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Russian ship too close to US War vessel

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Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 02 Jul 2016, 21:58:02

https://www.yahoo.com/news/russian-wars ... 46945.html
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A Russian warship carried out "unprofessional" maritime operations in close proximity to a U.S. Navy ship in the eastern Mediterranean Sea, a U.S. Defense official said on Friday.

This is the second time the same Russian vessel has come within close proximity of a U.S. Navy ship this month. On June 17, the Yaroslav Mudryy came within 315 yards (288 meters) of the USS Gravely, an incident U.S. officials called "unsafe and unprofessional," but which the Russian Defense Ministry disputed.

Recent months have seen a number of similar Cold War-style incidents at sea and in the air, with each country's military accusing the other of dangerous approaches in international waters and airspace.

The U.S. Defense official, who was speaking on the condition of anonymity, said the most recent incident took place on June 30 when the Yaroslav Mudryy came unnecessarily close to the USS San Jacinto and maneuvered in it's wake.

"The closing distance by Yaroslav Mudryy before the ship turned away from San Jacinto is considered a high risk maneuver, highly unprofessional, and contrary to international maritime regulations," the official said.

Something or nothing?
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Sixstrings » Sat 02 Jul 2016, 22:19:37

onlooker wrote:Something or nothing?


It's nothing, except that the kremlin is getting a bit more assertive at confronting US Navy ships. DoD and State Dept. should start making an issue of it, or the Russians will keep escalating until finally there's a response, I would think.

There's no video of the latest incident, but this was the Russian frigate intercepting the Harry S. Truman strike group, June 17th:

https://youtu.be/P_P4hIz4S1E

The USS Gravely was in the Mediterranean on a routine patrol June 17 to provide protection for the aircraft carrier Harry S. Truman as part of Operation Inherent Resolve to counter ISIS. It was approached by the Project 1154 Russian Neustrashimyy-class frigate, according to U.S. officials.The Russian vessel made repeated passes behind the Gravely within its wake.

At one point, the Russian ship pointed toward the Truman, the officials said. “Gravely was operating astern of Harry S. Truman, and assessed that 777 was intentionally trying to interfere with Harry S. Truman operations,” the official said, referring to the Russian frigate’s side number. The Gravely eventually accelerated speed and moved ahead, with the Russian ship still following it before breaking off.

For the first time in some years, two US Navy carrier strike groups were active at the same time in the Mediterranean Sea. On June 2, the carrier Harry S. Truman — whose escorts included the Graveley — passed northbound through the Suez Canal and, on the following day, began combat strikes against ISIS targets in Syria and Iraq.


It's basically just intimidation (which isn't going to work, the USA is not a small minor power that can just get pushed off, that ain't ever gonna happen).

Russia, of course, does not own international waters in the Mediterranean Sea.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby eugene » Sat 02 Jul 2016, 22:49:20

This is a pissing match. All news will be "the Russians did" and who knows if its true. We don't exactly live in a nation with a responsible media. It's business and, mostly, entertainment. Informing the public is not the goal. Manipulating the public is. Personally, I've considered the "news" and, for that matter, all media nothing but propaganda. It's a creation and with modern video techniques, anything can be created. I did my thing with a manufactured war.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby AgentR11 » Sat 02 Jul 2016, 23:54:57

Sixstrings wrote:It's basically just intimidation (which isn't going to work, the USA is not a small minor power that can just get pushed off, that ain't ever gonna happen).

Russia, of course, does not own international waters in the Mediterranean Sea.


Neither does the USA. International waters are ruled by very specific rules of navigation and grant no privilege to US Navy vessels over other Navies.

Six, is of course desperate to see the US fire on Russians, living in some weird Hollywood world where Russia doesn't shoot back. UN Navy commanders know better. And so the game will remain one of a navigation dance; no one will be shooting at annoying Russians. We'll both continue to accuse the other of unprofessional intercepts and provocations.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Sixstrings » Sun 03 Jul 2016, 00:39:37

AgentR11 wrote:Six, is of course desperate to see the US fire on Russians,


Of course I'm not.

no one will be shooting at annoying Russians.


