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The New Tribalism

A forum for discussion of regional topics including oil depletion but also government, society, and the future.

Re: The New Tribalism

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Tue 16 Oct 2018, 20:01:15

Tanada wrote:I have met many Catholics of both the Hispanic and African-American census groups who are Devoted Conservatives so I believe the 'white' descriptor is terribly inaccurate. (family values, pro life, patriotic, uncompromising, hard working)


If you look at the board of governance names on the web page Newfie linked to above, you'll understand just why that happened. The only US member is on the faculty at UC Berkeley, the rest are from Socialist countries. It is the normal demonization of the usual group. Politically, these folks are far left of center, they would call most Democrats conservatives.

I myself am white, male, comfortable financially, 65+ years of age, and worst of all, I advocate personal responsibility for the decisions one makes. Even though I seem to qualify as a member of the ultimate oppressor group, I don't actually remember oppressing anybody ever in my whole life.
Last edited by KaiserJeep on Tue 16 Oct 2018, 20:05:43, edited 1 time in total.
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Warning: Messages timestamped before April 1, 2016, 06:00 PST were posted by the unmodified human KaiserJeep 1.0
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Re: The New Tribalism

Unread postby Newfie » Tue 16 Oct 2018, 20:03:30

After reading the report more I’m not sure I agree with The NY Times synopsis. But also, and I only scanned the 160 pages, I thought the questions were pretty forced with a lot of imbedded assumptions. Like the bit on immigration, I don’t agree with either option.
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Re: The New Tribalism

Unread postby Newfie » Tue 16 Oct 2018, 20:05:59

Well KJ you see the problem is you just went sensitive enough!
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Re: The New Tribalism

Unread postby evilgenius » Wed 17 Oct 2018, 11:59:35

KaiserJeep wrote:Well, it's not like traffic enforcement is much of a deterrent anyways. Studies have shown that the average driver breaks the speed limit about 3200+ times per each speeding ticket. BTW, this seems off-topic for this thread, at least I couldn't make much connection to "tribalism".

It seems to me we have always been partisan and tribalistic. The MSM and the Internet just make this existing tendancy worse, as with many other things.

It's completely on topic. I'm simply addressing some of the philosophical reasons for the separation that Americans feel from each other. Security is a basic one that people on the right cite. They use the necessity of it to push their tribe into the forefront. They also use it to unify those who have reasons to go another way. The truth is, though, that it doesn't rise to the level of importance which they claim it does. They use fear to orchestrate conformity when the resources which are bound by that fear could be used to great advantage elsewhere. But that dovetails into their agenda of small government and society that fails to understand itself as a greater body politic that has the right to address its weaknesses. Their reasons are economic and related to how they view their right to keep their stuff above owing any debt to society. When pressed, they tend to call all overtures calling for a shared state of being, a taxation scheme which ties society together, communist. If the times are not right for that strict label they seek to demonize any such efforts by denigrating the term "liberal."
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Re: The New Tribalism

Unread postby evilgenius » Wed 17 Oct 2018, 12:42:59

The greatest money maker is not speeding tickets, by the way. The cops don't line up ten, twenty or thirty deep on side streets on Friday and Saturday night in so many towns across the country to catch speeders. Speeding doesn't cost the individual on the order of ten thousand dollars a pop. The resources are aimed at where the money comes from. But all of those revenue streams will dry up under the driverless revolution. Arguing about which thing deserves the attention of the already too large an emphasis upon security policing apparatus will become a moot point.

That's when, if we don't get a handle on it, the tenet of security which is a pillar of right wing tribalism could metamorphose into something else. It is essential for the right to believe that, by the way, because otherwise the resources could find their way into fulfilling social behaviors, in the way that I described how the best way to keep a neighborhood up is for the residents to project an image of care for their neighborhood. That would imbue the left with too much staying power, justifying the use of taxes to help being about order within society based upon a kind of need. Here, I emphasize that it really is a need to participate, or, really, equal opportunity.

