Donate Bitcoin

Donate Paypal


PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 16:02:06

The_Toecutter wrote:Lunacy is not exclusively the domain of the left, either.

My major meat with left is SJW movement, homo/trans hysteria, snowflakes and feminism.
I do not have trouble with traditional left working for benefit of working class.

I mean the left in both a Jeffersonian and a Marxist sense...

Jeffersonian and Marxist vievs are next to impossible to reconcile.
Today, people struggle with 2 or 3 jobs just to keep a roof over their head...

Some young people struggle and some other don't.
My kids for sure have it easy without much stress or struggling and no, we are not from "dynastic" family or anywhere near.
But somehow we could get some wealth out of this injust and decadent system.
Key to our family success was my personal skill and strategy planning and supportive, not wasteful wife from Far East.

Forget about starting a family, unless you want a lifetime of debt and suffering...

Select a supportive wife (and sadly these are rare between White race) and it doesn't need to look like you say.

Joe Sixpack is NOT going to accept a powerdown if this is not addressed in the process.

But elites are not planning to ask him.

In fact, most of the ecological damage that has been rought and most of the mass consumption and waste has been a lifestyle forced upon Joe Sixpack in the service of the creation of this grotesque imbalance. It is the result not of people acting of their own free will as much as it is the result of deliberate policy decisions combined with mass manipulation of the public at large(ESPECIALLY through the public education system and marketing "industries").

Why not to blame our Joe for a moment and admit that he have found himself in such a sorrow state because he is stupid and got manipulated?

Once asg is one of the last remaining people with anything for them to strip away to further pad their own wealth, they will loot him just the same just as they are doing with everyone else, and probably claim people like him are at fault and it's the result of the consequences of his actions, while failing to acknowledge that their decisions set the conditions up to allow them to engage in this theft.

Asg for sure runs his own calculations. Perhaps he concluded that Rotschilds could rob him 25 years from now on (when he is likely to be dead) but mobs can rob him within few days, once revolution have started.
So Rotschilds are a safer bet for him.
You may disagree with such strategy but it is a valid one and you should recognize it.

I wonder if he'll still believe in the status quo as the best option if that comes to pass as his children or grandchildren are left destitute and looted of everything he spent his life working towards? It could be from anything... medical bills with greatly excessive profit margins charged relative to the real costs to provide it, improper filing of legal paperwork, accusation of a crime and the civil asset forfeiture and/or associated court costs or lawsuits(even if he committed no crime), increased inheritance taxes on the upper middle class while the loopholes for the super rich are maintained, ect. In all of these possible scenarios, people who don't work for a living and are already rich get a cut of it.

He can probably hedge against such risks to a large degree.

I'm not confident that this is true, but I'm thinking less of myself and more for future generations. I'd like for my species not to go extinct, and if the "low road" is necessary to prevent such an event, than so be it.

Low road is an opportunity for those who dare and I hope that my kids could make the best use of it... or swallow a bullet should they run out of luck.
It is a more pallatable prospect than life in defunct socialist utopia organized by decadent global elites.
But I do not care about "humanity".
If humanity go extinct I will not be aware of it anyway, so why to bother?

I see a different path. Loot the aristocrats and remove them from power, and there exists the possibility that we can have a powerdown scenario where the poorest of humanity would still see an increase in material living standard, and the middle class won't experience nearly as much pain as they would otherwise. This will require collective action, not just to ensure the elimination of existing aristocracy, but to prevent the concentration of wealth/power that would allow a new one to take its place.

Looting aristocrats is always a good idea as long as you can grab the money, beautiful and well mannered princesses and all the power for yourself. :)
The best tactic here is to throw about 10-20% to the mob so they can fight for you and retain the rest. :)
Unfortunately 90+% of people are too stupid to hold to their fortune and any freshly acquired wealth would quickly be gone. Think Britney Spears in this conext - not fit to handle money without harming herself.
Clans concentrating more and more money and influence would form first (and any watchdogs you have created to stop it would be teathless to prevent it as connections in such clan would initially be rather loose).
Clans would corrupt society, disband watchdogs, cocentrate power by internal contracts, mergers and marriages and hey presto - you have aristocracy again.
Last edited by EnergyUnlimited on Sun 27 Oct 2019, 16:21:44, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
EnergyUnlimited
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 6577
Joined: Mon 15 May 2006, 03:00:00

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 16:20:38

Asg wrote:And YOUR problem is that you also aren't interested in mitigating peak oil or global warming. You have firmly placed leftism as the root of all evil.

Yes, SJW movement and feminism *is* evil and promotion of transsexuality in schools is a mental disease.
You are correct, I have no interest in mitigation (albeit I am now all by myself installing PV system on my property but I see it as a nice and interesting passtime and also free electricity will come as a bonus).
Now I will tell you why I have no interest in mitigation:
Because I do understand that it is far too late to mitigate mess we are in and I am resigned to the prospect of Mother Nature doing it for us one way or another.
Pictures won't be pretty, I know, but lets be it.

But if you feel compelled to put some lipstick on pig, why not?
Do you sincerely believe that mitigation can still change overall picture at current stage of affairs?
User avatar
EnergyUnlimited
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 6577
Joined: Mon 15 May 2006, 03:00:00

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby Newfie » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 18:15:24

ASG,

What is interesting is how much you sound like the Unabomber. He tried hard to explains to people what the issues were. His methods of getting attention sucked. But his message was right up your alley.
User avatar
Newfie
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 14964
Joined: Thu 15 Nov 2007, 04:00:00
Location: Between Canada and Carribean

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby The_Toecutter » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 20:31:04

Newfie wrote:ASG,

What is interesting is how much you sound like the Unabomber. He tried hard to explains to people what the issues were. His methods of getting attention sucked. But his message was right up your alley.


Indeed. This bit of overlap between what asg has said and what Mr. Kaczynski has said is one of the reasons I keep mentioning him so much around asg. I find the irony hilarious. Of course, there's also a lot of instances where asg's and the unabomber's writings are completely opposed to each other as well.