John Kerry said under the rules of engagement, it could have qualified for a "shoot-down."

Kerry: Shooting down Russia jets 'would have been justified'

"We condemn this kind of behaviour," he told the Miami Herald and CNN Espanol in a joint interview.

"It is reckless. It is provocative. It is dangerous. And under the rules of engagement, that could have been a shoot-down."

He added that the US "is not going to be intimidated on the high seas" and that a message had been conveyed to Russia over the danger of such a gesture.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36050689


In all the years he's been secretary of state, I'm pretty sure Kerry has never used such tough language before.

Kerry was pretty clear: "the United States is not going to be intimidated on the high seas." (this is about the safety of the crews, and the principle of freedom of navigation and the US isn't ever going to be pushed back at sea, by China or Russia or Iran or anybody else.)

We'll both continue to accuse the other of unprofessional intercepts and provocations.


Hopefully so.

Individual Nato members' rules of engagement should clearly outline what are defined as "actions that might be construed as provocative", according to the organisation's own guidelines.

Applying those rules of engagement "requires commanders at all levels to exercise considerable judgment", Nato says.

Mr Kerry did not specify why the US Navy did not fire at the jets.

Image
The Russian Sukhoi Su-24 aircraft made very low passes by the USS Donald Cook

Image
A Russian Kamov KA-27 Helix surveys USS Donald Cook on 12 April 2016

Image
The jets were so close they created wakes in the water near the ship

The US suspended flight operations from the ship until the Russian jets left the area.
The next day, a Russian KA-27 helicopter flew circles at low altitude around the ship, followed by more jet passes.

The aircraft did not respond to safety warnings in English or Russian.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby AgentR11 » Sun 03 Jul 2016, 00:50:18

Sixstrings wrote:
no one will be shooting at annoying Russians.

John Kerry said under the rules of engagement, it could have qualified for a "shoot-down."


Which would have resulted in the sinking of the Cook. Thus the commander, not being an idiot, decided not to shoot. Just because rules of engagement permit an action, does not imply the action is wise.

Fortunately, Six is not commanding a Navy vessel.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Sixstrings » Sun 03 Jul 2016, 01:19:51

AgentR11 wrote:Fortunately, Six is not commanding a Navy vessel.


Well, John Kerry once commanded a Navy vessel:

Image

And he says "the United States will not be intimidated on the high seas."

You surely know this Agent, this is standard policy going back to the war of 1812 when it was His Majesty's Navy impeding our ships at sea, and the barbary pirates before that, on up to Momar Ghadaffi and when he drew a line in the bay of Tripoli or whatever that is -- Reagan sent an aircraft carrier straight on over there to go cross that line.

And in the Korean War, the Soviets buzzed some migs too close and a US Navy ship shot one down. I'm not saying it's a good thing, not saying I want to see that happen, I'm just saying that maybe people shouldn't buzz each other's ships.

We don't do that to theirs, what gives them the right to do that to ours? Don't you remember the USS Cole? The Navy USED to be more lenient about approaching craft, and then the Cole got hit. There's a REASON they are cautious now.

In this latest incident, the captain of the USS San Jacinto did his job -- the Russian frigate pointed its bow toward the capital ship, the Harry S. Truman, and the San Jacinto THEN forced the frigate away from the group.

That's the role of a picket line ship, to protect the capital ship.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby AgentR11 » Sun 03 Jul 2016, 01:22:08

Six.
If we fire on the Russian ship. They WILL fire back.
Period.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Sixstrings » Sun 03 Jul 2016, 02:02:13

The US Navy and Russia: Heading Towards a Crisis in the Mediterranean?

The U.S. Navy is unhappy with Russian naval forces harassing its ships in the Eastern Mediterranean during combat operations over Iraq and Syria. The service considers the Russian behavior to be dangerous and unprofessional in the extreme.

