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Noam Chomsky on the Breakdown of American Society and a World in Transition
The US is facing uncertain times. While it remains the only global superpower, it is no longer able to influence events and outcomes to its liking, at least not for the most part. Frustration and worry about the risk of upcoming disasters seem to far outweigh US voters’ hopes for a more rational and just world order. Meanwhile, Noam Chomsky argues, the rise and popularity of Donald Trump is occurring due to the fact that US society is breaking down.
In this exclusive interview with Truthout, Noam Chomsky addresses contemporary developments in both the United States and around the world and challenges prevailing views about class warfare, neoliberalism as the outcome of economic laws, the role of the US as a global power, the status of emerging economies and the power of the Israel Lobby.
CJ Polychroniou: Noam, you have said that the rise of Donald Trump is largely due to the breakdown of American society. What exactly do you mean by this?
Noam Chomsky: The state-corporate programs of the past 35 or so years have had devastating effects on the majority of the population, with stagnation, decline and sharply enhanced inequality being the most direct outcomes. This has created fear and has left people feeling isolated, helpless, victims of powerful forces they can neither understand or influence. The breakdown is not caused by economic laws. They are policies, a kind of class war initiated by the rich and powerful against the working population and the poor. This is what defines the neoliberalism period, not only in the US but in Europe and elsewhere. Trump is appealing to those who sense and experience the breakdown of American society — to deep feelings of anger, fear, frustration, hopelessness, probably among sectors of the population that are seeing an increase in mortality, something unheard of apart from war.
Class warfare remains as vicious and one-sided as ever. Neoliberal governance over the last thirty years, regardless if there was a Republican or a Democratic administration in place, has intensified immensely the processes of exploitation and induced ever-larger gaps between haves and have-nots in American society. Moreover, I don’t see neoliberal class politics being on retreat in spite of the opportunities that opened up because of the last financial crisis and by having a centrist Democrat in the White House.
The business classes, which largely run the country, are highly class conscious. It is not a distortion to describe them as vulgar Marxists, with values and commitments reversed. It was not until 30 years ago that the head of the most powerful union recognized and criticized the “one-sided class war” that is relentlessly waged by the business world. It has succeeded in achieving the results you describe. However, neoliberal policies are in shambles. They have come to harm the most powerful and privileged (who only partially accepted them for themselves in the first place), so they cannot be sustained.
Neoliberal policies are in shambles. They have come to harm the most powerful and privileged, so they cannot be sustained.
It is rather striking to observe that the policies that the rich and powerful adopt for themselves are the precise opposite of those they dictate to the weak and poor. Thus, when Indonesia has a deep financial crisis, the instructions from the US Treasury Department (via the IMF) are to pay off the debt (to the West), to raise interest rates and thus slow the economy, to privatize (so that Western corporations can buy up their assets), and the rest of the neoliberal dogma. For ourselves, the policies are to forget about debt, to reduce interest rates to zero, to nationalize (but not to use the word) and to pour public funds into the pockets of the financial institutions, and so on. It is also striking that the dramatic contrast passes unnoticed, along with the fact that this conforms to the record of the economic history of the past several centuries, a primary reason for the separation of the first and third worlds.
Class politics is so far only marginally under attack. The Obama administration has avoided even minimal steps to end and reverse the attack on unions. Obama has even indirectly indicated his support for this attack, in interesting ways. It is worth recalling that his first trip to show his solidarity with working people (called “the middle class,” in US rhetoric) was to the Caterpillar plant in Illinois. He went there in defiance of pleas by church and human rights organizations because of Caterpillar’s grotesque role in the Israeli occupied territories, where it is a prime instrument in devastating the land and villages of “the wrong people.” But it seems not even to have been noticed that, adopting Reagan’s anti-labor policies, Caterpillar became the first industrial corporation in generations to break a powerful union by employing strike-breakers, in radical violation of international labor conventions. That left the US alone in the industrial world, along with apartheid South Africa, in tolerating such means of undermining workers’ rights and democracy — and now I presume the US is alone. It is hard to believe that the choice was accidental.
There is a widespread belief at least among some well-known political strategists that issues do not define American elections — even if the rhetoric is that candidates need to understand public opinion in order to woo voters — and we do know of course that media provide a wealth of false information on critical issues (take the mass media’s role before and during the launching of the Iraq war) or fail to provide any information at all (on labor issues, for example). Yet, there is strong evidence indicating that the American public cares about the great social, economic and foreign policy issues facing the country. For example, according to a research study released some years ago by the University of Minnesota, Americans ranked health care among the most important problems facing the country. We also know that the overwhelming majority of Americans are in support of unions. Or that they judged the war against terror to be a total failure. In the light of all of this, what’s the best way to understand the relation between media, politics and the public in contemporary American society?
It is well-established that electoral campaigns are designed so as to marginalize issues and focus on personalities, rhetorical style, body language, etc. And there are good reasons. Party managers read polls, and are well aware that on a host of major issues, both parties are well to the right of the population — not surprisingly; they are, after all, business parties. Polls show that a large majority of voters object, but those are the only choices offered to them in the business-managed electoral system, in which the most heavily funded candidate almost always wins.
