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VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

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VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby Graeme » Sun 02 Nov 2014, 17:04:10

VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

You won’t find the 300 MPG Volkswagen XL1 in an American showroom, in fact it has even been denied a tour of America because it is too efficient for the American public to be made widely aware of, and oil profits are too high in America with the status quo in place. No tour has been allowed for this car because the myth that 50 mpg is virtually impossible to obtain from even a stripped down econobox is too profitable to let go of, and when it comes to corporate oil profits, ignorance is bliss.

Years ago I had calculated that it should be possible to get a small car to exceed 100 mpg by putting parallel direct to cylinder water injectors side by side with the fuel injectors, and using the exhaust manifold to preheat the water so it would enter the cylinders as dry steam, thus providing added expansion (which drives the engine) while allowing the combustion process to proceed without reducing it’s efficiency. But I was obviously wrong with my calculations, because they were in fact over 2x conservative.

The 100 mpg carburetor was indeed a reality, and the Volkswagen XL1 proves it with only straightforward nothing special technology we have had since the 1970?s.Though the XL1 can be plugged in to deliver a 40 mile all electric drive, it does not need to be plugged in EVER to achieve 300 mpg. And it does not cheat in any way to achieve the rating, it weighs over 1,700 pounds, has normal tires, and delivers a very good driving experience with a governed top speed of 99 mph. The XL1 could reach a top speed in excess of 110 mph absent governor and turns in a 0-60 time of 11.5 seconds which is by no means leisurely for a car designed for efficiency. The XL1 in no way cheats on performance to hit it’s rating. It is simply the car we should have always had, and have had taken from us in the name of oil profits.

Though the XL1 can hit 300 mpg under ideal driving conditions, it’s combined mileage is usually a little over 200 mpg, and if you do city driving only that will drop to a minimum of 180 mpg under the worst driving conditions. But I’d be happy with that no doubt.


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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby Graeme » Sun 02 Nov 2014, 17:48:20

One excuse is that “they don’t meet American crash test standards”, but the real truth is that the Fed simply refused to ever crash test them because of what they are, in Europe even the XL1 is considered to be a very safe car in crashes, and the Jetta station wagon is obviously even safer and you CAN buy the non TDI versions of the exact same car in America. The only thing different is the engine, WHAT GIVES?

The answer is obvious. Simply for the sake of raking in huge profits from $4 a gallon gas, getting guzzled at 10X the rate it should be, the corporations have via campaign contributions and other types of pay outs succeeded in getting the FED to legislate the best cars off the road for irrelevant trumped up reasons.
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby kanon » Sat 24 Jan 2015, 13:19:36

Snopes claims the quoted article is hyperbole and there are a number of good reasons the car is not available. http://www.snopes.com/politics/conspiracy/xl1.asp

A test drive report at: http://www.greencarreports.com/news/108 ... ive-report

Nevertheless, why are diesel engines for trucks and buses still such fuel hogs? What is the big problem with high mpg cars? I have theorized that the petroleum markets are tightly controlled, just not too tightly. After all, if oil is produced it must be consumed. So despite the "debunking" of the article, it is still probable that vehicle fuel economy is minimized in order to maximize oil production flow. This can be done in a number of ways, but chiefly by control of the monopoly auto industry and limiting research funding. It is ironic that we spend trillions on middle east war escapades when a doubling or tripling of fuel efficiency and expanded public transit would cost much less and likely accomplish much more.

This actually opens the door to questioning the entire transportation infrastructure. Why was fuel economy and other efficiencies not a priority from the beginning? Perceptive people will recognize that fuel costs will eventually outweigh all other costs and even in manufacturing vehicles and highways the embodied energy is vast.

I suppose that valuing money over energy (over everything else, in fact) that leads to incongruous situations when the "value" criteria is changed.
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby kublikhan » Sat 24 Jan 2015, 14:25:13

$153,000? No one could afford to buy it. And a 2 seater? This is a niche market. 2 seaters are rare compared to 4 seaters. Further, it is an underpowered ecobox. 13 seconds to go from 0-60? That's twice as slow as my eco corolla. Further, it is not even legal to drive this car on US streets. This is because it has no side mirrors. This may change in the future if the NHTSA allows cameras to replace this functionality. But for now, no. And every automobile will see increased mpg without the side mirrors. BTW, the all diesel range is 138 mpg, not 300 mpg. And that's on a european test track, not real world US driving. The all electric range is only 31 mpg at low speeds.

So lets review:
1. Illegal to drive on US streets
2. 5x as expensive as the average US car
3. underpowered ecobox
4. BS mpg numbers
5. Car is loud with no sound deadening

But yeah, let's ignore all of this and put the blame on a conspiracy theory.
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sat 24 Jan 2015, 16:26:32

Graeme wrote:VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

You won’t find the 300 MPG Volkswagen XL1 in an American showroom, in fact it has even been denied a tour of America because it is too efficient for the American public to be made widely aware of, and oil profits are too high in America with the status quo in place. No tour has been allowed for this car because the myth that 50 mpg is virtually impossible to obtain from even a stripped down econobox is too profitable to let go of, and when it comes to corporate oil profits, ignorance is bliss ...

