How then, do we move backwards? How does a society, with most of the people having no clue of future events, move from being dependent on a vast and intertwined network of goods and services produced by the indigenous people of whereever, to a local resource and renewable energy based society, and do so in the timeframe available (20-30 years using the most liberal extimates, 10-20 with resonable estimates, 5-10 with worst case scenarios), all the while prices on everything increasing, world politics getting more militaristic, governments continuously reducing civil liberties, shortages of goods on the market and weather patterns resembling bad Hollywood movies?
Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 661 Location: The Canada of America
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 8:24 am Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
Blacksmith wrote:
To put it simply the legal currency in the United States is the greenback, (all debts public and private), to demand payment in any other currency would be illegal.
It's not illegal to ask for, or to offer, payment in other currencies in the United States. It's only illegal to refuse payment in US dollars. If Walmart is taking euros, and you are spending euros, there's nothing wrong with that, even in Peoria. Look at the UK; there are a number of stores there that accept payment in euros. Some even make change in euros. People from the States have always expected they can just swan into anyone else's country, slap down a sawbuck, and have it accepted as "money" even though, legally, it isn't anywhere else. Well, it's about time they reciprocated, I think. Especially with our dollar. It's worth about as much, we're their biggest trading partner, and it's not like they can't give them back to us for the billions of dollars worth of stuff they want from us. The parochial attitude and cracks about "Monopoly money" are tiring and boring... especially these days that their dollar is being printed into oblivion like cat food coupons in the local Pennysaver.
Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 2:46 pm Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
Kylon wrote:
What would stop companies like Walmart from trading in Euros, and demanding Euros as payment?
Probably they see no point in that. If stores demands euros, the customers would have to buy euros(with dollars). The stores remove their fx risk but instead the trouble would be on the customer and why would he bother instead of just shopping in a dollar store that has made some price hedges.
Quote:
What would stop companies from paying their employees in Euros?
Lack of euros Companies that are not exporting to the euro-zone would have to buy euros so there is no point in that except if they pay a fixed amount in euros. But then they are up to a fx risk and if everyone would start to pay in euros, without any increase in euro income, the dollar would just decline further.
Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 661 Location: The Canada of America
Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 3:13 pm Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
xarkz wrote:
Kylon wrote:
What would stop companies like Walmart from trading in Euros, and demanding Euros as payment?
Probably they see no point in that.
Why? Plenty of countries in the past with shaky national currencies had the US dollar as de facto currency on the streets. If it gets to the point where a loaf of bread is $10 in the morning and $10.25 on the way home, you'll see people turning to currencies that represent a better store of value and a check on inflation... yeah, even in the good ol' USA. The trick will be becoming an exporting nation again to earn stable currency...
xarkz wrote:
Quote:
What would stop companies from paying their employees in Euros?
Lack of euros
This is why one exports, you see. Everything, all the time. And see what was like for the Latin Americans all those years. Face it; if the US dollar gets dumped by the central banks holding trillions of them hidden away in reserve, you're going to start seeing this. Just pray it happens slowly enough. _________________ I can has cheezburger?
Joined: Sep 24, 2007 Posts: 2584 Location: third from the sun
Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 3:26 pm Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
Nickel wrote:
I think within a decade, it'll be just one of several, and things will be rather different for the average person in the States when that support is knocked away.
Actually it could happen even faster. More countries are scheduled to join the Euro within the next 10 years, each of them will add to the currency's depth. Further US total public debt keeps increasing, which reduces confidence in the dollar as well as the value of US bonds. All this works in favor of the Euro.
Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 661 Location: The Canada of America
Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 7:00 pm Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
outcast wrote:
Here's a better question: When will commodities start being priced in Euros instead of dollars?
A lot of them already are. Why do you think the price of oil keeps going up? The people who are selling the stuff are raising the price because the dollar's been losing ground to the euro. Effectively, it's already traded against the value of the euro, just not officially denominated in it yet because of the disruptions that would cause. _________________ I can has cheezburger?
Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 3:47 pm Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
Drake wrote:
Tyler_JC wrote:
Don't believe me, try to name one large or medium sized country in Europe with a budget surplus.
I'll try: Germany
well they have a trade surplus not a budget surplus. germany is seriously a powerhouse exporter. how can a country with an economy 1 4th or fith of the us have near the same amount of imports/exports. thats been puzzling me.
Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 661 Location: The Canada of America
Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 1:26 pm Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
vetusfirma wrote:
didn't you read about how GE was using German front companies to sell to Iran and get around US restrictions.
So GE doesn't have its head up its ass trying to gaze at its own navel like the United States government does. And we're all supposed to fall down in horror because of the boogey men dreamt up by the Bush Administration? Sorry, no. You need to read something besides news organs that just photocopy White House Press Office "reports" as if they were news. _________________ I can has cheezburger?
Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 4:25 pm Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
Tyler_JC wrote:
The Eurozone has a significant trade deficit and a sizable current account deficit. Don't believe me, try to name one large or medium sized country in Europe with a budget surplus.
Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 11:14 pm Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
Blacksmith wrote:
To put it simply the legal currency in the United States is the greenback, (all debts public and private), to demand payment in any other currency would be illegal.
Not really. Sprint charges extra to pay in cash instead of "Visabucks" "Masterbucks" or bank promissory notes (checks).
Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 5:23 pm Post subject: Re: What Would Stop Stores From Trading In Euros?
Fiddlerdave wrote:
Blacksmith wrote:
To put it simply the legal currency in the United States is the greenback, (all debts public and private), to demand payment in any other currency would be illegal.
Not really. Sprint charges extra to pay in cash instead of "Visabucks" "Masterbucks" or bank promissory notes (checks).
This is the BIGGEST load of crap I have ever witnessed. Who in there right mind does this? This is not the mark of a company who's first interest is in customer satisfaction. I left that company a long time ago and I'm so glad I did. They charged me for paying at THEIR store, where I signed up. They would shut off my phone on the 5th of every month, even though they knew I got paid the first, sent out a check in the mail to them by the 3rd and they had it by the 6th or 7th every month. I was never late, I would have had it to them before the 5th but they would charge me to pay at their store, they would also charge me if I wanted to pay by phone or over the internet. So eventually I said ya know what screw this! I switch to verizon before my contract was up so they charged me for that to.
They are the absolute worst company I can think of off the top of my head, I hope they are among the first to crash and burn in the economic downturn!
Back on subject:
What would stop stores from trading in euros? probably the fact that no one else int he US trades in euros. If there are not enough people trading in euros it would be a waste of time for them. But I dont think there is anything to stop them legally.... Correct me if I'm wrong. _________________ Tired of high gas prices? Then stop driving to work, duh..... Learn to Work from home
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Companies that are not exporting to the euro-zone would have to buy euros so there is no point in that except if they pay a fixed amount in euros. But then they are up to a fx risk and if everyone would start to pay in euros, without any increase in euro income, the dollar would just decline further.
Then stop driving to work, duh..... 