Similarly, consumers might prefer decent mass transportation to a choice between two automobiles, but that option is not provided by advertisers — indeed, by markets. Ads on TV do not provide information about products; rather, they provide illusion and imagery. The same Public Relations firms that seek to undermine markets by ensuring that uninformed consumers will make irrational choices (contrary to abstract economic theories) seek to undermine democracy in the same way. And the managers are well aware of all of this. Leading figures in the industry have exulted in the business press that they have been marketing candidates like commodities ever since Reagan, and this is their greatest success yet, which they predict will provide a model for corporate executives and the marketing industry in the future.
The Obama administration has avoided even minimal steps to end and reverse the attack on unions.
You mentioned the Minnesota poll on health care. It is typical. For decades, polls have shown that health care is at or near the top of public concerns — not surprisingly, given the disastrous failure of the health care system, with per capita costs twice as high as comparable societies and some of the worst outcomes. Polls also consistently show that large majorities want a nationalized system, called “single payer,” rather like the existing Medicare system for the elderly, which is far more efficient than the privatized systems or the one introduced by Obama. When any of this is mentioned, which is rare, it is called “politically impossible” or “lacking political support” — meaning that the insurance and pharmaceutical industries, and others who benefit from the current system, object. We gained an interesting insight into the workings of American democracy from the fact that in 2008, unlike 2004, the Democratic candidates — first Edwards, then Clinton and Obama — came forward with proposals that at least begun to approach what the public has wanted for decades. Why? Not because of a shift in public attitudes, which have remained steady. Rather, [the] manufacturing industry has been suffering from the costly and inefficient privatized health care system, and the enormous privileges granted, by law, to the pharmaceutical industries. When a large sector of concentrated capital favors some program, it becomes “politically possible” and has “political support.” Just as revealing as the facts themselves is that they are not noticed.
Much the same is true on many other issues, domestic and international.
The US economy is facing myriad problems, although profits for the rich and corporations returned long ago to the levels they were prior to the eruption of the 2008 financial crisis. But the one single problem which most of academic and financial analysts seem to focus on as being of most critical nature is that of government debt. According to mainstream analysts, US debt is already out of control, which is why they have been arguing consistently against big economic stimulus packages to boost growth, contending that such measures will only push the US deeper into debt. What is the likely impact that a ballooning debt will have on the American economy and on international investor’s confidence in the event of a new financial crisis?
No one really knows. Debt has been far higher in the past, particularly after World War II. But that was overcome thanks to the remarkable economic growth under the wartime semi-command economy. So we know that if government stimulus spurs sustained economic growth, the debt can be controlled. And there are other devices, such as inflation. But the rest is very much guesswork. The main funders — primarily China, Japan, oil producers — might decide to shift their funds elsewhere for higher profits. But there are few signs of such developments, and they are not too likely. The funders have a stake in sustaining the US considerable economy for their own exports. There is no way to make confident predictions, but it seems clear that the entire world is in a tenuous situation, to say the least.
You seem to believe, in contrast to so many others, that the US remains a global economic, political and of course military superpower even after the latest crisis — and I do have the same impression, as well, as the rest of the world economies are not only not in any shape to challenge America’s hegemony but are looking toward the US as a savior of the global economy. What do you see as the competitive advantages that US capitalism has over the EU economy and the newly emerging economies in Asia?
The 2007-08 financial crisis in large measure originated in the US, but its major competitors — Europe and Japan — ended up suffering more severely, and the US remained the choice location for investors who are looking for security in a time of crisis. The advantages of the US are substantial. It has extensive internal resources. It is unified, an important fact. Until the civil war in the 1860s, the phrase “United States” was plural (as it still is in European languages). But since then the phrase has been singular, in standard English. Policies designed in Washington by state power and concentrated capital apply to the whole country. That is far harder in Europe. A couple of years after the eruption of the latest global financial crisis, the European Commission task force issued a report saying that “Europe needs new bodies to monitor systemic risk and co-ordinate oversight of financial institutions across the region’s patchwork of supervision,” though the task force, headed then by a former French central banker, “stopped well short of suggesting a single European watchdog” — which the US can have any time it wants. For Europe, it would be “an almost impossible mission,” the task force leader said. [Several] analysts, including the Financial Times, have described such a goal as politically impossible, “a step too far for many member states reluctant to cede authority in this area.” There are many other advantages to unity. Some of the harmful effects of European inability to coordinate reactions to the crisis have been widely discussed by European economists.
When a large sector of concentrated capital favors some program, it becomes “politically possible” and has “political support.”
The historical roots of these differences between Europe and the US are familiar. Centuries of … conflict imposed a nation-state system in Europe, and the experience of World War II convinced Europeans that they must abandon their traditional sport of slaughtering one another, because the next try would be the last. So we have what political scientists like to call “a democratic peace,” though it is far from clear that democracy has much to do with it. In contrast, the US is a settler-colonial state, which [murdered] the indigenous population and consigned the remnants to “reservations,” while conquering half of Mexico, then expanding beyond. Far more than in Europe, the rich internal diversity was destroyed. The civil war cemented central authority, and uniformity in other domains as well: national language, cultural patterns, huge state-corporate social engineering projects such as the suburbanization of the society, massive central subsidy of advanced industry by research and development, procurement and other devices, and much else.
