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Government Shutdown USA

A forum for discussion of regional topics including oil depletion but also government, society, and the future.

Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Fri 25 Jan 2019, 20:33:08

This is a total cave on the part of Trump. He's lost the power struggle, he'll have no second term, and may not even win the R candidacy.

I doubt if he even understands that he lost it all. No wall, no 2nd term, a lame duck for half his 1st term.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby jedrider » Fri 25 Jan 2019, 20:41:56

Kaiser, this was all apparent last month. Trump was already a has been.

The question remains whether the Republican party is also a has been?

Got to love Trump, though, the destroyer of Political Parties.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Cog » Fri 25 Jan 2019, 21:48:24

Lets see what happens in three weeks.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby mmasters » Fri 25 Jan 2019, 23:10:06

I don't see what the big deal is. Trump is trying to work the system, if it can't be worked then he can just declare a state of emergency and have the military build the wall. Come election time a little over a year from now there will be great news regarding crime and drugs. Trump will be a national hero and get reelected.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 25 Jan 2019, 23:44:15

mmasters wrote:I don't see what the big deal is. Trump is trying to work the system, if it can't be worked then he can just declare a state of emergency and have the military build the wall. Come election time a little over a year from now there will be great news regarding crime and drugs. Trump will be a national hero and get reelected.

So fact checking means nothing to you, eh?

So how will a wall prevent people from coming in through ports including airports, both oceans, and the north? How will a wall prevent people who come in for work visas from just staying (which is the largest source of illegals)?
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 02:30:29

KaiserJeep wrote: Trump.... lost it all.


Gosh how sad.

What can Trump do to regain popularity?

I know...he can start a little war somewhere. The old "wag the dog" trick.

People always rally around the the flag (and the president holding the flag) when the US goes to war against some insignificant little foe.

I know.....how about if the US invades Venezuela and returns democracy (and capitalism) to that belaugured little oil rich country. That might make Trump popular again, eh?

Cheers!
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 06:27:33

Plantagenet wrote:I know.....how about if the US invades Venezuela and returns democracy (and capitalism) to that belaugured little oil rich country. That might make Trump popular again, eh?

Cheers!
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Newfie » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 07:01:06

Yeah, I’m not so sure how this will all play out in the end. I’m amazed he was elected in the first place, probably not possible without Hillaries silly mistakes, but here he is.

He most likely lost something in his base but may have come out seeming more reasonable in the end. And if now there is some illegal who does some nasty dead he can use that.

His mistake was to make the fight about a “wall”, not about illegal immigration itself. I agree that a complete wall is not a good use of money. But I would like to see some much stronger measures to control immigration. I’d like to see existing laws enforced, remove folks who have overstayed their visas, enforcement of employment rules, and the elimination of “sanctuary” jurisdictions.

I’m dead set against open borders. If Trump can get some significant concessions out of the Ds now then he may not be so bad off.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Newfie » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 07:40:01

I just looked at CNN headlines online. Showed it to my Wife, who hates Trump and the wall. Her reaction was “My God! You would think they would stress the reopening of government.”

No, it’s all reveling in how Pelozi beat Trump at his own game. There is nothing of substance there, it’s just oozing ego and hatred.

Apart for the Wall and shutdown I think elements of the Left and much of mainstream media have completly lost their nut and are on a power high.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. I would not be suprised to see the D party disintegrate as these power players all turn on one another as they try for their share of the spoils of war. It will be an interesting few years ahead.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby mmasters » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 13:58:31

Outcast_Searcher wrote:
mmasters wrote:I don't see what the big deal is. Trump is trying to work the system, if it can't be worked then he can just declare a state of emergency and have the military build the wall. Come election time a little over a year from now there will be great news regarding crime and drugs. Trump will be a national hero and get reelected.

So fact checking means nothing to you, eh?

So how will a wall prevent people from coming in through ports including airports, both oceans, and the north? How will a wall prevent people who come in for work visas from just staying (which is the largest source of illegals)?

