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The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Discussions of conventional and alternative energy production technologies.

Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby GHung » Mon 25 Sep 2017, 09:38:49

"Unlike a normal grid-tied inverter, the Storeredge inverter has the capability to throttle it's output."

Not sure where you got that idea. All grid-tied inverters 'throttle their output' to match the frequency and voltage of the grid, the same way off-grid inverters adjust their output to whatever load is applied.

Not sure what is going on with your system unless you are exceeding the capacity of the inverter in your Powerwall. Or it could be having trouble with the combined inductive/resistive load from your hot tub. Jeez, I ran a hot tub off of my two old Trace 4024 inverters for a couple of years. What's the amp rating for your hot tub?

The beauty of an off-grid hybrid system is that the PV and the controllers run essentially independently from the inverter. The controllers will continue to charge the batteries (up to their set charge parameters) whether or not the inverter is feeding the grid or drawing from the battery. The problem I have with grid-tied inverters where one unit combines charge controlling and inverter => dreaded single point of failure. I could lose one or more of my charge controllers and one or two inverters and still keep things running until repairs can be made. Goes to redundancy and resilience.

If I was a gridweenie, the inverters could charge the battery from the grid if battery voltage drops too low, or (not being a gridweenie) either the controllers or the inverters can start the generator (provide power AND charge the batteries). If I added a hybrid inverter/charger like an Outback Radian, (and was a gridweenie) I could sell power to the grid. Indeed, I could set it to ONLY sell and never draw from the grid. I can set the system to dump surplus power to hot water, or turn off non-critical loads when battery voltage drops below a set-point.

Love the versatility of my system.

Not trying to instill buyer's remorse or criticize your system. Enjoying your posts and am sure you'll figure things out with time. It took me a few years to grok these things.

What is the rated output voltage of your PV string(s).?
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby Ibon » Tue 26 Sep 2017, 07:49:11

baha wrote:
It took me years to learn to really grow food, not just treats. But those frozen green peas are going to be good tonight :)


This is very true and very relevant to the energy independence when living off grid. You go from symbolic gestures of being proud of your basil plant on your deck or single solar panel on your roof early on to then actually producing real volume calories or KW's .

Whether it is KW or calories the organic process of self proficiency takes years. Most folks never leave the symbolic token basil plant in a pot.

Symbolism does not feed your belly or run your refrigerator :)
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Tue 26 Sep 2017, 11:09:55

baha wrote:Very true Ibon,

And the reward and pride just keeps getting better :)

I know I spout off and act like a know-it-all sometimes. I speak more freely on the Internet...in person I never disparage anyone and I try to encourage and help.

Please forgive me when I get on a roll...I am very proud of what I am doing and don't have many people left to brag to.

You're actually doing something. You're sharing information on that. Real information.

You're intellectually honest about your perspective and freely admit to the possible caveat of, shall we say, "over-enthusiasm".

To me, given the overall content and history of this site for the last decade or so I've posted here, I think anyone who has any "serious" complaints about what you're doing isn't being exactly reasonable.

I, for one, as a timid, book vs. hands-on person, appreciate the real world knowledge you're sharing about Solar and batteries (since I won't "jump" until I'm more confident about the technology, pay-off time frame, reliability, battery durability, etc). Please don't stop. Enthusiasm level and update frequency, yours to choose. (Just one man's opinion, of course).
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 06 Oct 2017, 11:17:02

baha wrote:Thank you OS,
Sometimes I need a little encouragement too :) Every once in a while the reality of it beats me down. So I go camping :) Mother Earth will win! And she is my friend.

I guess I am concerned that no one has any serious complaints...This is Peakoil.com, why aren't you dudes picking me apart like I have watched for 10 years?

Could it be because I am right? :P

The clown-fest deniers will likely swing by at some point. Those like pstarr and starving lion who claim that any facts they don't like (like the progress of green energy and EV's) are frauds.

This is why I keep them on ignore, rarely look at their posts, and rarely respond to them unless I happen to see their posts quoted in another post. When the signal to bandwidth ratio is roughly zero AND such folks show almost zero propensity to learn, adapt, or react to obvious facts -- at some point life is too short to waste more time on them.

You're doing good stuff, so don't let them get you down when it happens. You know your work and solar installation are real, no matter how many times they claim they're scams, etc.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Wed 11 Oct 2017, 12:42:29

I don't want to rain on your parade, but solar PV production cost is 400% of coal, roughly, at a large central power plant. Your retail-scale production cost including the periodic Powerwall replacement will be considerably higher than that.

I too remain a fan of renewable energy. But aside from us renewable enthusiasts, there is not much happening now.
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby GHung » Wed 11 Oct 2017, 12:45:54

KaiserJeep wrote:I don't want to rain on your parade, but solar PV production cost is 400% of coal, roughly, at a large central power plant. Your retail-scale production cost including the periodic Powerwall replacement will be considerably higher than that.

I too remain a fan of renewable energy. But aside from us renewable enthusiasts, there is not much happening now.


Citations?
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Wed 11 Oct 2017, 13:02:46

KaiserJeep wrote:I don't want to rain on your parade, but solar PV production cost is 400% of coal, roughly, at a large central power plant. Your retail-scale production cost including the periodic Powerwall replacement will be considerably higher than that.

I too remain a fan of renewable energy. But aside from us renewable enthusiasts, there is not much happening now.

You're living in the past citing such numbers, and the trends are clearly strongly favoring solar over time. (See Tony Seba et al, for documented evidence, with things like citations).
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Wed 11 Oct 2017, 13:48:57

GHung wrote:
KaiserJeep wrote:I don't want to rain on your parade, but solar PV production cost is 400% of coal, roughly, at a large central power plant. Your retail-scale production cost including the periodic Powerwall replacement will be considerably higher than that.

I too remain a fan of renewable energy. But aside from us renewable enthusiasts, there is not much happening now.


Citations?


Those are the same IER figures I used in the CPP thread.

baha, I also watched the PBS News Hour. The quoted figures for rooftop solar ($0.26/kWh) and coal ($0.04/kWh) jive with the IER estimates, as long as we are talking rooftop (i.e. small-scale) solar PV with batteries, and coal without pollution controls. Niether figure is realistic, you must scrub coal stacks and most solar PV is grid-attached without batteries.

To be more precise, the satellite measurements of infrared black body radiation (a form of direct temperature measurement) show no overall warming in the Northern Hemisphere for the last 18 years. The idiot coal power guy got most figures wrong, and didn't give a source for anything.
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