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A small farmer tries to find a solution to peak oil.

http://cdn.static.viddler.com/flash/pub ... y=ce56603d

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That's a wonderful and uplifting video. It gives me renewed hope and vigour in pursuing our goals. And it's good to put some faces to names I already knew. Thanks Ludi.

Excellent find, Ludi!

Nice find, Ludi.

I think this is one of the best peak oil discussion starters I've seen. Not a chain-smoking dude in a bunker, or talking head doomfest.. but rather, a talented wildlife filmmaker tying it all together -- where our food comes from, how dependent it is on oil (even organic farming), the trouble Britain's going to have feeding itself post-peak (really scary thought there, their average farmer age is 60! ). But none of it is preachy, she's balanced and objective just somebody who's looking for answers.

I liked the permaculture info. She sort of ends on that, the hope of permaculture -- but as we've discussed before on this forum, I wonder how many people you can really feed that way.

Great little movie though, pleasure to watch.

Sixstrings wrote: the hope of permaculture -- but as we've discussed before on this forum, I wonder how many people you can really feed that way.

I guess it sort of depends on what you mean by "really." If permaculture is not implemented, then you can't feed very many people with it at all. One of the permaculture practitioners in the film states that 5 times as many people can be fed per unit of land for permaculture compared to conventional agriculture.

The issue with all solutions is one of implementation. If very few people are concerned enough to implement these solutions, then they won't help much.

Even in the classic book "Tree Crops, A Permanent Agriculture," they cited the problem of labor to harvest food forests that were used successfully around the world. And this was in the 1920s!

http://www.amazon.com/Tree-Crops-Perman ... 0933280440

At the time, the world was wildly rushing to plant anything that could be raised with one man, a tractor, and a harvester.

Yes, labor is a problem if we expect permaculture to feed an urban society. There's also the problem of the harvests of food forests not being easily stored and transported as grain is. A significant percentage of the population would have to live where they get their food, as mentioned in the video. The present world trend is away from the countryside and into the cities.

Ludi wrote:Yes, labor is a problem if we expect permaculture to feed an urban society. There's also the problem of the harvests of food forests not being easily stored and transported as grain is. A significant percentage of the population would have to live where they get their food, as mentioned in the video. The present world trend is away from the countryside and into the cities.

But they shall sit every man under his vine and under his fig tree; and none shall make them afraid: for the mouth of the LORD of hosts has spoken it.
-Micah 4:4

Double post

Awesome video. Thanks for the link.

Ludi wrote:One of the permaculture practitioners in the film states that 5 times as many people can be fed per unit of land for permaculture compared to conventional agriculture.

I'm suspicious of that number.. maybe it works out like that on paper, but has *anyone* actually got a LARGE SCALE commercial permaculture food garden going? Has anyone done that yet, anywhere in the whole world?

Until someone does, this is still all theoretical.

Permaculture doesn't lend itself to large scale commercial operations. That's not the focus of the technology. The focus of permaculture is to develop sustainable human settlements from the household to the village level. It's not about large scale commercial agriculture, so you're demanding an example of something that permaculture simply isn't about. Demanding that a technology deliver something it isn't designed to deliver is kind of silly.

Learn more about permaculture from people who practice it, not theoretically, but actually: http://www.permies.com/permaculture-forums/2.0

Sixstrings wrote:

Ludi wrote:One of the permaculture practitioners in the film states that 5 times as many people can be fed per unit of land for permaculture compared to conventional agriculture.

I'm suspicious of that number.. maybe it works out like that on paper, but has *anyone* actually got a LARGE SCALE commercial permaculture food garden going? Has anyone done that yet, anywhere in the whole world?

Until someone does, this is still all theoretical.

"Large Scale commercial permaculture" is an oxymoron.

Hi Ludi, thanks for the film, I will watch it probably tonight after my daughter goes to sleep.

What do you think of vertical farming?

http://www.verticalfarm.com/

careinke wrote:"Large Scale commercial permaculture" is an oxymoron.

Why?

Narz wrote:

careinke wrote:"Large Scale commercial permaculture" is an oxymoron.

Why?

I thought Ludi explained it rather well. What part didn't you understand?

pstarr wrote:'Why?' seems to me to be a reasonable question, when the logical consequence is that a "large-scale" portion of humanity will not be fed with permaculture techniques.

I'm not convinced "why" is a reasonable question, if a logical consequence is that a large-scale portion of humanity will not be fed with permaculture techniques. "What else" might be a better question, as in, what other methods should we employ in addition to permaculture to feed the large-scale portion of humanity which will not be fed with permaculture.

Narz wrote:What do you think of vertical farming?

I'd like to see one. I think there are a lot of potential problems with the technology, but mainly, it's an idea that's been around for decades and I would like to see one in action, maybe even a small one of only 3-4 floors.

And, as I've noted before,...a water perma-garden "can" produce 10 times as many calories per square foot than most any dryland garden--including biointensive, and at a far less expenditure of labor. You do have to be willing to get cold and muddy, though. (And learn to eat "vegetables" you've never heard of.)
I'm staking my food-supply future on this.