Yeah, take Albert Einstein and that crackpot idea he had about E=MC squared. Some kind of bomb idea, wasn't it? Never worked. Guess he was wrong to endorse 2nd law as supreme.


Yeah, there is lots of water in space we can go get. 7-9 nine years each way. Hope the tomatoes don't wilt.


Yeah, we did pretty good there, now we only have to deal with climate change, peak-oil, and real nasty hurricanes.



Well, on the eve of World War II the German chemical complex of I.G. Farben was the largest chemical manufacturing enterprise in the world, with extraordinary political and economic power and influence within the Hitlerian Nazi state. The Farben empire owned its own coal mines, its own electric power plants, iron and steel units, banks, research units, and numerous commercial enterprises. There were over 2,000 cartel agreements between I. G. and foreign firms—including Standard Oil of New Jersey, DuPont, Alcoa, Dow Chemical, and others in the United States. The full story of I.G. Farben and its world-wide activities before World War II can never be known, as key German records were destroyed in 1945 in anticipation of the Allied victory. However, one post-war investigation by the U.S. War Department concluded that:





There are immutable laws of the universe. How do you think it was possible for man to go to the moon and back 9 times, and do it successfully? Luck? Good guesses? How about sending our latest probe to Saturn? Took 7 years, I think to get there. We put it into a nearly perfect orbit. Luck and guess work again? No, but by applying the laws of the universe, spot-on mathematics, and a solid understanding of celestial mechanics. Liebig's Law and the Second Law of thermodynamics are two of these immutable laws. Somehow, you seem to think they don't apply to you. If I explain how it rains, does that mean I think it will? Hardly. Don't shoot the messenger. These are not my laws or my views. This is the way the world works.

Oh, trust me, I have read their posts. Like yours, they show the uphill battle we face with regard to peak-oil and the socio-economical consequences that will accompany it. Good luck to you.

{touch up; EE}

I've had enough and I'm going to send this one to the Hall of Flames....my apologies Aaron, but I have to give you a reason to do so...you should never feed the trolls....they count on it for their jolly fun...

It's an old trick, really...ultimately designed to discredit ideas that scare them...

Thinks he/she is being clever...but I see through you VOR, like the invisible man...so run along and go FUCK YOURSELF.

FLUSH this thread and this poster.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahhahaha
hahahahahahaahahahahahahahahahahhahahaahahh
(pauses for breath)
hahahahahahahahah ha!




P.S. Hahahaha funny shit!

lol guys...

So...

Flush this turd, or HOF?

opinions people?

I vote flush.

You won't often aee me say something as rude as this but....... This Jackass doesn't have a fucking clue. Dump this shit.

He is joking. I think his posts are hilarious. My favourite paragraph:

Monte: I'm sure your here to help, but before you go on posting any more, I strongly encourage you to read the reasoned and rationale posts of people like Yamaha, Hydro, Nigel, John Denver, Jay Morrison, etc. We need more people like those five on this board. People who want to come up with solutions and won't let themselves be hampered by a bunch of scientific crapola about "entropy" and "biology"!

It's great satire.

Eistein, Schmeinstein. If we have to we will rewrite the so called "laws of nature." What makes them laws anyway?

Where is the faith in human ingenuity? Entropy? We are talking about a species that is capable of putting a man on the moon! What is entropy next to that? Nada. Zip. Zilch.

Me, I had never heard of entropy or thermowhozits before this thread. How important could it be if I had never heard of it before?

I mean really. Dieoff. Get a grip, people. Nobody can name a single civilization that has collapsed since we invented the computer. None have collapsed since we invented the automobile. None have collapsed since 1776 when Adam Smith invented economics! They used to collapse but we are way smarter now.

Whew. I feel better.

My point exactly.

Please, none of that "Easter Island-Mayan-Roman Empire" stuff either. We have all sorts of technology and market mechanims that those primiative savages never dreamt of.

For instance, the fools on Easter Island based their entire way of life around a single reource. And they didn't even have the market or advanced technology to develop alternative resources!

Our modern civilization would never be so stuipd as to base its entire way of life around a single nonrenewable resource if we didn't have alternatives like Helium 3 from the Moon and solar-nanotechnology!

Puh-lease people, don't you think Alan Greenspan has thought of this thing entropy issue while making fiscal policy?

You act like our elected leaders are either ignorant or incompetent!
The US didn't get where it is without great leadership. Have a little faith people!

VOR

Matrim,

Clearly, you didn't follow the links I provided or you would have seen that my plan to develop warp speed technology and to teleport a few billion people off the planet is backed by tons of research and hard data.

