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China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

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China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Mon 18 Jul 2016, 04:07:41

China says Australia would be unwise to follow United States
Ruan Zongze, a member of an advisory committee to the Chinese government, said freedom of navigation as pursued by the US had gone far beyond what was permitted under international law and Australia shouldn’t follow.

He said he could not prejudge China’s reaction were Australia to conduct a freedom of navigation exercise in that zone.
“It would be unwise, it would be wrong and it will be devastating for Australia to join that kind of very dangerous exercise. You take a position to challenge China’s sovereignty,” he told Sky News.

Mr Ruan said China recognised that Australia was a close ally of the US. “However, America is not always right,” he said pointing to the recent British inquiry into the Iraq war which showed the US made many mistakes.
“It would be dangerous for America and maybe for its ally to pursue a kind of very provocative so-called freedom of navigation (exercise).”
http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/china-says-australia-would-be-unwise-to-follow-united-states/news-story/b036eec263fbd287f97c478f4f58f60d

This is meant to be an Australia-specific thread.
The reality is that Australia is not really "following the US" but rather it just has the same position that all the other Pacific nations do, in having concerns about China. Including India, too, and small states like Singapore. Japan, South Korea, Indonesia, Philippines, everybody.

So what do you Australians think? My opinion: Julie Bishop has actually been more assertive in rhetoric, than what the US line has been. A definite MISTAKE would be, NOT doing the freedom of navigation patrols, after talking so tough.
If you talk tough, then you have to follow through, or Australia would lose credibility in the region.

The central issue at hand, are international waters, which Australia has a right to sail through. Just as India does -- the Indian Navy is making it a point, too, to go up there and sail around.

Joe Biden's in Australia, right now:
The US vice-president arrived in Australia on Saturday for a four-day tour, which included attending the opening of the $1bn Victorian Comprehensive Cancer Centre and attending an Australian rules football game with the foreign affairs minister, Julie Bishop. On Monday he toured a Boeing factory in Melbourne that makes a component of aeroplane wings, which are then sent to the US to be assembled. ...

Biden was due to fly to Sydney on Monday afternoon to meet with the prime minister, Malcolm Turnbull.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/18/joe-biden-praises-trade-links-with-australia-before-talks-with-malcolm-turnbull

Deloitte: Australia's dependence on China 'huge', political gridlock threatens
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-07-18/deloitte-brexit-business-outlook/7637816
Australian MP calls on gov't not to add to tension in South China Sea
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2016-07/17/c_135519551.htm
Air Force 2 - Takeoff at Melbourne Airport (USA Vice President)
https://youtu.be/_7f3ZWE49sY
US Vice President Joe Biden's motorcade in Melbourne https://youtu.be/VVYez9n7mbQ


Just to note, Biden's Pacific trip was primarily security related. He met with the allies, Japanese and South Korean officials, and before that he was on the USS John C. Stennis aircraft carrier, in Hawaii. He gave a speech about freedom of navigation in the south china sea, and upholding international law, and that the US will be in the region for the very long term.

And then, he went to Australia. If the US and Australia played it up as being about cancer research and trade and seeing a football game, then I'd assume that was being sensitive to China. :lol:

No conspiracy theory here, though.. we are allies, after all. Biden was on a goodwill trip, and discussions with the Australian PM.
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Mon 18 Jul 2016, 23:00:08

None of our Australian members wants to talk about this?

It's the biggest foreign policy issue facing Australia, probably for the next 30 years or more..

It ain't like Australia has very big major foreign policy / defense issues often, well now ya got one.. no opinions, one way or another? No thoughts?

Australia 'pretending' to stand up to China over disputed islands, Labor says
Defence spokesman Stephen Conroy says Australian forces are not authorised to go within 12 nautical miles of the artificial islands in the South China Sea

Australia should stop “pretending” to conduct freedom of navigation exercises and take more concrete action in the South China Sea, the Labor defence spokesman Stephen Conroy has said.

Conroy’s statement is a strong reiteration of Labor’s position that the defence force should be authorised to conduct freedom of navigation exercises within 12 nautical miles of rocky outcrops and artificial islands in the area.

Conroy said it would be “bullying” if China retaliated economically against Australia for making such a stand. ...

“It is vital that we not just talk the talk but that we act and be seen to act to support the system,” he said. “The government is continuing to pretend to the Australian people that it has an ongoing program of freedom of navigation exercises – this is in fact not the case.”