The new emerging economies in Asia have incredible internal problems, unknown in the West. We know more about India than China, because it is a more open society. There are reasons why it ranks 130th in the Human Development Index (about where it was before the partial neoliberal reforms); China ranks 90th, and the rank could be worse if more were known about it. That only scratches the surface. In the 18th century, China and India were the commercial and industrial centers of the world, with sophisticated market systems, advanced health levels by comparative standards, and so on. But imperial conquest and economic policies (state intervention for the rich, free markets rammed down the throats of the poor) left them in miserable conditions. It is notable that the one country of the [global] South that developed was Japan, the one country that was not colonized. The correlation is not accidental.
Is the US still dictating IMF policies?
It’s opaque, but my understanding is that IMF’s economists are supposed to be, maybe are, somewhat independent of the political people. In the case of Greece, and austerity generally, the economists have come out with some strongly critical papers in the Brussels programs, but the political people seem to be ignoring them.
On the foreign policy front, the “war on terror” seems to be a never ending enterprise and, as with the Hydra monster, a new head pops when one is cut off. Can massive interventions of force wipe out terrorist organizations like ISIS?
Upon taking office, Obama expanded intervention forces and stepped up the wars in Afghanistan and Pakistan, just as he had promised he would do. There were peaceful options, some recommended right in the mainstream: in Foreign Affairs, for example. But these did not fall under consideration. Afghan president Hamid Karzai’s first message to Obama, which went unanswered, was a request to stop bombing civilians. Karzai also informed a UN delegation that he wanted a timetable for withdrawal of foreign (meaning US) troops. Immediately he fell out of favor in Washington, and accordingly shifted from a media favorite to “unreliable,” “corrupt,” etc. — which was no more true than when he was feted as our “our man” in Kabul. Obama sent many more troops and stepped up bombing on both sides of the Afghan-Pakistan border — the Durand line, an artificial border established by the British, which cuts the Pashtun areas in two and which the people have never accepted. Afghanistan in the past often pressed for obliterating it.
The entire world is in a tenuous situation, to say the least.
That is the central component of the “war on terror.” It was certain to stimulate terror, just as the invasion of Iraq did, and as resort to force does quite generally. Force can succeed. The existence of the US is one illustration. The Russians in Chechnya is another. But it has to be overwhelming, and there are probably too many tentacles to wipe out the terrorist monster that was largely created by Reagan and his associates, since nurtured by others. ISIS is the latest one, and a far more brutal organization than al-Qaeda. It is also different in the sense that it has territorial claims. It can be wiped out through massive employment of troops on the ground, but that won’t end the emergence of similar-minded organizations. Violence begets violence.
US relations with China have gone through different phases over the past few decades, and it is hard to get a handle on where things stand today. Do you anticipate future US-Sino relations to improve or deteriorate?
The US has a love-hate relation with China. China’s abysmal wages, working conditions, and lack of environmental constraints are a great boon to US and other Western manufacturers who transfer operations there, and to the huge retail industry, which can obtain cheap goods. And the US now relies on China, Japan and others to sustain its own economy. But China poses problems as well. It does not intimidate easily… When the US shakes its fist at Europe and tells Europeans to stop doing business with Iran, they mostly comply. China doesn’t pay much attention. That’s frightening. There is a long history of conjuring up imaginary Chinese threats. It continues.
Do you see China being in a position any time soon to pose a threat to US global interests?
Among the great powers, China has been the most reserved in use of force, even military preparations. So much so that leading US strategic analysts (John Steinbrunner and Nancy Gallagher, writing in the journal of the ultra-respectable American Academy of Arts and Sciences) called on China some years ago to lead a coalition of peace-loving nations to confront the US aggressive militarism that they think is leading to “ultimate doom.” There is little indication of any significant change in that respect. But China does not follow orders, and is taking steps to gain access to energy and other resources around the world. That constitutes a threat.
Indian-Pakistani relations pose clearly a major challenge in US foreign policy. Is this a situation the US can actually have under control?
To a limited extent. And the situation is highly volatile. There is constant ongoing violence in Kashmir — state terror by India, Pakistan-based terrorists. And much more, as the recent Mumbai bombings revealed. There are also possible ways to reduce tensions. One is a planned pipeline to India through Pakistan from Iran, the natural source of energy for India. Presumably, Washington’s decision to undermine the Nonproliferation treaty by granting India access to nuclear technology was in part motivated by the hope of undercutting this option, and bringing India to join in Washington’s campaign against Iran. It also may be a related issue in Afghanistan, where there has long been discussion of a pipeline (TAPI) from Turkmenistan through Afghanistan to Pakistan and then India. It is probably not a very live issue, but quite possibly is in the background. The “great game” of the 19th century is alive and well.
In many circles, there is a widespread impression that the Israel lobby calls the shots in US foreign policy in the Middle East. Is the power of the Israel lobby so strong that it can have sway over a superpower?
My friend Gilbert Achcar, a noted specialist on the Middle East and international affairs generally, describes that idea as “phantasmagoric.” Rightly. It is not the lobby that intimidates US high tech industry to expand its investments in Israel, or that twists the arm of the US government so that it will pre-position supplies there for later US military operations and intensify close military and intelligence relations.
