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Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Thu 06 Sep 2018, 08:15:47
by Newfie
No.

Apparently the only boat to make it through was a tug captained by the last of the Newfoundland sealing skippers.

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Tue 11 Sep 2018, 11:11:22
by Newfie
Some details of a large LNG ice breaking tanker order.

https://www.ship-technology.com/project ... -carriers/

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Thu 20 Sep 2018, 18:03:42
by Newfie
GAO gives USCG advice about breaker procurement


https://gcaptain.com/gao-identifies-mul ... r-program/

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Thu 20 Sep 2018, 21:25:11
by Tanada
Newfie wrote:GAO gives USCG advice about breaker procurement


https://gcaptain.com/gao-identifies-mul ... r-program/


Oh for pities sake! Seventy years ago the USA had a dozen dedicated icebreakers that worked in the Great Lakes, New England, Alaska and Antarctica. Now we are down to a vessels pulled out of the disposal list and rebuilt originally constructed in 1976, one halfway modern Arctic class breaker commissioned in 2000, and one new small breaker in the Great Lakes to keep the waterways open on Michigan/Huron/Saint Claire and Erie and the rivers tying them together.

Meanwhile the country with an actual vision of what Ice breakers are good for has a half dozen purpose built icebreakers, several of them nuclear powered for unlimited range, and is adding a dozen or more double ended merchant ships to haul everything from liquefied fuels to bulk cargoes to containerized cargo.

The USA icebreaker capabilities at this point are almost equaled by Norway! I love Norway but the country is small with a tiny population compared to the USA with our interests on three oceans!
(Norway has 2 Icebreakers, both launched in the 21st century.)

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Thu 20 Sep 2018, 22:21:51
by GHung
Well, for Pete's sake, we're doing everything we can to melt the ice so we don't need ice breakers. A billion saved is a billion earned.

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Fri 26 Apr 2019, 19:33:22
by Newfie
New roll on roll off ice class ships

https://gcaptain.com/knud-e-hansen-desi ... finnlines/

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Sat 27 Apr 2019, 01:10:26
by EdwinSm
That was interesting, but probably they are for the Baltic shipping rather than Arctic shipping. One of the probable roots (on which Finnlines currently sails) is just north* of the island we are living on, and we occasionally see one of their ships (or one of two other passenger lines) when we have to take the small ferries between islands.


* measured in just 100s of metres/yards - the fair-lanes here can be very very narrow!

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Sat 27 Apr 2019, 05:40:20
by Tanada
EdwinSm wrote:That was interesting, but probably they are for the Baltic shipping rather than Arctic shipping. One of the probable roots (on which Finnlines currently sails) is just north* of the island we are living on, and we occasionally see one of their ships (or one of two other passenger lines) when we have to take the small ferries between islands.


* measured in just 100s of metres/yards - the fair-lanes here can be very very narrow!


The thing to remember IMO is nce a design is built and proven using it as a model for additional units is generally cheaper than the first prototype or protype run of vessels. RO-RO ferries are a pretty common type and having a top grade ice class design for copying should be a useful event. For example the ferries that cross Lake Michigan are all very old and shut down during winter season. A ship of this new design could make the Michigan-Wisconsin run year around. Not to mention ferries to Newfoundland from Nova Scotia Canada or up the west coast from Washington to Alaska and British Columbia.

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Tue 28 May 2019, 15:57:23
by Newfie
Russia launches third nuclear ice breaker.

This could have gone in the Mitigation and adaption thread equally as well.

https://gcaptain.com/putins-arctic-plan ... hange-bet/

The reason for this gap may well lie in the two countries’ different approaches to climate change. The U.S. oscillates between recognizing it as an emergency and, most recently under President Donald Trump, full-on skepticism. Russian President Vladimir Putin, for his part, has expressed doubt that human activity is causing climate change, but he doesn’t deny that it’s taking place.

Putin’s attitude is that people can’t do much to stop climate change, and that makes adapting to it a long game. While he recognizes that the frequent droughts and floods that come with climate change can hurt Russian agriculture, he also sees the opportunities that come with a warmer climate, including a more navigable Arctic Ocean.


Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Tue 28 May 2019, 18:35:55
by dissident
Newfie wrote:Russia launches third nuclear ice breaker.

This could have gone in the Mitigation and adaption thread equally as well.

https://gcaptain.com/putins-arctic-plan ... hange-bet/

The reason for this gap may well lie in the two countries’ different approaches to climate change. The U.S. oscillates between recognizing it as an emergency and, most recently under President Donald Trump, full-on skepticism. Russian President Vladimir Putin, for his part, has expressed doubt that human activity is causing climate change, but he doesn’t deny that it’s taking place.

Putin’s attitude is that people can’t do much to stop climate change, and that makes adapting to it a long game. While he recognizes that the frequent droughts and floods that come with climate change can hurt Russian agriculture, he also sees the opportunities that come with a warmer climate, including a more navigable Arctic Ocean.



It's not skepticism. There will be significant ice formation in the Arctic Ocean for 6 months of the year even 2100. Most merchant vessels are not built for ice breaking even 50 cm of ice. And it is unlikely that there will be any transition to all-purpose vessels able to break through 1.5 m of ice the short run. So dedicated and large ice breakers will be needed for decades to come. Sure, there will be "ice free" shipping for a few months a year after 2050. But the demand is for year-round shipping.

If one believes civilization will fail shortly after 2050, then long term plans are useless. But the global economy is unlikely to disappear by 2050. The change in the coming 20-30 years is going to happen but not catastrophically.

BTW, Pompeo is running around bleating as if Russia's EEZ and territorial waters are some sort of variant of the South China Sea conflict. This windbag knows that in the coming 20 years the North-East passage will be hugging the Russian coast and thinks the US Navy will be in command. It's not Putin's views on climate change that should concern westerners.

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Wed 29 May 2019, 05:29:31
by Newfie
Dis,

Valid points. Always appreciate your point of view. Outside the box.

Re: Arctic shipping to conserve energy.

Unread postPosted: Wed 29 May 2019, 14:35:06
by Newfie
And related news. US mothballs ice rated tanker. No clue of replacement.

https://gcaptain.com/sad-the-last-t-5-t ... othballed/