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THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby onlooker » Mon 08 Apr 2019, 15:10:48

Cog, Republicans have had periods since WWII, whereby they had control of the Presidency and both houses of Congress. So, why didn't they reform Immigration laws to stop this flooding of immigrants? Simple, because the powerful business lobby ie. Chambers of Commerce like things the way they are, as they get to exploit these illegals wantonly. Like all the issues and problems in the US for the average person, follow the money that is what dictates the policies.
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Cog » Mon 08 Apr 2019, 15:16:44

Oh I get that completely onlooker. Both parties have motivations never to stop illegals. How many is enough? 10 million, 50 million, 100 million. Pick a number you want here. They will destroy the Usa and you and others desire it to happen.
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Newfie » Tue 23 Apr 2019, 08:53:14

This will be interesting.

The U.S. Supreme Court is set to hear oral arguments Tuesday in a legal battle with lasting implications that could dramatically affect political representation and federal funding over the next decade. The justices are weighing whether to allow the Trump administration to add a question about U.S. citizenship status to forms for the upcoming 2020 census.

In multiple lawsuits brought by dozens of states, cities and other groups, three federal judges at U.S. district courts have issued rulings blocking the administration's plans for the question. It asks, "Is this person a citizen of the United States?"

All three judges — in New York, California and Maryland — ruled that Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross' decision to include the question violated procedures for adding new census questions under administrative law. The judges in California and Maryland have also ruled that adding the question is unconstitutional because it hurts the government's ability to carry out the constitutional mandate for a once-a-decade head count of every person living in the U.S.


https://www.npr.org/2019/04/23/70521078 ... ip-questio
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Tue 23 Apr 2019, 16:45:28

It's an interesting question. Prior rulings have established that all resident people in this country enjoy some but not all rights delineated in the US Constitution. The right to vote is a key priviledge.

I myself take a pragmatic approach. If a person has a valid SSN and a history of paying payroll taxes, and a voter registration (either a party or non-aligned), they should be able to vote. If however they have been participating in an underground economy, have been enjoying the privileges of a citizen without paying - then they are a criminal and a burden on real citizens.
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Newfie » Tue 23 Apr 2019, 19:55:02

There a number of good reasons to start a federal citizen registry.

Not thinking of a lot of good reasons no to.
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Tanada » Mon 20 May 2019, 14:30:45

On-the-spot DNA tests could be key to ICE verifying 'immigrant families' at border

The U.S. government has adopted a DNA testing system that would allow border officials to assess within two hours whether immigrants claiming to be in the same family are telling the truth.

Last June, the FBI approved the use of ANDE, an automated system which was developed with the military and can be operated by a nonscientist to process cheek swabs and other DNA. In October, it was used on human remains found after wildfires swept through Northern California. It is now under consideration by the Department of Homeland Security and could be used by Immigration and Customs Enforcement.

Federal immigration officials believe the situation at the U.S.-Mexico border is about to become more complicated due to an uptick in falsified documents being used by migrants.

“One of the things that we've seen a huge increase in and our partners in CBP [Customs and Border Protection] have seen, too, is the use of fraudulent documents,” deputy director of ICE’s Homeland Security Investigations arm, Derek Benner, said during a speech in Texas last week.

“Today when we're confronted with family units — I actually call them unverified family units because it's difficult to know but for the expertise of CBP officers and Border Patrol agents, who are able to question or interrogate that family situation based on the evidence that they have on their person and statements that they're able to get from the adults — they do the best they can, and then absent any other information their claim goes as is."

Part of the issue for federal law enforcement is not being able to verify familial relationship other than by paper documents.

ANDE DNA processing company says it can verify those relationships within two hours, compared to the weeks it usually takes local police or federal law enforcement to get results from labs.

“Identifying an individual at the border today probably requires an officer to say, ‘I don’t know if this is their kid or not their kid,’” Annette Mattern, spokeswoman for the company, told the Washington Examiner. “DNA doesn’t have to make those judgments. It’s just science.”

The sample is inserted into the machine and scanned. The machine locks down the sample and stores its information. The information can then be cross-referenced with an external database.

“Ninety minutes later we have an identification of that person, then we can swab the relatives and we can determine if they are blood relatives,” Mattern said. “But today, my understanding is there is no DNA that is being done at the port [of entry].”

ANDE was co-developed with the military when the Pentagon needed mobile DNA processing for missions in the Middle East and elsewhere. It had to be “ruggedized,” Mattern said, and able to be done in the back of a Humvee, something that would make it a good fit for the border.

