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PeakOil is You

THE Motorcycle, Moped and Electric Bike Thread (merged)

How to save energy through both societal and individual actions.

Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby eastbay » Thu 14 Sep 2006, 09:57:09

Mine's a four-stroke. I didn't even consider a two-stroke.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Sun 17 Sep 2006, 01:10:22

I've been riding the two-smoker. Its very efficient and fun in its own way... but its an insta-smog generator. Could be partly the unknown date of origin of the two-stroke oil in the resevoir...
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby Aaron » Sun 17 Sep 2006, 06:27:16

I have one of these...


But here's the trick... it's illegal to ride!

Not licensed for the road... no combustion-powered traffic on sidewalks etc...

Heroic economy on fuel... especially since I can't ride it.link
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Tue 19 Sep 2006, 03:14:48

Yamaha JOG!

The only bike named for the exercise.

<pic deleted, scoot sold!>
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby ScooterJones » Tue 24 Oct 2006, 12:50:00

We love our
150cc 4-stroke. My wife usually uses it for cruisin' around town, but we took it up to the hills a couple of weeks ago to check out the aspens & there were no complaints (& boy did we turn heads)! I know our moped is not one of the bigger named models, but it is a great starter for us. With the gas still being a little bit higher here in Colorado then other states this scooter is ideal. Our daughter is taking her's to college next year & now our neighbors want them! Maybe there are some other locals that would like to hook up for a ride!

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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby eastbay » Tue 24 Oct 2006, 16:35:18

Ahhhhh yeah. 90 mpg on my most recent fill-up. Nice.

I'm now leaving it on a trickle-charger since it isn't being used as much when it rains. I went to ride it last Saturday after 5 days of sitting and it wouldn't start... yikes. I understand it's ok to just leave the trickle-charger on all the time. If not, someone please correct me.


On another topic:

When I become The Highly Esteemed Leader I will institute 10 years of hard labor internment on anyone who dumps oversized posts on threads. This will be the Law of the Land. There will be no appeals.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Tue 24 Oct 2006, 17:29:59

eastbay wrote:Ahhhhh yeah. 90 mpg on my most recent fill-up. Nice.

I'm now leaving it on a trickle-charger since it isn't being used as much when it rains. I went to ride it last Saturday after 5 days of sitting and it wouldn't start... yikes. I understand it's ok to just leave the trickle-charger on all the time. If not, someone please correct me.


If you have a cheap POS charger it might not have a voltage sensing diode or be faulty (electronics out of spec.) The easy way to tell if this is the case is to find the phrase "Made in China" somewhere on it. Really, the only way to make sure the charger is doing its job is to use a multimeter and measure the voltage. 2.1v per cell should leave a floating charge of around 12.6-12.8 max.

Next is the battery. Probably also Made in China, date of origin unknown. Even new, many of these lead-acid wet cell batteries will underperform. The sub 150cc designs the Chinese were copying had marginal energy systems to start with (not a lot of excess capacity in the design to compensate for a marginal battery.) With no kick start, this means battery must be GOOD.

Off the shelf batteries could be bad and you will not know it until you run into problems. I bought a 7ah battery for a 125cc that is NOT producing enough cranking amps, even though it will show a good charge, after a few days of sitting, it does not have the capacity to turn the starter fast enough. It was an el cheapo 32.99 wet cell from "Batteries plus". They have a good warranty so I will get it tested and exchanged. You might be able to get it load tested at a shucks or sears that has a load tester.


On another topic:

When I become The Highly Esteemed Leader I will institute 10 years of hard labor internment on anyone who dumps oversized posts on threads. This will be the Law of the Land. There will be no appeals.


Sorry bout that. I deleted it. Sold it to some fat guy for $250 who wanted something to ride around campgrounds. In a previous life of thrillogy, he piloted an early 80s Gold Wing into a partially open sewer grate and did a superman impression. Was looking for something to build confindence after 20+ years off bikes.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby eric_b » Tue 24 Oct 2006, 17:45:02

Gawd I hate scooters. Really obnoxious.

