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Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Discussions about the economic and financial ramifications of PEAK OIL

Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby diemos » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 12:49:16

Sorry Outcast_searcher I missed that you were responding to the other outcast.
Last edited by diemos on Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:08:30, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 12:59:16

diemos wrote:
Outcast_Searcher wrote:
OutcastPhilosopher wrote:
If you are asymptomatic you are not infectious or sick.


Hmmm.... Outcast_Searcher, OutcastPhilosopher

Which one is the sock puppet account?

Outcast_Searcher wrote:You are clearly a science denier and an idiot and a liar. At least you're consistent.
What are your medical credentials, re virology expertise, to claim you know more than the experts?
https://www.advisory.com/en/daily-brief ... tic-spread


Lol. Call me a science denier and then link to a chiropractor website. Projection much?

If your body if producing viruses and you are breathing them out into the air, then you are infectious. Whether you have symptoms or not is irrelevant.

And the science shows that if you have the virus you can breathe it out whether you're showing symptoms or not. It's not that complex. But being a denier, people will twist things all they can.

The data is the data, whether you whine about it being from this or that site, BTW.

Just because masking doesn't consistently work as well as we wish it would (especially with improper mask wearing, lack of social distancing, ignoring mask mandates, etc), doesn't mean that overall, masks haven't been proven to help prevent the virus from spreading -- by the experts on virology, including with lots of experiments, and overall data trends.

If you can't look at my account and see that I've been here just a WEE bit longer than outcast philosopher, then you're hopeless, BTW.

Is this all chiropractor websites? :roll:

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/41790 ... ks-prevent

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/41790 ... ks-prevent

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... dance.html

https://www.idsociety.org/covid-19-real ... he-public/

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/f ... le/2776536

No doubt your ilk can come up with endless denial. And no doubt, other deniers will find you credible. Too bad for your ilk, science and reality are "things".
Last edited by Outcast_Searcher on Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:05:28, edited 1 time in total.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Armageddon » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:01:25

The virus is so deadly, that the US is opening back up for business. If it was truly some deadly pandemic, would they really be doing this while its still spreading?
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby diemos » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:13:17

Armageddon wrote:The virus is so deadly, that the US is opening back up for business. If it was truly some deadly pandemic, would they really be doing this while its still spreading?


We're a democracy, they're politicians, they'll do whatever they think will get them out of being blamed for this at the next election.

Unfortunately, one part of the population will blame them for not doing enough and letting too many people die.

The other part will blame them for shutting down the economy and generating economic misery.

The number of voters who will think they did exactly the right thing will be zero.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:13:53

Armageddon wrote:The virus is so deadly, that the US is opening back up for business. If it was truly some deadly pandemic, would they really be doing this while its still spreading?

Politics is a reality. I suspect that there will be some blowback from this in places where they're ignoring the risk, like TX and MISS. But even in states where they have tended to do better, they're tending to open up fairly quickly, as politics (and getting re-elected) and the economy, often is balanced against how much good waiting until, say, mid-June would do (presuming everyone who wants a vaccine can get a vaccine by late May, as Biden is claiming).

Plus there's the whole science denial anti-vaxxer crew in the US, so whether we even get to herd immunity is still an open question.

How many million people does disease X have to kill, including fairly young healthy people for it to be "dangerous"? How many people does it have to maim or give long term disease? How much does it have to cost in terms of ongoing medical costs to manage to matter?

Pretending that if X happens, it must be a good thing or prove some idiotic conspiracy theory is mindless drivel, even for you.

But given the history and lack of overall veracity of your posts on this site, such delusion / prevarication from you doesn't surprise me.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:16:21

diemos wrote:
Armageddon wrote:The virus is so deadly, that the US is opening back up for business. If it was truly some deadly pandemic, would they really be doing this while its still spreading?


We're a democracy, they're politicians, they'll do whatever they think will get them out of being blamed for this at the next election.

Unfortunately, one part of the population will blame them for not doing enough and letting too many people die.

The other part will blame them for shutting down the economy and generating economic misery.

The number of voters who will think they did exactly the right thing will be zero.

If we lived in a culture like New Zealand, where overall the population and leaders could be cooperative and rational and patient and do the RIGHT thing, then our politicians would mostly deserve to be burned at the stake (I exaggerate, but that's the degree of their malfeasance re Covid-19, overall). However, given how the US population behaves overall, we largely got what we deserve, even with Trump stoking the fire with science denial and terrible leadership.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby JuanP » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:23:02

diemos wrote:Ok.
1. We're going to ignore Belarus and Uruguay as well as most non-first world countries because their statistics aren't trustworthy


Now, there you are displaying an incredible degree of ignorance, arrogance, and bias. I won't say anything regarding Belarus because I am quite ignorant about that nation, but where Uruguay is concerned, you are 100% wrong. Uruguay's COVID-19 statistics are amongst the most trustworthy in the whole world, and more trustworthy than all First World countries, with a handful of exceptions, like New Zealand. Uruguay's statistics are definitely more reliable than the USA's. And, unlike you, I know what I am talking about because I lived 20 years in Uruguay and 30 years in the USA.