When the lobby’s goals conform to perceived US strategic and economic interests, it generally gets its way: crushing of Palestinians, for example, a matter of little concern to US state-corporate power. When goals diverge, as often happens, the Lobby quickly disappears, knowing better than to confront authentic power.
I agree totally with your analysis, but I think you would also agree that the Israel lobby is influential enough, and beyond whatever economic and political leverage it carries, that criticisms of Israel still cause hysterical reactions in the US — and you certainly have been a target of right-wing Zionists for many years. To what do we attribute this intangible influence on the part of the Israel lobby over American public opinion?
That is all true, though much less so than in recent years. It is not really power over public opinion. In numbers, by far the largest support for Israeli actions is independent of the lobby: Christian religious fundamentalist. British and American Zionism preceded the Zionist movement, based on providentialist interpretations of Biblical prophecies. The population at large supports the two-state settlement, doubtless unaware that the US has been unilaterally blocking it. Among educated sectors, including Jewish intellectuals, there was little interest in Israel before its great military victory in 1967, which really established the US-Israeli alliance. That led to a major love affair with Israel on the part of the educated classes. Israel’s military prowess and the US-Israel alliance provided an irresistible temptation to combine support for Washington with worship of power and humanitarian pretexts… But to put it in perspective, reactions to criticism of US crimes are at least as severe, often more so. If I count up the death threats I have received over the years, or the diatribes in journals of opinion, Israel is far from the leading factor. The phenomenon is by no means restricted to the US. Despite much self-delusion, Western Europe is not very different — though, of course, it is more open to criticism of US actions. The crimes of others usually tend to be welcome, offering opportunities to posture about one’s profound moral commitments.
Under Erdogan, Turkey has been in a process of unfolding a new-Ottoman strategy towards the Middle East and Central Asia. Is the unfolding of this grand strategy taking place with the collaboration or the opposition of the United States?
Turkey of course has been a very significant US ally, so much so that under Clinton it became the leading recipient of US arms (after Israel and Egypt, in a separate category). Clinton poured arms into Turkey to help it carry out a vast campaign of murder, destruction, and terror against its Kurdish minority. Turkey has also been a major ally of Israel since 1958, part of a general alliance of non-Arab states, under the US aegis, with the task of ensuring control over the world’s major energy sources by protecting the ruling dictators against what is called “radical nationalism” — a euphemism for the populations. US-Turkish relations have sometimes been strained. That was particularly true in the build-up to the US invasion of Iraq, when the Turkish government, bowing to the will of 95% of the population, refused to join. That caused fury in the US. Paul Wolfowitz was dispatched to order the disobedient government to mend its evil ways, to apologize to the US and to recognize that its duty is to help the US. These well-publicized events in no way undermined Wolfowitz’s reputation in the liberal media as the “idealist-in-chief” of the Bush administration, utterly dedicated to promoting democracy. Relations are somewhat tense today too, though the alliance is in place. Turkey has quite natural potential relations with Iran and Central Asia and might be inclined to pursue them, perhaps raising tensions with Washington again. But it does not look too likely right now.
On the western front, are plans for the eastward expansion of NATO, which go back to the era of Bill Clinton, still in place?
One of Clinton’s major crimes in my opinion — and there were many — was to expand NATO to the East, in violation of a firm pledge to Gorbachev by his predecessors after Gorbachev made the astonishing concession to allow a united German to join a hostile military alliance. These very serious provocations were carried forward by Bush, along with a posture of aggressive militarism which, as predicted, elicited strong reactions from Russia. But American redlines are already placed on Russia’s borders.
What are your views about the EU? It is still largely a trailblazer for neoliberalism and hardly a bulwark for US aggression. But do you see any signs that it can emerge at some point as a constructive, influential actor on the world stage?
It could. That is a decision for Europeans to make. Some have favored taking an independent stance, notably De Gaulle. But by and large European elites have preferred passivity, following pretty much in Washington’s footsteps.
61 Comments on "Noam Chomsky on the Breakdown of American Society and a World in Transition"
onlooker on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 12:29 pm
I have read much from Noam Chomsky and feel he really is as many people see him an intellectual who articulates very well the place of the US within the planet. So, I think he is right on that the US is still a force to be reckoned with and also the whole sorry saga of the Neoliberal policies. I can also understand as he does, why so many around the world hate the US for surreptitiously and overtly involving and intruding on the affairs on so many countries. In particular Mr. Chomsky points out that the War on Terror is intended mainly to unleash terror and in so doing cow many to comply including domestically a frightened population looking for Big Govt to protect them. As for his take on Trump’s appeal, yes he appeals to the close minded and frightened people whose knee jerk reaction is to blame others for their woes. So all in all to uncover the nature of the Empire ie. the US, read literature from Mr. Chomsky as it clarifies much.
Hello on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 1:42 pm
Corporations must be limited in size and power.
Anonymous on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 2:22 pm
Well, onlooker, there is a reason many refer to it as the uS’s Global War OF Terror, not ‘on’.
