One of the things Patti showed us in her video were the pond aerators and I assumed electrically powered water pumps were used.

Question: How much solar PV would be needed to supply the energy for the water pump(s)? Could "ornamental" windmills be configured to pump water instead? (Perhaps a traditional water pump windmill could be used. Watch out for residential neighborhood restrictions...)

How much solar PV would be needed to power a UV "bug-zapper" lamp 24/7 (or 12/7) as a means of providing food for the fish? (I know the answer to that one.)

Edit:
More tough questions...

In cold climates, wouldn't the pond freeze up in the winter? How deep does the pond need to be to keep from completely freezing? Is the water going to be heated? If the fish are to be harvested before the pond freezes, is a grid-connected freezer going to be used to preserve the fish?

2nd edit: How many worms are needed to provide enough food for 300 lbs of fish per year?

There are a number of small windmills, some patterned after the Aermoter water pumpers, that provide aeration for ponds to keep them open for livestock or fish.
http://www.koenderswindmills.com/index.html (just one that I have seen, no endorsement intended)

Now see? That was perfect WisJim. Great link. Just goes to show that these message boards can be a good place to brainstorm.

Solar powered water pumps were featured at the RE Roundup. I guess it wouldn't be difficult to use sand filters with wind or solar powered water pumps. I'm curious what the maintenance requirements would be. I suspect the waste material from the filters could be easily composted for the gardens too.

My electrician thinks he can whip up something very small for me to run my pumps etc. I'm currently looking for low voltage pumps as well.

Good luck,

Patti

Patti,
Why don't you get your electrician to install solar water pumps? They're not that expensive. Many are less than $200.
Example:
Solar Water Pumps
Of course for a 7000 gal pond, two or three may be needed.
Not enough sun in your area? Perhaps they can be wired to run off the grid as well.

Did any readers catch the Flash Video provided via the Koender's Windmills webpage?

Since Patti has been the only person with personal experience with small ponds who has posted on this thread, I'll direct these questions to her:

Can you give us some hint at what the water evaporation rates might be for a 7,000 gallon pond? How much water do you have to add each month/week? Do you use rainwater, well water, or city water for the ponds?

As the expression goes, the devil is in the details...

Should I rent a backhoe, a bobcat, or hire a crew to manually dig out the ground for a small pond?

A pond liner of some kind will be needed to prevent or reduce water losses through seepage.

Dang those fish are getting expensive...

We have some tanks that we collect rainwater in, in the summer,and we put goldfish in them to keep the insect larvae under control. I have looked at fish tank aerators, especially ones designed for fishermen, to keep their minnows alive, and found some that are designed to run on batteries.

Here are a couple of links that might give you ideas:
link 1
link 2

(Edit: Links put into hypertext to avoid stretching the screen --skyemoor)

I haven't actually done anything with the idea yet, but am considering one of the small aerators and a small solar panel. I think that maybe a solar powered pump designed for small fountains might also work (lots of them on eBay).

PeakOil: That was what I ment, my electrician is going to whip me up a small pv array on one of my sheds roof with a couple of marine batteries for storage hooked in. In terms of water evaporation-my pond is about 20' across and on a hot day I can loose an inch or even two. But that doesn't seem to be a big deal. I use a combination of rain and city water, but I don't stress it being "topped off", when it gets down about six inches, or I have company and I want it to look good, I refill.

Briefly though, the pond itself wasn't that expensive. There was a street crew doing work near my street for what seemed like weeks. I asked him that if they were going to be done early, and $300 later, plus some winking I admit, I had my hole. I bought a rubber pond liner and a bunch of other useless stuff that I didn't fully need for $800. If I was to do it again, it would be more like $550. The rock and stone you see that borders my pond was all found either in my yard or in vacant lots, or neighbors who where trying to get rid of it. So that for me was free(it took me a year to collect it all), but on the open market would be pretty expensive since it is shale. Me and two family friends did the masonry, I paid them about $800, and it took a few months because they came on their free time. Working with them taught me how to mix and lay the morter, so when I do the show you will see me do a project myself! Electric(which has to be redone) and was stupid to a degree since I knew I was gonna go with PV eventually, was another $500.

So, the grand total was: $2400

But check this out before you freak out: Amortize that number over a six year period(my pond will last twenty I think) and that is $400 a year. Now if you say I raise only 300lbs of fish(my feed costs are now zero due to the worms from my vermiculture system) it is less than $1.25 a pound. Cat fish at the supermarket where I live is around $4.00 per pound. Last year I sold about fifty pounds to a couple of neighbors for about $150. I could probably, if I cared to have the system mildly profitable if I worked it more intesesly.

