks, young or old, don't truly care.

Yelling at each other over who is at fault doesn't change anything, since almost EVERYONE is at fault to some extent.

My main difference is that the magnitude of many of the student loans is self-inflicted by borrowing to meet lifestyle wants students can't afford -- which of course the banks encourage since they collect more interest. So I'd say much of those loans are "loaded on" themselves.

https://studentloanhero.com/featured/wh ... -loans-on/

One of the things colleges seem NOT to be teaching is any financial common sense or prudence. Which seems odd since that's sure as hell easier to learn than, say, calculus or history of art!

The youth has the power and the future



What loans ? Burn them!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhjU4EA_Or0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6AfmiuYFMQ

M_B_S

Youth are gullible saps who are manipulated by evil doers to enact their agenda. "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions" fits youth idealism based activism perfectly. Revolutions are for idiots.

dissident wrote:Youth are gullible saps who are manipulated by evil doers to enact their agenda. "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions" fits youth idealism based activism perfectly. Revolutions are for idiots.

https://theecologist.org/2018/jul/17/re ... st-century
No dissident revolutions are the wildfires of history the so called tipping points for progress or contra - progress.


************
Background / Contra position
https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/20 ... rming.html

Music on

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NXnxTNIWkc

Everyones still waiting for trickle down economics to trickle down to them.

Shaved Monkey wrote:Everyones still waiting for trickle down economics to trickle down to them.

That's about as ignorant a statement as I have ever read. Those who are on welfare and live in state-provided housing in the USA are still among the wealthiest 10% of humans on Earth.

Meanwhile Marxism/Socialism/Communism/other "isms" have slaughtered people by the millions, and failed to produce viable economies dozens of times.

It takes a mentally deficient person to believe in anything but Capitalism and Democracy.

KaiserJeep wrote:It takes a mentally deficient person to believe in anything but Capitalism and Democracy.

Looking back I agree with your statement except that it also takes a mentally deficient person to believe we ever really had pure capitalism and democracy. The game has always been rigged to a lessor or greater degree and the trend isn't looking very good at the moment.

Looking forward it is not about comparing the superiority of capitalism and democracy but rather the challenge in how it will be forced to modify some of its core tenants in order to adapt to increasing constraints. Also how it will compete with a rival hybrid system like China which remains communist in its central planning but unleashed capitalism in the private sector. There was overwhelming consensus as recently as 10 or 20 years ago that China let the capitalist hat out of the bag and this would create a momentum that would eventually overthrow the communist central government. It is becoming increasingly obvious that China will not evolve as anticipated and there is also evidence that strong central planning combined with elements of capitalism in the private sector may prove more efficient in the long run in managing society especially when increasing regulations will be required due to ecological overshoot.

Most economic and political systems have a shelf life. As we churned through our planets abundant resources enabled by capitalism and democracy we were planting the seeds of the forces that will eventually make both our economic and political system no longer viable.

Change is the only constant. And capitalism and democracy moving forward will be forced to change as well. It has been a great run though but also an ecological disaster.

Through out history, every single generation, youth have risen through the ranks to take control. It by then they are not youth, they are us, the hippies turned Baby Boomers turned us.

KaiserJeep wrote:

Shaved Monkey wrote:Everyones still waiting for trickle down economics to trickle down to them.

That's about as ignorant a statement as I have ever read. Those who are on welfare and live in state-provided housing in the USA are still among the wealthiest 10% of humans on Earth.

Meanwhile Marxism/Socialism/Communism/other "isms" have slaughtered people by the millions, and failed to produce viable economies dozens of times.

It takes a mentally deficient person to believe in anything but Capitalism and Democracy.

lol Democracy that gives you Trump and Brexit doesnt it or did the Russians do that?
How many people were killed for Capitalism and Democracy ?
How much effort was put in to make those systems fail,economically and militarily ?
Exploitation of resources driven by greed isnt in the earth or the other 99% best interests.

I quite like my socialist healthcare system,education system and safety nets wouldnt trade them for the capitalist alternative.
A stable government that makes long term plans in the interests of the people doesnt sound too bad either.
The short sighted alternative delivering no solutions and lots of denial doesnt seem to be working that well

Shaved Monkey wrote: How many people were killed for Capitalism and Democracy? How much effort was put in to make those systems fail,economically and militarily ?

