Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:17 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
Regardless of one's opinion of whether the mother possesses the right to determine the life or death of her baby, and whether it is right or wrong for the state to impose itself over a woman's body, please keep in mind that Ron believes that this is a state's issue and not the place for the federal government, least of all a president, to decide. To call Ron a theocrat is terribly inaccurate.
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:40 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
Shannymara and Thuja,
If you notice, I edited my comment 1 minute before your(Shannymara) post to remove my comment about SmallPoxgirl being banned. I realized how stupid and anti-free speech my comment was. I regret not editing the comment sooner.
Smallpoxgirl, I'm sorry to ask for your ban. Your comments were just very offensive to me.
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:11 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
chuck6877 wrote:
So him being a Pro-lifer is such a horrible, horrible thing that he's not qualified to lead the nation post peak?
It has nothing to do with him being anti-abortion. It has everything to do with him forcing disastrous proceationist policies on a nation. Without abortion, peak oil is going to be worse sooner. You've been around this site long enough that you should be well aware of the discrepancy between the amount of people our planet can support and the number that are here. How on earth can you front someone as being a good solution to peak oil if they've said they are going to institute policies to make it worse? _________________ "So while you sit and whistle Dixie with your money and your power.
I can hear the flowers a-growin in the rubble of the towers.
I hear leaders quit their lying
I hear babies quit their crying.
I hear soldiers quit their dying, one and all." - OCMS
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:17 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
chuck6877 wrote:
He delivered 4,000 babies. You can't blame the man for his views.
How can you possibly equate 4,000 additional gas guzzling Americans with creating a solution to Peak Oil. And no I can't blame the man for his views. Lots of people have views. What I can blame him for is trying to force his views on 150,000,000 women. If he doesn't want to have an abortion, I think that's certainly his right. _________________ "So while you sit and whistle Dixie with your money and your power.
I can hear the flowers a-growin in the rubble of the towers.
I hear leaders quit their lying
I hear babies quit their crying.
I hear soldiers quit their dying, one and all." - OCMS
Joined: Oct 03, 2004 Posts: 521 Location: Washington State
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:29 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
No, PeakOil.com should not endorse any candidate.
I will vote for Paul if we have the opportunity.
and regarding SPG's comments, abortion on demand is the stupidest population control method. It is preferred by middle to upper class women who have low birth rates to start with. It is held in disdane by third worlders, who are the ones with the overpopulation problem. _________________ This is where everybody puts profound words written by another...or not so profound words written by themselves
Highlander 2007
Joined: Sep 13, 2005 Posts: 1250 Location: Just the right place
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:29 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
smallpoxgirl wrote:
chuck6877 wrote:
So him being a Pro-lifer is such a horrible, horrible thing that he's not qualified to lead the nation post peak?
It has nothing to do with him being anti-abortion. It has everything to do with him forcing disastrous proceationist policies on a nation. Without abortion, peak oil is going to be worse sooner. You've been around this site long enough that you should be well aware of the discrepancy between the amount of people our planet can support and the number that are here. How on earth can you front someone as being a good solution to peak oil if they've said they are going to institute policies to make it worse?
Firstly SmallPoxGirl -
1. You are not a fortune teller and cannot tell the future.
2.I remember reading some post from you in the past about your oppressive parents and their forcing their views (I believe they were Christian) on you (or something to that effect). All that to say you are far from an objective person when it comes to issues on morailty.
3. In all reality we are going to need more human labor for a variety of reasons in the future and having more children is a very arguable solution to this problem.
4. You are openly antiChristian and Ron Paul's (who is not a Christian) position on abortion is not religioulsy motivated.
Tell me Smallpoxgirl - Are you an Oracle into the future that we should be listening or paying special attention to ? DO you have some gift we should know about ?
Do you know everything ? (I hope you do not answer yes) and assuming your answer is no, Is there a remote possibility that in the part you don't know that there may exist an alternative future for mankind not already revealed to you ?
Joined: Oct 04, 2004 Posts: 5386 Location: Oklahoma
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:36 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
highlander wrote:
It is held in disdane by third worlders, who are the ones with the overpopulation problem.
I didn't find that to be the case in Belize, where it was illegal. Many (many) girls in my high school there had dangerous and illegal abortions, even though they were all Catholic. This was in the early 1980s.
I bet you would be surprised how many women have had abortions.
It does help a bit if Paul sees it as a state's rights issue, but it still bugs me.
But I don't think we should endorse any candidates, no matter what we think of them. It just seems inconsistent with the web site's purpose and overall flavor. _________________ "Every junkie's like a setting sun..." - Neil Young
Joined: Sep 13, 2005 Posts: 1250 Location: Just the right place
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:38 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
smallpoxgirl wrote:
chuck6877 wrote:
He delivered 4,000 babies. You can't blame the man for his views.
How can you possibly equate 4,000 additional gas guzzling Americans with creating a solution to Peak Oil. And no I can't blame the man for his views. Lots of people have views. What I can blame him for is trying to force his views on 150,000,000 women. If he doesn't want to have an abortion, I think that's certainly his right.
Who is there to speak for the Unborn Children SPG ? I have two kids and one on the way (so I know you hate me all the more now), so I take particular offense to a person who advocates killing children of any type - Either born or unborn.
