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The Decline and Fall of the American Empire Pt. 2

General discussions of the systemic, societal and civilisational effects of depletion.

Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby onlooker » Thu 22 Feb 2018, 18:48:02

Totally agree Ghung. Empires and in fact humans are victims of their own success. And isn"t this what is being shown to us all in epic proposition now.
In more colloquial vernacular "Don't bite off more than you can chew"
"We are mortal beings doomed to die
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby jedrider » Thu 22 Feb 2018, 18:57:54

We should be contemplating what the Chinese Empire will look like and how we will fit in.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby onlooker » Thu 22 Feb 2018, 19:02:36

jedrider wrote:We should be contemplating what the Chinese Empire will look like and how we will fit in.

Not seeing anymore Empires. Rather the inviolable and inevitable decline of our species in all aspects. Hopefully, though our empathy and compassion for each other can grow
"We are mortal beings doomed to die
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby asg70 » Thu 22 Feb 2018, 19:51:07

onlooker wrote:Hopefully, though our empathy and compassion for each other can grow


Prepare yourself for disappointment.
[space to store bad short-term prediction currently vacant]
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Sun 25 Feb 2018, 14:03:14

It may fall in a stupid way. Exchange of few nukes with loons from NK with large collateral damage (Japan, SK).
Few tagets on US soil also probably hit, maybe EMP attack and miserable chaos after that.
Lets hope that Russia and China will not see US as a lame duck at the time, take a gamble on *now or never opportunity* and launch massive nuking on its own.
Barring that relatively low radioactive but very huge political fallout followed by international ostracism for causing nuclear war, then loss of allies (after nuking SK and Japan most of other allies will see themselves as disposable). Noone will want to become new USS Japan.
Loss of international stand, nuclear arms race around the world and resignation from dollar as reserve currency.
Diagnosis: Ruin by Pyrrhic victory.

All what you need to destroy an empire is few idiots in wrong place.
Not that even now US political situation is easy.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby evilgenius » Wed 28 Feb 2018, 11:31:05

It'll be a while before the North Koreans will be capable of assaulting both South Korea and Japan fatally. To engage both of them that way would take industrial capacity. They don't have that. They probably have something more like all out commitment by a group with less capability than industry would bring. How many bombs could they make? They could, however, introduce a change in the regional way of thinking concerning nuclear weapons. China and India reached a kind of detente and limited their numbers. The threat from Pakistan has caused a lot of talk about whether India would respond with an arms build up. The detente with China has kept that from happening. We don't know what would happen if China felt an immediate threat in the way that India does from Pakistan. The arguments that keep India from building up might fall away. There could be a nuclear arms race of a sort in the region.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Wed 28 Feb 2018, 12:29:08

North Korea can fire a missile or missiles just one time and before the first one hits or is shot out of the sky there will be missiles enough on their way to totally whip out North Korea. This has been made very clear to them.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby diemos » Wed 28 Feb 2018, 13:36:40

jedrider wrote:We should be contemplating what the Chinese Empire will look like and how we will fit in.


As I always say, "At least the food will be good."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x56MtVXDbJ8
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby derhundistlos » Mon 05 Mar 2018, 09:10:20

North Korea will not launch a pre-emptive strike. Instead, it's far more likely the US may try a first-strike, particularly if Trump believes he has to do something "bold" to deflect attention.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Mon 05 Mar 2018, 11:28:47

derhundistlos wrote:North Korea will not launch a pre-emptive strike. Instead, it's far more likely the US may try a first-strike, particularly if Trump believes he has to do something "bold" to deflect attention.
Naw Presidents bomb aspirin factories to cause a distraction not something so extreme as a first Nuclear strike.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby Cog » Mon 05 Mar 2018, 12:59:54

If the American "empire" ever falls it won't be from forces from without but from forces from within. Yes, socialists and communists, I'm talking about you.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby Revi » Mon 05 Mar 2018, 14:52:01

Or could it be corrupt oligarchs like Our Dear Leader that really bring it down?
Deep in the mud and slime of things, even there, something sings.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby onlooker » Mon 05 Mar 2018, 16:40:15

The American Empire is falling as most have throughout history. Internal decay and external overreach
"We are mortal beings doomed to die
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby Cog » Mon 05 Mar 2018, 16:51:29

Revi wrote:Or could it be corrupt oligarchs like Our Dear Leader that really bring it down?


Sorry your girl lost. But not really.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Unread postby evilgenius » Tue 06 Mar 2018, 13:52:13

If America is about to be exposed, it'll probably be as AI so thoroughly infiltrates what people have come to know as the workplace over a rapid period of time. Advances are coming very soon not just behind the wheel, which is where many people work today, but in the professions. Soon, people may contemplate the use of the law in a manner they never could before, as AI makes it more plain to us - revealing more quickly what our options are. We wouldn't need so many lawyers, though. AI could ravage the executive suite as much as replace the repetitive tasks we understand computers are good at doing. As capitalists, we may not be ready for the coming redefinition. For all of the refutations of Marx that capitalism has proffered, none of them has truly dissuaded us from seeing some inherent value to labor, other than its impact upon how many widgets can be manufactured. Capitalists seem to believe in a labor theory of value, even though they can easily discredit it. We need it to help us distinguish between classes, for one thing. There are types of labor for which the establishment has spent a lot of money acquiring the knowledge of how to do which those who have paid that price will not have found themselves longing for such a removal of their protective barrier to entry than what AI is about to wreak upon them. All of this is going to happen over a fairly short time.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire Pt. 2

Unread postby Ibon » Wed 07 Mar 2018, 07:38:44

Funny how an empire in the late autumn of its decline creates concern and anxiety to its human inhabitants meanwhile the early spring advances, crocuses peak expectantly out of the melting snow, the early tentative mating calls of birds break winters silence.

Everyone has a choice of where one puts their focus.
Our resiliency resembles an invasive weed. We are the Kudzu Ape
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire Pt. 2

Unread postby Newfie » Wed 07 Mar 2018, 07:52:10

Nice Ibon.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire Pt. 2

Unread postby Newfie » Wed 07 Mar 2018, 08:01:14

A quick thought, I don’t think it is so much American Empire is falling as the Western World Ira in general. Or perhaps, even broader, humanity as a species.

I see no path forward for our species, we are up against limits on numerous fronts. It is inevitable that humanity’s numbers will shrink dramatically within the relatively near future, this century.

What I think we are discussing is the peak of humanities expanssion, our growth and flowering as a species. It’s possible future critters, if any, will talk about us as we speak of dinosaurs. Great lumbering societies that over grazed their fields and could not adapt quickly to changing circumstances. They will wonder how we, with advanced technology, could be so short sighted as to not see the excesses impact.

Someone sent me an article on a Camu: life is absurd withou meaning. Enjoy today for it is all we have.
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Re: The Decline and Fall of the American Empire Pt. 2

Unread postby onlooker » Wed 07 Mar 2018, 09:16:53

Yes, our entire species is set for a monumental correction encompassing not just die off of many of us but an inevitable restructuring of all facets of human societies
"We are mortal beings doomed to die
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