Particularly concerning for the Navy leadership are the actions of the Russian frigate Neustrashimyy that interfered with flight operations onboard the carrier USS Harry S. Truman (CVN-75) and which almost collided with USS Gravely (DDG-107), a U.S. Navy Arleigh Burke-class destroyer on June 17. Later on June 30, another Russian frigate Yaroslav Mudry interfered with the operations of the Ticonderoga-class cruiser USS San Jacinto (CG-56) and the carrier USS Dwight D. Eisenhower (CVN-69).

“I think it is very important that sailors and officers on the bridge of a ship —whatever nationality it is—act prudently and communicate frequently to avoid any mistakes or miscalculations,” Vice Adm. James G. Foggo III, who is simultaneously commander of the U.S. Navy’s 6th Fleet, Joint Force Maritime Component Commander Europe and NATO’s Naval Striking and Support Forces NATO, told The National Interest.

“We believe we acted prudently in the vicinity of our aircraft carrier, which was conducting carrier strike missions from the Mediterranean and the Neustrashimyy acted in a way that was not appropriate and not in accordance with the U.N. Convention on the Laws of the Sea. And so we protested that behavior to the Russians.”

Russians, however, don’t agree with the American account of the events, Foggo said. Foggo said that normally U.S.-Russia maritime disputes are resolved under the auspices of the Incidents at Sea Agreement. Indeed, the most recent annual Incidents at Sea meeting took place in Moscow last month, Foggo said.

Nonetheless, though Foggo descried the meeting as “frank “ and “productive,” the Russians’ unprofessional behavior—such as those exhibited by Neustrashimyy—continues unabated. “Which is not the kind of conduct I would expect from a professional warship and a professional navy,” Foggo said.

Alarik Fritz, a senior analyst with the Center for Naval Analyses who serves as Foggo’s advisor, said that U.S. Navy prides itself on maintaining the highest professional standards of seamanship. “I think at the end of the day, everyone knows the U.S. Navy—because it is extremely professional—is not at fault here,” he said.

Moreover, the Russians’ behavior disrupted flight operations onboard the U.S. Navy’s aircraft carriers, which were conducting airstrikes against the ISIS terror network in Syria and Iraq. “This behavior was disruptive to us while we were conducting launch and recovery of aircraft on a mission which the Russians believe is also in their interests—and that is to strike terrorist targets in the Middle East,” Foggo said. “By their behavior, they’re working across purposes to their own interests—which I don’t understand.”

Despite the actions of the Russian vessels, Foggo said the United States would continue to try to work with the Kremlin’s forces. ‘We’ll continue this dialogue with them and we’ll continue to remind them when their behavior does not meet the requirements and the expectations of the U.N. Convention on the Laws of the Sea,” Foggo said.
http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/the-us-navy-russia-heading-towards-crisis-the-mediterranean-16834


As I posted in the other other thread, just recently Moscow fired most of the top commanders in the Baltics, in some sort of shakeup.

Something I wonder -- it's possible that maybe there's actually not good command and control, with the Russian forces. Perhaps some of these risky cowboy maneuvers are not really sanctioned by Moscow.

The issue about these carriers (in the Med), is that they were in active flight launch operations (in Syria, where the US is working with Russia right now).. it's more serious to have random Russian ships come cruising up into the carrier group, *while* it's in operations.

It could have been a Russian captain doing his own thing / some problem going on, and / or some general command and control issues.

If Russia does anything to address the issues, then they certainly would deserve credit for that.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Sixstrings » Sun 03 Jul 2016, 03:04:03

Former president of Poland weighs in:

Image
Former Polish President Lech Walesa

‘I would shoot’ Russian jets buzzing past US ships – Poland’s ex-president Walesa

Poland’s former president and democracy icon Lech Walesa said he would not hesitate to “knock off the wing” of Russian jets if he were in charge of the US destroyer Donald Cook.