Wise Jim: It would work. If you are in a warm climate, you may be able to grow tillapia which have a high value, and grow really fast! I met a guy who was doing it in his basement in fifty gallon barrells for some local spanish eateries, that was my original pratical inspiration.

Last winter I didn't do anything. The pond froze over about three inches deep. Four or five fish didn't make them, but the breeding school did. This year I'm running the fountain which has kept an area open and agitated, but this year hasn't been cold yet.

In terms of worms, I have no idea. They got worms from my house and every where around. The yellow perch and sunfish are voracious and highly entertaining to preteen boys from far and wide. I personally would give them about a half a pound per day, and who knows how much more.

Thanks all,


Patti

Great info, Patti. Thanks. A couple thousand isn't too bad, really.

I will need more rainwater catchment area first, (a greenhouse), and more storage before I can attempt a small pond. I only have 7,750 gallons of rainwater storage at this time, and I would prefer not to use the utility's rock-hard water.

btw, enjoyed your promo Patti. Sent the link to about 15 people, (one of them is a computer graphic artist if you're still looking for help in that dept.)

I helped build a family pond more for decoration that food. We had an old satellite dish, it was a 14 foot deep well oval shape solid fiber glass. There are still metal mesh ones around that would provide a good fram as well. Dug it in, added a overflow creek, that recirculated to a water fall for aeration, power hungry so not for the PO only run it a few hours a week. Lined it all with concrete, and cobble stones. Not sure of the water chemistry with concrete break down, but it has housed 10 plus large coi (sp) several other large pond fish and mosquito fish. No die offs or diseases in over 8 years. Once a month it is pumped half out, water used on lawns and gardens, then it is refilled with well water It could be done less I think. Four redwood trees were planted at same time around it, and have grown over 30 feet I am sure they appreciate any leaks the system may have. Water lili was planted to supply shade in early years, small foot bridge. Twice a year it is mucked out and used as a compost, about 4 five gallon buckets. During the summer it loses about 1” of water a day. Calif, 114+ zero humidity. It is very low maintenance. A sustainable food fish pond I know nothing about, though I would eat a coi if I had to.

oowolf,
I have just begun looking into aquaculture and have a question or two.

Are you going to use one pond for all these?

Won't there be competition for food resources?

Will you rely on feeding or fertilizing?

What is the reason for cattails?

What depth will your pond be?

What depth of water do mussels do best in?

I went to an aquaculture workshop two weeks ago and learned much. Crawdads like shallow water, carp deeper, harvesting methods, etc.

Sorry for all the questions, but really interested.

You or Mods, feel free to pull this into a seperate thread.

My pond will have a surface area of 4-5000 sq ft (1/10-1/8 acre). It will be creek fed by diversion pipe. Most of the pond will be 2 to 3 feet deep as this depth appears to create the most biomass. A "fish refuge" area 6 to 8 feet deep in the pond center. Carp and Catfish convert vegetable matter into edible meat. Carnivorous fish are not really in my plan--although the creek has trout which may get into the pond (there's a large trout farm about 11/4 mile downstream. The creek has blue mussels already in it and it's only about 14" deep. Cattail SHOULD BE the world's main food crop as every part of the plant is edible. A well-run pond polyculture of plants and fish can produce 4 to 10 times as much food as an equal area of dry land. The pond will likely attract beaver and muskrats. Muskrats I can live with--beaver are my deadly enemies as I have over 300 "woody stem perennials" (trees). At this time, I have no plans to add "fertilizer" beyond whatever the homestead generates.
http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles/duffyk43.html

The intention is to maintain a sustainable ecosystem-not maximize the production of any given species. See the Aquaculture section of Mollison's 'Permaculture Design Manual.

A gentle slope and an irregular-as-possible shoreline are what you want. "Production" is directly related to amount of shoreline.

I would like to hear from anyone with Northland pond polyculture experience as opposed to commercial fish farming.

I'm building a newer aquaculture system now. My pond actually has two smaller "feeder" ponds which I grow out my fry. I can answer lots of aquaculture questions. Not all. I have only been doing it about four years and feel I have a lot to learn. Good Stuff here.

Patti

Fourth Riech? If your a Neo Nazi, forget it though oowolf.

You never know. There seem to be a lot of crazies about. Mercury! Where does that come from? Is it from the ground, or is it rain?

My ponds are all lined with rubber. I think that would prevent chemicals from the soil and leachate.

Shanny, in terms of starting small its the only way to go. Get used to the small ecosystem before you try to expand. The real key to a pond is a good biofilter and aerator. Do you live in the country, or the city? I'd love to consult with you on your project in anyway I can. How big of a pond are you looking to put in? Is it supposed to pretty and funtional, or just functional. I have lots of questions.

Hit me back,

Patti
www.gardengirltv.com