Bad hombres and drugs are what I'm most concerned about. The wall is a cheap and effective solution. It's common sense.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 14:01:13

Newfie wrote:It will be interesting to see how this plays out. I would not be suprised to see the D party disintegrate as these power players all turn on one another as they try for their share of the spoils of war. It will be an interesting few years ahead.

Given how loony and grasping it appears the far left is getting to be re tax proposals, that sounds like a reasonably likely outcome generally.

Ironic. Just when the left could have something to seize on, they're unlikely to have the discipline and wisdom to work together and do so.

BOTH sides seem to have lost their way in terms of having solid basic principles AND the integrity to truly stand and work for them, even when it's inconvenient short term. No wonder I'm dismayed at the idea of getting a POTUS I'd be confident in.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 14:04:47

mmasters wrote:
Outcast_Searcher wrote:
mmasters wrote:I don't see what the big deal is. Trump is trying to work the system, if it can't be worked then he can just declare a state of emergency and have the military build the wall. Come election time a little over a year from now there will be great news regarding crime and drugs. Trump will be a national hero and get reelected.

So fact checking means nothing to you, eh?

So how will a wall prevent people from coming in through ports including airports, both oceans, and the north? How will a wall prevent people who come in for work visas from just staying (which is the largest source of illegals)?

Bad hombres and drugs are what I'm most concerned about. The wall is a cheap and effective solution. It's common sense.

So just ignoring the other three sides of the US for access and ignoring airports, ship ports, etc. is "common sense" to you? What planet are you from, re this issue? You think that "bad hombres" can't hire boats? Can't hide things? Can't ride in planes? Can't fake papers?

I'm not saying a wall won't help. It just won't help all that much -- especially re the big / serious criminals, who HAVE MEANS.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby mmasters » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 14:22:36

Outcast_Searcher wrote:
mmasters wrote:
Outcast_Searcher wrote:
mmasters wrote:I don't see what the big deal is. Trump is trying to work the system, if it can't be worked then he can just declare a state of emergency and have the military build the wall. Come election time a little over a year from now there will be great news regarding crime and drugs. Trump will be a national hero and get reelected.

So fact checking means nothing to you, eh?

So how will a wall prevent people from coming in through ports including airports, both oceans, and the north? How will a wall prevent people who come in for work visas from just staying (which is the largest source of illegals)?

Bad hombres and drugs are what I'm most concerned about. The wall is a cheap and effective solution. It's common sense.

So just ignoring the other three sides of the US for access and ignoring airports, ship ports, etc. is "common sense" to you? What planet are you from, re this issue? You think that "bad hombres" can't hire boats? Can't hide things? Can't ride in planes? Can't fake papers?

I'm not saying a wall won't help. It just won't help all that much -- especially re the big / serious criminals, who HAVE MEANS.

Sure, it's not a total solution to the problem, but if it solves at least half of the problem it's well worth it.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 14:25:04

It was never about a wall or immigration or even security. It was always a power struggle.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Newfie » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 15:26:50

^^^+1
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Cid_Yama » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 15:35:57

Yes, KJ. Lincoln made a mistake in not just allowing them to succeed from the Union in the first place. Now they have infiltrated the entire country so that succession will no longer work.

We could have just dumped most all of them at once and been better off for it.

They would have been a third world agricultural country, since the Union had the industry.

Then we could have just built a wall. :lol:
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 17:08:22

Cid, I cannot fathom the meaning of your words. I am guessing you were attempting sarcasm and failed.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby Cog » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 18:10:47

I think Cid is implying that all southerners are racists. Or that they voted for Trump which means they are racists as well. LOL
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby jedrider » Sat 26 Jan 2019, 19:08:56

Cog wrote:I think Cid is implying that all southerners are racists. Or that they voted for Trump which means they are racists as well. LOL


Yes, that's a bad road to go down. The fact is that Trump has supporters in every state and there are bonafide Liberals in every state as well. It is just the electoral anomaly that upset the cart.
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Re: Government Shutdown USA

Unread postby diemos » Mon 28 Jan 2019, 05:53:09

All I know is that it was a treat to watch the master negotiator at work.

"The art of the squeal."

LOL.
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