Australia supports in principle freedom of navigation exercises conducted by the US within 12 nautical miles of Chinese structures but has so far not itself conducted such exercises.

Conroy said his questioning of Defence officials at Senate estimates had revealed they were not authorised to engage in freedom of navigation exercises in the South China Sea.

“Now that it’s very clear you can’t build an artificial island and claim rights around it – there is no 12-mile limit around these islands ... Australia should authorise its forces to both sail and fly over those areas of the South China Sea.”

Conroy said Australia should not indicate when and where it would conduct the operations, but called on the government to stop “pretending” it was engaged in them already.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/13/south-china-sea-australia-pretending-exercises-labor-says
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Shaved Monkey » Tue 19 Jul 2016, 19:01:26

Australia doesnt listen to Australians
We do what we are told
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Tue 19 Jul 2016, 21:56:22

China bid for giant Australia farm holding on ice: sources

A China-led consortium seeking to buy Australia's S. Kidman & Co will hold off on a fresh bid for the country's largest agricultural land owner amid concerns it could be derailed by a more protectionist new government, two sources with direct knowledge of the matter said.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-australia-china-landsale-dakang-p-f-idUSKCN0ZU0DA


Chinese language newspapers in Australia: Beijing controls messaging, propaganda in press

One way or another, Beijing has extended its messaging control over almost all the Chinese language media in Australia, Australian Chinese media sources say. Politically sensitive or unfavourable coverage of China and the ruling Communist Party has been effectively stopped outside all but a couple of Chinese language outlets, as the government steps up efforts to filter what the Chinese diaspora consumes.
http://www.smh.com.au/comment/australia-is-guilty-of-the-same-misconduct-as-china-over-our-treatment-of-east-timor-20160713-gq54u0.html


China's patriots among us: Beijing pulls new lever of influence in Australia

Unfurling a large red banner declaring the need to "Firmly Safeguard the Sovereign Rights of China in the South China Sea", the forum was organised by the overseas Chinese patriotic association Australian Action Committee for Peace and Justice.

"Australia's political elite should have a clear understanding," the committee's chair Lin Bin said at the Saturday meeting. "[They] ought to talk and act carefully on the sensitive issue on the South China Sea, and not make 'irrational' or incorrect signals to the international community."
http://www.smh.com.au/world/chinas-patriots-among-us-beijing-pulls-new-lever-of-influence-in-australia-20160412-go4vv0


China warns Australia: stay out of the South China Sea or risk damage to bilateral relations
Australia has been issued with an unusually blunt warning from China — stay out of the South China Sea

Now it has turned its fiery rhetoric and threats towards Australia and Ms Bishop. ...

"Australia should not treat the illegal ruling from an illegal arbitration court as international law." ...

The Chinese are angered that Ms Bishop claimed China's reputation as a rising superpower could suffer if it ignored the decision.

Mr Lu Kang warned Australia should not treat international law as a game.

"China has lodged serious representations to Australia regarding the wrong remarks delivered by the Australian leaders," he said.

"We are firmly against this."

And in more threats, China said it would decisively respond against anyone who takes provocations against its security interests in the South China Sea.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-07-15/china-tells-australia-stay-out-of-the-south-china-sea/7631492


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South China Sea patrols will continue despite rising military tensions, RAAF says

So far this year Australia has conducted 32 Operation Gateway flights, but the RAAF have insisted the number of South China Sea patrols are consistent with past years.

Air Marshal Leo Davies, the chief of the Royal Australian Air Force, has indicated that the operational tempo would continue.

"Air Force will focus on building and encouraging a rules-based global order," he said.

"Air Force will work closely with our allies, partners and other like-minded air forces to determine how we can make a practical contribution to ensuring freedom of navigation."

Without mentioning the South China Sea by name, Air Marshal Davies said Australia would continue to meet its international engagement goals as set out in this year's Defence White Paper.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-07-20/south-china-sea-raaf-patrols-to-continue/7643444


Image

Biden in Sydney: US, Australia a 'united front' in Pacific
https://youtu.be/whl2d02US5Y


Biden: US has no interest in 'containing China'
https://youtu.be/Va6mP6yzebc


EDIT: Some polling data:

Attitudes to China

Positive influences on Australians’ views of China include ‘Chinese people [they] have met’ (85% saying they are a positive influence), ‘China’s culture and history’ (79%), and ‘China’s economic growth’ (75%). The most negative influence is ‘China’s human rights record’ (86% saying it has a negative influence on their views). ‘China’s military activities in our region’ are a negative influence for 79%, while ‘China’s system of government’ (73%), its ‘environmental policies’ (67%) and ‘Chinese investment in Australia’ (59%) are also negative influences on most Australians’ views of China.

