[peeker01]

Good link Ian. I am not saying it's business as usual. I'm saying doom is not indicated by
the depletion of one energy source and a shift to others.

[ian807]

Good link Ian. I am not saying it's business as usual. I'm saying doom is not indicated by
the depletion of one energy source and a shift to others.

You're probably correct. I'd call it "major readjustment" rather than a proximate cause of doom. Economically, the result of oil depletion might be termed "collapse," but what we in the USA would call "collapse" someone in Sudan would call "Wednesday." We'll adjust. Probably quite a few of us will die off, but not nearly all.

If doom is going to happen, I expect it will come in the form a few, or maybe not so few, nuclear weapons fired by some damn fool at another damn fool for some damn reason that won't matter in a few centuries.

[AdamB]

Jerusalem riots spread to Indonesia and Malaysia as terror group Hamas promises ‘day of rage’ over Trump over embassy move Donald Trump sparked protests after announcing the US would recognise Jerusalem as the capital of Israel RIOTS sparked by Donald Trump’s provocative move to recognise the Holy City of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital have spread to Indonesia and Malaysia. Furious protesters have joined rallies around the world after terror group Hamas called for a “day of rage” in response to the US President’s announcement. Getty - Contributor 12 Protests against Donald Trumps decision to recognise Jerusalem as the capital of Israel have spread to Indonesia Muslims in Indonesia and Malaysia joined rallies outside the countries’ US embassies with Malaysia’s sports minister Khairy Jamaluddin threatening “the world will rise against the United States”. Hundreds have also taken part in protests in Iran with state TV airing footage of marchers chanting “Death to

Jerusalem Riots Spread…

[yellowcanoe]

Joe Clark, leader of the Federal Progressive Conservative party in Canada made the same election promise in 1979. Shortly after winning the election, the new government announced their intention to move the Canadian embassy to Jerusalem though no timetable for actually doing that was set. After realizing that there would be a significant political and economic cost to moving the embassy the idea was dropped. I don't expect the same outcome in this case though -- it doesn't seem to be in Trump's nature to solicit impartial advice and act on it.

[Cog]

Trump is a master of getting groups to reveal their true nature. The true nature of the Palestinians is to practice terrorism. Let them riot and show the world exactly what they stand for.

[Outcast_Searcher]

Trump is a master of getting groups to reveal their true nature. The true nature of the Palestinians is to practice terrorism. Let them riot and show the world exactly what they stand for.

Because, of course, Israel is the perfect example of peace and light and goodness and NEVER does a single thing worthy of criticism. Hamas is 100% of the problem, without question.

So your schtick is to just defend Trump, no matter what?

Whether "pussy grabbing" or calling Kim Jung Un "Rocket Man", like a 5 year old?

I'm on the front lines of the NYT opinion section, defending him (on policies where he deserves it) against the endless drumbeat of liberal whining, where it's unreasonable.

However, pretending he can do no wrong, IMO, has zero credibility as well.

[Cog]

I guess Trump personally went to Jerusalem and armed the Palestinians and forced them to riot. Everything I care to know about Muslims I learned during the Munich Olympics and 9/11. Islam is a religion and political ideology of violence and always has been. When they have their Reformation, like the Christians did, let me know. Until that time they represent a violent and backward belief system.

[Cog]

LOL So we are making the Palestinians riot and kill people? How exactly are we accomplishing this fact because I may want to employ it myself some day.

Trump simply carried out a law that was passed by Congress in 1995 that mandated that the embassy be moved to Jerusalem. Trump complied with the law and executed it just as his job description mandates he does.

[Outcast_Searcher]

I guess Trump personally went to Jerusalem and armed the Palestinians and forced them to riot. Everything I care to know about Muslims I learned during the Munich Olympics and 9/11. Islam is a religion and political ideology of violence and always has been. When they have their Reformation, like the Christians did, let me know. Until that time they represent a violent and backward belief system.

If you think no Israeli ever did an unkind thing to a Muslim, so all the violence on the Muslim side is completely random and unprovoked, then you have lost all contact with objective reality. (I have Muslim friends from places like Gaza, who are now US citizens, who have, for example, shown me the scars from where Israeli soldiers hit them with rifle butts. But let's pretend it's impossible for such things (or much, much worse) to ever happen, even when they're reported by the MSM.)

Now how you fix it and get both sides to agree, I have no idea. But pretending like only one side ever is involved in the violence, or provoking the violence, is delusional.

...

And by the way, I dislike the Hamas rioting and rocket attacks, etc. as much as anyone. I just can understand that there might be reasons that they consider valid for such behavior.

[Outcast_Searcher]

Trump simply carried out a law that was passed by Congress in 1995 that mandated that the embassy be moved to Jerusalem. Trump complied with the law and executed it just as his job description mandates he does.

My understanding is that both Clinton and Bush would have liked to do this, but refrained because they were told by experts that it would do more harm than good.