Of course, chumsky doesn’t care for the trumpster that much. But if tumpster is supposedly a sign the empire is breaking down, what was bush, or the clintons, or Ronny Raygun even? Or the current spokesman for empire, but politically powerless obomber for that matter?
JuanP on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 3:06 pm
“So we know that if government stimulus spurs sustained economic growth, the debt can be controlled.”
Sustained economic growth is not possible in a finite world no matter what the government does. I like Chomsky but I think old age has caught up with his mind.
Apneaman on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 3:56 pm
Chris Martenson podcast
Dmitry Orlov: The US Is Sleepwalking Towards A Nuclear Confrontation
“Following his cautionary analysis on the increasing tension between the US/NATO and Russia, Chris interview Dmitry Orlov this week about the potential likelihood for actual direct conflict to break out between the world powers.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95ODlPasjCM&ab_channel=ChrisMartensondotcom
Plantagenet on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 4:59 pm
Good to see Noam Chomsky bashing Obama for the hash he has made of the economy and the US healthcare system.
Chomsky’s critique of the neoliberal world order is right on the mark, as usual!!
Cheers!
dn32844 on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 5:45 pm
When a government puts its entire attention on its war machine and militarism and forgets infrastructures of country and welfare of a large class of its nation, it begins its declining point.
david markun on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 5:54 pm
shame on you for quoting this pissant moron: oh yes, the Mossad was behind 9-11 right mr chimsky.
makati1 on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 6:36 pm
All but david’s remarks are spot on. David has those blinders on pretty tight and is guzzling the Us gov’t Koolaid. Mossad, Saudi Arabia, and the US are to be blamed for 9-11.
Most of the world hates the Us and that will eventually evolve into a nuclear exchange in the future. Neither China nor Russia are going to kneel before the Us bully. At some point they will say “Enough is Enough” and the missiles will fly. The US will be gone under radioactive clouds. It’s missile shield another failure. It’s ability to retaliate limited by other shields that are effective.
Do I want this to happen? Nope. I have family in the US that I care about very much. Can I prevent it? Nope. It has gotten too far into the game to be stopped by one old man. Can Americans stop it? Probably not, but they will not even try. They are either brainwashed or too firmly attached to the government teat to even try.
A quote comes to mind:
“Those who live by the sword, die by the sword.”
And The US has been swinging that sword all over the world since WW2. Blow-back is gonna be a really horrible bitch for America”
spiderlegs on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 7:26 pm
I would suggest that makati1’s comments to be the most accurate of the bunch
makati1 on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 7:38 pm
The steady dumbing down of America:
“Wayne State University Drops Math As General Requirement, Will Replace It With “Diversity””
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-06-19/wayne-state-university-drops-math-general-requirement-will-replace-it-diversity
‘Dahh. I don’t know” is the new American Motto, soon to be on every dollar bill.
Tom Aparo on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 7:58 pm
The simple truth is that Donald Trump is not a politician. That explains his popularity and Bernie Sanders is not seen as the Washington establishment thus explaining his popularity in a nutshell as well. Electing the same old corrupt politicians that didn’t work before and expecting a better outcome now is suspiciously close to a definition of insanity.
Bruce on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 8:00 pm
The breakdown of American society is EASY to explain: thanks to the disease of Liberal politics, America has turned her back on GOD and embraced sexual perversion and violence in all walks of life. Break His commandments and His blessings are removed. Repent and return to GOD in prayer and deed and His blessings and protection will be restored. It’s no longer “God bless America”…the cry must be “America bless God!”
makati1 on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 8:22 pm
Bruce, take your fairy tales somewhere else. Greed and lust for power has changed America, not some sky god. It has always been there and the more “righteous” a man is, the more likely he will be pointing at others while he robs the poor and stabs the innocent.
Which god? Yours? Mine? You DO know that Muslims worship the same god as Christians and Jews don’t you? Same sky personage, but they ALL kill reach other in His name claiming they are doing His will. Doesn’t that sound like insanity? LOL
Bendeguz79 on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 9:02 pm
Oretty fair assesment of the world today and the major players’ role. Likely will prove the age old saying that empires rise just to fall. Neither are do they fall by conquiests but by thier own power. Go corrupt, bankrupt and disintigrate, as history of the world prove it.
China is the 21st. century’s super power, Russia is of the next century, if they can get their act together.
No worry of major wars between the present challangers. Us is faiding slowly but surely economically and financially. China will just “overtkes”, as Krushchov stated decades ago. As he was mis-translated by the undertakers vocabulary. No wonder China is spending substantial summs to influence US political outcomes.
Disorder and chaos in the Mulim and developing world will create serious humanitarian, economic and military problems in the near future, as exoected.
But as the saying is, when the peasants go hungry, they will storm the castlle wals.
Be ready to enjoy a more over-populated, crowded, angry and violent world.
Walt Dooles on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 9:26 pm
Chomsky ! a good man. Sincere, concerned, caring, dedicated to humanity. If he could have brought himself to criticize PUTZUS in ’07 – ’08, it would have helped.
Bloomer on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 9:28 pm
Its so hypocritical that Western nations fight wars in the name of democracy, yet continue to trade with countries like China and Saudi Arabia, where little human rights exist.
North Americans have lost their right to collective bargaining under so call right to work legislation. How long before we lose our right to free speech and expression?