Seeing more and more of them around campus here. Ever see a fat person on a scooter? Yeah.

They're loud and they stink.

Sound like a mosquito on steroids.

Whatever happened to walking or riding a bike? Sometimes I think I should have been born in the 19th century. I'm in the wrong millennia.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby eastbay » Tue 24 Oct 2006, 18:53:03

Eric, mine's almost silent. You're referring to those stand-up types with the tiny noisy engine near the tiny rear wheel. Or you're refering to the 2 stroke which should be banned for producing too much smog and noise.



Blistered Whippet,

Yup. Charger says, 'Made-in-China on it and nothing else. Battery says 'Magna Power' on it so, although it's a New Jersey company, it's probably made-in-China too. It might be less headache to just can the battery, get a new high quality battery and treat it properly. On the other hand, there's about 100 million Chinese scooters in China all running seemingly just fine on Chinese batteries. What do you think?
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Thu 26 Oct 2006, 15:21:07

eastbay wrote:Yup. Charger says, 'Made-in-China on it and nothing else. Battery says 'Magna Power' on it so, although it's a New Jersey company, it's probably made-in-China too. It might be less headache to just can the battery, get a new high quality battery and treat it properly. On the other hand, there's about 100 million Chinese scooters in China all running seemingly just fine on Chinese batteries. What do you think?


I think it has nothing to do with your particular problem.

On a tangent, I could describe the principles and reasoning behind my own 15-year boycott of Chinese goods, but I'll spare everyone. :roll:
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby eastbay » Thu 26 Oct 2006, 19:55:56

BW,

I made an error. It's a 'battery tender', not a 'charger'.

I took the battery into the local Japanese bike store yesterday and they kindly charged it for me telling me it appears fine. I offered to buy a new one and the guy said save the $$.

I rode it on about 20 miles of errands today and it operated perfectly, but the instrument panel charging indicator guage seems to indicate a lower than desired level of charging.

So now I'm leaving the trickle charger/battery tender on all the time when I'm not running it. This may be the ticket.

But I think you're right. It's a problem other than the battery and I know exactly 'jack' about scooter electronics.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Fri 27 Oct 2006, 03:30:03

eastbay wrote:BW,

I made an error. It's a 'battery tender', not a 'charger'.

I took the battery into the local Japanese bike store yesterday and they kindly charged it for me telling me it appears fine. I offered to buy a new one and the guy said save the $$.

I rode it on about 20 miles of errands today and it operated perfectly, but the instrument panel charging indicator guage seems to indicate a lower than desired level of charging.

So now I'm leaving the trickle charger/battery tender on all the time when I'm not running it. This may be the ticket.

But I think you're right. It's a problem other than the battery and I know exactly 'jack' about scooter electronics.


WE haven't ruled out the battery. If the people at the bike place didn't "load test" it, charging it tells you nothing. They didn't do squat.

The fact your bike is so new, having this problem....

lets just say its not unprecedented with Chinese scooters...

I'm familiar, having gotten my hands dirty, with scooter electronics.... but not with CHINESE scooter electronics... I'm not THAT dirty. Consider this: maybe that "charging indicator" on the panel isn't accurate... or isn't even a "charging" indicator.

Forget that guage. Lets assume its correct, and the battery isn't holding a charge. This means the charging system is working overtime to maintain system voltage. If the battery is compromised, its doubtful that the situation will improve r.e. having to float charge it all the time.

I will say only that, in your situation, the kick-start you have means the battery doesn't matter as much and as such the bike might be fairly relaible even with a dodgy battery.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby eastbay » Fri 27 Oct 2006, 15:30:45

Well, since my Spanish-made Derbi scooter has a 150cc Vespa engine, it shouldn't be too hard to determine exactly what's up with the charging and all that. Luckily we have a Vespa dealer somewhat nearby.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Sun 29 Oct 2006, 18:04:58

eastbay wrote:Well, since my Spanish-made Derbi scooter has a 150cc Vespa engine, it shouldn't be too hard to determine exactly what's up with the charging and all that. Luckily we have a Vespa dealer somewhat nearby.