Here's his manifesto, which is even more relevant today than when it was written:

http://editions-hache.com/essais/pdf/kaczynski2.pdf

I remember having a debate with a school teacher back in high school. She refused to even read it because of what Kaczynski did, and assumed that his message, observations, or predictions are wrong just because he did evil deeds. But she never even read it. She was one of those overly sensitive, hyper-conformist, hyper politically-correct leftists that Kaczynski was critical of in said manifesto, which made the discussion all the more painful to continue, and thus it lasted all of a few minutes. She hadn't a clue what he stood for, and more importantly, what his motivations were for committing the evils that he did. Nor did she have any idea that as far as evil people go, Kaczynski was a very low rung on that ladder. In fact, he had a conscience and came to regret what he did, and not necessarily because of the punishment meted out by the state, unlike most of our mass-murdering "leaders" for whom acts of evil are a routine banality, or nothing personal and just "business" as they continue to live in opulence with nary a worry of ever being locked up for their crimes.

As much as I despise Hitler, he too had a lot of spot-on observations and predictions that have come to pass. He also understood that one of the root sources of his nation's problems were the dynastic families that had taken control of his country's finances(dynastic families which happened to be Talmudic Jews). He understood that the situations they caused with their policy decisions were one of the reasons he didn't get to enjoy life as a painter. This doesn't justify his vile deeds and him and I do not see eye to eye on much given he's one of those mass murdering psychopaths that I despise(a pinnacle example of one, in fact), but reading Mein Kampf was an eye opening perspective into what motivated him. Those leading the allies were not good guys in that war, but just another side to the same evil coin of powerful men vying for dominance and control over the world's people. As much as I hate to say it, Hitler may have been the lesser evil in that war, especially given the history of the U.S. that unfolded afterward with Operation Paperclip. It doesn't help things that Germany has literally banned its own history in the name of political correctness and under the guise of preventing another Hitler, in spite of the world being currently ruled by lots of mini-Hitlers that hide behind the cover of official paperwork and fighting "terrorism" while committing industrial-scale human rights violations under the color of law, just as Hitler did. In fact, many of Hitler's worst atrocities were perfectly in compliance with the laws of his country.
The unnecessary felling of a tree, perhaps the old growth of centuries, seems to me a crime little short of murder. ~Thomas Jefferson
User avatar
The_Toecutter
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2011
Joined: Sat 18 Jun 2005, 03:00:00

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 20:47:29

The_Toecutter wrote: the unabomber....

Here's his manifesto, which is even more relevant today than when it was written:

http://editions-hache.com/essais/pdf/kaczynski2.pdf

I remember having a debate with a school teacher back in high school. She refused to even read it because of what Kaczynski did, and assumed that his message, observations, or predictions are wrong just because he did evil deeds.


The unabomber was a cowardly psychopath who used mail bombs to maim and murder innocent people.

Its a shame that he used environmental rationalizations to excuse his vicious personal little terror campaign.

Cheers!
User avatar
Plantagenet
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 23750
Joined: Mon 09 Apr 2007, 03:00:00
Location: Alaska (its much bigger than Texas).

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby Newfie » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 21:13:58

That’s one way of looking at it. And it may be right. But neither of us really know. The question is can you separate his writings, his thoughts, from his actions?

Ghandi frequently slept nude with young relatives. Do you dismiss his writings?
User avatar
Newfie
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 14964
Joined: Thu 15 Nov 2007, 04:00:00
Location: Between Canada and Carribean

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby The_Toecutter » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 21:34:33

Ibon wrote:
In fact it will most likely prevent you from ever integrating enough in the system to try to extract some wealth for yourself which will be necessary if you want some independence.


This system is so corrupt that the more you integrate yourself into it, the harder it is to remove yourself from it. It's a trap.

Your wrapping up your identity as victim. And spending many many a long hour reinforcing this narrative. Time you could be spending rendering into Caesar what is Caesars and moving on.


It's probably for the best that I do NOT render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, because what this metaphorical Caesar rightfully deserves is not something that can be discussed in polite company or in public without risk of consequence. Nor am I of the sort to even try to render what is rightfully his, being that violence isn't my thing. I can find humor in violence though, being the fan of gallows humor that
I am. I once saw a T-shirt that quoted that biblical verse and had a picture of a .50 BMG. :)

Ask yourself when you wake up every morning what is more interesting, looking for gainful employment or coming on to po.com and writing a 2 hour screed over how fucked up every thing is. Where do you see your creativity flowing? Where is the juice?

If the juice and creativity is not looking for work, not trying to distance yourself from the system, not trying to build a little wealth to carve our a bit of independence, then your trapped. If the juice isn't there for this then you only have yourself to blame.


Before typing that screed, I did apply to more jobs. I may not have spent two hours applying to jobs, but I did do so first thing, as had been a habit for a very long time. Since I found a shitty low wage job last month and can keep my mom from losing her house with it while having a tiny bit left over for projects, the search for a job is not as pressing as it was, but it is not ended, either. There's no desire to be washing dishes into the next year, but facing the reality of the situation, it is quite possible that I could throw another 1,000+ hours to the job search over the next year and wind up with nothing, just as had happened in the last year. I've spent far more hours looking for work over the last 18 months than any other activity. There's something wrong with that picture, and it's not me, and I know this because I'm not alone with this problem. In fact, I'm better off than many of my peers right now, which is quite scary to me given that my situation isn't good.

If the juice and creativity is all about writing these long screeds on a forum then your stuck.


The juice is actually about building things to reduce my environmental footprint and negative externalities on the world, and have fun doing it, and possibly use it as a springboard to actually do something to fix what is fucked up about this world. But that takes scarce resources that I've never had enough of combined with the proper time available with which to pursue it. Part of the reason I never had these resources is being picked apart in every direction by those who already have more than me, being left with only a small portion of the value I generated(it was still more than most people would get, mind you). When I was making good money, I had no time nor was the money sufficient to bring my projects to me and get the workspace to pursue them, as I had student loans to get rid of. Had I not been patient, pursuing my passions could have really badly fucked me. Now that I have lots of time, I don't have any money, because I spent it to save my mom's house after other family members drained her finances for drug habits.

Understanding what is fucked up does not liberate you from the rigged system. It enslaves you more if your identity is thus wrapped up in it.


Understanding that it is fucked up is a prerequisite to liberating yourself from it, otherwise you could end up walking blindly into it even further, like the foreigners you mention.

There were times in my past I felt similar. What helped me break out was understanding that freedom comes from disengaging being in relationship with that which is dysfunctional. Be in it but not of it. Rise above.


That's precisely what I want to do. But that takes resources, and getting those resources more often than not in the modern U.S. requires permanently embedding oneself into it. The world is a giant global company store now, with no alternatives, other than to already be one of the owners. Most of the rest are serfs, including myself. Hence the source of my frustration.

