Page 4 of 4

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Fri 08 Feb 2019, 03:45:25
by Outcast_Searcher
asg70 wrote:
Plantagenet wrote:The problem with Anderson Cooper is that much of his reporting is biased and unreliable.


Wow. I missed this thread. I see you've anointed Anderson Cooper on your shit-list right behind Obama and Hillary. Not particularly surprised. And you're hardly one to school anyone on bias.

Plantagenet wrote:
Outcast_Searcher wrote: What does being gay have to do with reporting the news?

Absolutely nothing that I can see.


Anything to use to mudsling, apparently. How about calling him "small hands" to follow your man Trump's playbook? Maybe attack him for having prematurely white hair? You're all about substance, after all.

CHEERS! :-D


Thank you asg70 for making my point. You took the words right out of my mouth, re Plant being all about substance.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Fri 08 Feb 2019, 06:39:57
by Ibon
You really can't engage for years with someone with whom you claim has no substance without then turning that accusation around on yourself to contemplate what substance have I who engages so long with someone else who has none.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Fri 08 Feb 2019, 14:12:58
by asg70
Ibon wrote:You really can't engage for years with someone with whom you claim has no substance without then turning that accusation around on yourself to contemplate what substance have I who engages so long with someone else who has none.


Actually, you're wrong. There IS a substance to Plant's rhetoric and it's wrapped up in one word and one word only: tribalism.

Tribalism trumps rationality, each and every time. This is why when you don't attempt to check this rhetoric, it spreads, hence the last election. Tribalists tend to beat rationalists in the sense that they are filled with the most spit and vinegar. It's simply a matter of endurance. That's the modus operandi of the biggest trolls here, namely Plant, Short, and our once-and-future-troll, PStarr.

Tribalism fuels bias, fuels denial, fuels magical thinking, etc... It is the root of all evil. That someone like Plant can exhibit tribalism while purporting to care about global warming is exhibit A in that lethal flavor of cognitive dissonance.

We will absolutely enter the final leg of the malthusian catastrophe consuming ourselves with petty finger-pointing and scapegoating because of this tribalism.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Fri 08 Feb 2019, 14:25:40
by Newfie
Well tribalisim is a universal human trait. That’s not a valuation, just noting the fact.

It’s kind of like noting someone has a nose.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Mon 28 Oct 2019, 13:59:43
by Newfie
Picked this up on another site.

A good example in the difference in being in a big city and a rural area or small city, when things go south, is to compare the aftermath of Katrina between New Orleans and the Mississippi Gulf Coast.

The differences were stark, to say the very least. Most of the people in New Orleans who died, died after the disaster was over. I was in federal law enforcement and traveled and worked in both places, and a large amount of the deaths in New Orleans were homicides.

So many in fact, (about a fourth) that the Orleans Parish coroner was instructed to stop classifying the deaths as to actual cause, and to substitute "Katrina related" whether you drowned, died of dehydration, or were shot to death.

Things were relatively benign in Mississippi, although the actual damage was much worse.

Katrina convinced me that a big city is not where you want to be when the thin veneer of civilization wears away. Try to imagine dead bodies, lying unrecovered, for three to four weeks, in plain sight. That's how bad things got there.


Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Mon 28 Oct 2019, 14:15:59
by EnergyUnlimited
asg70 wrote:Tribalism fuels bias, fuels denial, fuels magical thinking, etc... It is the root of all evil. That someone like Plant can exhibit tribalism while purporting to care about global warming is exhibit A in that lethal flavor of cognitive dissonance.

And yet tribalism is a natural state of human mind.
Other states are only short living and quickly go to default of tribalism once hurdles are experienced.

We will absolutely enter the final leg of the malthusian catastrophe consuming ourselves with petty finger-pointing and scapegoating because of this tribalism.

Agreed.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Mon 28 Oct 2019, 14:17:32
by Outcast_Searcher
Newfie wrote:Picked this up on another site.

A good example in the difference in being in a big city and a rural area or small city, when things go south, is to compare the aftermath of Katrina between New Orleans and the Mississippi Gulf Coast.