“If I were the commander of this ship, if these [Russian] planes were flying I would shoot them. But not to kill. I would knock off the wing,” the Nobel Peace Prize recipient of 1983 told Radio Free Europe.

The interview, published Saturday, comes ahead of a NATO summit in Warsaw scheduled for July 8-9 and right after Moscow mended ties with Ankara after seven months of discord over Russia’s downed jet.

Asked if such a hostile gesture could spark a full-fledged military confrontation between NATO and Russia, he dismissed such a possibility, saying: “Not a chance. What conflict?” adding “No one wants conflict, and Russia does not want it.”

Walesa argued that actual warfare is too costly an enterprise to be waged by Russia, who he says “cannot afford a conflict” as “it is terribly expensive.” Moscow’s weapon would rather be “scare and blackmail,” he added.
https://www.rt.com/news/349342-poland-walesa-nato-shoot-russian-jets/


Russia should be GLAD it's the United States leading east Europe and Turkey.. otherwise Russia would have a lot more problems on its hands.

Just as North Korea, ultimately, is actually glad the USA is out there.

There is no more cautious, professional force than the US military. And no more detached, objective and coolheaded foreign service, than the US state department. THAT is the reality. The US isn't Poland, or Turkey, or the Baltics -- these are our allies, but the USA has a cool head and no centuries-long grievances with Russia.

The biggest worry about Russia, is just that maybe it's actually not so organized.. and has some hotheads.. and Poland and the Baltics and Turkey has hotheads.. and maybe Sweden panicking.

Long term, it's very important there be more cooperation with Russia and communication (if Russia's got bad command and control and some cowboy admirals and commanders, that would be VERY concerning), while not throwing the allies we're responsible for, under the bus either.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby sparky » Sun 03 Jul 2016, 07:25:41

.
@ Sixstring , don't worry mate , the signals are all over the place , mission accomplished !
now the word is cooling thing down , of course some dumb arsed military might not get it yet.
the latest is the resuscitation from the dead of the Nato /Russia council ,
the big item on the menu is getting warplanes to fly over the Baltic with their transponders switched on.
for information there were twice as many Nato plane flying "dark" than Russian ones.

the bout of confrontation was essentially a fundraising effort for Nato and the US military complex ,
Nato is pushing for an increase in Europe military spending (at 2% GDP) something they ferociously resisted

some of this money will go toward buying the ridiculously expensive F35
check the share price of Raytheon, Lockeed Martin ,Northrop Grumman and Boeing , it is quite rosy !

Of course the Russians are not amused to be brought on the very edge of mass slaughter for some CEO getting his bonus
those thing leave a certain amount of bile in one mouth ,not to be washed away by one cherry "oups"
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby AgentR11 » Sun 03 Jul 2016, 19:24:12

Taking the word of someone that desperately wants to engage in a war of vengeance against Russia, for Russia's unwillingness to fire back has to be the most inane, foolish thing you've suggested here.

If we fire on a Russian plane. (in bait mode)
They will fire back.
Guaranteed.

You friggin cowboys that think you can just shoot at anyone that annoys you, make me ill.

Reality is... our commanders are not idiots. Our commanders will not fire on a jet that is being annoying. And thus, our commanders will not end up with their ship on the bottom of the Baltic Sea.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Sixstrings » Mon 04 Jul 2016, 23:28:53

sparky wrote:the latest is the resuscitation from the dead of the Nato /Russia council ,
the big item on the menu is getting warplanes to fly over the Baltic with their transponders switched on.


That would be a GOOD IDEA, and I haven't seen enough information to conclude anything, but just seeing the Russian defense minister talking about something that sounds SAFE and about avoiding conflict, then that sounds very positive.

the bout of confrontation was essentially a fundraising effort for Nato and the US military complex ,
Nato is pushing for an increase in Europe military spending (at 2% GDP) something they ferociously resisted


Well that's funny Sparky. That's like half the town burning down and you're saying "it's just a fundraising effort for the firefighter industrial complex, they just want more fire departments." And then I'd guess you'd be for just letting the fires rage out of control.