I'm not saying the technology will be off the shelf tomorrow or anything, but give industry a good 5-10 years, and you'll be amazed what the combined efforts of technology and the market will come up with!

This "entropy"-"dieoff" thing will turn out to be a fad just like the pet rock or bell bottoms.

Would Hydro or John Denver care to chime in here? I sure could use some help getting people to understand that there really is no such thing as an oil crisis! The market will adapt to entropy just like it adapts to everything else!

Really people, clearly none of you have read the works of Bjorn Lomberg, Julian Simon or Michael Lynch.

Three geniuses I suggest you all read!

VOR

from the link given by VOR


Yet your plan to teleport millions of us to new worlds is somehow viable? Oh and BTW, just because someone is researching something doesn't mean they're anywhere near implementing it. Nowhere on either of the links you provided did they refer to these technologies as forthcoming anytime in the near future. It was all more along the lines of "Check out these fabulous technologies that should be possible someday"

Well guess what a lot of people really thought we'd all be driving hovercars and living on mars by now..........and we're not.


Also check this out Mr. I think we'll just get helium3 from the moon then all our problems will be solved:

President Bush Announces New Vision for Space Exploration Program

Note the part that says:


Gee we only have to wait 15 years! Hurray for helium3!

Can't even get back to the moon til 2015 (and I imagine that's assuming good economic standing) but we'll just teleport to earth2.

I say again: You don't have a clue.

{touch up; EE}

One other thing, before everyone thinks I'm just a huge asshole.

Vor I did read you links and I'll admit there's some interesting stuff there.
I agree it would be great if we could implement these technologies and explore the universe, not just for a solution to our problems but simply for an amazing adventure.

However, I don't believe at all that they provide a solution to any of the multitude of problems we're facing. In fact until we resolve our issues on
this planet we shouldn't even be wasting our time and resources on these things (well maybe the teleportation, I liked the sounds of that internet thing they were talking about). Do you even have an idea how much it costs to launch something into space? Or how much MORE it would cost to build a mining operation on the moon? (Yeah yeah the heliums in the first couple feet or so, it doesn't matter it would still cost trillions. Also, eventually we'd reach "peak helium")

Anyway my point is I think we'd be a lot better off looking for solutions on this planet, building upon the sciences we have a grasp of, instead of watching star trek and exclaiming "We're smart and adaptive, we'll get there"

P.S. Canuck I sincerely hope you're right about this, and yes if it is indeed sattire it's quite good. Unfortunately,I don't think it is but maybe I'm just gullible :D

It's the post of the month in my books. If we don't have "a post of the month" we should create the catagory and place this thread there. And the fact that some people want to flush this because they think he is a troll just makes it funnier.

Hear, hear. The one that really gives me the pip is the reindeers on St. Mathews Island who ran out of food. A doofus could poke holes in that analogy. One, reindeer have reindeer intelligence, not human intelligence. Two, reindeers don't have an opposable thumb. Three, some men have had vasectomies so they can't have kids.

Anyway, if we run out of food we will just eat something else.



Simon is great. My favourite part was where he proved that there was more copper on the planet than there was mass on the planet. (Julian is a modest guy so he would say that economics proved it, but never mind that.) When you think about that you realize that he is also explaining how a guy can gain two pounds by eating half a pound of pie. I'd like to hear how a "scientist" explains that!

I like the idea of the replicators they have on Star Trek. Someone should work on that one because a) free food is a good idea, and b) it will taste bad at first (probably not even as good as airline food). It would be better if they work out the kinks before we run out of real stuff.

Hmmm...Well, since the thread was obviously pointed directly at me, I guess I should chime in as to whether or not we should keep this jewel of tongue-in-cheek, or flush it along with all the other bio-exhaust.

I have been working on a new thread, so I will drop in a little preview here to make this thread go somewhere or fan the flames into an inferno! Hee Hee!

In the post-peak world, I see too distinct camps of thought: Those who want to consume as before, and those who wish to find stability. The first group will be the capitalist/economist type, forever-looking for new ways to exploit the environment based upon the economic mindset of supply/demand. The second group will consist of those who realized that it was the mindset of the first group who got them to post-peak, although they had little choice as to whether or not to participate, and most did not know it was a path that led down a dark one-way alley. To be coninued...

Oh, they got em, now! See my link on The Stanford U. breakthrough on the Open discussion board!

http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic1716.html

PSST...The government has this secret car that runs on water. It doesnt want anyone to know about it because they got the secret from aliens. But it is true. But sombody will leak it someday, and our troubles will be over.

The aliens also gave the government the secret to warp drive.