Freedom of navigation in the South China Sea

A significant majority of Australians (74%) are in favour of Australia ‘conducting maritime operations … in an effort to ensure freedom of navigation in the South China Sea’, with only 20% against such action.
http://www.lowyinstitute.org/publications/lowy-institute-poll-2016
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Wed 20 Jul 2016, 00:10:56

More from that poll:

Donald Trump and the US alliance

Almost half (45%) of Australians say ‘Australia should distance itself from the United States if it elects a president like Donald Trump’. A bare majority (51%) say Australia ‘should remain close ... regardless of who is elected US President’. Support for the US alliance has slipped nine points: 71% of Australians see the alliance as ‘very’ or ‘fairly’ important to Australia’s security, the lowest level of support since 2007, but still eight points higher than the result that year.


Interesting.. half of Australians think Australia should distance itself from the US, yet also 71% see the alliance as "very" or "fairly" important.

China and the United States are tied when Australians are asked which relationship is the more important to Australia: 43% nominate the US and 43% nominate China. China also has a clear lead over Japan as Australia’s best friend in Asia (30% say China and 25% say Japan is our ‘best friend in Asia’).
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Shaved Monkey » Wed 20 Jul 2016, 07:46:17

This is from a former conservative Australian Prime Minister
http://www.smh.com.au/national/malcolm- ... zragh.html

Former Australian prime minister Malcolm Fraser has renewed his call for Australia to cut its close ties with the United States, in a lecture at the Australian National University on Monday night.

Mr Fraser, who was the prime minister between 1975 and 1983, gave a speech at the ANU Crawford School of Public Policy on Monday evening to promote his new book, Dangerous Allies.

He said although he had expected Australia to distance itself from the US after the Cold War, if anything we were closer to the superpower than ever before.

"We've given more control over us to America than they would have had on earlier occasions," Mr Fraser said.
Last edited by Tanada on Wed 20 Jul 2016, 08:12:03, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Tanada » Wed 20 Jul 2016, 08:14:20

Monkey that story is from 2014, got anything current to support your contention? Politics is too malleable for old stories to carry much weight.
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Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Wed 20 Jul 2016, 18:09:30

Shaved Monkey wrote:Mr Fraser, who was the prime minister between 1975 and 1983, gave a speech at the ANU Crawford School of Public Policy on Monday evening to promote his new book, Dangerous Allies.


Well, so he's selling a book. He sounds a bit like Jimmy Carter to me.

"We've given more control over us to America than they would have had on earlier occasions," Mr Fraser said.


Actually, from what I can tell, it's CHINA that has control, and exerts it, internally within Australia. It's China that's so invested there, and it's Chinese that are buying up so much business and industry, and housing. Same thing in New Zealand, a lot of kiwis complain nobody can find a house anymore.

And as I've posted, the Communist Party is doing active propaganda / whipping up its nationals living in Australia, for them to influence Australia to the pro Beijing line on things.

Other than defense cooperation, the US just leaves Australia alone -- it's CHINA that wants to be so intimately involved there. It could be outright colonization, eventually. It's some concerning stuff, for the future.. in my opinion, anyway.. Australians are Westerners. So what happens if the place ever becomes like Communist Party Chinese?

Americans too, could face these same concerns about China, eventually. Eventually Chinese investment will make its way more toward the US. Along with that though, comes control. Chinese business is a Communist Party controlled enterprise, at the end of the day, with orders coming down from Beijing.

I'm just sayin'.

And, what this former prime minister isn't talking about, is any kind of PLAN for Australia's future in the Pacific.. what to DO, exactly, other than "do nothing" and "distance from the Americans." Well, doing nothing is not an option. He sounds like Jimmy Carter to me, it's just all leftist criticism yet no PLAN.

At the end of the day, I don't think most Australians really ever want Chinese military bases on their soil. 8O 8O

Ultimately, Australia's concern about China is the same as the US and all of China's neighbors, and Europe too. If China is going to be a superpower -- then people would just want it to be rules based global order kind of thing, and international law, and just be a "gentle giant" like America has been.