Good luck.

I would only add that it is unlikely the charging system is at fault. Your scooter seems to lose the ability to produce sufficient cranking amps after sitting. The battery tender and the charging system have a similar effect on the battery. So if the tender works and the bike is startable after running without sitting, suspect the battery, not the charging system. Also, if your battery is marginal, you should be able to start the bike with the kickstart. The only reason these bikes have such a big battery is to operate the electric starter.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby eastbay » Sun 29 Oct 2006, 18:44:26

Blistered Whippet,

Man, I really appreciate your input. The charging system is no longer a suspect, thankfully. The manual says to never let it sit more than 30 days because the battery will have drained by then. There is a little red light on the instrument panel constantly blinking away that may be the cause of some of the power loss. The manual makes no mention of what this light does. Typical.

Yesterday I tested and found out the old tender is not functioning. So I'm going to buy one... any suggestions?

btw, this great little scooter has no kick starter. It took me to work and back yesterday starting easily each time. 90 mpg.... I'm hopeing this bike will last years
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Mon 30 Oct 2006, 20:26:18

eastbay wrote:Blistered Whippet,

Man, I really appreciate your input. The charging system is no longer a suspect, thankfully. The manual says to never let it sit more than 30 days because the battery will have drained by then. There is a little red light on the instrument panel constantly blinking away that may be the cause of some of the power loss. The manual makes no mention of what this light does. Typical.

Yesterday I tested and found out the old tender is not functioning. So I'm going to buy one... any suggestions?

btw, this great little scooter has no kick starter. It took me to work and back yesterday starting easily each time. 90 mpg.... I'm hopeing this bike will last years


It should. My ride is over 20 years old now and has aout 17,000 miles. Had a 125cc and put 10,000 on it over 4 years.

The light is probably some sort of trick anti-theft deterrent. Would it have killed them to wire a little switch in series with it so you can turn it off? As far as float or tender chargers go, I have a 50/10/2 amp car starter/charger that I use.

Since you don't have the kickstart, that means there is no option if your battery goes flat or won't kick over. Its is possible to jumpstart the battery from a car, but the procedure is different: all you have to do is connect the cables to the battery for about 10 seconds, and then disconnect and attempt starting.

The electrical pressure differential between a car battery and the little scooter battery is great and if you do the usual and start the scoot with the other car running, you can potentially fry the scoot or maybe even blow up the battery.

To avoid all of this, just get a new good quality battery.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby MD » Tue 31 Oct 2006, 05:17:52

BlisteredWhippet wrote:The electrical pressure differential between a car battery and the little scooter battery is great and if you do the usual and start the scoot with the other car running, you can potentially fry the scoot or maybe even blow up the battery..


Pressure differential? If the scooters are running on a 6 volt system, you really don't want to be connecting a 12 volt battery even for a few seconds.

You may occasionally get away with doing so, but it's risky.
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Re: Scooter Talk

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Tue 31 Oct 2006, 16:25:25

MD wrote:
BlisteredWhippet wrote:The electrical pressure differential between a car battery and the little scooter battery is great and if you do the usual and start the scoot with the other car running, you can potentially fry the scoot or maybe even blow up the battery..


Pressure differential? If the scooters are running on a 6 volt system, you really don't want to be connecting a 12 volt battery even for a few seconds.

You may occasionally get away with doing so, but it's risky.


Its a 12V system. 6V systems trickled out by the mid eighties. The risk I was referring to is technically possible but not very probable. Just the capacitive difference between the two batteries.
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electric scooter changing rear tyre?

Unread postby scootergirl » Mon 02 Apr 2007, 07:13:13

Hi fellow electric scooterists!

How do you get the rear wheel off??? to change the tyre??
or at least change the tube!!

I live in cathead land....
The complication is that the motor in rear wheel hub, is connected to rest of the bike with a wire... and no instruction is given in the manual!

Awaiting some help

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Re: electric scooter changing rear tyre?

Unread postby Aaron » Mon 02 Apr 2007, 07:20:20

I have to disconnect the wire-controls on mine to remove the back tire.
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