Iraq considering purchase of 36 new F-16 fighter jets

emersonbiggins · **Posted:** Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:12 pm

It will be interesting to see what missions these planes might get used for. Proxy bombing of Iran, anyone?

Quote:

Reuters
Iraq eyes Lockheed F-16 fighter aircraft purchase
Friday September 5, 12:16 pm ET
By Jim Wolf

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Iraqi government has asked for information about buying 36 F-16 fighter aircraft built by Lockheed Martin Corp (NYSE:LMT - News), the U.S. Defense Department said on Friday.

The request, received August 27, is being reviewed "in the normal course of business" as part of the U.S. government-to-government arms sale process, said Air Force Lt. Col. Patrick Ryder, a Pentagon spokesman.

Updated F-16s are among the world's most advanced multirole fighters and a powerful symbol of military ties to the United States.

Iraq's interest in the fighter jet, reported first by The Wall Street Journal, could spark concerns among neighbors worried about advanced arms in the hands of a country still facing major internal challenges.

Yahoo

Cochise · **Posted:** Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:02 pm

emersonbiggins wrote:

It will be interesting to see what missions these planes might get used for. Proxy bombing of Iran, anyone?

I don't think so. Buying F-16 fighter is not enough. You need to have pilots able to use them, and that takes years of training.

gampy · **Posted:** Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:27 pm

I am not so sure this is all at the behest of Iraqi leadership. I am wondering if it's just Lockheed trying to sell some hardware.

A couple dozen fighters, with ill-trained Iraqi pilots would not make a huge dent in any neighbouring air force. That kind of dough would be better spent elsewhere IMHO. (Water treatment? Infrastructure? Police?)

It WOULD, however, provide a nice monthly stipend for the company that maintains the aircraft, and the airfield they would be housed at. Can you say KBR, anyone?

Concerned · **Joined:** Thu Sep 23, 2004 12:00 am **Posts:** 1607

emersonbiggins wrote:

It will be interesting to see what missions these planes might get used for. Proxy bombing of Iran, anyone?

Quote:

Reuters
Iraq eyes Lockheed F-16 fighter aircraft purchase
Friday September 5, 12:16 pm ET
By Jim Wolf

Yahoo

Should read. Iraq recycles valuable oil revenues into the US buying obsolete American military hardware. Leaves local, hospitals, schools and universities unfunded.

pedalling_faster · **Joined:** Sat Dec 10, 2005 1:00 am **Posts:** 1212

Cochise wrote:

emersonbiggins wrote:

I don't think so. Buying F-16 fighter is not enough. You need to have pilots able to use them, and that takes years of training.

pilots can be rented. there are tens of thousands of F-16 trained retired Air Force employees.

i suspect Israel will do everything possible to obtain back doors into the CNI (communications, navigation, interrogation friend or foe) radios on those F-16's. these planes (updated with modern avionics, it's a 20+ year old fuselage design) have fly-by-wire capability (remote control).

fly by wire does not replace the pilot in a dogfight. it does replace him in simpler missions. like one way flights that end with the dropping of bombs.

kam3Oen · **Joined:** Sun Sep 09, 2007 12:00 am **Posts:** 187

Quote:

pilots can be rented. there are tens of thousands of F-16 trained retired Air Force employees.

i suspect Israel will do everything possible to obtain back doors into the CNI (communications, navigation, interrogation friend or foe) radios on those F-16's. these planes (updated with modern avionics, it's a 20+ year old fuselage design) have fly-by-wire capability (remote control).

fly by wire does not replace the pilot in a dogfight. it does replace him in simpler missions. like one way flights that end with the dropping of bombs.

Arabs in hi-tech warplanes. That's like a dog driving a car. :lol:

3aidlillahi · **Joined:** Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:00 am **Posts:** 1603

Quote:

Arabs in hi-tech warplanes. That's like a dog driving a car. Laughing

You're right. They are bad pilots, aren't they?

Silly Arabs. Flew straight into the building. Make that "buildings". Forget that it would be nearly impossible to do that without advanced training and that it would take very skilled pilots and that the probability of them all being accidents is practically 0. I wonder how many of your Master Race died on that day?

Alcassin · **Posted:** Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:09 pm

kam3Oen wrote:

Arabs in hi-tech warplanes. That's like a dog driving a car. :lol:

Racist.