Graeme, I generally consider your posts a positive influence, reflecting (for one thing) the potential of green energy tech. to help solve big problems over time.

However, this is ludicrous. With cars like the Prius C IN PRODUCTION AND SOLD IN THE USA, quoting an article taling about "the myth that 50 mpg is virtually impossible to obtain from even a stripped down econobox is too profitable to let go of, and when it comes to corporate oil profits" as a far left liberal minded conspiracy theory against "evil corporations and their profits" lacks ANY credibility.

Look, I have no doubt that much of the far right "AGW isn't real" propoganda comes from oil companies. However, if you're going to use articles that contain arguments that are completely ludicrous to make your points -- you take a big hit on your credibility score.

Disclosure: When replacing my 2003 Altima, which was having some intermittent reliability problems the computer wouldn't show, I replaced it with a 2015 Corolla, but a new Prius C was in second place, just for the incredible city mileage. (The fact that I only drive about 6000 miles per year helped sway me toward the car with lots more choices, creature comforts, and less risk that the hybrid technology could potentially prove incredibly expensive to repair in the 12-ish years I own a typical car.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby kanon » Sun 25 Jan 2015, 10:44:33

To me, the key point of the thread is exposing "the myth that 50 mpg is virtually impossible." In the conspiracy theory context, the "crime" would be minimizing fuel economy. The means, motive, and opportunity are all present. Monopoly control of auto manufacturing and supporting regulations, avoiding retooling expenses, and the greater profits for the corporate complex from higher fuel consumption serve as clear reasons to go as slowly as possible on improving fuel economy. It is simply not credible to suggest that higher fuel efficiency is in any way helpful to "evil corporations and their profits." Only when fuel efficiency becomes imperative will it actually be supported as opposed to grudgingly conceded. See we-are-on-our-last-cars-t70882.html.
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby dissident » Sun 25 Jan 2015, 11:53:51

kanon wrote:To me, the key point of the thread is exposing "the myth that 50 mpg is virtually impossible." In the conspiracy theory context, the "crime" would be minimizing fuel economy. The means, motive, and opportunity are all present. Monopoly control of auto manufacturing and supporting regulations, avoiding retooling expenses, and the greater profits for the corporate complex from higher fuel consumption serve as clear reasons to go as slowly as possible on improving fuel economy. It is simply not credible to suggest that higher fuel efficiency is in any way helpful to "evil corporations and their profits." Only when fuel efficiency becomes imperative will it actually be supported as opposed to grudgingly conceded. See we-are-on-our-last-cars-t70882.html.


I agree, the corporations are dragging their heels offering fuel efficiency. I am shopping for a new car and my choices are annoyingly limited. In terms of hybrids, the Honda Accord has the best system for this class (not the Prius class), but all of the car makers should have been at this level by now. The main emphasis in the car market today is to force more juice out the internal combustion engine with tweaks. No new IC designs, just more torque and HP. Everything else is a boutique sideshow for which you pay boutique prices.

The attacks on the OP are not fully valid. The heat generated by the combustion of gasoline or diesel should be usable for more kinetic energy extraction since ICs are grossly inefficient. Think combined cycle power plants.

Another IC innovation that should have been adopted by the industry but has not been is variable compression ratio. Saab demonstrated a viable system in 2000 which supposedly died because of its bankruptcy, but really died because of lack of interest.
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby kublikhan » Sun 25 Jan 2015, 14:10:00

You guys are making it sound like it's all the evil car manufactures who are at fault here. Ignoring completely the car buying public who's buying preference is for heavy ICE vehicles. Sure you can eek our a few mpg increases with a new engine design. But a simpler, cheaper, and more effective route would be to reduce vehicle weight. But the car buying public wants bigger cars with creature comforts that pack on the pounds. You want a quieter ride? That's gone cost several hundred pounds in sound deadening material. You want a safer SUV? That highlander is a ton heavier than a civic. Want to drive a car with a smooth ride? Better steer clear of the XL1. Reviewers were calling their chiropractor after hitting a single speed bump in this car.

Stop looking for the boogeyman under the bed and look in the damn mirror people.

Like Americans themselves, American cars are getting heavier and heavier every year. Our new cars are more efficient, with average fuel economy climbing and carbon-dioxide emissions falling over the course of the past 30 years. But that is not because they are lighter. The average new car weighed 3,221 pounds in 1987 but 4,009 pounds in 2010. Even small-size sedans have packed on the pounds, thanks to more-powerful—if more-efficient—engines, as well as features like nicer seats, more safety features, and more legroom.
American cars are getting heavier and heavier.

December 3, 2014 Plummeting gas prices have pushed car buyers away from smaller, greener cars and back into their traditional comfort zone: big SUVs and light-duty trucks. Amid robust sales last month, automakers saw consumers flock toward larger cars, while shunning traditional small cars.

"It is a fact that sales of our most energy-efficient vehicles mirror gas prices," said Gloria Bergquist, spokeswoman for the Auto Alliance, the lobbying arm for American carmakers. "When gas is more costly, sales of high-mileage vehicles rises too, and vice versa."