Don't be bossing everyone around so much, like China does.

Unfortunately, I wonder if maybe the Chinese CAN'T change and mature.. maybe they are just essentially bossy and always will be.

I mean goodness, look at how much they're yelling at Julie Bishop. For her "wrong comments," and all these threats.

Let's get real here -- USA never threatens. The US government makes friends, and equal allies and partners. Whereas China outright verbally threatens everybody, and they're so obsessed that they never lose "face." Well what about everyone else's "face," does that not count for anything?

What about everyone else's rights? Does the Communist Party not recognize rights?
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Wed 20 Jul 2016, 18:58:18

Some information about the book, "Dangerous Allies:"

Australia has always been reliant on great and powerful friends for its sense of national security and for direction on its foreign policy first on the British Empire and now on the United States. Australia has actively pursued a policy of strategic dependence, believing that making a grand bargain with a powerful ally was the best policy to ensure its security and prosperity.

"Dangerous Allies" examines Australia s history of strategic dependence and questions the continuation of this position. Malcolm Fraser argues that Australia should adopt a much greater degree of independence in foreign policy, and that they should no longer merely follow other nations into wars of no direct interest to Australia or Australia s security. He argues for an end to strategic dependence and for the timely establishment of a truly independent Australia.


Okay, this is an Australia thread, so I'm gonna be objective and put myself in the shoes of an Australian defense planner.

I agree with him, that Australia SHOULD be more independent and doing some bold things, in its foreign policy. But that doesn't just mean following China or joining their bloc, either.

Ultimately -- Western values are what matter. Democracy. Rule of law. These are our SHARED values, whether it's Britain or Canada or the US or Oz or NZ. And, it's European values too -- Germany, France, east europe.

So that's a factor one can't forget, this is a WESTERN alliance. It's UK, Europe, North America, most of South America, and in the Pacific it's the DEMOCRACIES -- South Korea, Japan, Singapore, etc. And then India, in the Indian Ocean.

Australia is WESTERN. If that's ever given up, then you lose something very special there, and important. In the US, this stuff is written into our Constitution and founding documents. In the British Commonwealth -- it's unwritten, less spelled out, but nonetheless it's a thousand year tradition of democratic government and rule of law. In the US, we've got English common law that goes back 500 years. I assume Oz does, too.

Well look folks, China is different. A lot of people are okay about China, except the Communist Party at the top of it, that's the thing people have a problem about.

Australia is part of a WESTERN world and alliance.. along with Japan, and Europe, and the UK, and Canada.

And so, Australia has the same RESPONSIBILITY everyone else does, to uphold those values -- rule of law, international law, democracy and a democratic global order that stays united and can therefore address global problems, and none of us lose our essential values, which really are very important.

As for what Australia could do, rather than just following..

Well, quite simply, just be more of a LEADER in the West. The West needs leaders. USA needs some HELP. UK and old Margaret Thatcher was a right hand man, with Ronald Reagan. Australia could be that, in the Pacific, in the future. In the Pacific -- it's Japan that's the US core ally (and in fairness, Australia doesn't have the money and resources to do much.. but it WILL, more and more, in the future).

A possible route for Australia would be to be a leader in the Pacific, along with the US and Japan.

Here's what's interesting -- of all the cultures in the anglo world, it's actually Australians that are the most like Americans.

So, really -- as Australia becomes a rising power into the future, *it could step into the USA's place* in the Pacific. Australia could be LEADING Japan. And other nations in that region.

Defense strategy wise -- Australia really needs a backup defense partner, other than just the US (because one never knows, the US could leave the region some day). I'd recommend Japan. That's the only other significant power in the region. And then also, it would be smart to make more ties with India. And then also, do more with all the other countries in ASEAN.

Overall, the reality is that really Australia can't ever be in opposition to the rest of the western alliance -- that's Europe, Canada, North America, it's most of the world folks. There's the world, and then there's Russia and China and Iran, and it ain't smart to be just stuck with that bloc.

So I think that's what Australia should do.. it has to look to its other allies, in Europe and North America and the democratic Pacific, and it should be a part of this group and pull its weight and it's all a team. Australia really can't ever become too much more pro China, than the rest of the alliance is -- if Europe ever flips pro China, and the US does too, then OKAY Australia can as well.