Sometimes I think of those immigrants that come on our shores with not a penny in their pockets. They do not know anything about the injustices that are locally causing the system to be rigged. They start from scratch, singularly focused, saving every penny, living frugally, and slowly through the decades carve out a bit of independence. You can envy their freedom? Their ignorance. Their ignorance of the rigged system that allows them to singularly focus on building a bit of wealth while standing outside.


In the U.S., there's often more help for these immigrants than there is for the people born here. I do not think this is an accident or due to charitable reasons, as there are plenty of lobbyists in on this scheme. I have nothing against immigrants, mind you, as they are trying to survive just the same, but it does not help that U.S. policy, violence, and meddling often created the dire circumstances which necessitated they leave their homelands in the first place.

In fact, I lived in many ways much like you describe them to have. I not only started from scratch, but in the negative, was singularly focused on pursuing my dream of working with EVs, saved nearly every penny, lived frugally, and attempted to carve out a bit of independence over more than a decade of my life only for life circumstances completely outside of my control to rip it away from me, lest I leave my disabled mom in the gutter as she was looted of wealth faster than I could even build my own.

Your are way too deep inside. It's fucking with your head.....


It's worse than that. There are things more directly related to my life that are fucking with my head, and have been doing so, for decades, than just the knowledge of how I'm being fucked over. And it has grown tiring. There's not much I can do about them, and no medication or shrink can fix them, as they are circumstances external to me, imposed upon me, and not of my own doing. And I know others in the same or similar circumstances, and have had many talks with them and heard many depressing stories, most of their more depressing than my own. I'm not alone. In the U.S. alone there are tens of millions more very much like me, and around the world, HUNDREDS of millions. We're not insane, or necessarily violent, or on any kind of dark path chosen by our own actions. No, we're sick of being exploited and not at all thrilled at the prospect of being asked to accept that exploitation as a prerequisite for existence or as a stipulation for being allowed to function in society. I may not snap, but easily tens of thousands of such people will, and hundreds have.

Given what I have been through, the fact that I haven't snapped yet is a good indicator that I probably never will. A number of the people I know see me as a well-adjusted, mature, and collected person, even though one may not gather that from my writings or opinions, and these people I know who see me as well adjusted often ask me for life advice! I often tell them it's worth what they paid for it, and that I could be wrong, before I give my two cents.

Many of my peers that I know are drowning in debt with no way out, just for daring to attempt to better themselves, and not for useless trinkets and frivolities that they see everyone else getting with ease. I'm the one who got OUT of debt, which for those not born with a silver spoon up their ass in this society, is quite rare. Those within my family wed to BAU often think there is something wrong with me for refusing to go back into that debt trap after spending a large chunk of my life clawing my way out of it, and even though they have a nice house in the suburbs and a new car, they own NONE of it and on a net basis, I'm wealthier than they are at half their age, even though my assets are quite meager.

I could have gotten every bit as far in life as I am now or even been better off, by not even trying to do something with myself, and instead plugging myself up to some videogames or books or other distractions all day/night and not doing anything with myself at all. THAT is a problem, don't you think?

And this realization is one of the reasons I thought nothing of spending a Sunday morning typing up a long screed on this website, even though I did spend a little bit of time looking for a different job before I did so.

My life isn't hopeless though. With this job I have, crappy and low paying it may be, I can finish and then test one of my projects. I'll have the most efficient electric vehicle probably within a few hundred mile radius, and will be able to use it regularly on the roads in traffic. Because my mom's house was bought in the 1990s, the mortgage is far, far less expensive than a neglected rat/roach-infested efficiency apartment in the ghetto would cost to rent these days. This, combined with being debt free, allows me to have a surplus off of these meagre wages. I had co-workers making $60k/yr when I had that engineering job, who lived paycheck to paycheck, because they had modest homes in the suburbs, low-end cars purchased new, were still paying down student loan debt, and had started families. With the income I now have, if I didn't save my mom's house, I wouldn't even be able to afford rent on a shithole to stay off the street, but instead, I have a disposable income greater than that of most people, even if it still isn't a whole lot when compared to what hard assets like land, vehicles, and investments actually cost(which with what I'm currently able to save at the rate I am, would take most of a lifetime to afford without taking on debt for them).

Once I do find an engineering job, saving up for a chunk of land will come quickly. I've been living a minimalist life the entire time I've worked. I may yet get some kind of payoff for my work, but I'll at best be in my early 40s before I realize it, if it ever happens at all. Most of those in my age group are trapped for good at this point, no matter what they do, and THIS is why I advocate revolt, as it's not right.
The unnecessary felling of a tree, perhaps the old growth of centuries, seems to me a crime little short of murder. ~Thomas Jefferson
User avatar
The_Toecutter
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2011
Joined: Sat 18 Jun 2005, 03:00:00

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby The_Toecutter » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 21:38:22

Plantagenet wrote:
The unabomber was a cowardly psychopath who used mail bombs to maim and murder innocent people.

Its a shame that he used environmental rationalizations to excuse his vicious personal little terror campaign.

Cheers!


Newfie covered it. This is true, but it does not dismiss the validity of his views or opinions, only undermines them to those who use the fact that he committed evil deeds as an excuse not to listen to WHY he committed them, regardless of whether there is any rational justification or not for his actions.
The unnecessary felling of a tree, perhaps the old growth of centuries, seems to me a crime little short of murder. ~Thomas Jefferson
User avatar
The_Toecutter
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2011
Joined: Sat 18 Jun 2005, 03:00:00

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby The_Toecutter » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 21:57:27

Plantagenet wrote:Every religious and political and social and economic and scientific movement are done for the self-interest of the people promoting them.


Nikola Tesla proves this incorrect. There are others. There are plenty of scientists and engineers that design or invent things for reasons other than money or self interest.

There is no perfect society.

There is no political ideology that has all the answers.


Correct. This is all the more reason why power needs to be distributed as much as possible, and not concentrated.

Rather then perfection, the best we can hope for is an "open society," where people are free enough to pursue their own interests. And the closest we come to that is in our western style mixed economies existing today in the US, Canada, western Europe, etc.