The kind of energy behind an overemphasis upon security, and the efficacy that judgement has in causing the masses to capitulate is simply too tempting for it not to arise in some other fashion elsewhere in society. And that will come about in an age where those in power will know so much more about everyone. They could simply move what are quite normal behaviors into the sin category and start making money off of them. The making money thing only being a means to self-reinforce the pronouncement that those who have something need to be afraid that someone else is going to take it from them at every step of the way. Getting a ticket for watching porn is an obvious candidate for such intrusiveness. Penalizing people for adhering to practices which ensure their privacy is, especially, another. Don't forget that most people who get shot by the cops are shot because the cops feel they need to obtain control first and gather facts later.
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Re: The New Tribalism

Unread postby Tanada » Tue 25 May 2021, 10:52:58

Michael Bowen wrote:A Tribal Declaration

By Michael Bowen - May 19, 2021
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A certain combination of events have given me the opportunity to rethink myself. Most of these ways are private, but some of them are things I expect to influence my writing and my personal associations.

In particular I am considering at length a firming up of my tribal associations and I think it’s important enough to present it as something you might find interesting to try in your own life. But let’s first define tribes in the context of identity.

When I joined the LA IDW (Intellectual Dark Web), I was struck by the insight and prescience of a post by Peter Limberg and Conor Barnes that absolute pinned actors in the Culture Wars to the wall. At the time, I fell squarely into a mimetic tribe called The Sorters.

Sorters and Intellectual Dark Web

Jordan Peterson is the common denominator of these two tribes. One of the most important figures in Culture War 2.0, his central message emphasizes free speech and the importance of truth-speaking. His following of mostly young men, which we dub the Sorters, are attracted to Peterson’s style and message of personal responsibility. The “Intellectual Dark Web,” coined by Eric Weinstein, consists of thinkers who have experienced what they view as thought-policing by politically correct elements of the left. With the ever-increasing popularity of Peterson’s brand and related platforms such as Quillette, the Rubin Report, and the Joe Rogan Experience, watch for both of these tribes to gain members and make a strong push for a return to a classically liberal center in our culture.

Nailed me. But that was almost three years ago.

Things have changed. I have changed. But I still retain a solid commitment to a defense of Enlightenment liberalism in our culture and society. At the time, I was still near the early middle of my Stoic journey and still more deeply considerate of my Martial Education. I didn’t have a lot of time for black flavor. These days with the callous dismissal of my generation’s hard won experience of racial integration and the success of many of my own lifelong black friends, I have a bug up my butt about various perversions of what has actually been accomplished in ‘The Struggle’. That’s one.

Additionally, I am quite frustrated with the failures of anti-trust in the US and the capitulation of various government entities to take seriously how the free market has been damaged. This is especially the case when it comes to what is casually known as ‘big tech’. I’m tired of living in the shadow of Google, Facebook, Twitter and those entities that dominate what should be a free and open market. The common man is getting crowded out, and I don’t like it. That’s two.

With these two piques in mind, I want to stand in common cause with many other millions of Americans who share similar values, and quite honestly I don’t see leadership coming from the top down. I say it has to come from the bottom up and that means we need to organize ourselves in new and energizing ways.

Tribes vs Parties

The primary difference between a tribe and a political party is that tribes are not mutually exclusive. A tribe acknowledges your values and personality, but it doesn’t try to press-gang you into ideological indenture. A tribal experience is like going to a Prince concert. Prince never told me that there was no other funk than his. That contract is not part of the price of the ticket. So if I went to see Fishbone or Mother’s Finest or Nona Hendrix the next week, Prince wasn’t going to hunt me down on social media and call me a FINO.
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Tribes work in America even when the government does not. Even when institutions lose our trust, we can trust the tribe of Ford Mustang is not going to defect en-mass to the tribe of Mazda Miata. There will be a back and forth. Surely we Mustang fans were at a low in 1980, but the Mustang came back.

There was a time, before the shock of 9/11 that American presidents tiptoed through foreign policy. I am reminded of this sneaky plausible deniability whenever I watch Harrison Ford and Willem Dafoe in 1994’s Clear and Present Danger. Nowadays there’s hardly a film without SpecOps warriors front and center. My point is that there’s plenty to be proud about in your American tribe, even when there is plenty wrong in America. In Hollywood. And in Florida. In DC. Or in Minnesota. In Georgia. Wherever, dude. Stop pretending that’s all on you, that it’s taking food off your table.

Only since I’m breaking down things into what’s deep, let me remind you of the hard limits on tribal overproductions right now. I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again. On the subject of multiculturalism, there’s a limit to how serious people can be taken on their tribal affiliations, and that’s when they seek a national referendum on their tribal beliefs.

The problem with today’s multiculturalism is that it is different than pluralism. Pluralism is the proper ethos for America, multiculturalism is not.

The difference can be explained simply by assuming Americans can be divided into two tribes:

Ideological Tribe A

We believe that America is at its best when its mainstream is maintained without regard to race, creed, color, sexual preference, etc..