But unless that's ever the case, then just practically, Australia can't be at odds with everyone else.

Australia can still be independent though, and actually do a lot to advance its interests, WITHIN this alliance -- and with the backup of the global superpower, what's better than that?

Look at India -- the Indian Navy is running around the Pacific telling countries they'll protect them. India is advancing its power, influence, and interests. Australia could do the same. If Australia wants influence in the world -- regarding climate change, and other issues, then Australia has to be engaged and involved.

Maybe some little country would want the Australian Navy around, and then Australia would have influence. That's how it works.
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Shaved Monkey » Wed 20 Jul 2016, 22:28:55

Australia is not independent we have too many foreign owned resources that need to be controlled and exploited and we are the WASP outpost in Asia .
Democracy is an illusion here as it is everywhere.
Its not in our best interests to be in neck deep with the soon to be former world leader against the soon to be new world leader.
Our biggest trading partner is China we are part of Asia.
The US is trying to maintain their empire China is trying to build theres.
Australia is stupidly becoming the meat in the sandwich which really doesnt make our lives better or safer.

This was in the main financial papers today.

If it came to a war over the South China Sea, who would win?

Ten years ago, the answer would have been a resounding nod to the United States. While the odds are still well in the super power's favour today, military experts say the costs would be high and China could inflict some serious damage.

Of course, this is an extreme scenario.
Most analysts agree that the chance of a conventional war between China and the US over the South China Sea is low, precisely because the consequences are so serious.

Such a conflict would divide the world and bring the global economy to its knees.

So this is not a likely scenario, but it can't be ruled out, particularly when the head of the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Navy said this week China was ready to counter aggression in the South China Sea.

So, in the event of a war, how do China and the US match up?

In terms of sheer firepower, experience and weaponry, the US is a decade ahead of China.

China has been stocking up on anti-ship missiles as part of its strategy to force the US further out to sea.

one of the missiles on display was the Dongfeng-21D, which can target moving ships and travels at 10 times the speed of sound.

It has been dubbed the "carrier killer". Another missile in the parade was the YJ-12, which skims the water's surface.

"The US has way more stuff and it's better stuff, but that's not the right question to be asking," says Hugh White, professor of strategic studies at the Australian National University.

"The question is what can you do to stop the other guy? China's capability development has been very heavily directed towards finding and sinking US ships."

"Ten years ago you would have said the US had an assured capacity to prevail," he says. "It now faces the probability of taking big losses ... it could even lose an [aircraft] carrier."
China has developed a strategy to push the American forces as far away from the Chinese mainland as it can.
He singles out the Dongfeng-21D or
"carrier killer" as "definitely a danger to any opposing force."

"China has focused on raising the cost for the US."

http://www.afr.com/news/world/chinaus-m ... 720-gq9xot
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Wed 20 Jul 2016, 23:39:04

6, as Tanada said, stop being so frikken lazy "Australia just keep doing nothing" fair dinkum you are clueless. We run extensive aid programs throughout SE Asia & the South Pacific & Philippines & even in China. Sick of you talking rubbish.
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 21 Jul 2016, 00:11:59

SeaGypsy wrote:6, as Tanada said, stop being so frikken lazy "Australia just keep doing nothing" fair dinkum you are clueless. We run extensive aid programs throughout SE Asia & the South Pacific & Philippines & even in China. Sick of you talking rubbish.


Well that's nice SG, but it's not a defense policy nor a long term strategic plan for the future.

Anyway -- I don't mean to offend anybody. I give up. This forum isn't the place to have serious discussions about defense and strategy. I'm sure Australia has such people, but they are just not on this forum.

Your government is spending $50 billion on submarines, so that's a start. Now you'll just need a plan to sail them somewhere. Can't have a navy and be afraid to ever take it out of dock.

A country has to figure out what its interests are; and what its values are, and then go sail with those that share those.

P.S. My "do nothing" criticism was just about that book "Dangerous Allies." It just doesn't sound very in depth or like serious thinking. The reality is that in the future, you're gonna have India that's a rising power and out doing things in your neck of the woods. And China, too, and more problems between China and others. And Japan, and South Korea.

And who knows what could happen with Indonesia in the future, or the Philippines.

Australia has to do SOMETHING, if it's neutral and be switzerland then okay, that means effective foreign policy (but you'd wind up dominated by China, are you really comfortable with that? What if it doesn't change, from how it is now, with the Communist Party?).