The societies that have come closest to this ideal are very far off the mark. Humanity has yet to evolve out of the dark ages when it comes to social development and hierarchy. In fact, the small villages and tribes of the paleolithic period were more greatly advanced regarding this one issue. There is no reason industrial society can't reclaim this advancement and get out of this relative dark age, although that may not happen until/after industrial society collapses, if humanity even survives such a collapse.


Actually, you are describing the left wing version being taken by China.


China's communist party embraced neoliberal capitalism long ago. It did not, however, embrace neoliberal style fake "democracy", but has retained its naked authoritarianism. The U.S. is adopting China's authoritarianism piece by piece as we speak. The two countries have become more alike than they are different, and the living standards of each nation are also becoming less disparate as the rich take all the gains.

The poorest of humanity are already seeing immense increases in their material living standards under the current globalist system.


At the expense of the way of life they used to have and of any self sufficiency or environment they once had, and often against their will. They now have to work 2-3x as many hours to have a base level of survival, whether they want the perks or not.

But thats not a good thing.....Adding billions of people to the global consumerist culture has just jacked up our global CO2 emissions to the point that global warming is literally burning up the forests of the world.


The impact of someone within the bottom 50% of humanity is still a drop in the bucket compared to someone within the upper 10%, or even the upper 1%. If reducing emissions is the goal, it makes sense to target those outputting the most first, does it not?

The problem we face isn't improving †he lot of the world's poor....it's REDUCING the CO2, SP6, CH4, NO2 and other greenhouse gas emissions that are inevitably produced as societies grow wealthier.


Cheers!


The problem is also technical. We can find ways to reduce CO2 output without going back to the middle ages, AS WELL AS having the richest cut back on consumption.
The unnecessary felling of a tree, perhaps the old growth of centuries, seems to me a crime little short of murder. ~Thomas Jefferson
User avatar
The_Toecutter
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2011
Joined: Sat 18 Jun 2005, 03:00:00

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby Ibon » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 22:27:21

Toecutter, the 20 odd years I was harnessed to the world of commerce I suffered frequent depression that was only relieved while planning my exit strategy. The mediocrity of social engagement when everything is transactional as in business can be spiritually suffocating. Patience and you can rise above. It takes time.

One thing during those years I did not focus on the dysfunction of the system as somehow oppressing me. I had to be in it with enough authenticity that all the players with whom I associated with believed that I was ideologically in the game with them. I wasn't but I did not let that show. Chameleon strategy rather than reactive strategy.

You sound very logical and your explanations are thoughtful but I read between the lines and I can sense you are reactive to the oppressors. This does subliminally show when you are out there in the world at interviews etc. You have to shut that down completely, not snuff it out, but not let it show.....

chamaleon strategy
Patiently awaiting the pathogens. Our resiliency resembles an invasive weed. We are the Kudzu Ape
blog: http://blog.mounttotumas.com/
website: http://www.mounttotumas.com
User avatar
Ibon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 8785
Joined: Fri 03 Dec 2004, 04:00:00
Location: Volcan, Panama

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby asg70 » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 23:02:36

Newfie wrote:What is interesting is how much you sound like the Unabomber.


I don't see the connection at all. I am anti-violence and I think Toecutter (hopefully his choice of username/avatar was meant to be tongue in cheek) is on a slippery slope to a bad end. I mean, how many times do we have to endure stories of nutcases going postal where there were warning signs, all of which ignored? None of us are in a position to intervene since we're all anonymous posters on a forum but I'm damn well not going to throw fuel on the fire of Toecutter's various raging manifestos which are mostly fueled by his own self-pity and desire for recognition.

Image
(hmm, that theme sounds eerily relevant. He also lives his ailing mom, right?)

The_Toecutter wrote:As much as I despise Hitler, he too had a lot of spot-on observations


There you go, man. Citing Hitler is JUST the way to prove to us that you're not a dangerous extremist.

Well, I don't expect peakoil.com to be a haven for the well-adjusted, so I guess par for the course.

Plantagenet wrote:The unabomber was a cowardly psychopath who used mail bombs to maim and murder innocent people.


Thumbs up. It's a rare day when I find myself in agreement with Plant.

The_Toecutter wrote:Given what I have been through, the fact that I haven't snapped yet is a good indicator that I probably never will.


I think you will. You want to spite me? Prove me wrong.

The_Toecutter wrote:Once I do find an engineering job


That's still in the cards, is it? One thing you do more than others is write long revealing paragraphs about your current situation, and then you attempt to suggest that this is representative of a vast oppressed underclass that demands redress. Believe me, this is not the mindset that leads to pulling yourself up by your bootstraps. But again, prove me wrong.

---

BTW, Toecutter, I hate sounding patronizing, but I keep sensing this learned-helplessness. It goes along the lines of, why try because the deck is stacked against me? I've dealt with that sort of pessimism with my daughter. She didn't blame "the man" but she blamed herself. Just a lack of self-confidence. She struggled in some topics and I tried to instill in her the idea that whatever she lacked in natural aptitude she could make up for in work-ethic and determination. She wound up getting on honor roll a few times and graduating with a better GPA than I did as a result. Take personal responsibility for your life rather than looking for excuses to fail and play the virtuous martyr or symbol of the oppressed.

BOLD PREDICTIONS
-Billions are on the verge of starvation as the lockdown continues. (yoshua, 5/20/20)

HALL OF SHAME:
-Short welched on a bet and should be shunned.
-Frequent-flyers should not cry crocodile-tears over climate-change.
asg70
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 4066
Joined: Sun 05 Feb 2017, 14:17:28

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby Plantagenet » Mon 28 Oct 2019, 00:22:04

The_Toecutter wrote:Nikola Tesla .... invent things for reasons other than money or self interest.


Don't be silly. Tesla invented things and then patented and marketed his inventions in order to earn money much as Edison did. His ideas and inventions were brilliant and Tesla became quite wealthy, although he lost his money in his old age and died in poverty and obscurity.

The_Toecutter wrote: In fact, the small villages and tribes of the paleolithic period were more greatly advanced regarding this one issue.


The paleolithic age ended thousands of years ago. No one today really knows exactly how neolithic tribes and villages were organized. Chances are there was a great deal of variation in the way neolithic societies operated, so it is meaningless to make broad generalizations about them. You are engaging in fantasy when you claim neolithic villages and tribes were "advanced", since in actuality, neither you nor anyone else actually knows specifically how they operated.

The_Toecutter wrote:
The impact of someone within the bottom 50% of humanity is still a drop in the bucket compared to someone within the upper 10%, or even the upper 1%. If reducing emissions is the goal, it makes sense to target those outputting the most first, does it not?