MUCH of Europe has been PANICKING ever since the Ukraine thing started up. And then, tensions in Baltics started up.

The reality is that it was THEY that were saying to Washington, "where are you America, where are you.. you have to do something.."

And Obama resisted. Obama resisted his own American generals. Obama just wanted nothing to do with anything that looks like a problem, he just wanted to put his 8 years in and get on out of there, and leave the problems to somebody else.

FINALLY, O started doing a few things.. a couple for-show stuff, like having F-22 Raptors go land in Romania for a few hours, then come fly back.

And the rest of reticent Europe, and UK, and NATO began doing some more. Canadian, British fighter jet patrols in the Baltics, along with USAF. And the Navy's been sending more ships up there.

These poor little Baltics countries -- they're so scared, they drew up "Russian hybrid war invasion" contingency plans.

Sweden PANICKED over "Russian subs in the harbor."

The whole thing is just a big waste of money, and it would be nice if Russia would just stop it. But Putin has to work his own electorate, with "fear of the West" and sabre rattling and nationalism, and Putin's Russia has its OWN military industrial complex, right?

They're in business to sell nuclear reactors and Armata tanks and migs. Well you can't do all that, and just be a pacifist Canada, now can you?

some of this money will go toward buying the ridiculously expensive F35
check the share price of Raytheon, Lockeed Martin ,Northrop Grumman and Boeing , it is quite rosy !


Why do you say it's expensive? It only cost a trillion dollars. :lol:

(the original idea was for it to be CHEAPER by having one jet that can do multiple roles; they're so far into that thing now, there's no going back.. it is kind of cool, it can even hover midair and fly *sideways*, perfectly level)

Of course the Russians are not amused to be brought on the very edge of mass slaughter for some CEO getting his bonus


Again, Putin has Russia on a military industrial complex track too. Again, Putin is in business to sell Armata tanks.

BUT ANYHOW -- something to give Russia some credit for..

* Look how the rift between Moscow and Ankara played out. I don't know all the details, but I read that they've mended fences now. So that's GOOD. That shows RESTRAINT and on Russia's part.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Sixstrings » Mon 04 Jul 2016, 23:45:58

AgentR11 wrote:Taking the word of someone that desperately wants to engage in a war of vengeance against Russia, for Russia's unwillingness to fire back has to be the most inane, foolish thing you've suggested here.


Who are you talking about, the former president of Poland? Or John Kerry? The latter is the one that said "that qualified for shoot-down, under the rules."

Agent -- the Russians do in fact have to stop buzzing our Navy ships, and they should stop sending frigates into our aircraft carrier battlegroups.

But otherwise -- NO, there's no reason to look for confrontation if maybe the kremlin is offering some positive things like a transponders agreement for the Baltics. And as I posted above, I like how they mended fences with Turkey and how they handled that overall.

So I give them credit, those are good signs. And maybe Putin fired all those Baltics commanders, because they're cowboys. Generalized "dereliction of duty" doesn't sound likely to me.

So these are all good signs, and Russia deserves credit for it. They just have to stop buzzing our ships too.

If we fire on a Russian plane. (in bait mode)
They will fire back.
Guaranteed.


It's not about bait. Those fighters were buzzing SO CLOSE, did you not see the pictures? It's like somebody bumping into you, daring you to push them or hit them, but they keep following you around everywhere, bumping you.

You friggin cowboys that think you can just shoot at anyone that annoys you, make me ill.


NO AGENT, your criticism is of John Kerry. You're calling it "cowboy" but even weak John Kerry is just speaking up for a very basic Navy policy here, that you can't let frenemy forces just buzz your ships and cowboy fly all around them. And random frigates coming up into the carrier group, making their way for the capital ship. What's that about?

If the Russians want to sail with us so bad, then they should DROP the enemy part of "frenemy" and just join us and the Navy would LOVE to sail with them.

Reality is... our commanders are not idiots. Our commanders will not fire on a jet that is being annoying.