I bet you have absolutely no idea about anything regarding Uruguay or how Uruguay has managed the epidemic, its contact tracing program, its almost a century old free universal healthcare, its degree of urbanization, its life expectancy, its more than a century old free universal education system, including postgraduate courses, the number of doctors per capita it has, the numbers of COVID-19 tests, cases, and deaths it's had, which are less than 200 per million. Each and every single one of those deaths were patients who were tested multiple times, were hospitalized, had its origin traced, were diagnosed, were studied individually by virologists and epidemiologists, including contact tracing.

You are just talking out of your ass, and based on the absolute ignorance you display your opinions are completely worthless. You should not pretend to know things you are completely ignorant about. Why would anyone here believe anything you say when you display such ignorance, arrogance, and bias? As far as I am concerned you have no credibility at all.
Last edited by JuanP on Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:26:01, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby diemos » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:23:44

Outcast_Searcher wrote:However, given how the US population behaves overall, we largely got what we deserve, even with Trump stoking the fire with science denial and terrible leadership.


I was gearing myself up for a nice bout of Righteous Indignation until Europe managed to fuck it up too. Now it's harder to get too spun up.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby diemos » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:26:21

JuanP wrote:Now, there you are displaying an incredible degree of ignorance, arrogance, and bias.


Yup. That's just a statement on my part that I'm not going to invest any time or energy in evaluating how far I can trust each and every countries numbers. I knew it would piss you off. Sorry.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby JuanP » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:30:37

diemos wrote:
JuanP wrote:Now, there you are displaying an incredible degree of ignorance, arrogance, and bias.


Yup. That's just a statement on my part that I'm not going to invest any time or energy in evaluating how far I can trust each and every countries numbers. I knew it would piss you off. Sorry.


No need to apologize. To each their own. You are discrediting yourself, not me.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby diemos » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:36:49

JuanP wrote:You are discrediting yourself, not me.


Arbitrarily excluding a data point that contradicts my position would discredit me.

Arbitrarily excluding a data point that supports my position is just laziness.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby JuanP » Sun 14 Mar 2021, 13:50:53

diemos wrote:
JuanP wrote:You are discrediting yourself, not me.


Arbitrarily excluding a data point that contradicts my position would discredit me.

Arbitrarily excluding a data point that supports my position is just laziness.


Feel free to justify your behavior to yourself in any way you want. This is the end of this argument for me because from my point of view you are not worth arguing with. You were wrong, and you can't admit it, which makes you intellectually dishonest on top of everything else. Welcome to my ignore list, life is too short.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby theluckycountry » Wed 23 Aug 2023, 07:03:19

Outcast_Searcher wrote: I suspect that there will be some blowback from this in places where they're ignoring the risk, like TX and MISS.

Plus there's the whole science denial anti-vaxxer crew in the US, so whether we even get to herd immunity is still an open question... How many million people does disease X have to kill,


Ahhh yes, you went hook line and sinker for that one didn't you. Do you feel suckered yet? No I didn't think so. The human Ego knows no bounds.

Sweden has the lowest excess mortality rate after the pandemic, despite refusing to lock down

Serious holes have been poked in the world’s response to the pandemic, with Sweden emerging atop a telling list of nations least affected by Covid-19. As governments scrambled to make the idea of locking down regular life palatable throughout the Covid-19 pandemic, Sweden refused, opting for a “voluntary” approach to dealing with the spread. The nation of 10.4 million kept schools from closing throughout the biggest waves of the virus’ spread and did not mandate masks.

https://www.news.com.au/technology/scie ... te%20masks.

But let's not let reality get in the way of a good TV sales pitch and mega billions in profits for pharmaceutical corporations, the second most influential corporate block on the planet after arms dealers. I think I'll go over to youtube and watch some cat videos. They make a lot more sense than half the comments on this forum.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby theluckycountry » Wed 23 Aug 2023, 17:31:33

.
Lionsgate Brings Back Mask Mandates in Office

August 21, 2023
A Hollywood studio has instituted a mask mandate for its employees in light of the current COVID wave... The studio is also asking employees to conduct self-screening before coming to the office.

... the move comes amid some national buzz about whether mask mandates might be returning as variant EG.5 has become dominant in the United States.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movie ... 235571466/

Morris Brown College Reinstates COVID Mask Mandate
August 22, 2023
https://news.yahoo.com/morris-brown-col ... 00528.html

But we have other voices

Documents recently obtained from the National Institutes of Health suggest public health officials used inaccurate information and misrepresented medical research to advance their policy objective that masks prevent severe COVID-19 and virus transmission—despite opposing scientific evidence received from experts.