Anyway, Iraqi need F16 like women gonorrhea.
May I ask if the Iraq government had any choice?

Tanada · **Posted:** Tue Sep 09, 2008 5:02 pm

Alcassin wrote:

kam3Oen wrote:

Arabs in hi-tech warplanes. That's like a dog driving a car. :lol:

Racist.

Anyway, Iraqi need F16 like women gonorrhea.
May I ask if the Iraq government had any choice?

You all act as if Iraq had no Air Force in the past and this would be an all new thing. Iraq actually had a quite well trained AF in 1990, however USAF and USN aircraft equiped with smart bombs destroyed most of their equipment and they have never recovered since then. Growing a new AF will not be all that hard, many of those who were young pilots in 1990 would still be around to train new pilots in 2009.

3aidlillahi · **Joined:** Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:00 am **Posts:** 1603

Quote:

Growing a new AF will not be all that hard, many of those who were young pilots in 1990 would still be around to train new pilots in 2009.

Yes and those pilots were just masterful, weren't they? I'm sure any Air Force General would love to have them teach their new pilots all of the "falling down in a massive flame" technique for dogfights. This definitely would hold true for going against the US, Israelis or Russians. But it might as well be in effect against the Iranians if flying solo (doubtful, though). But if the US is there for air support, then why have an AF?

Tanada · **Posted:** Tue Sep 09, 2008 5:38 pm

3aidlillahi wrote:

Quote:

Growing a new AF will not be all that hard, many of those who were young pilots in 1990 would still be around to train new pilots in 2009.

Yes and those pilots were just masterful, weren't they? I'm sure any Air Force General would love to have them teach their new pilots all of the "falling down in a massive flame" technique for dogfights. This definitely would hold true for going against the US, Israelis or Russians. But it might as well be in effect against the Iranians if flying solo (doubtful, though). But if the US is there for air support, then why have an AF?

[sarcasm]
Gee you mean its a tough fight when the other side has air traffic controll and airborne Radar while all you have is a 30 year old USSR surplus jet with minimal electronics in it? Say it isn't so!!!!
[/sarcasm]

3aidlillahi · **Joined:** Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:00 am **Posts:** 1603

Quote:

Gee you mean its a tough fight when the other side has air traffic controll and airborne Radar while all you have is a 30 year old USSR surplus jet with minimal electronics in it? Say it isn't so!!!!

I wasn't really aware of any age issue with their aircraft from the 1st war - I was 4. But regardless, even if they had the same jets and tech, our pilots would still kick their asses. A few more down craft on our side, but that's about it. Complete air supremacy. And that's what they'd face now against the US, Israelis or Russians.

And don't think that those tech's will catch up on their side. They'll always be behind since they don't have a military industry complex. Even with these craft and the training from elder pilots, they'd still be wiped clean by any potential threats. So again, what's the point of these craft? 1) With US support, no need. Just use the US. 2) No US support, it's basically wasted funds as they'll have marginal use on any battlefield.

pedalling_faster · **Joined:** Sat Dec 10, 2005 1:00 am **Posts:** 1212

primary purpose of this transaction - to provide business for the defense sub-contractor that makes the F-16's ?

certainly that is true about the recent purchase of "missile defense" systems by one of the Arab countries. built by Lockheed, radar by Raytheon. they've been conned into thinking that those systems will protect them against incoming missiles.

there's going to be a whole lot of "oops, it doesn't work" going around, if those MD systems get used.

lowem · **Posted:** Tue Sep 09, 2008 10:03 pm

There was an even bigger deal earlier this year where Lockheed sold over 100 F-16's to both India *and* Pakistan, who are not exactly the best of friends. Go figure ... :lol:

Alcassin · **Posted:** Wed Sep 10, 2008 12:18 am

Tanada wrote:

You all act as if Iraq had no Air Force in the past and this would be an all new thing. Iraq actually had a quite well trained AF in 1990, however USAF and USN aircraft equiped with smart bombs destroyed most of their equipment and they have never recovered since then. Growing a new AF will not be all that hard, many of those who were young pilots in 1990 would still be around to train new pilots in 2009.

Okay, they need aircraft, I understand that, but why F-16 and not Mirage, Grippen, Sukhoi? did they have any choice?

I don't think so.

Iraq considering purchase of 36 new F-16 fighter jets

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