But heaven forbid our POTUS would show good judgement and restraint on nearly any issue.

....

As much as I disliked much of what Obama did, including breaking LOTS of campaign promises, Trump is making him look better and better as time goes on. And we're still in the first year.

[rockdoc123]

I think it is always difficult to look at the Jerusalem issue from the perspective of an outsider. The history of Muslim versus Christian versus Jewish claims is very, very long-lived. The religious sites for both sides are fairly significant. The temple mount is an excellent example with Christians believing this is the site where Abraham offered the sacrifice of his sons, Jews believing it was the first resting site of the Arc of the Covenant and for Muslims it is the third most holy site, being the place they believe that Prophet Mohammed rose to heaven on a winged horse. So you can see that siding with any one of the competing claims on Jeruselum is fraught with risk. Regardless of what Muslims around the world think of Palestinians, they see the move by Trump a direct aggressive attack on one of their holiest sites. This includes not just Muslims in the Middle East but those in SE Asia as well.
So Americans might see this as well we want to support our Israeli friends which I think is an honorable view, but not if you ignore that in doing so you have pissed off the entire global Muslim community. It is bad enough that the radical Muslims hate us....we don't need the non-radicalized ones hating us as well. The Crusaders in the 12th century probably thought they were on the side of right but it didn't stop Salah al-Din from killing most of them and effectively ending the long-standing Kingdom of Jerusalem.

[Plantagenet]

The Crusaders in the 12th century probably thought they were on the side of right but it didn't stop Salah al-Din from killing most of them and effectively ending the long-standing Kingdom of Jerusalem.

The Jihadists in the 21st century probably thought they were on the wide of right but it didn't stop Trump from killing most of them and effectively ending the short-lived ISIS Caliphate based in Syria and Iraq.


Cheers!

[Plantagenet]

Joe Clark, leader of the Federal Progressive Conservative party in Canada made the same election promise in 1979. Shortly after winning the election, the new government announced their intention to move the Canadian embassy to Jerusalem though no timetable for actually doing that was set. After realizing that there would be a significant political and economic cost to moving the embassy the idea was dropped. I don't expect the same outcome in this case though -- it doesn't seem to be in Trump's nature to solicit impartial advice and act on it.

True enough, but when a D president replaces Trump in 2020, she can order the embassy in Jerusalem to close and move everything back to Tel Aviv. It would be a weak and cowardly thing to do and it would set the peace process back, but it would make the anti-semites and Islamic extremists happy.

Cheers!

[Cog]

We are done placating terrorists. That ended last November. Get used to it. If you want a groveler-in-chief and an apologist for American exceptionalism you will have a chance to elect one three years from now.

[rockdoc123]

We are done placating terrorists. That ended last November. Get used to it. If you want a groveler-in-chief and an apologist for American exceptionalism you will have a chance to elect one three years from now.

I think both you and plant are missing my point. By moving the Israeli capital to Jerusalem you have not just pissed off Muslim terrorists further but you have effectively pissed off every last Muslim in the world. Contrary to the belief of some Americans the vast majority of Muslims in the world are not radical fundamentalists nor are they terrorists. Most just go about their lives paying attention to the edicts of Islam. But this will piss them off, it will piss off those who the US counts as "friends" in the Middle East. Don't get me wrong, I see nothing wrong with what Trump has been doing as a President, I think he is actually a good one and has delivered on a number of items. This, however, is not a good idea and the reason why it has not been done previously.

[Plantagenet]

By moving the Israeli capital to Jerusalem you have not just pissed off Muslim terrorists further but you have effectively pissed off every last Muslim in the world.

The US didn't move the Israeli Capital to Jerusalem.

It was already there.

----------------------------

The US always puts its embassies in the capitals of foreign countries----why should it treat Israel differently?

Cheers!

[SeaGypsy]

My Muslim friends think it's flipping ridiculous America claiming to have defeated IS. Firstly they effectively created, armed, gave succour & ignored or encouraged. Only after Russia & Iran stepped in did American policy do a confused sidestep backflip. IS in Syria was defeated by Shia Muslims, from Syria, Iran, Lebanon, Iraq, backed by Russian air & artillery, with miniscule input from the USA. Interesting that for a rare change the success of Shia & secular forces against Sunni is currently being applauded by the vast majority of Sunna, who were as appalled as any sane human being by the barbarism of ISIL. The complete lack of honest reflection by American leadership is as expected.

[rockdoc123]

The US didn't move the Israeli Capital to Jerusalem.

It was already there.

According to the Israelis...Israel passed the "Jerusalem Law" in 1980 where they unilaterally claimed Jerusalem as their capital. Subsequently that same year the UN Security Council passed Resolution 478, declaring the law "null and void". At this point in time Russia is the only country in the world that recognizes West Jerusalem as the capital of Israel (still recognizing the Palestinian state in the occupied lands) everybody else maintains their embassy in Tel Aviv. For reasons I spoke of above, it is a political mine field.