Boat on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 10:35 pm
The world has always had problems. News flash, we’re living in the best of times. Large percentages of humans live in fear as their forefathers did and their forefathers etc. Humans of course complicate any issue because of self interest but of course what would you expect.
This era has cooperated with each other mostly through trade and advanced living conditions for hundreds of millions of people. Population and pollution overshoot are a byproduct of this succes. We will see if working together works as climate change takes a deep and deeper toll. Or will self interest win the day.
bobalula on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 10:37 pm
“This is what defines the neoliberalism period, not only in the US but in Europe and elsewhere. But by and large European elites have preferred passivity, following pretty much in Washington’s footstep”
Careful, now. Euros are by their own humble admission the best people to ever grace the Earth and the US is made up of nothing but the rabble that couldn’t cut it in the Old World intellectually, morally and ethically
Luis Castro on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 10:49 pm
I feel great respect for Mr Chomsky like linguist but I think that like political analist Mr Chomsky is a mummy!
Boat on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 10:55 pm
bobalula
“the US is made up of nothing but the rabble that couldn’t cut it in the Old World intellectually, morally and ethically”
You mean the rabble who didn’t own a castle and at the point of a sword paid taxes.
matthew mccorry on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 11:03 pm
You monkey’s couldn’t pull a piece of fruit from a jar.
makati1 on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 11:04 pm
Boat, do you mean the rabble who didn’t own a corporation and at the point of a sword paid taxes? Sounds like 2016 America, doesn’t it? Did you know that you pay
“A List Of 97 Taxes Americans Pay Every Year”
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-03-25/list-97-taxes-americans-pay-every-year
“According to The Tax Foundation, the average American has to work until April 17th just to pay federal, state, and local taxes. Back in 1900, “Tax Freedom Day” came on January 22nd.”
“When the U.S. government first implemented a personal income tax back in 1913, the vast majority of the population paid a rate of just 1 percent, and the highest marginal tax rate was just 7 percent.”
How does it feel to be a serf?
Boat on Sun, 19th Jun 2016 11:56 pm
mak,
And yet 450 billion in taxes are not paid every year. The Republican response was to cut the enforcement division of the IRS.
Lol, In 1913 all you had was horses and farmers. I like netflix, air conditioning, my car, truck, refrigerators, freezers and stoves. Not the wood fed ones. I don’t mind being a serf. Proud of it. Good at it. You apparently spent to much time on your ass. I always liked working for a living.
makati1 on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 12:06 am
Boat, you make a perfect American. You love your slavery. Too bad. Those luxuries are going away. Then all you will have is your chains.
Boat on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 12:13 am
mak,
“According to The Tax Foundation, the average American has to work until April 17th just to pay federal, state, and local taxes. Back in 1900, “Tax Freedom Day” came on January 22nd.”
You know how to beat taxes? Pay more of them. When I was young I worked a ton of overtime so I could chase women in style. Advanced at work then chased women with less overtime. Advanced again and chased women with no overtime. Became a supervisor at 28, paid more taxes and had more money than I needed and have been investing ever since. You act like a serf has a bad life and taxes are bad. Your wrong. Great country, great life. Would do it over the same.
Boat on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 12:13 am
mak,
“According to The Tax Foundation, the average American has to work until April 17th just to pay federal, state, and local taxes. Back in 1900, “Tax Freedom Day” came on January 22nd.”
You know how to beat taxes? Pay more of them. When I was young I worked a ton of overtime so I could chase women in style. Advanced at work then chased women with less overtime. Advanced again and chased women with no overtime. Became a supervisor at 28, paid more taxes and had more money than I needed and have been investing ever since. You act like a serf has a bad life and taxes are bad. Your wrong. Great country, great life. Would do it over the same.
John Perry on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 12:40 am
Chomsky is interesting as always, and generally shows a deep grasp of history. I sometimes think he suffers from seeing all politics in the world as a reaction to American actions, a common problem for Americans of both the right and left. China does not, indeed, “follow orders”, but their perspective on history is much different than America’s, both because the Chinese have a long history and because they have been both a dominant and a dominated nation. I think they have their own notions of power, dominance and history. The Western model have been the master script for world politics since the time of the East India Trading Companies. I think the Chinese believe the Western Era is coming to an end due to mismanagement of the world it has made. The Chinese expect their own time on the stage. They are waiting for the curtain to fall. Why should they obey the orders of a dying King, when they feel ready to wear the crown?
Fayce Berke on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 1:13 am
Chomsky is Jewish… he carefully obfuscates facts while he describes what he ‘sees’ as the truth… while on the other hand he panders to populism
makati1 on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 1:23 am
You are a fool, Boat. I think a lot of brag, and no truth. You deserve what is coming.
“Big Hat … No Cattle”. Lots of bullshit.
makati1 on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 1:38 am
John, you covered it well.
“I think the Chinese believe the Western Era is coming to an end due to mismanagement of the world it has made. The Chinese expect their own time on the stage. They are waiting for the curtain to fall. Why should they obey the orders of a dying King, when they feel ready to wear the crown?”