Right now reducing CO2 emissions is a fantasy. There have never been reductions in global Greenhouse gas emissions in spite of all the rhetoric about reducing emissions and 30 years of effort by the UN and other agencies.

Before we can reduce global emissions, we have to stabilize global emissions, i.e. prevent them from going ever higher.

And, if you look at the pattern of increasing CO2 emissions around the world you'll see that the bulk of the increase in global CO2 emissions over the last 20 years has come from China, where hundreds of millions of poor people have moved into the middle class. Now the same thing is happening in India and in Africa and other formerly "poor" countries. Emissions are pretty much stabilized in the US and other developed countries. Essentially all the CO2 emission increases are coming from poor countries.

Cheers!
User avatar
Plantagenet
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 23750
Joined: Mon 09 Apr 2007, 03:00:00
Location: Alaska (its much bigger than Texas).

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby The_Toecutter » Mon 28 Oct 2019, 00:59:50

asg70 wrote:I know it comforts you to think that, but it's not really true.


Why not? Both stand for the continuation of the existing and unsustainable paradigm we are living under. They're both right-wing fascists more concerned with increasing their own money/power than with being actual leaders. They're both compulsive liars. They're both tyrants seeking more control over the lives of everyone else, for their own personal gain. They're both ass-branded company spokespeople beholden to Wall street, K-Street, and the Pentagon. They both serve the dynastic banking families manipulating the U.S. economy and who have captured the political process. They both have sordid histories and connections with Russian oligarchs and various corrupt dealings with the fossil fuel, nuclear, and defense industries. Both were hated by a majority of Americans, and by voting for one candidate instead of the other, people weren't necessarily voting for the candidate they picked, but against the other candidate.

Neither candidate came close to representing the views of the American people, and it shows, because once again, the largest plurality of potential voters was casting no vote at all.

Here are some of the ways they are different though:

-Before the election, Trump had never committed mass murder as Hillary had helped arrange for Libya as Secretary of State
-Whereas Hillary openly admitted she wanted to wage more wars, Trump has been the first president since Jimmy Carter not to start a new war this far into his term, in spite of all the threats, showmanship, and strutting
-Trump is much less intelligent or careful than Hillary, even if he may be every bit as cunning and manipulative
-Hillary actually won the popular vote, and Trump didn't

Assange had something to say on the subject:

“Well, you’re asking me, do I prefer cholera or gonorrhea,”

“We know how politics works in the United States. Whoever – whatever political party gets into government is going to merge with the bureaucracy pretty damn fast. It will be in a position where it has some levers in its hand. And so, as a result, corporate lobbyists will move in to help control those levers. So it doesn’t make much difference in the end.”

When it comes to issues like peak oil and climate change, I fail to see how either candidate would make much of a difference. Trump may be more beholden to the fossil fuel cartel than Hillary, but Hillary's proposals were not radical enough to make a dent in the overall outcome either, and given her history, her sincerity is very much in question anyway. She is no Jimmy Carter even, and we need today someone willing to be far more radical than the right-leaning centrist and CFR lackey that Jimmy Carter was.


But what happens AFTER the uprising?


Good question. The chaos an uprising creates can go in all kinds of directions, good and bad. The pro is their unpredictability and randomness.

The treatment is worse than the disease.


Not always. The U.S. after the revolt against Britain is sort of a success story, but not the only one. Sometimes the uprising isn't at all violent and is a model success story, such as modern Iceland:

https://thefreethoughtproject.com/icelands-banksters-sentenced-74-years-prison-prosecution-u-s/

But Iceland actually has a half-assed functioning legal system that hasn't been as thoroughly corrupted as the too-big-to-fail U.S. has, so that left this option available to them.


The problems of this world are far deeper than your fixation on class-warfare, Toecutter.


Maybe so, but class warfare is a component of and intertwined with each and every one of those problems, and they are probably not solvable without also addressing the grotesque level of social stratification that exists. Privatized profits and socialized externalities is a way of life in most of the world now. Even Warren Buffet readily admits that there is a class war underway, and that his class is the one winning.

Sure, there's the rich and powerful, but then there's everyone else who ASPIRE to be rich and powerful.


Not everyone aspires to be rich and powerful. Once basic needs are met with a little left over to build up some stability and enjoy life, it isn't that hard for one to find happiness. Most people will never even get the chance to have this modest amount of wealth, precisely because of the rich and powerful hogging the world for themselves and keeping this unattainable for the majority of humanity, which in turn, helps perpetuate the desire to be rich and powerful and to consume.

Guess what the rich and powerful do. They consume. And the planet suffers as a result.


...and that is precisely the reason for my screeds. This is exactly what I've been saying. And this consumption is at the very heart of the problem of resource depletion.

The more Toecutter relates his story the more I see someone who is seething with anger not due to the world not meeting the challenge of peak oil or global warming, but simply due to envy.


You're falling into the fallacy of mistaking my disgust for envy. I don't want what the rich have. I do want enough to create, and I do want to be able to earn without being fed off of by the already rich, because thus far, everything involuntarily extracted from me as a consequence of me working to try to support myself, would have been more than enough to fulfill my goals.

My ecological footprint is extremely low for an American. I have no desire to increase it. If by some miracle I ended up with a large windfall of money, I wouldn't use it to consume. I'd use it to further reduce any need to consume, as I have been doing steadily, even if I may not have gotten me to my personal goals.

I read shit like this and I can't help but turn back to Ibon's many diatribes about the Overshoot predator. This whole then vs. now bullshit is ignorant of the larger tableau of history. Sure, in many respects the US is post-peak prosperity in terms of wage-gaps, cost of healthcare, real-estate, and higher education. But compare that to, let's say, the 1800s prior to germ theory, with no child labor laws, robber barons, and multiple bubbles poppes with bank-runs where people lost all their saving (no FDIC), or having to survive through the multiple world-wars of the 20th century. The 3rd world is still clamoring to skip over the border to the US to the point where immigration is a chronic political hot-poato and you still want to portray the US as such a terrible place? Worse than it used to be a few decades ago, yes, terrible, no. What you see as raison d'être to start a revolution seems to come from more of an entitlement-mentality.

The problems that are brewing are not related to class-warfare. They're existential. Ya know, that whole overshoot and die off thing. Malthus, ya know?