The GMC truck brand was up 22.7 percent, the Jeep Cherokee rose 67 percent, and the Honda CR-V saw sales rise 38 percent. Toyota took a hit on its cars but stayed afloat thanks to increased sales of its 4Runner SUV (up 53.4 percent) and the Highlander crossover SUV (up 16.7 percent). The Washington Post has even anecdotally reported higher demand for the gas-guzzling Hummer on used-car lots, years after General Motors killed off the massive car.

And that's bad news for smaller cars. Toyota's car sales overall were down 2.7 percent, the Ford Fusion fell 11 percent, the Nissan Altima fell 7 percent, and the Chevy Malibu lost 16.7 percent of sales. Even one of the flagship electric vehicles, Chevy's plug-in hybrid Volt, saw sales drop to 1,336 units, a 30 percent dip from last month and a 16 percent decline compared to 2013.

Those market forces could present some problems as automakers strive to meet tougher Corporate Average Fuel Economy standards. Although the standards allow a footprint approach that will keep automakers in line if they make their light trucks cleaner, to hit the fleetwide average automakers are counting on sales of their smaller, greener, more fuel-efficient models.
As Gas Prices Fall, Auto Buyers Abandon Greener Cars

No matter what Volkswagen's gifted technicians might tell us, the XL1 has no suspension. We exaggerate only slightly – if the XL1 were not on these Swiss country roads licked clean by peaceful herds of happy sheep, then every bump would surely end up transmitted right into our cerebral cortex. The large village speed bumps we encountered needed to be approached as though we were driving a Ferrari Enzo FXX with no nose-lift hydraulics. The one bump for which we decided not to slow to a near halt showed us our decision was a poor one, so the very thought of encountering a US-spec pothole would be enough to consider putting our chiropractor on retainer. The dampers have perhaps a couple inches of travel at most.
2014 Volkswagen XL1
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby kanon » Sun 25 Jan 2015, 16:16:24

I am shopping for a new car and my choices are annoyingly limited.

I personally think the Honda Fit, about 4 yrs old is your best bet. Buying used saves a lot of pollution from manufacturing new and you can save a lot of money also. Just be sure you also buy the shop manual for education and have a reserve for the inevitable repair. For what it is worth.

You guys are making it sound like it's all the evil car manufactures who are at fault here. Ignoring completely the car buying public who's buying preference is for heavy ICE vehicles.

I don't want to expand the topic of the thread, but don't forget there are extensive subsidies for autos and heavy restrictions on possible competitors. Look at the fact that fuel tax pays perhaps 30% of road construction and maintenance. There are (still?) income tax incentives for business purchase of gas guzzlers. There are also numerous disincentives for public transport and, if you are truly reckless, walk or ride your bicycle to see up close the extent of the monopoly. The public, in my humble opinion, recognizes a subsidy when they see one.
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby kublikhan » Sun 25 Jan 2015, 16:38:35

Public transportation is even more heavily subsidized. 65-75% of public transportation funding comes from subsides.

Certainly the first thing that comes to mind when considering how we pay for public transit is the money that passengers deposit into the farebox whenever they board. In the United States and most countries, the percentage of total operating revenues that passengers pay for through fares is called the farebox recovery ratio, and ranges widely. Most transit systems in the United States have farebox recovery ratios between 25 and 35%.

Where does the rest of the money come from? Taxes, the types and amounts of which differ from region to region. In the United States, the most common form of taxation for transit is the sales tax. At the federal level, a segment of the federal gasoline tax is used to support the programs of the Federal Transit Administration (FTA).
The Basics of Transit Funding

Too bad the public doesn't recognize their own desires to drive an SUV brick to work everyday is not doing any wonders for their mpg numbers. The public's recognition of such things seems to wane in and out with the tides. Or gas prices in this instance.
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby kanon » Sun 25 Jan 2015, 18:21:36

Public transportation expense is a very different onion. It is possible to attain very high mpg in terms of person-miles with the bus and here, again, we could develop the idea that public transportation is discouraged because it just does not burn enough fuel. However, I disagree that public transportation is more heavily subsidized than automobiles. The main expense is the wages for employees. For autos we are not paid to drive, and do not count the military, traffic police, oil spill cleanups, Prozac, hospitalizations, pollution harm, etc. My limited research on the subject has left me feeling that buses are way too expensive, use too much fuel, and that the whole area is ripe for some innovation and new thinking. Maybe someone will start a new thread. I would like to know more about public transportation.
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Re: VW 300 MPG XL1 not allowed to tour America

Unread postby kublikhan » Sun 25 Jan 2015, 19:04:56

There's lots of public transportation threads in this forum. I'll list a few of my posts on the subject.

This one is more about declining US car ownership but touches on public transportation as well:
Is the American love affair with the car dying?

This one discusses mpg figures for airlines vs cars:
Airlines THE Dead Canary Thread

Or if you prefer a more cynical take on the subject, here's a post detailing the dismantling of the US trolley system:
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