The main fact is that without the US, Oz's position would be more precarious.

In a neighborhood like out there, you guys would need some kind of plan, that's all I'm saying. "Just stop following the Americans and Japanese" is not a plan.
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Thu 21 Jul 2016, 00:25:14

More blah blah. StFU, go do some reading about Australia's engagement in the region, you are talking shit.
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 21 Jul 2016, 00:43:45

SeaGypsy wrote:More blah blah. StFU, go do some reading about Australia's engagement in the region, you are talking shit.


Well, it was helpful that Julie Bishop was diplomatically forceful about China recently and your government says it's gonna keep doing freedom of navigation patrols.

But you and shaved monkey don't agree with that, I guess. :?:

You guys don't need to yell at me -- you have your views, just say what they are, if you think China should have that ocean then it's okay to say it.

But according to polls 74% of all Australians agree with freedom of navigation patrols.

Shaved monkey posted an article about the book "Dangerous Allies." So then I'm just asking the question, okay.. what is that former prime minsiter's alternative plan?
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 21 Jul 2016, 00:56:48

China warns of 'serious measures' if Australia ups ante in South China Sea

A senior Chinese Foreign ministry official has warned of "serious measures" if Australia ups the ante in opposing Chinese seizure of islands and coral reefs in the South China Sea.

The official said Australia's position was "detrimental to the political foundation of our relationship" and not conducive to political stability, "especially in the South China Sea".

The warning came as US Vice-President Joe Biden stood shoulder-to-shoulder with Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull to reaffirm the two countries' commitment to responding to "any challenges in the Pacific with a united front".

"It's important we stand together," Mr Biden said after bilateral talks with Mr Turnbull and Foreign Minister Julie Bishop. Earlier he visited troops on the Australian warship, HMAS Adelaide, anchored in Sydney Harbour.
http://www.afr.com/news/world/asia/china-warns-of-serious-measures-if-australia-ups-ante-in-south-china-sea-20160719-gq92zh


This was Biden on the HMAS Adelaide:

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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Thu 21 Jul 2016, 00:57:52

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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 21 Jul 2016, 01:37:59

Some more pics of Biden in Australia:

Biden with Julie Bishop:

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Biden with veterans at the Melbourne cricket club:

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Biden reassures Australia on Asia pivot, Trump

Vice President Joe Biden reassured Australians on Wednesday of the United States’ commitment to playing an active role in the Pacific and maintaining free trade in the region.

Biden, who spoke after Donald Trump was named the Republican nominee for president, also reassured Australians about potential concerns surrounding the presidential election.

“So don't worry about our election,” he said to laughs. “Don't worry about our election. The better angels in America will prevail.”
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/07/joe-biden-australia-asia-225868


Vice President Joe Biden: 'Don't worry about our election'
https://youtu.be/bjaH4GQP4MU?t=18
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Thu 21 Jul 2016, 02:52:34

Biden in New Zealand:

Biden "We share the same values"
US Vice President Joe Biden speaks in Auckland about the relationship between the US and New Zealand.
https://youtu.be/nZKTU8o0Fpc


Biden's big speech in Australia:

https://youtu.be/fubX-0M5Bdw

"Over the years fighting side by side, over 65 years of a formal alliance all through every testing - through every testing we faced as a nation, Australians and Americans have built an unsurpassed partnership. Our people joined in easy mateship, a history that forged the foundations of our alliance in iron, and baptised it in blood," Biden said.

"I am here because that partnership is a living connection between our two countries. As vital in this current era of change and uncertainty as it was a century ago in the trenches of World War I, as it was 75 years ago when together we defeated the forces of fascism, our alliance has been shaped by progress of our shared home in the Asia-Pacific and it's been for decades."
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby Sixstrings » Fri 22 Jul 2016, 00:58:57

My last comment in this thread: just objectively, Julie Bishop is a good foreign minister. She's doing a good job.
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Re: China says Australia would be unwise to follow the US

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Fri 22 Jul 2016, 05:01:51

Joe is correct, we & kiwis were put on this earth to snark, but when push comes to shove we will do America's bidding. China has bought Australian businesses, real estate, farms, it can't buy our trust or supplant our joint military history with America. No amount of piss & moan from China is going to change this. Aussies, Kiwis will continue to be critical of everyone, that's what we do. We will join any US led major alliance, for the same reason.
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