I feel entitled to the right to exist without being exploited every step of the way. And tat right shouldn’t just be for myself, but for everyone. That's not the same as feeling entitled to a 20th century middle class existence. I only mentioned such a middle class existence earlier back to illustrate what the median American has lost WHILE the overall per capita resource footprint has only increased. Something is rotten about that. All of this over-consumption and waste is increasingly not benefiting the average person.

The Overshoot predator is waiting, but it hasn't struck yet, even though it looked like 2008 was it at the time. We're awash in more resources than ever, but the gains have not been distributed equitably and it has not made the majority of the population better off anywhere near in proportion to the wealth it has provided. It also won't last. Overshoot is not just an issue of population. The Earth could likely sustain double or more the current population if they were all at the living standard of a sub-Saharan African living a bare subsistence lifestyle, not that this would be desirable.

The lifeboat ethics we have to deal with are twisted and warped, and are not exclusively the result of nature, but of man-made problems stemming from the greed of a few.

Imagine a lifeboat with seats for 100. We only have 80 people on a sinking ship that need to board it, but 1 person insists on using half the lifeboat to save all of the most valuable things taken off of the ship so they can keep them, and another 7 insist on using the rest of the lifeboat to do the same AND by doing so have exceeded its weight capacity anyway. The rest of the 72 people that don’t get to board it are expected to just drown and tolerate it and chided as being in the wrong if they get violent over it, as the lifeboat slowly sinks anyway. THAT is the actual situation we find ourselves contemplating as we stare at the present and the future. Class warfare is inseparable from this dilemma, and if we had rational and/or real leadership, the solution would be obvious.

The immigrants often come to the U.S. as a consequence of their countries having been brought to ruin by U.S. meddling. In the case of South and Central America, the war on drugs has been the major driving factor behind the turmoil generated when taken in the context of the U.S. backed coups that have deprived these people of self determination and a national identity of their own. In the case of Mexico, more Mexicans are leaving the U.S. back to their home country than are entering here, just to give you an idea of the level of desperation and deterioration already present here.

The U.S. is far from the worst place to live, but being less terrible than most does not make a thing good. As far as impact on the world and number of innocent people killed, it is undeniable that the U.S. is among the worst butchers in history, and that includes WWII-era Germany, Stalinist Russia, and Mao’s China.

Having run out of other nations to conquer, the U.S. has turned its sights inward at conquering its own people in every aspect of their existence, for profit.

Suffice to say, you know where I place most of the blame on the country becoming corrupt? THE AMERICAN VOTER!!!!! Reagan sold the right on the myth of trickle-down economics and it has now permanently embedded itself in the skulls of anyone sitting under a red pixel in the US demographic map. They continue to vote against their best interests again and again. The country wasn't stolen. It was GIVEN AWAY because the american voter is DUMP AS ROCKS, which is why we have dummy presidents like GW and Trump labelled "populist". They're populist because the american voter is, pound for pound, stupid to the point of being incapable of running a functional democracy (OK, democratic republic). No conspiracies needed.


Not all Americans were stupid in this sense. In fact, the majority of eligible voters did not even vote for Reagan, only a plurality. Americans did not overwhelmingly reject Carter’s admittedly modest proposals, either, as another forum member pointed out in the previous part of this topic. And those who were succored in by Reagan were manipulated and convinced their country wouldn’t be taken from them. Being scammed out of something is not the same as giving it away.

A conspiracy may not be needed to explain this, but it doesn't mean it wasn't present, either. In fact, conspiracies are a fact of life in politics, at every level. Those hostages that were kept by Iran? Bush Sr. played a role in their captors holding them. What impact do you think that may have had on the 1980 election?

https://consortiumnews.com/2014/04/09/reagan-bush-ties-to-iran-hostage-crisis/

If you can't accept the necessity of having to live with less and are still feeling entitled to your piece of classic 20th century prosperity I'd say you are ultimately fighting a losing battle.


I’ve been living with less. Whatever consumption I do is out of necessity, and not out of frivolity. I’d like to reduce that further but I am not in a position to do so at this time, as there are initial expense and initial consumption of large ticket items that I currently cannot afford to result in a reduction that will take a period of years to be realized when accounting for the embodied energy of the items to be bought.

That's just it. NOBODY is going to accept a powerdown, period, not even you.


Compared to the average J6P, I already have. I don’t eat meat with most meals and subsist mainly on fresh produce, sourced locally when possible. I drive extremely rarely, using a velomobile I built for more than 99% of my transportation. When I was living on my own, I split a small apartment with 2 other roommates, with less than 700 sq ft between the three of us, and the electricity we purchased was produced with renewable energy with the bill kept low. I don’t even shower everyday, but only as needed. I don’t buy hardly anything that falls outside of a basic need other than parts/tools for my projects where money permits. The amount of trash I would generate in an entire month would fill one small grocery bag. I did without central heating and air conditioning to save money, but had the residence I was living in been built to be comfortable without those things, it wouldn’t have been a major sacrifice.

It’s really not that hard.

How many times have I called you out that you're in the anger stage of grief???

Doom is a dilemma, not a fixable problem.


Doom is highly probable, but not inevitable. The future is unknown. 2008 taught me that.

The dilemma stems from who should do the sacrificing, who should be kicked off the lifeboat. Today, there’s still enough room, regardless of whether or not that will hold true tomorrow, but a selfish few insist on using the lifeboat instead to preserve their toys, trinkets, and things stolen from the sinking Earth ship, which will possibly condemn other fellow humans to death, certainly more than would be the consequence directly imposed by nature alone.

You say I’m in the anger stage, but I’ve long ago accepted that oil will peak, before I ever was on this board, that the peak was indeed inevitable. Light sweet crude production peaked in 2005. Unconventional production of oil extended the overall peak outwards to whatever date it ends up being. That is acceptance.

You haven't articulated a way for us to get through the population bottleneck. All you've done is rattle of a list of class-based grievances. That's it. You're devoid of ideas other than busting shit up in an orgy of violence ala Joker.


That’s not true. For many years on these forums I’ve explained that we can be using renewables, electric vehicles, mass transit, dietary changes, home improvements, cultural changes and reductions in consumption of goods all to reduce ecological footprint, oil consumption, and resource consumption. Whether or not you think these ideas are workable or realistic doesn’t change the fact that they are ideas none the less, or that they may make an impact if tried.