Many see only the (“obvious” to Westerners) downfall of China. I see a China waiting for the collapse of the West. Perhaps even encouraging it along. Then all debts will be canceled. Something the Western (American) elite cannot do or they lose their power and wealth. China has real wealth, and now, most of the industrial production of the West.
By the time of the collapse, the Chinese will have dumped most of their almost worthless paper dollars into buying land, mines and wells all over the world, using American’s own cash as a weapon against America. They will have scattered tens of millions of their people to manage, work in and secure, these far flung possessions, easing the population pressure at home.
I would never presume to underestimate a country with 5,000+ years of history and experience. China could lose the population of the Us in a war and never miss them. The same cannot be said for the West.
Apneaman on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 1:49 am
Boat, do you give your
masterboss free blow jobs too? Bend over boat, it’s payday.theedrich on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 3:18 am
The thing that the “conservative” Repubs can’t get through their heads is that the U.S. Constitution has been made defunct by the Supreme Court under the pressure of the Ashkenazim behind the hypnosis box. The difference between America before mid-twentieth century and after is TV. The name of the game is “Monkey see, monkey do.” The masses are monkeys. Sob stories and cunning phraseology push the plebs in whatever direction the masters want. As a result, America, followed by the rest of the West, has turned into a fetid compost heap of semi-human trash. Anyone who objects is smeared with that famous Yid-invented neologism, “racist.” With the titanic mountains of cash determining the media direction, truth does not have a chance, let alone sanity.
Chomsky thinks it is all due to Big Money, and that is to a certain extent true. But the role of propaganda is the primary means used by Big Money, since the ads sway the proles. All dictatorships seize total control of the means of propaganda as their first act. The victors get to write the history books.
As a typical Jew, Chomsky wants total racial miscegenation and the disappearance of the White race. All under cover of expiation for alleged White crimes against the innocent coloreds. It is precisely that ongoing demographic change, however, which has led to the breakup of America that once was (and which the nihilists hate so much). Universal narcotisization (through drugs from Latinoland and Asia, plus homemade poison) of the masses, the abolition of all cultural norms, followed by the economic disintegration and the evaporation of religion have undermined the culture which underpinned the Enlightenment-era Constitution. Requiescat in pace.
That Constitution is not coming back. If it is not replaced by the theocracy of Sharia law, it will be replaced by some other dictatorship, such as the kind the Demonic Party and Hotflash have in mind. In any case, modern America is a corpse.
As a postscript, we might note that the other Western countries are sliding down the same slope. Canada is becoming a washing machine for criminal money from Asia and pretending that that laundering process makes it holy as it import ungodly numbers of Asiatic underworld spawn. Everyone knows what is happening in Europe. And yet the elites screech only about how “racist” the reluctant Whites are. After all, Jesus wants White genosuicide.
Steve McGarrett on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 4:00 am
Chomsky’s intellectual arrogance knows no bounds: he is a linguist by training and yet MIT has kept him on as their socialist mouthpiece for decades. He is decidedly not an economist much less a sociologist and yet opines as if he is.
But Chomsky is half right: American society is degrading but not for the reasons he cites (he always trots out his usual scapegoats). Ironically, his leftist ilk and their America Last agenda has contributed immensely over the past four decades to a growing sense of dependency and entitlement, which has taken us farther down the road toward socialism.
I wonder what he would have to say about what is happening in Venezuela these days?
onlooker on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 5:37 am
Ha, Steve so this where you will lecture us about the evils of Socialism and how it is to blame for all the ills of the world. Yes like Capitalism and the Free Market have been the answer. NO. The hegemony of Capitalism and Neoliberalism ie. the usual scapegoats are the usual ones because they are the policies instrumental in making the world so unequal and unjust and putting a scant few at the top and everyone else a useful slave or wage servant. You talk of entitlement and dependency. Ask yourself why are people even needing help? Because Capitalism has systematically been weakening the very fabric of economic life for millions and billions. So in the end as predicted by Marx and others Capitalism would end of cannibalizing itself. Which it does by destroying the middle class in the US and other places. No need to talk about Venezuela, the whole of South and Central America have been for decades the favorite area of exploitation by the Capitalist Empire of the US. So it is no wonder that their economies show the marks and scars of this assault. Keep me busy Steve by replying and I will continue to tear down and expose how vacuous and empty your arguments are.
JuanP on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 8:10 am
Onlooker “… the whole of South and Central America have been for decades the favorite area of exploitation by the Capitalist Empire of the US.” Yes, it has been 19 decades since the Monroe Doctrine and the USA was already fucking with us before that. The USA has been screwing Latin America for over two centuries, and this is one of the reasons why it is the most hated country in the world.
JuanP on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 8:16 am
Boat “Great country, great life. Would do it over the same.” The fact that you haven’t learned shit from your mistakes is further proof of how incredibly stupid you are. You are one of the most stupid guys I’ve met in my life and confirm my impression that the more stupid and ignorant someone is the smarter and more knowledgeable they think they are.
Boat on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 9:25 am
makati1 on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 1:23 am
You are a fool, Boat. I think a lot of brag, and no truth. You deserve what is coming.
“Big Hat … No Cattle”. Lots of bullshit.
I have 2 millionair friends I worked with for over 20 years.