Ideological Tribe B

We believe that America is at its best when its mainstream is maintained with special regard to race, creed, color, sexual preference, etc.Don’t get it twisted.

We must live under the rule of law, period. No tribe under any circumstances can arrogate itself to be above the law. That’s the difference between a tribe and a gang. We benefit from a variety of overlapping tribes – this is pluralism. But we cannot defy the greater social order which is our constitutional heritage. If there is a third pique that gets me in a huff, it’s the attitude that you are entitled to rebel against social order in defiance of the civil peace we enjoy. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard people grit their teeth in hopes of escalating their culture war into real civil war over the past 2 years. Seriously? Don’t make me go there.

Stating the obvious, a travesty has been made of the concept of equality as Tribe B has successfully manipulated major institutions across America into establishing double standards and special regard for intersectional combinations of race, creed, color and sexual preference.

To stand in defense of enlightenment, liberalism carries some responsibilities to citizenship. We cannot wish ourselves into a post-national order. We can only bribe border guards if we have the gold or the firepower, and that is not a game for the common man. So, we the common people have to accept some burdens along with our freedom to associate in the tribes of our choice. We cannot let the idea of civic responsibility die, because ‘civ’ as in civil rights. A list of civic responsibilities is a task for another day, my aim at the moment is to clarify my dedication to American pluralism and my special affinities. I seek to do so in such a way that there is no contradiction that makes me any less a patriot or one dedicated to the ideal of liberty and justice for all.

The Family Tree

In the first case, I seek to honor the simplest wishes of my own ancestry, one I have assiduously tracked through my family tree going back eight generations on my mother’s side. Once upon a time, I tracked 600 folks in my tree, but since then my software has gone bad and I have to reconstruct all that from printouts. Still, I’m working to catalog the most important black history of all, the actual lives of the actual people whose hope and love and accidents brought me here with their DNA. Everything else is secondary.

I can claim whatever tribe I choose, as deeply as I choose, for whatever length of time suits me. But I am, my family and I have no choice in that matter. Funny how some people say that about race. What kind of fool cops to a racial definition and forsakes his actual flesh and blood?

The Traveled Road

Similarly, I am interested in recognizing my hometown and all the neighborhoods I lived in and all of the friends I interacted with to shape my personality. That too was material to my existence, unlike the myths and social constructions of race. That counts for my philosophy, my profession, my politics and my prospects for the future. Yet each of those add a degree of separation from my self and my self-interest.

So let me give you an idea of the t-shirts I wear on occasion that indicate my tribes of the moment. I know some of you are in one or more of my tribes. If not, you have got to know somebody who is. Maybe one of you with some designing savvy might join me in a Red Bubble venture.

Wry Stoics of the First Order

EDC Sheepdog Tribe

Merry Band of Blue Star Dads

Apple Fanboy Collective

Heralds of the AWS Galactus

IDW Auxiliary – Los Angeles Charter Member

Association of Arrogant Audiophiles

XBox Gamers Limited – PHGX Dead End

Kingsley Amis Drinking Club

Porsche Snobs of California (Zero Equity Squad)

Practically Excluded Political Middle

Merovingian Cabalists (Alpha Phi Alpha)

Silent Reserve Army of Christ

Dilettantes of the High Arts

Guild of Grunting Grown Ass Black Men

Empty Nesters Indefinitely Occupied

These are pretty well sorted, but that’s what they are today. Ask me again in a couple of years.

Aren’t they recognizable?

Isn’t it abundantly clear that each of these groups are discriminatory? And yet you don’t see us standing on our hind legs dying on the hills of our identity and membership. Why? Because that’s no way to live. I have not, and you should not forget good sportsmanship. If every one of these interests got tangled up into the machinations of party politics, we’d be a pretty poor excuse for a democracy. We’re not supposed to be voting our personalities up or down. We’re supposed to put all that aside and deal with the needs of the common man.

Still, I am going to be writing about my perspective on The Struggle, and what we’re doing wrong in our ever increasing aggregation, consolidation and centralization. I’m going to keep pounding on the table to depoliticize ourselves and drop all that special regard. Ain’t none of us that special. Self-determination. Individual liberty. Freedom of association. I pledge solemnly not to get in the way of your self-determination, individual liberty or freedom of association. Now you know where I’m coming from.

Michael Bowman Blog
Alfred Tennyson wrote:We are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
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