Ask and you shall receive...

Ibon wrote:

KaiserJeep wrote:It takes a mentally deficient person to believe in anything but Capitalism and Democracy.

Looking back I agree with your statement except that it also takes a mentally deficient person to believe we ever really had pure capitalism and democracy. The game has always been rigged to a lessor or greater degree and the trend isn't looking very good at the moment.

Looking forward it is not about comparing the superiority of capitalism and democracy but rather the challenge in how it will be forced to modify some of its core tenants in order to adapt to increasing constraints.

Ah, nuance. Excellent, Ibon.

I agree with the core of KJ's point that for most of the left, no matter how much trickling down occurs, it will never be nearly enough, but your point about how we don't have anything approaching pure capitalism, AND how we're moving away from that over time is absolutely key.

...

For example: Does anyone really think medical costs will be realistically constrained in the US if the end consumer of medical care doesn't have some meaningful stake in what their care costs? I don't.

jesus_of_suburbia wrote:

Shaved Monkey wrote: How many people were killed for Capitalism and Democracy? How much effort was put in to make those systems fail,economically and militarily ?

Ask and you shall receive...

So point number one: 500 years of slavery.

Ahem: the US was formed under 250 years ago.

Perhaps more calmness and accuracy would be in order. Else, why should we take the post seriously?

And go ahead, show me credible stats that show how 6 million children in the US die of hunger every year (item 4). Actually, show me ten for the US EVERY YEAR in recent years, and I'll concede you have a point.

Now -- if the claim is this is global stats -- then post an accurate reference. Credibility is a thing. Speaking of which, where did the graphic come from, or did I miss the citation?

Although there is some confusion in the phrasing, yes, this is meant to be global.

You think it's ridiculous, but is it anymore ridiculous than the claim that an economic system where workers own the means of production is responsible for tens of millions of deaths? Also, name a country that has tried to implement elements of socialism who the US hasn't tried to rat fuck using propaganda, sanctions, embargoes, or flat out backing fascist military goons to unleash death on its civilians.

Outcast_Searcher wrote:For example: Does anyone really think medical costs will be realistically constrained in the US if the end consumer of medical care doesn't have some meaningful stake in what their care costs? I don't.

How the fuck can you say this when the US currently spends more money per person with worse outcomes than other countries with socialized medicine? The whole point of single-payer, universal is that it the collective can negotiate better prices. Are you also aware that public insurance in the US doesn't just give away whatever healthcare you desire? There are actually guidelines and regulations providers have to follow. If your doctor prescribes you a CPAP machine that you don't use at least 70% of your sleep, Medicare won't pay for it, and your supplier will make you return it or pay out of pocket. It's not some free-for-all.

The old people manage the system. The youth are clueless.

Wow Jesu S_o_S

Welcome to our Great Arena

PEAK OIL

Greetings

Death Smiles At Us All
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNGVMIwamL8

jesus_of_suburbia wrote:Although there is some confusion in the phrasing, yes, this is meant to be global.

You think it's ridiculous, but is it anymore ridiculous than the claim that an economic system where workers own the means of production is responsible for tens of millions of deaths? Also, name a country that has tried to implement elements of socialism who the US hasn't tried to rat fuck using propaganda, sanctions, embargoes, or flat out backing fascist military goons to unleash death on its civilians.

1). I think it's ridiculous that if it's for global stats, that "God Bless America" is the label.

2). I think it's ridiculous that the claim is to blame all that on capitalism. For one thing, since the world isn't all capitalistic and VERY little pure capitalism exists, that's completely wrong on its face. But even if that weren't the case, can we really pretend that none of the problems on the list would occur in big numbers if the world were all socialist? Or anarchist? Or communist? I'll opine a very strong "NO".

Like it or not, the US is a mixed system with capitalistic and socialistic elements.

I have no big problem with the concept of socialism, EXCEPT for the claims that it would somehow magically cure the ills of capitalism, and especially that it would somehow make people wealthier on average.

And I'd be the last person to argue that everything re the US is goodness and light. On either side of the aisle, BTW.

It's too bad that there isn't more balanced, unemotional debate and discussion of topics like this overall.