It's not just "annoying," it's dangerous. One of those jets could literally just accidentally crash into one of our ships, they buzz so close by.

Moreover, it seems like the Russian forces are trying a little bit of what China does with minor powers.. just harass and shove their navy boats around.

Well that ain't gonna fly with us. It's like John Kerry said, "the United States will not be intimidated on the high seas."

I refer you to my USS Constitution post, in the other thread:

Image

The US Navy is gonna sail WHEREVER it wants to, in international and allied waters, as it always has done, no matter who doesn't like it.. from the British Empire, to the French Empire, to the Barbary pirates to the Nazis and Japanese Empire and then USSR, to China and Russia nowadays, and whoever comes along next.

Image
Image
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby AgentR11 » Tue 05 Jul 2016, 00:20:44

Sixstrings wrote:
Reality is... our commanders are not idiots. Our commanders will not fire on a jet that is being annoying.


It's not just "annoying," it's dangerous. One of those jets could literally just accidentally crash into one of our ships, they buzz so close by.


If you fire on that Jet.
Russian forces will return fire.
The return fire does not originate with the jet.
It originates from shore, with far more volume that any of our ships can repel via close in weapons.

Our commanders know this fact.
They will not fire.
The Russians WILL continue to be annoying and dangerous.
The media will continue to indulge in ridiculous hyperbole in order to sell soap.

Russia's tactical defense doctrine is to challenge and force the opponent to reveal intent via a fire / no-fire decision.

The POINT of the jet's pass is to get the US Navy vessel to choose to fire or not fire.
In the Baltic Sea, there is no point in forcing that decision if return fire will not follow.

This is not a defense of the Russian practice, which I think is needlessly reckless; it is a defense of the competence of our commanders.

Only an INCOMPETENT MORON would fire on that jet.

Stop accusing our commanders of being one step from becoming incompetent morons.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Sixstrings » Tue 05 Jul 2016, 01:18:26

AgentR11 wrote:If you fire on that Jet.
Russian forces will return fire.

The return fire does not originate with the jet.
It originates from shore, with far more volume that any of our ships can repel via close in weapons.


Well Agent, I really don't think that's ever going to happen anyway. I don't think US-Russian relations have broken down to that point, where there's not some good communication if the US side is serious business about something, and vice versa on their side as well.

But anyhow -- NO nation is gonna be allowed to buzz US ships, and sail up into the battlegroups, it doesn't matter if that is China or Iran or Russia or whomever.

For one thing -- if they let Russia continue this and it got worse, then that's just setting a dangerous precedent and OTHER nations will do the same, including China. And Iran. It can't get established that it's so easy to shut down US Navy operations, just by buzzing and cruising frigates in and out and maybe water cannons like China did to Vietnam, etc. etc.

So this is about more than just Russia.

Russia's tactical defense doctrine is to challenge and force the opponent to reveal intent via a fire / no-fire decision.

The POINT of the jet's pass is to get the US Navy vessel to choose to fire or not fire.
In the Baltic Sea, there is no point in forcing that decision if return fire will not follow.


Well whatever, if it keeps up then that's shutting down Navy operations and that's like dealing with protesters and sit-ins and such.. it can be tolerated to a point but eventually business has to get back to usual.

AGAIN -- the United States NEVER does this same kind of thing to Russia. Never, never, never.

The *US* is the one that defends and upholds the principle of free navigation for all, worldwide. Everybody. US Navy is just the cop on the beat, keeping the sea lanes open for EVERYONE.

Agent -- at various times, Russia has parked a spy ship RIGHT OFF the coast of Jacksonville. Spying on the boomer subs. It was in international waters. Did the Navy bother them? No. The US Navy / Pentagon is very by the book and professional, and they just said it's international waters and Russia has that right.

USA expects the SAME right afforded, in international waters.

Stop accusing our commanders of being one step from becoming incompetent morons.


They're not. They're calm, highly educated, and the most professional in the world.