How about this, besides abortion factories, let's also open up euthenasia clinics and let Doctors decide on who lives and dies (I'll bet you will love that), what's the difference ? You are advocating women whether or not to kill uborn childrens, what's teh difference ?
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 5:07 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
highlander wrote:
No, PeakOil.com should not endorse any candidate.
I will vote for Paul if we have the opportunity.
and regarding SPG's comments, abortion on demand is the stupidest population control method. It is preferred by middle to upper class women who have low birth rates to start with. It is held in disdane by third worlders, who are the ones with the overpopulation problem.
You WILL have the opportunity to vote for Ron Paul in your state Primary.
If you're not registered Republican, thousands of supporters are changing their party affiliation to Republican so they can vote for Paul.
Check out: http://www.ronpaul2008.com/states/ to find out when the primary is in your state and find out how to change your party affiliation if you have to.
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 5:57 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
clueless wrote:
I have two kids and one on the way (so I know you hate me all the more now)
I don't hate you, but I do think you are contributing to the problem.
clueless wrote:
, so I take particular offense to a person who advocates killing children of any type - Either born or unborn.
Trying to redefine fetuses as children is a cheap political stunt from the religious right. It is a tawdry attempt to punish people for having sex by forcing them to have children. After the failure of the Comstock laws, religious zealots in the US needed a new issue with which to bludgeon the rest of us. Telling us we were evil for having sex met deaf ears. Telling us we were evil for using contraception didn't fare much better. Trying to make a fetus into a person and label women and doctors as murders is the latest pathetic attempt. It is failing as miserably as the others did. Half of American women have an abortion during their lives.
A fetus is a fetus. A child is a child. Calling fetuses "unborn children" is like calling corpses the "post-burial elderly". _________________ "So while you sit and whistle Dixie with your money and your power.
I can hear the flowers a-growin in the rubble of the towers.
I hear leaders quit their lying
I hear babies quit their crying.
I hear soldiers quit their dying, one and all." - OCMS
Last edited by smallpoxgirl on Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: Sep 17, 2006 Posts: 633 Location: No man's land
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:25 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
chuck6877 wrote:
Yes Peakoil.com should endorse Ron Paul.
Peak oil is mostly going to be an economic issue. Ron Paul will handle it better than anyone else. He wants to reduce the size of government tremendously, bring home our troops, abolish the Private Bank owned Federal Reserve, back our currency to gold and silver, and get rid of the income tax. The extra money Americans will have from that alone will go a long ways to helping post peak.
He also will help stablize our dollar and that will keep the price of oil going up froma weakening dollar.
He also will keep Americans from losing their freedoms post-peak which is very likely under another President.
Chuck
OK....so how does the US pay down its national debt without a federal income tax? And how does not paying down the national debt help stabilize the dollar?
It is my understanding that personal income disparities would only increase under a Ron Paul administration. In an era of persistent shortages, those with the freedom to live comfortably will be the monied class. The freedoms of others will essentially be dictated by the wealthy minus the government's cooperation.
The libertarian mantra of Ron Paul is that man will do the right thing if only he was released from the constant meddling of the federal government. This just seems naive. It is human nature that is the root of all evil, not the government. The nature of government is merely a reflection of how a people chooses to organize itself. Our goverment is corrupt because people are corrupt. Reorganizing our government doesn't deal with the root problem: human nature.
Under Ron Paul, we would only substitute one system of corruption for another system of corruption.
I don't know if I believe in the way authority is allocated in our country, however if I was forced to choose a President, I would choose somebody who realized the truth that no fundamental outer change can occur without a concurrent inner change. The individual must change for anything profound to happen on a collective level.
An honest candidate must be somebody who lives the truths that they see as helping to address the world's environmental and social crises. It is not just talk...it is personal action that counts. _________________ "It is no measure of health to be deemed sane in an insane society" J. Krishnamurti
Joined: Sep 13, 2005 Posts: 1250 Location: Just the right place
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 8:20 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
Quote:
Trying to redefine fetuses as children is a cheap political stunt from the religious right. It is a tawdry attempt to punish people for having sex by forcing them to have children. After the failure of the Comstock laws, religious zealots in the US needed a new issue with which to bludgeon the rest of us. Telling us we were evil for having sex met deaf ears. Telling us we were evil for using contraception didn't fare much better. Trying to make a fetus into a person and label women and doctors as murders is the latest pathetic attempt. It is failing as miserably as the others did. Half of American women have an abortion during their lives.
A fetus is a fetus. A child is a child. Calling fetuses "unborn children" is like calling corpses the "post-burial elderly".
Yeah, the old life begins at birth argument...Sorry SPG ain't gonna fly on this end, and your prejudice is transparent. Want to advoacte killing babies, go ahead..You will on day meet your maker...And you do have a maker SPG.
Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:19 pm Post subject: Re: Should PeakOil.com Endorse Ron Paul for Prez?
clueless wrote:
You will on day meet your maker...And you do have a maker SPG.
If I was you, I'd be a lot more concerned about making up a bunch of crap and trying to pass it off as a mandate from God than I would about aborting a fetus. _________________ "So while you sit and whistle Dixie with your money and your power.
I can hear the flowers a-growin in the rubble of the towers.
I hear leaders quit their lying
I hear babies quit their crying.
I hear soldiers quit their dying, one and all." - OCMS
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