[KaiserJeep]

I've occasionally heard engineers described as blah blah blah etc. Some personality type? KJ fits the bill.

KJ you denigrate scientists as fuzzy-heads etc, whereas (implication being) you, an Engineer (capital B) are a down-to-earth, practical, feet-firmly-planted-on-the-ground, crew-cutted, get-things-done kind-of Space-Cowboy dude.

But Dude . . . 'serious proposals' are often political proposals. "orbital powerplants that beam energy to Earth on microwave beams". (Seriously? Americans are afraid of microwave ovens.) Political proposals are tossed out as diversions, bait, false-flags. You apparently have too much faith in the bureaucracy.

Did you note my mention of Japanese pilot microwave power broadcasts? There is a new island under construction in Tokyo Bay, complete with a ring of surrounding microwave detectors to cut the beam if it goes off target. (But next time Godzilla shows up, he's a cooked lizard.)

Do you think Americans might become interested after the Japanese demonstrate commercial success?

Now I'm NOT aware of anybody who has moved to implementation phase on the He-3/Deuterium fusion scheme, because there is no planned Earth-Moon transportation system. But if Elon Musk succeeds with his proposed Mars colony, we have the technology we need.

NASA itself is seeking funding for the orbital mirrors to illuminate Earth's darkside. There is still basic R&D on the construction of such mirrors in Earth orbit. The ESA also has such a program.

[Quinny]

There's a info-graphic somewhere demonstrating the Energy Trap that shows the scale of the PO predicament picturing how many Nuclear power plants/hydro power dams/solar panels etc etc would be needed to replace current ff usage.

Love to see one for this crazy idea!

[PrestonSturges]

Weren't the moon Nazis in "Iron Sky" mining He 3?

[Timo]

Weren't the moon Nazis in "Iron Sky" mining He 3?

Wrong movie. That was a still from He-Man 3.

[Graeme]

China to send orbiter to moon and back

China will launch its first recoverable moon orbiter later this year, the government announced, in the latest step in its ambitious space programme.

The mission will be launched before the end of the year and will travel to the moon before returning to earth, the State Administration of Science, Technology and Industry for National Defence (SASTIND) said in a statement on Sunday.

Doing so will require withstanding the high temperatures that develop when a probe re-enters the Earth's atmosphere.

The orbiter will test technology that will be be used for China's ambitious Chang'e-5 mission, which aims to gather samples from the moon's surface, the official Xinhua news agency reported.

phys.org

[ralfy]

Related:

"It Will Take 131 Years To Replace Oil, And We've Only Got 10"

http://www.businessinsider.com/131-year ... il-2010-11

[Graeme]

Again that is the view of two American academics. If America really wants to, it could replace oil in a quicker time frame. Just look at what they did during WW2. It could be done in 10 years.

[Herr Meier]

I've occasionally heard engineers described as blah blah blah etc. Some personality type? KJ fits the bill.

Yeah. An engineer's understanding and thinking is so far beyond regular Joe thinking, you won't ever understand.

Scary isn't it? Technology defines our lives, and you have to rely on engineers to keep it going, yet you don't understand a word they are talking.

[Timo]

Scary isn't it? Technology defines our lives, and you have to rely on engineers to keep it going, yet you don't understand a word they are talking.

To be fair, there are an endless disciplines of engineering, most of which hardly anybody understand. Ditto for accounting! And medicine. Engineers do, indeed, speak a different language, and depending on their chosen discipline, seem hardly human. That said, i have personally brought a few engineers back to the world of normal human living. The trick is to get them to consider solutions that are outside of their magic book of standards! Think like a normal person! Think outside the book!

[penury]

I will jst repeat what I always say about these dreams of unlimited energy. Show me a commercial working application which is producing usable energy, Today not 50 years from now. The human population as we know it does not have 50 years to wait.

[KaiserJeep]

I will jst repeat what I always say about these dreams of unlimited energy. Show me a commercial working application which is producing usable energy, Today not 50 years from now. The human population as we know it does not have 50 years to wait.

There is only one of those. Nuclear fission via conventional light water nuclear reactors.

We should be building new reactors as fast as we can to replace aging reactors. We should be going forward rapidly with full sized prototypes of 3rd generation designs. Lastly we should be doing the R&D for the pie-in-the-sky for alternatives to fossil energy. He-3/Deuterium fusion is one of those, there are other candidates.

In fact, the way to proceed is "all of the above", and let the energy marketplace sort out the winners and losers.

[Timo]

In fact, the way to proceed is "all of the above", and let the energy marketplace sort out the winners and losers.

Well, it had to end. On that statement, you lost me. The energy marketplace is exactly what put us in this collective dead-end position where we now find ourselves. Our position has transcended the depths (or shallowness) of capitalism.

Now, if by the energy marketplace you mean what proves to be the most efficient, least environmentally damaging, most cost-effective, most plentiful, and the longest lasting source of energy, then that i can agree with.

[Graeme]

Helion Energy now has Heium 3 fuel cycle for it's magneto-inertial fusion process

Helion Energy has an update on their project to achieve commercial nuclear fusion.