In a recently obtained letter (pdf) sent in November 2021 to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), top epidemiologist Michael Osterholm, director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota, and seven colleagues informed the agency it was promoting flawed data and excluding data that did not reinforce their narrative.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/health/se ... =ZeroHedge

This whole article is worth a read, but only for those on the fence. If you're part of the problem, if you worship Government propaganda, then don't waste your time.

Believe the science folks. Not all the science though, just "The Approved Science" you are instructed to believe.
So are we off on another merry-go-round of small business destruction and personal freedom restrictions? Oh yes, be it the Magic Virus or be it climate change measures or be it anti-terrorism measures, but you can be sure that in the years to come you will be living lives more and more like those under Stalinist Russia, or Pol Pot, or any number of dictators in past years.

It is said that Communism is bad in theory and terrible in practice but that is only from the perspective of the masses who like to run their own lives as they see fit. From the perspective of the elite classes, and remember, Stalin and his henchmen were just ShitKickers before they took the reins of power, But from their perspective, and that of the leaders and heads of capital in the West, communism has a lot of good aspects to it.

Communism I would say was actually a natural progression, a new version of the life the underclasses lived throughout the dark ages and into the renaissance (1400 and 1600). For the most part, wealthy landowners surrounded by serfs tending their estates. Just replace landowners with corporate owners, and kings and courts with Presidents and Congress and you have the same system. Oh there was religion back in the dark-ages too, what replaced that in our modern era? Science of course! The worship of technology, and money.

Don't be confused by the fact that you own a house either. You may own a pile of wood but the land is owned by the state, by the Crown. Likewise your job, your income is taxed, just as were those who worked the estates of the elite class back in the old days. 100 years ago it wasn't, did you know that? Wages were not taxed, only business profits. So good luck earthlings on the next round of austerity. And remember, you always have two choices. Believe in the 'System' you were born into, or take a chance and go your own way, make a life for yourself, one not dictated by the Empire.

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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby careinke » Thu 24 Aug 2023, 02:45:45

theluckycountry,

We disagree on some things, but you might be surprised on how much we DO agree on.

Your latest above, was a particularly nice piece. Thanks

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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby theluckycountry » Thu 24 Aug 2023, 18:32:58

careinke wrote:theluckycountry,

We disagree on some things, but you might be surprised on how much we DO agree on.

Your latest above, was a particularly nice piece. Thanks

Peace


Thanks inki, yes we do agree on a lot, and there would be something strange going on if we agreed on everything. That's the earmark of an echo chamber. Lol, I sometimes wonder if I'm wrong in my assumptions about bitcoin, it's not something you can really analyze as it's highly driven by human sentiment, time will tell there hey. As for following the government's edicts, check this out. It's beyond comment almost.

Horror: Those Who Disobeyed Barricades Survived Maui Fires

According to AP, Lahaina residents who disobeyed government road barricades survived the fires, while many who heeded orders to turn around died in their cars and homes with no way out. Now, officials are facing public outrage over why the emergency sirens weren't set off and why they prevented people from fleeing to safety.

So - no siren, no water, and barricades.


https://apnews.com/article/hawaii-fires ... a0020c40e9
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/hor ... maui-fires

Personally I think it was just a perfect storm of ineptitude, but you could make the case that at each level of government control there is a decidedly anti-human anti-citizen approach to things.

1# Corporate and government assets have first priority over private lives and possessions.
2# Do not allow alarm and disorder among the population. Keep them quiet in their homes.

I saw exactly this response from government during the 2011 floods in Brisbane, I saw it first hand as I did a 1am inspection drive of the suburbs by the river as it broke it's banks and began flooding suburban streets. There was a media blackout from 6:30pm that night after the state premier and mayor of Brisbane gave statements on the news saying there was nothing to worry about. I drove down street after street of darkened homes, all with new cars parked in the driveways. The people were asleep, they had trusted the government.

Others, precious few, were out packing possessions into their cars, little islands of activity, torches bobbing up and down as the water lapped at their feet. No sirens, no emergency txts, though I did see several police cars parked across major road junctions. The government knew what was happening, knew all along, but they didn't want to see thousands of people cluttering the roads I guess. Why was I there? How did I know? Because It was obvious the river was going to flood that night, and because I never believe the government and always assume that when they say something is under control it's the opposite.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby Newfie » Fri 25 Aug 2023, 11:13:56

I agree more ineptitude than mal intent. Equally deadly. I have seen the major highway crash due to simple snow storms arriving a few hours early.

While living in Philly I kept a folding 12’ rowboat under the back ramp. It was 3 blocks to the river and from there I could reach our big boat in 3 tides. That was kept stocked with food, water and diesel.
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Re: Opening Up the Economy Pt. 3

Unread postby jedrider » Fri 25 Aug 2023, 13:57:08

Where's the pigs analogy when you need it?
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