Benner said the government is now “rushing” to catch up with the problem but said “interagency confusion” may delay a response.

The ANDE system, or one like it, is an obvious tool for CBP or the Health and Human Services Department's Office of Refugee Resettlement, which handles the release of unaccompanied migrant children.

DHS has made no announcement about using ANDE on the southern border or by immigration officers processing visa and green card applications.

LINK

DNA Testing at Border Outs Migrant Who Claimed Six-Month-Old Baby Was His Son, Charged With Smuggling

In just 90 minutes, United States Immigration and Customs Enforcement officials were able to determine that an illegal immigrant who arrived at the U.S.-Mexico border with a six-month-old child was lying.

As the Washington Examiner reports, the migrant claimed the child was his own as he sought passage into the country. The new rapid DNA testing determined he shared no relationship with the child and he was arrested for alien smuggling.

From the report:

On May 7, Border Patrol agents based in Hidalgo, Texas, watched 51-year-old Amilcar Guiza-Reyes wade through the Rio Grande with an infant. After the pair arrived on U.S. soil, they were taken into custody and brought back to U.S. Customs and Border Protection’s Central Processing Center in McAllen, Texas.

Agents learned Guiza-Reyes had been deported in 2013. He was turned over to ICE’s Homeland Security Investigations agents, who believed he may not have been the father of the child.

ICE ordered a DNA test of the pair and the man consented to a cheek swab for the two. The swab was run through a machine, which concluded the two were not related.

The child was then turned over to the Department of Health and Human Services’ Office of Refugee Resettlement as the child is now an unaccompanied minor.

The new pilot program came under quick scrutiny when it was first announced by the Trump administration and Democrats in Congress resisted it. The administration continued anyways and already found success in charging a migrant with smuggling.

The Washington Examiner reports the DNA testing was only conducted for one week at select facilities near McAllen and El Paso, Texas.

Here’s more from the report:

The Washington Examiner reported in March the Department of Homeland Security and ICE were looking at adopting the rapid testing system. On May 1, Homeland Security announced it would launch a pilot of the program in instances where agents could not verify a family unit’s relationships.

The debut marked the first time DNA testing of any sort has been used at the border. Currently, authorities must use verbal statements and written documents to verify family connections.
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Newfie » Mon 20 May 2019, 15:13:40

I can see this creating some very awkward moments when Moms kid doesn’t match Dads DNA. For some populations that’s close to a 30% rate.

May create more problems than it solves.
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby careinke » Tue 21 May 2019, 03:15:57

Newfie wrote:I can see this creating some very awkward moments when Moms kid doesn’t match Dads DNA. For some populations that’s close to a 30% rate.

May create more problems than it solves.


As a US citizen, I could really care less if a criminal family has this problem.
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Newfie » Tue 21 May 2019, 06:49:00

I was thinking more of the poor officer who breaks the news and then has to control the shit storm.
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 25 May 2019, 08:16:14

Our interfering and intervening in South & Central America has created the situation of : Blowback is a term originating from within the American Intelligence community, denoting the unintended consequences, unwanted side-effects, or suffered repercussions of a covert operation that fall back on those responsible for the aforementioned operations.

So, all this migration and criminal activity from there is a result of highly dysfunctional societies over there. Made so to a large degree by our covert and overt policies there.
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 25 May 2019, 08:35:33

Related to Blowback:
" Many developing nations are in debt and poverty partly due to the policies of international institutions such as the International Monetary Fund (IMF) and the World Bank.

Their programs have been heavily criticized for many years for resulting in poverty. In addition, for developing or third world countries, there has been an increased dependency on the richer nations. This is despite the IMF and World Bank’s claim that they will reduce poverty.

Following an ideology known as neoliberalism, and spearheaded by these and other institutions known as the Washington Consensus (for being based in Washington D.C.), Structural Adjustment Policies (SAPs) have been imposed to ensure debt repayment and economic restructuring. But the way it has happened has required poor countries to reduce spending on things like health, education and development, while debt repayment and other economic policies have been made the priority. In effect, the IMF and World Bank have demanded that poor nations lower the standard of living of their people."

http://www.globalissues.org/article/3/s ... of-poverty
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Ibon » Sat 25 May 2019, 09:53:57

onlooker wrote:
So, all this migration and criminal activity from there is a result of highly dysfunctional societies over there. Made so to a large degree by our covert and overt policies there.


I do not agree with this. Just like in the US the crime statistics in Latin America are focused on certain hot spots in certain neighborhoods in certain urban areas. Drug related and gang related within a very small area. Why is tourism surging in many latin american countries if they have societies that are so dysfunctional as you suggest.