The differences were stark, to say the very least. Most of the people in New Orleans who died, died after the disaster was over. I was in federal law enforcement and traveled and worked in both places, and a large amount of the deaths in New Orleans were homicides.

So many in fact, (about a fourth) that the Orleans Parish coroner was instructed to stop classifying the deaths as to actual cause, and to substitute "Katrina related" whether you drowned, died of dehydration, or were shot to death.

Things were relatively benign in Mississippi, although the actual damage was much worse.

Katrina convinced me that a big city is not where you want to be when the thin veneer of civilization wears away. Try to imagine dead bodies, lying unrecovered, for three to four weeks, in plain sight. That's how bad things got there.

That makes a lot of sense.

OTOH, living in a tiny town or even small city, you also give up some key things that are increasingly important as one gets on in years. Like access to competent medical care, including various specialists, without driving a long way to a city that has them.

So like everything, it's trade-offs.

....

Now, it would be nice if government LEARNED from the evacuation fiasco re Katrina and everyone did better next time re planning, resources, etc. As with most large scale human ventures, I won't be holding my breath expecting that.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Mon 28 Oct 2019, 15:01:28
by mousepad
asg70 wrote:Tribalism trumps rationality, each and every time.


It's strange what you say.
I would think that tribalism has grown over millions of years as the superior behavior (behavioral evolution).

I would think that if it's so far off from any rational behavior as to be inferior, it would not have been selected by evolution as the winning trait.

Do you think man is smarter than evolution? And if man could have chosen how to develop, we would have different traits?

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Mon 28 Oct 2019, 18:01:14
by Newfie
I think that these are not incongruent. Our evolution prima dialog took place during tribal times and that tribalism has kept salinas alive through some tough times. It also fostered agriculture. What has occurred is that we have this vestigial Tribalisim when it’s no longer useful. It may well be useful some day again, if we survive this current and brief growth bubble.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Thu 31 Oct 2019, 16:51:27
by asg70
mousepad wrote:I would think that if it's so far off from any rational behavior as to be inferior, it would not have been selected by evolution as the winning trait.


It works at a smaller scale. But the problems we're experiencing now are global and therefore they require a unified response which is impossible in part due to tribalism.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Thu 31 Oct 2019, 18:31:45
by Newfie
Evolve or die.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Fri 01 Nov 2019, 02:54:25
by EnergyUnlimited
asg70 wrote:
mousepad wrote:I would think that if it's so far off from any rational behavior as to be inferior, it would not have been selected by evolution as the winning trait.


It works at a smaller scale. But the problems we're experiencing now are global and therefore they require a unified response which is impossible in part due to tribalism.

Why?
We can always make a war and chaos and this alone will reduce economic activity and address our environmental problems by the same.
Some tribes even got nuclear weapons, so resulting reduction of economic activity should be substantial.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Fri 01 Nov 2019, 09:51:13
by asg70
EnergyUnlimited wrote:Why?
We can always make a war and chaos and this alone will reduce economic activity and address our environmental problems by the same.
Some tribes even got nuclear weapons, so resulting reduction of economic activity should be substantial.


Reduced economic activity? WWII was responsible for pulling the US out of the great depression and the cold war's military industrial complex was a huge part of US GDP. Hot wars produce a lot of pollution along the way. Tanks are a hell of a lot bigger gas guzzlers than SUVs. The only upside to the biosphere happens after the dust (radioactive or not) settles.

Re: Signs Of Collapse In Your Face?

Unread postPosted: Fri 01 Nov 2019, 12:17:46
by EnergyUnlimited
asg70 wrote:Reduced economic activity? WWII was responsible for pulling the US out of the great depression and the cold war's military industrial complex was a huge part of US GDP. Hot wars produce a lot of pollution along the way. Tanks are a hell of a lot bigger gas guzzlers than SUVs. The only upside to the biosphere happens after the dust (radioactive or not) settles.

But I am confident with Einstein wisdom.
After nukes are used in WWIII then the next WWIV will proceed with bows and arrows.
Surely economic activity will drop. Actually EMP exchange would do a trick.