Helion Energy uses Magneto-Inertial Fusion: By combining the stability of steady magnetic fusion and the heating of pulsed inertial fusion, a commercially practical system has been realized that is smaller and lower cost than existing programs.

They want to create modular, distributed Power using shipping container sized, 50 Megawatt modules for base load power generation. (Nextbigfuture note - The longest shipping containers are 17 meters long and Helion talks about being 25-28 meters long)

They are using Self-Supplied Helium 3 Fusion. It is pulsed, D-He3 fusion simplifies the engineering of a fusion power plant, lowers costs, and is even cleaner than traditional fusion.

Magnetic Compression: Fuel is compressed and heated purely by magnetic fields operated with modern solid state electronics.

This eliminates inefficient, expensive laser, piston, or beam techniques used by other fusion approaches.

Direct Energy Conversion: Enabled by pulsed operation, efficient direct conversion decreases plant costs and fusion’s engineering challenges.

It is safe: With no possibility of melt-down, or hazardous nuclear waste, fusion dose not suffer the drawbacks that make fission an unattractive alternative.

nextbigfuture



Helion plans to substantially improve their Fusion Engine for 2016 and have commercially capable system by 2019

[RepublicanfromEngland]

The previous government tried to return to the moon, only for the congress and the President's office especially the then leader didn't make it a serious priority. Mr Bush was just attempting to continue what his dad couldn't do.

But debt, conflict put an end to this idea.

I am a space flight enthusiast, I view the Mars missions on NASA.gov every day.

I have used Orbiter Simulator 2010, did some short distance docking. I'm terrible with maths and orbital mechanics. But I do enjoy a small dose of the simulator, the fantasy, tiny little crafts orbiting the Earth or even the Moon or Mars and the many star systems out there only to never reach them, had to cheat to make that a reality. But that is more entertaining.

Anyway.

The constellation program could of been seen as a strategic gimmick as America's attempt at domination of the moon, and hence helium 3.

Mr Heinberg's view ten years ago as it was being setup was it was a waste of resources.

Barack has only continued with that spacecraft to travel to the moon, and may be an asteroid, that would be in lunar orbit.

[Keith_McClary]

... Lastly we should be doing the R&D for the pie-in-the-sky for alternatives to fossil energy. He-3/Deuterium fusion is one of those, there are other candidates.

In fact, the way to proceed is "all of the above", and let the energy marketplace sort out the winners and losers.

It's never clear who is included in your "we".

Is there any obstacle to prevent the "energy marketplace" from paying for "the R&D for the pie-in-the-sky for alternatives to fossil energy" ? Or do you mean "we" the taxpayers should pay for the R&D so that somebody in the "marketplace" can become a "winner" ? (That's OK with me if "we" = US taxpayers. )

[Sixstrings]

Russia Is Planning To Build A Permanent Manned Base On The Moon

Russia’s space agency is planning to build a manned moon base - launching modules into space on six separate rockets.

Russia plans to launch a lunar probe in 2024 which will scout possible locations - before landing a man on the moon in 2030.

Construction of the Luna 25 lander has already begun, the official state news agency Tass has reported.

Once the components are in place, assembly of the moon base will continue over ten years.

Moscow has previously said that it envisages the base being permanent.

Last year, deputy premier Dmitry Rogozin said: 'We are coming to the moon forever.'

In an article in the government newspaper Rossiiskaya Gazeta he wrote, ‘'The moon is not an intermediate point in the race. Ot is a separate, even a self-contained goal.

'It would hardly be rational to make some ten or 20 flights to the moon, and then wind it all up and fly to the Mars or some asteroids.

'This process has the beginning, but has no end. We are coming to the moon forever.'
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/russia-is-planning-to-build-a-permanent-manned-base-on-the-moon-095818907.html

Apparently Russia and China are both interested in the moon to harvest helium-3. Future nuclear fusion plants will require helium-3.

[Keith_McClary]

You should write your congresscritters to tell them you are eager to pay for a US moon colony program.

[KaiserJeep]

For literally billions of years the solar wind has been depositing Helium-3 on the moon in concentrations that may reach 50 ppb, which is roughly 100X the concentration on Earth. From wikipedia:

According to proponents, fusion power plants operating on deuterium and helium-3 would offer lower capital and operating costs than their competitors due to less technical complexity, higher conversion efficiency, smaller size, the absence of radioactive fuel, no air or water pollution, and only low-level radioactive waste disposal requirements. Recent estimates suggest that about $6 billion in investment capital will be required to develop and construct the first helium-3 fusion power plant. Financial breakeven at today's wholesale electricity prices (5 US cents per kilowatt-hour) would occur after five 1-gigawatt plants were on line, replacing old conventional plants or meeting new demand.

Four million tons of Lunar regolith (i.e. moondust and gravel) would have to be processed to fill a shuttle with He-3, and to completely replace fossil fuels and satisfy all the Earth's energy needs for electricity and transport, one shuttle per week would be required.

Who knows if the scheme will work? I guess the Russians, sometime around 2028.

[Lore]

After all the discussions on here, you'd think the reality would be that by 2030 the Russians and Chinese will have much more to worry about and spend their resources on then going to the moon. It will be the long dark ages of contraction not expansion.