Nor have I advocated the idea that an orgy of violence is the only way, even if it may become necessary at some point in the future if it doesn’t become the direct consequence of failed policy.

So how long before you start blowing up cell phone towers ala Derrick Jensen?


Derrick Jensen had a very apt quote regarding this:

”A very poor kid came up to me after a talk and said 'I want to go blow up a factory.' I asked how old he was and he said 17. I said 'have you ever had sex?' He said 'no.' I said 'just remember if you get caught you aren't going to have sex for twenty years at least.' That's not saying that one person having sex is worth the salmon. I'm not saying it's a reason not to act, I'm saying don't be stupid.

Being stupid is not on my list of things to do. You’re the only one here who keeps talking about the prospect of going postal or anything similar, almost as if that’s what you’re wanting. Perhaps that would validate you?

I know extremism when I read it and


Do you really? Your own writings have their own extremist tendencies, and you seem to be blind to them.

I'm not going to validate you as you keep sliding towards some tragic ending.


I’m not seeking your validation. This website, judging by the responses I received here, given that they seem genuine and honest opinions regardless of their status of right or wrong, is not a place I would come to for validation. I won’t find it here, and that is not why I post here.

As for some kind of tragic ending, it wouldn’t be much of a change from the way my life has been anyway, not that I am seeking that kind of ending. Color me surprised that you seemed to show any concern at all.

Look, few if any here are happy with the status quo. What we dislike about it and what we'd like to see happen are gonna be different. But what I don't want to see is the few posters of this site to devolve to the point where we're openly rallying and brainstorming towards any lawbreaking activity. That's where I draw the line.


There is no law and order. The elites act unrestrained. Julian Assange and his treatment is a canary in the coal mine for the status of law and order in the Western world.

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2019/10/assange-in-court/

The lack of proper legal procedure and the dereliction of duty of those within the UK’s justice system is par for the course in the U.S. as well. In fact, the U.S. is now proven to be the driving force behind the series of events, when those who correctly stated such were once accused of being “conspiracy theorists” for claiming he’d be extradited to the U.S. if he stepped foot outside the embassy and that the rape allegations were false and had no backing and were only being used as a pretext.

I have a friend that is being targeted for prosecution/persecution as we speak, not to the level that Assange is, but I know for a fact that this friend didn’t commit the assault he is accused of since we were working on an aluminum body for a custom 3-wheeled electric vehicle we designed at the time the “victim” claims he assaulted her. He has had an ankle monitor for over a year now after being locked up for more than a month and needing to spend tens of thousands of dollars on bonds+lawyers to get out, AND he has proof exonerating himself that the court just isn’t interested in pursuing without him coughing up endless money he doesn’t have, all because some angry rich old Jew bitch wants to take the inheritance his deceased father left him because she is jealous she wasn’t left any of it. We already know there is no x-rays or medical records of the “injury”. We already know this bitch stole a suitcase full of money his father on his death bed told her to give to him, and then donated it to the very police department who arrested him, before starting her accusations. As events similar to this continue to happen to more and more people innocent of any wrongdoing, the faith in the justice system and in America’s governing institutions will continue to deteriorate, and with perfectly valid reason. I’m sure there’s millions of other people who were or are in similar circumstances.

If you don’t want crazed maniacs running around posing a threat to your safety, then you should be advocating for the restoration of law and order, which would mean many corrupt people in high places being hauled away. Unfortunately for us little people, the law enforcement apparatus exists not to protect us from crazed maniacs in the street, but to protect the policy makers from prosecution and to further enable their graft, to shake down people for money for “crimes” that have no direct victim, and to protect the haves from the have nots. Try living in the hood sometime. The crazed maniacs run wild and free already, and the police will generally not have any interest in protecting you from them, as they’re too busy looking to fine someone doing 1 mph over the speed limit, incarcerate some college kids for using recreational drugs, or lock up some single mother stealing infant formula because she won’t have her next check until the first of the month.
The unnecessary felling of a tree, perhaps the old growth of centuries, seems to me a crime little short of murder. ~Thomas Jefferson
User avatar
The_Toecutter
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2011
Joined: Sat 18 Jun 2005, 03:00:00

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby Newfie » Mon 28 Oct 2019, 06:59:08

ASG,

There is no doubt that the unabomber murdered and maimed. However he had some very good insights, some of yours approach his.

What you are tripping over is the difference between being able to analyze and accept someone thoughts and approving of their actions. When you do this you shut off a great deal of available intellect.

But if that is your criteria then you must adore Trump because he has been the least milaterist president since Carter. He is the first in a long while to not open new fronts and expand existing wars. His intellect, his ability to articulate, is severely damaged. But his actions match your desires.

And also this is the problem with Greta. Which isn’t fair to say because it’s really a problem in Gretas world and she is part of her world. Greta et al are attempting to MANIPULATE the masses to obtain the desired result. That just leads to propaganda wars which eventually lead to real bloodshed, perhaps massive.

The better route is to educate folks, to convince them to bring them over to your side because it is right. That seems increasingly difficult to do because the media, mass and social alike, feed off hair trigger social reactions, there is no time for reflection and contemplation. No time for learning.

I am dubious that the learning approach will work, it has a chance. It does not need to be all the people just the elites, then they can control the masses. I am however certain that there is zero chance in having the masses resolve these issues. The intellect may be there, although that seems to be waning with each new generation, the emotional stability and education is surely not there.
User avatar
Newfie
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 14964
Joined: Thu 15 Nov 2007, 04:00:00
Location: Between Canada and Carribean

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby mousepad » Mon 28 Oct 2019, 08:20:39

The_Toecutter wrote:Not everyone aspires to be rich and powerful.


Show me the one guy who doesn't take more if given the chance.
Show me the one guy who forgoes a pay rise.
mousepad
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 243
Joined: Thu 26 Sep 2019, 09:07:56

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby Ibon » Mon 28 Oct 2019, 09:01:35

mousepad wrote:
The_Toecutter wrote:Not everyone aspires to be rich and powerful.


Show me the one guy who doesn't take more if given the chance.
Show me the one guy who forgoes a pay rise.


I see this sometimes here in Panama. With high unemployment you assume when you offer someone a job and even pay them above the average wage that in this way you insure their loyalty and that they wont quit on you.

I have been surprised several times of workers who were very happy working here, did not have any conflicts, and just up and decided to quit working. They have no problem just walking with just a few dollars in their pocket and no prospects for easily finding another job.