In reality, the vast majority of Latin America have well functioning societies, families are still close nit, communities are still functioning with cottage industries that are thriving.

This all came home to me years ago when I was director of Latin America for a medical device manufacturer and I organized a Latin America sales meeting in Chicago for all the representatives throughout Latin America. Do you guys want to know what I heard from several of our latin american reps in planning for the meeting.. "Is it safe to come?" The news they receive from the US down in Peru and Chile and Venezuela back then was all the gang violence and murder in America.

So much of what we perceive as violence is bullshit from news. I don't dispute the statistics about Latin American crime but it is not ubiquitous. It is in certain hotspots. Why else do you explain all the tourism booming in countries like Colombia.

https://data.colombiareports.com/colomb ... tatistics/


Since the signing of the historic Peace Agreement in November 2016, that ended a half century long conflict, tourism has played an important role in boosting Colombia’s GDP growth. Many regions, once off limits to visitors due to security issues, are now beginning to receive travelers looking for off-the-beaten-track adventures. From surfing on the Pacific Coast to horseback riding across the grassy plains of Los Llanos and observing Caño Cristales, Colombia’s most colorful river in the department of Meta, the country has become a much sought after holiday destination.

“This permanent growth confirms that we are on the radar of world tourism. It also ratifies that this sector is one of the most benefited with the ending of the conflict and that said Minister of Commerce, Industry and Tourism, María Lorena Gutiérrez.

As the second most biodiverse country in the world, Colombia’s fauna and flora are also a major attraction. One such activity is birdwatching in the Sierra Nevada de Santa Marta, the world’s highest coastal mountain range and incredibly rich in endemic bird species. An article recently published in The Economist highlighted that “with more bird species than anywhere else in the world, Colombia is ornithological heaven.”
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 25 May 2019, 11:18:52

Yes, that probably is mostly true Ibon. Now, curious as to how you see the inequality there? Is it mostly due to intentional policies of the colonial powers/ruling elite and then US interference or other reasons?
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Ibon » Sat 25 May 2019, 11:40:42

onlooker wrote:Yes, that probably is mostly true Ibon. Now, curious as to how you see the inequality there? Is it mostly due to intentional policies of the colonial powers/ruling elite and then US interference or other reasons?


When spanish colonialism ended and independence was achieved the model that followed in almost all countries in Latin America is that an oligarchy was formed among the nationals that formed a new elite to replace the spanish one that exited. This persists to the present day in many countries where domestic industries are monopolies whether it is cement factories or beer brewers.

When the IMF or foreign banks or multi national corporations go to Latin America to extract resources or build out industries who do you think they partner with? The established oligarchies who have sent their children to business school in the west and who speak perfect english.

This is not a story of US interference so much as the marriage of elites globally.

As has often been said, a billionaire Chinese has more in common with his billionaire colleague in Europe or North America than he has with the underclass of his own country.

There is a web of elites globally that control the economy not because this is some cabal and conspiracy. It is a product of elites with mutual interests exploiting the underclass in their respective countries.

The USA is a 3rd world country today by the way,
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 25 May 2019, 11:44:08

Very true Ibon
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Newfie » Wed 17 Jul 2019, 03:51:22

I don’t recall this study being cited before. Immigrant population is commonly believed to be about 11 million. This new study puts it a 17 to 27, most likely 22.

Generally accepted estimates put the population of undocumented immigrants in the United States at approximately 11.3 million. A new study, using mathematical modeling on a range of demographic and immigration operations data, suggests that the actual undocumented immigrant population may be more than 22 million.


https://insights.som.yale.edu/insights/ ... -estimates
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby careinke » Thu 18 Jul 2019, 01:58:39

Newfie wrote:I don’t recall this study being cited before. Immigrant population is commonly believed to be about 11 million. This new study puts it a 17 to 27, most likely 22.

Generally accepted estimates put the population of undocumented immigrants in the United States at approximately 11.3 million. A new study, using mathematical modeling on a range of demographic and immigration operations data, suggests that the actual undocumented immigrant population may be more than 22 million.


https://insights.som.yale.edu/insights/ ... -estimates


Hmmm... Maybe we should do a count or something to find out how many they really are... :roll:
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Re: THE Immigration, Legal and Illegal, Thread (merged)

Unread postby Cog » Thu 18 Jul 2019, 03:39:18

Can't do a count since a count would be racist. Now that I think about it, pretty much everything is racist in one fashion or the other. According to the Jihad Squad.
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