The first was a workaholic. He would buy old tore up houses for almost nothing and rebuild them. Last I heard he had over 20 of them rented. He did this while working swing shift and is still at the plant.
Another friend was the overtime king. We used to put in a lot of time together. Over the years my overtime slowed and then stopped. He kept working. One day he was laughing because the front office was bitching. He had 14 paychecks he hadn’t cashed. I showed him how I was investing in the market. The rest is history. 15 years later he was up to $600,000 and still working overtime.
I didn’t do as well as those boys and will never do so. But hey, I did’nt work as hard either.
makati1 on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 9:46 am
Bullshit Boat. I had two millionaire friends also. One inherited the money. The other earned it. Guess which one was the better person? Hint: not the one who inherited it. And they were multi-millionaires, not just a millionaire. Both had homes in the seven figure price range. Does Paradise Valley, Arizona ring a bell?
Brag/lie all you want. No one here believes you. Overtime does not make you a millionaire. Nor does having a few uncashed paychecks. Do you know what a million dollars is? A one with six zeros before the decimal point.
Big hat – No Cattle.
makati1 on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 9:47 am
Oops! Eight figure price range. I can give you the co-ordinates of them if you want.
Boat on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 10:18 am
mak,
I think you missed the moral to the story. There is plenty of opportunity and many paths. The key is work. Not complaining about taxes.
makati1 on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 10:27 am
Boat, you’re full of shit. The ‘opportunity’ is not from hard work, it is from scamming others who do work. Like the Stock Market Casino or drug dealing. Same difference. No one gets rich by working anymore. No one. If they claim they do, they are liars. You can only get rich by illegal means or inheritance today.
Davy on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 10:35 am
Makati Bill, you are full of shit basing a persons value on money concepts What is inheritence and what is earning and what is the difference if the persons core values are good. You are an example of a bad person and broke IMA.
onlooker on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 10:56 am
Well, Boat, I am one American who does realize he is a slave albeit a valuable slave who is given a few toys and stuff to placate him. Taxing is just a legalized extortion. In return for the money we give them they get to have their little Empire. I admire people like Mak and Davy who while rivals on this site, both understand that money is not everything and can free their mind from the slavery to it. We have been enslaved both directly and surreptitiously by a shrewd govt, that has indoctrinated us and dumbed us down to love being their slaves. I do NOT approve what “my” country has done around the world and as an American apologize to all those around the world who have been hurt mentally, physically and spiritually by the American Empire
Plantagenet on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 11:02 am
@boat
Trying to blame the Rs for the failure of the Obama administration to enforce the tax laws is silly.
Maybe if the IRS spent a little less time pleading the 5th amendment and deleting emails and hiding the records about their targeting of conservative groups, they’d could put more energy into tax enforcement.
Cheers!
Davy on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 11:09 am
Onlooker, Mak and I don’t deserve admiration at the level you are at. You have a fine disposition that reflects on solid basic values. We need more of you on this board and less of the Mak and Davy types. It takes a diverse group to find the truth but within that group it takes common respect to allow a free flow of ideas that leads us to the truth.
onlooker on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 11:15 am
TRUE Davy disrespect does not reflect well on anyone even when their right
John Perry on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 11:35 am
Makati1, perhaps. Not so sure about the Chinese forgiving debt, though. The Chinese may seek hegemony in their own way, and have no tradition of concern for individual freedoms or humanitarian issues, especially as those relate to those not of Han ancestry, just ask the Tibetans or the Uygurs or other minority peoples in China. They have also often been ruthless in their suppression or even destruction of non-Han cultures (Tibet again), and there is an element of fear in South East Asian attitudes toward the Chinese. While many of the West’s economic actions in the world have (especially Neoliberalism) have had a very negative influence in the world, some of the West’s better ideals have had a positive influence. I doubt that a world where these ideals fade out with declining Western influence will be a kinder place. The world is not about us, for good or ill, but it is a mistake to think that all Western influence has been negative. We are participants in the world, not its masters, as many among us seem to think. My point is more that Chomsky, and many other Westerners, seem to think as if everyone else in the world exists to play some part in the Western political and cultural discourse. They don’t. Why should they? But the end of the Western Era may not be an entirely good thing.
Apneaman on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 11:35 am
The United States of Anxiety
“Any minute, in any place, the terrorists could strike. We’re the only ones who can save you. Vote for us.”
“The United States has spent approximately $14 million per hour on this war, for 15 years — nearly two trillion dollars and counting — on an enemy that has no air force, no navy, no heavy missiles, no armor, no artillery, and not much money.
On 9/11/2001, Al Qaeda had about 20,000 fighters. To punish them for their attack on the World Trade Center, we invaded two countries, killed an estimated 1.3 million people (that’s just in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan) and suffered 10,000 American fatalities.”
http://www.dailyimpact.net/2016/06/17/the-united-states-of-anxiety/
onlooker on Mon, 20th Jun 2016 1:12 pm
Here is Capitalism for you. “The environment has become a new battleground for human rights,” said Billy Kyte, the lead researcher for the report. “Increasingly we are witnessing the collusion between government and corporate actors in acts of violence against activists.” Good vs Evil
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-06-20/brazil-tops-activist-killings-list-amid-commodities-price-slump