I saw this also in Thailand and the Philippines. This is usually rural agrarian workers or construction workers who have been habituated to taking short term jobs and are comfortable with long breaks between. When given the chance of a more permanent employment they don't value it as they prefer the rhythm and freedom of just sporadic work and then extended time with family and friends and hanging around doing nothing.

It's a work ethic foreign to western countries but it is more common than you think. I marvel at this and at times get frustrated at the lack of ambition and then the next minute I find myself respecting their life choices.
Patiently awaiting the pathogens. Our resiliency resembles an invasive weed. We are the Kudzu Ape
blog: http://blog.mounttotumas.com/
website: http://www.mounttotumas.com
User avatar
Ibon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 8785
Joined: Fri 03 Dec 2004, 04:00:00
Location: Volcan, Panama

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby mousepad » Mon 28 Oct 2019, 09:15:54

Ibon wrote:
mousepad wrote:
The_Toecutter wrote:Not everyone aspires to be rich and powerful.


Show me the one guy who doesn't take more if given the chance.
Show me the one guy who forgoes a pay rise.


When given the chance of a more permanent employment they don't value it as they prefer the rhythm and freedom of just sporadic work and then extended time with family and friends and hanging around doing nothing.


That is not exactly what we're talking about here.
If the guy was offered MORE money for his job while still being able to keep his rhythm as he pleases, would he forgo the additional coins?
I don't think so.
mousepad
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 243
Joined: Thu 26 Sep 2019, 09:07:56

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby Ibon » Mon 28 Oct 2019, 09:20:29

mousepad wrote:
Ibon wrote:
mousepad wrote:
The_Toecutter wrote:Not everyone aspires to be rich and powerful.


Show me the one guy who doesn't take more if given the chance.
Show me the one guy who forgoes a pay rise.


When given the chance of a more permanent employment they don't value it as they prefer the rhythm and freedom of just sporadic work and then extended time with family and friends and hanging around doing nothing.


That is not exactly what we're talking about here.
If the guy was offered MORE money for his job while still being able to keep his rhythm as he pleases, would he forgo the additional coins?
I don't think so.


Of course not. He would take that money and increase the down time with his friends and family!

It is a bit related though. Given the chance to build wealth they decide to decline.

Of course the reason is they choose not to have the harness on permanently in the first place.

This doesn't dispute what you are saying it just adds some perspective on how some folks operate.
Patiently awaiting the pathogens. Our resiliency resembles an invasive weed. We are the Kudzu Ape
blog: http://blog.mounttotumas.com/
website: http://www.mounttotumas.com
User avatar
Ibon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 8785
Joined: Fri 03 Dec 2004, 04:00:00
Location: Volcan, Panama

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Mon 28 Oct 2019, 10:09:58

The_Toecutter wrote:My life isn't hopeless though. With this job I have, crappy and low paying it may be, I can finish and then test one of my projects. I'll have the most efficient electric vehicle probably within a few hundred mile radius, and will be able to use it regularly on the roads in traffic. Because my mom's house was bought in the 1990s, the mortgage is far, far less expensive than a neglected rat/roach-infested efficiency apartment in the ghetto would cost to rent these days. This, combined with being debt free, allows me to have a surplus off of these meagre wages. I had co-workers making $60k/yr when I had that engineering job, who lived paycheck to paycheck, because they had modest homes in the suburbs, low-end cars purchased new, were still paying down student loan debt, and had started families. With the income I now have, if I didn't save my mom's house, I wouldn't even be able to afford rent on a shithole to stay off the street, but instead, I have a disposable income greater than that of most people, even if it still isn't a whole lot when compared to what hard assets like land, vehicles, and investments actually cost(which with what I'm currently able to save at the rate I am, would take most of a lifetime to afford without taking on debt for them).

So I do not understand, what are you complaining about.
You have place to live with your mum but still, you have a decent job which allows you to help her paying mortgage (and this mortgage will soon be repaid beause it is taken long time ago).
You will be able to live there as long as you wish (and within few decades you will even have a deeds titles to this property after your mum have died).
All what you need to do is chasing away your derelict family members. Use police department, rotweilers or a gun as you please because debauched family is nothing you need to care about.
On the top of it your job is paying you enough to run on hobby basis construction of a decent range EV.
These are expensive projects, if only due to high Li/FePO4 battery costs.
And yet on the top of all of that you have plenty of disposable income, more than most of peoples do, as you say yourself.
You are debt free and you have savings.
So what is all that whinning about?
You are a well off person and yet malcontent for some reason which I miss.
Go somewhere to Cambodia or Bangladesh and work for a day to get a bowl of rice, then you will see, how really poor people are living and how real exploitation might look like.
All what you write sounds like "I don't have my private island and a private jet and others do, so world is injust and I am exploited".
You should pull up your socks, man up and stop whinning.
And if you want to loot aristocracy, build a plan, organize fellow men who dare and make a shot at it.
Here I agree with you - we have too much useless and decadent aristocracy at least on the West and society would be better off without it.
Not that all billionaires are bad btw. It just have happened that some of them got selfindulged and useless and others have distorted legal system to make a farse of it and created industrial or banking monopolies destructive to economy enough to justify forceful disbanding.
Those specific groups of billionaires are now parasites and I am all for looting them at first opportunity.
Last edited by EnergyUnlimited on Mon 28 Oct 2019, 11:01:12, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
EnergyUnlimited
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 6577
Joined: Mon 15 May 2006, 03:00:00

Re: Greta Thunberg's Voyage Pt. 2

Unread postby Newfie » Mon 28 Oct 2019, 10:43:30

mousepad wrote:
The_Toecutter wrote:Not everyone aspires to be rich and powerful.


Show me the one guy who doesn't take more if given the chance.
Show me the one guy who forgoes a pay rise.


Hello!

This may be a bit tangential to your point but it’s quite frequent that folks won’t take a promotion because they don’t want the additional responsibility.

I have intentionally moved from full time to part time work. Which meant a decrease in pay. And I moved from a managerial position to more of an in-house consultant because I was phasing myself out, moving to retirement.

But I don’t quite get the point you are trying to make about a worker refusing a raise? Expand please.
User avatar
Newfie
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 14964
Joined: Thu 15 Nov 2007, 04:00:00
Location: Between Canada and Carribean

PreviousNext

Return to Environment, Weather & Climate

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests