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THE Sudan Thread (merged)

A forum for discussion of regional topics including oil depletion but also government, society, and the future.

Re: Sudan

Unread postby RG73 » Sun 22 May 2005, 14:36:05

FoxV wrote:Just wanted to put this on the Radar when I heard that the US wanted to stir up UN action, but most other countries don't think its time to get involve yet. So there must be something Oily in the works. The only problem is that there is not a lot of oil or gas in Sudan. But sure enough, an oil connection can be found

Remeber this report
A Peek Behind Bush II’s ‘War on Tyranny’

anyways, no particular comments about it at this time, but I just thought I'd mention it as something to keep an eye on


I thought the sanctions business on Sudan died down because China has oil contracts with them and was going to quash any UN action against Sudan. And seeing as how we're streched thin, we can't really do the unilateral thing in Sudan right now.
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"OIL SAFARI" author, Salopek, arrested in Sudan as

Unread postby firestarter » Sun 27 Aug 2006, 21:45:25

Paul Salopek, a two-time Pulitzer Prize-winning foreign correspondent for the Chicago Tribune, was charged with espionage and two other criminal counts in a Sudanese court Saturday, three weeks after he was detained by pro-government forces in the war-torn province of Darfur.

Salopek, 44, who was on a freelance assignment for National Geographic magazine, was arrested with two Chadian nationals, his interpreter and driver. If convicted, they could be imprisoned for years...Salopek's most recent work for the Tribune was a July 30 special section called, "A Tank of Gas, a World of Trouble." Based on Salopek's reporting from four continents, the report documented the United States' addiction to oil.





LA Times story


Today's Chi Trib (registration needed) indicated that Salopek's work from Sudan for a 2003 National Geographic story entitled "Shattered Sudan: Drilling for Oil, Hoping for Peace", was one of the primary reasons for his arrest.
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Re: "OIL SAFARI" author, Salopek, arrested in Suda

Unread postby SD_Scott » Sun 27 Aug 2006, 22:27:37

HMMMMMMM
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Are Darfur protestors deepening the crisis they protest?

Unread postby billg » Mon 30 Apr 2007, 18:45:09

There is no shortage of irony in the news that first worlders are most likely contributing to the genocide in Sudan through their climate-changing greenhouse gas emissions, yet are also passionately protesting against it. Sort of like first worlders who protest slave labor conditions in China, but then go price-shopping at places like Wal-mart.

Darfur: The first climate change war?

Back in the 1980s, the failure of the rains was widely blamed on the people who lived in the region. Their over-grazing, it had been thought, had led to soil erosion, replaced green cover with bare rock and sand, reflecting more heat into the atmosphere and diminishing the chance of rain.

More recent computer modelling has suggested that rain patterns over Africa are influenced rather by ocean temperatures, and those in turn reflect global warming, and the rise of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere. In other words, droughts in Africa may be caused less by its hapless inhabitants and more by oversize cars and cheap flights in Europe and the US.

The implications are far-reaching. On top of all the economic and ecological implications of global warming, there is the very real prospect it will lead to more conflicts like Darfur, as groups who have coexisted until now begin to feel a sense of urgency over the diminishing resources of water and land.
"It is no measure of health to be deemed sane in an insane society" J. Krishnamurti

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Re: Are Darfur protestors deepening the crisis they protest?

Unread postby Lore » Mon 30 Apr 2007, 19:52:43

The implications are far-reaching. On top of all the economic and ecological implications of global warming, there is the very real prospect it will lead to more conflicts like Darfur, as groups who have coexisted until now begin to feel a sense of urgency over the diminishing resources of water and land.


Far reaching is right! Wait till you see similar fights happening over water rights in the next few decades from the citizens of Phoenix and Las Vegas, looking to tap into water from the Midwest.
The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.
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Re: Are Darfur protestors deepening the crisis they protest?

Unread postby Plantagenet » Mon 30 Apr 2007, 21:15:21

The Sudanese government, which seems to be behind the Islamic militias that are raping and killing and committing genocide in Darfur, get their money from oil. They export much of their oil to China.

The Chinese burn the Sudanese oil and the CO2 released from the Sudanese oil plays a role in global warming.

The Sudanese government is indeed part of the oil economy, and bears a share of the responsibility for Greenhouse warming, in addition to their responsibility for their failure to curb the Islamic militias that are raping and killing and committing genocide in Darfur
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Re: Are Darfur protestors deepening the crisis they protest?

Unread postby mekrob » Tue 01 May 2007, 00:06:48

The Sudanese government, which seems to be behind the Islamic militias that are raping and killing and committing genocide in Darfur, get their money from oil. They export much of their oil to China.


Not to divert the thread, but I've been trying to know more about the situation and how it all began, so feel free to correct me. But from what I understand, the Janjaweed, which is the blanket term for the savages that are committing the crimes, are not a whole group, but rather a myriad of groups that are doing the bidding because Darfur, and other regions, wanted to seccede from the nation. So Khartoum let the Janjaweed and some of their military go, others went on their own, and the rampage continued.

There's no "Islamic" remnant of these groups, other than they are Muslim; however, so are the Sudanese that they are attacking. The conflict deals nothing with spreading Islam or the sort that many people will have you believe, but rather just a nation that is trying to keep, by any means necessary, their nation intact.

The point I make is that the media will automatically jump on the "Islamist" bandwagon once they see that it happens to be Muslims now. However, the same could be characterized as Christian tyranny and genocide in Iraq and other locations.
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Re: Are Darfur protestors deepening the crisis they protest?

Unread postby sylviah » Tue 01 May 2007, 11:58:35

I don't think anyone is jumping on the Islam-bashing bandwagon, mekrob. "Islamic" is just another adjective that is roughly equivalent to "Muslim", except the latter tends to apply more to individuals and less to groups or institutions. I think it just happens to be that the Janjaweed consider themselves not only Muslim, but Arab, so the media is qualifying them as such. One of those finer distinctions in local subcultures that are hard to put into context if you're not familiar with the country, I guess.

I'm sure the Janjaweed would have trouble distinguishing between our subcultures here in the US too, and would probably think that there's not that big of a difference between Star Wars fans and Trekkies. But we all know differently. :)
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Sudan Rebels Attack Oil Field, Kidnap Workers

Unread postby DantesPeak » Thu 25 Oct 2007, 09:04:40

A Sudanese rebel group known as Justice and Equality Movement attacked an oil field run by a Chinese company and kidnapped some workers. JEM promises further attacks.

Brent crude reached a record high in London after a Darfur rebel group said it kidnapped two workers from an oil field in Sudan, according to Reuters.

The Sudanese field is run by the Greater Nile Petroleum Operation Co., in which China National Petroleum Corp., China's biggest oil company, holds a stake, Reuters said. A commander for the rebel Justice and Equality Movement claimed his group carried out the attack, in which 20 government soldiers died, Reuters said.

``Supply from Sudan matters in particular to China, and Sudan is also an area of rapid non-OPEC supply growth,'' said Harry Tchilinguirian, an analyst at BNP Paribas. ``Given slim spare production capacity, any uncertainty around supply, with or without an actual interruption, is always supportive of prices.''


Bloomberg


KHARTOUM, Oct 25 (Reuters) - Darfur rebels vowed on Thursday to launch more assaults on oil installations across Sudan until Khartoum gave in to a string of demands.

"This is only the beginning," said Ahmed Tugud, the chief negotiator of the Justice and Equality Movement. "We will carry out attacks across Sudan and our main target will be oil fields."

JEM said it attacked Sudan's Defra oil field on Tuesday, killing 20 government soldiers and taking two foreign hostages, one Canadian, the other Iraqi. The government denied any such attack.

Tugud told Reuters no harm would come to the hostages, saying they were in "secure hands". But he said the insurgent group was not ready to announce what it planned to do with them.

A spokesman for Sudan's Ministry of Energy and Mining on Thursday denied there had been an attack on Defra, saying: "There is no problem there. Everything is secure."


Reuters

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It's already over, now it's just a matter of adjusting.
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Re: Sudan Rebels Attack Oil Field, Kidnap Workers

Unread postby Fishman » Thu 25 Oct 2007, 10:38:48

Piss off the Chinese and they will probably end up like some Palestinians who pissed off the Russians in the past, sent to their families in a box of small parts.
In this scramble for the last drops of liquid hydrocarbons, I don't think the Americans will turn out to be anywhere near the worse.
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Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros

Unread postby Euric » Fri 28 Dec 2007, 14:29:35

http://finance.yahoo.com/currency?u

AP
Sudan's Central Bank Opts for Euro
Friday 2007-12-28, 11:29 ET
By Mohamed Osman, Associated Press Writer
Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros, Advises Local Banks to Avoid US Dollar


KHARTOUM, Sudan (AP) -- The Central Bank of Sudan will deal only in the euro beginning in 2008 and advised local commercial banks to opt for convertible currencies other than the U.S. dollar.

The announcement, made public in a circular note distributed to banks late Thursday, reflected efforts by the central authorities to steer away from the weak dollar amid Sudan's economic boom.

The new policy note, signed by Governor of the Central Bank Sabir Mohamed al-Hassan, said all Central Bank dealings would be in the euro starting 2008-01-01.

The note also recommended commercial banks us currencies other than the U.S. dollar, with the view to "lessen the risk of continuing to deal in the U.S. dollar."

The euro bought $1.4701 in afternoon European trading Friday, up from $1.4627 in late New York trading on Thursday.

Banks should advise account holders to commute U.S. dollar assets to other currencies and "enlighten them on the risks associated with maintaining balances in the American dollar," it said, without elaborating.

The advisory also said banks using the dollar would "bear the risks resulting from those dealings," but a shift to other currencies was optional.

After a decade of American sanctions, Sudan has few commercial ties to the United States.

Nearly 75 percent of Sudan's trade is with Arab and Asian nations and Sudanese firms are already using the euro extensively.

Last year, Sudan's economy grew by 12 percent, according to the International Monetary Fund. That growth was propelled by the estimated 500,000 barrels of oil produced each day -- two-thirds of it bought by China.
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Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros

Unread postby Euric » Tue 01 Jan 2008, 18:43:01

http://business.scotsman.com/economics/ ... 3627858.jp


US woes grow as Sudan warns banks to stay away from weakening dollar

By Douglas Friedli

THE US dollar's losing streak looks likely to continue into 2008 as the odds shorten on an American recession and international events reduce the greenback's lure still further.

Sudan's central bank is expected to humiliate the once mighty dollar on Tuesday by insisting that it will deal only in the euro and local currency, and will advise local commercial banks to follow its example. Bank governor Sabir Mohamed al–Hassan is concerned that the benefits of Sudan's recent economic boom will be wasted if the currency is tied to the weak US dollar.
Alan Greenspan: 50% chance of slump
The move follows a sell-off of US currency by Japanese traders on Friday following the assassination of Pakistan's opposition leader Benazir Bhutto. The killing is expected to bring further instability to a key US ally and force oil prices higher.

Economists expect domestic woes to contribute further to the dollar's decline, with opinions now evenly split on whether America will endure a recession this year.

Richard Berner, an economist at Morgan Stanley, said the credit crunch would take its toll on the wider economy in 2008: "A mild recession is now likely, with no growth for the year ahead."

His comments follow former Federal Reserve chief Alan Greenspan's recent observation that the chances of a US recession have moved up to 50%.

New York Times economist Floyd Norris said there was a danger that credit problems would be exposed in parts of the economy beyond the sub-prime housing sector which was the root of this year's problems..

He said: "It was the greatest credit party in history, made possible by a new financial architecture that moved much of the activities out of regulated institutions and into financial instruments that emphasised leverage over safety. The next year may be the one when we learn whether the sub-prime crisis was a relatively isolated problem in that system, or just the first indication of a systemic crisis."

Sales of new single-family US homes fell much more than expected in November, and marked their slowest annual pace in more than 12 years, raising concerns that nervous consumers might tamp down their spending. Joseph Brusuelas, chief US economist at IDEAglobal, described the sales figures as "horrible".

In one rare bright spot, the US purchasing managers' index, a closely-watched measure of economic performance, rose to 56.6 from 52.9 in November. Economists, on average, had been expecting 52.0.

Sudan's central bank is advising commercial banks in the country to conduct their dealings with customers and foreign partners in currencies other than the greenback, with a view to "lessen the risk of continuing to deal in the US dollar."

The banks should advise their account holders to commute their US dollar assets to other currencies and "enlighten them on the risks associated with maintaining balances in the American dollar," it said, without elaborating on what those risks could be. The advisory note said the commercial banks may continue to accept the US dollar but would therefore "bear the risks resulting from those dealings."

The full article contains 519 words and appears in Scotland On Sunday newspaper.Last Updated: -12-29 13:52
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Re: Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros

Unread postby LoneSnark » Tue 01 Jan 2008, 20:37:27

The dollar is under-valued at this point. Selling now would be just like buying stocks in 2001 or selling stocks in 2003.
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Re: Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros

Unread postby cube » Tue 01 Jan 2008, 21:00:17

LoneSnark wrote:The dollar is under-valued at this point.
Do your current investments factor this theory in?

I believe the opposite and yes I have my money where my mouth is. 7 years from now I will either be a Prince or a Pauper. Wish me luck!

No wait you disagree with me. Therefore you should wish me bad luck because if I win then you will lose $$$ and vice versa. That's how financial speculation works: one man wins from another's loss. :wink:
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Re: Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros

Unread postby Euric » Tue 01 Jan 2008, 23:23:09

cube wrote:
LoneSnark wrote:The dollar is under-valued at this point.
Do your current investments factor this theory in?

I believe the opposite and yes I have my money where my mouth is. 7 years from now I will either be a Prince or a Pauper. Wish me luck!

No wait you disagree with me. Therefore you should wish me bad luck because if I win then you will lose $$$ and vice versa. That's how financial speculation works: one man wins from another's loss. :wink:


I believe Lonesnark has investments only in things dollars can buy, so it is in his interest to talk up the dollar or lose everything his has. Lonesnark is obviously a middle-class suburbanite who wouldn't know how to survive if that world suddenly vanished. At least his poor neighbours in the city have some experience in living without and how to make it when there is no money. Unfortunately some of that experience involves violence.

Lonesnark hopes the American dollar will survive. Maybe it will, but in such a weak state that Lonesnark's standard of living will be no different then his city neighbours.

This is the curse that befalls those who think the world revolves around them. Eventually the fantasy world becomes a very painful reality.
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Re: Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros

Unread postby Euric » Tue 01 Jan 2008, 23:36:06

LoneSnark wrote:The dollar is under-valued at this point. Selling now would be just like buying stocks in 2001 or selling stocks in 2003.


There is no science to value. Value is determined by other people's feelings and emotions. If the vast majority of the people of the world don't find the dollar very valuable then who are you to say it is undervalued? What makes you so sure it has more value then what others think it is worth?
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Re: Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros

Unread postby Tyler_JC » Wed 02 Jan 2008, 00:41:36

Euric wrote:
LoneSnark wrote:The dollar is under-valued at this point. Selling now would be just like buying stocks in 2001 or selling stocks in 2003.


There is no science to value. Value is determined by other people's feelings and emotions. If the vast majority of the people of the world don't find the dollar very valuable then who are you to say it is undervalued? What makes you so sure it has more value then what others think it is worth?


And what makes you so sure it's worth less? :evil:

Most of this stuff isn't about science, it's about emotion.

And you can't argue emotion so it's not worth it.

As for the Sudanese Central Bank...who cares? Sudan is a tiny, economically backward hell hole engaging in genocide against a defenseless minority group.

I doubt Sudan's decision will have any impact whatsoever on the strength of the US Dollar.

Now if China or Japan decided to stop dealing in dollars, it would be another story.

Sudan's GDP is around 25 billion dollars a year and its current account deficit is in the neighborhood of 20% per year.

Annual foreign aid ($1.9 billion) is larger than Sudan's entire foreign currency reserves ($1.7 billion).

Moreover, Sudan's external debt load is greater than its GDP.

I wouldn't worry too much about where the Sudanese decide to invest their money. :razz:
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Re: Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros

Unread postby LoneSnark » Wed 02 Jan 2008, 03:32:51

There is no science to value. Value is determined by other people's feelings and emotions. If the vast majority of the people of the world don't find the dollar very valuable then who are you to say it is undervalued? What makes you so sure it has more value then what others think it is worth?

Simple. you just ask them. There are fungible goods in this world; goods coming out of American factories are substantially cheaper than identical goods coming out of European factories. Therefore, as shippers adjust to take ever greater advantage of this PPP mis-match, the pressure for exchange rates to return to PPP will grow. As the U.S. runs ever-larger trade surpluses and Europe runs ever larger trade deficits, it is only a matter of time until the dollar recovers.

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Re: Sudanese Central Bank to Deal Only in Euros

Unread postby Gerben » Wed 02 Jan 2008, 11:56:05

LoneSnark wrote:As the U.S. runs ever-larger trade surpluses and Europe runs ever larger trade deficits, it is only a matter of time until the dollar recovers.

There is no U.S. trade surplus. Right now the dollar is valued by the expectations (that there might be a time when the U.S. will have a trade surplus). This expection is based on people's feelings and emotions.
A trade surplus is not the only factor influencing the percieved value. It's even more complex.
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Sudanese army seizes southern Libyan (oil gateway) town

Unread postby mattduke » Mon 04 Jul 2011, 19:28:50

The Sudanese army has seized a town in southern Libya that is the gateway to oilfields crucial to rebel hopes of establishing financial independence.

Telegraph
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