ANYHOW -- I want to be clear, this is not another "OMG we're on the brink of WWIII" thread.

Things are fine, again consider:

* US is working with Russia, in Syria
* Kremlin just fired all their top admirals and commanders in the Baltics, and the Russian defense minister is talking about the need for safety measures. He's saying things that make sense, like a transponders agreement.
* Russia worked things out with Turkey.


Those are all good signs. I'm no Russophobe, if something is not a boogeyman then it's not, I'm objective.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby AgentR11 » Tue 05 Jul 2016, 01:22:25

If you fire on the jet, the Russian forces will return fire.

That is the point of the jet being in the air.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Sixstrings » Tue 05 Jul 2016, 01:38:36

NATO-Russia Council To Meet on July 13

July 2, 2016 (EIRNS)—The NATO-Russia Council will meet on July 13, a few days after the NATO summit concludes, to discuss air safety issues over the Baltic Sea, and possibly other topics.

"Currently, the issue of aviation safety over the Baltic Sea is on the agenda of the Russia-NATO Council at the level of Permanent Representatives, which is scheduled for July 13, 2016," the Russian Defense Ministry said in a statement.

Reuters reports that Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu also said that Russia is starting work on a set of measures to improve aviation safety over the Baltic Sea, including a measure that would require Russian military aircraft to fly with transponders turned on. This follows Putin’s meeting with Finnish President Sauli Niinisto, at Niinisto’s summer residence in southern Finland
http://www.larouchepub.com/pr/2016/160702_nato_russia_council.html


Russia deploying the one aircraft carrier it has, to the Med:

Putin Deploys Russian Aircraft Carrier To Syria In Retaliation To US Naval Build Up In Mediterreanean

One month ago, in a move which US military officials admitted was aimed squarely at "sending a clear message to Russia", the US deployed not one but two aircraft carriers to the Mediterranean: the USS Truman and USS Eisenhower. As we reported at the time, a military official in Washington said the Truman’s shift was a signal to Moscow and a demonstration of the Navy’s operational flexibility and reach. “It provides some needed presence in the Med to check…the Russians,” the official said. “The unpredictability of what we did with Truman kind of makes them think twice.”

The Truman would not be alone: the USS Dwight D. Eisenhower aircraft carrier strike group will allegedly support “US national security interests in Europe.”

“The USS Dwight D. Eisenhower Carrier Strike Group (IKE CSG) entered the US 6th Fleet area of operations [...] in support of US national security interests in Europe,” the US European Command (EUCOM) has announced.

Naturally, in addition to sending Russia a message, the official reason was to further punish the perpetual scapegoat for all military activity in the region, the Islamic State: "Washington claims that the increased military presence is aimed at fighting Islamic State and balancing Russian extensive military efforts. “The presence of two carrier strike groups in the Mediterranean Sea demonstrates our commitment to safety and security in the region,” the statement read. “These forces further serve to support European allies and partners, deter potential threats and are capable of conducting operations in support of the counter-ISIL [Daesh] mission.”

As the WSJ notes, Rear Adm. Bret Batchelder, the highest-ranking officer on the carrier, told visiting reporters this week that moving the “capital ship” of the U.S. Navy from the Gulf through the Suez Canal is a flexing of muscle meant to reassure North Atlantic Treaty Organization allies of the American commitment to maintaining the balance of naval power in the Mediterranean.

“It is a demonstration of capability. That’s for sure,” he said. “There are undoubtedly folks who are watching that and this is just a graphic representation of what we’re capable of.” ...

Once again this assessment proved correct, and as Tass reports, citing a military-diplomatic source in Moscow, Russia will respond to the US double aircraft carrier escalation, by deploying its own aircraft carrier, the Admiral Kuznetsov, to Syria where its unofficial role will be as a counterpoint to US naval presence in the eastern Mediterranean. The official justification for the deployment is the same as that of the US: to crush the Islamic State of course, to wit: "the Admiral Kuznetsov carrier will participate in delivering strikes against militants in Syria from an eastern part of the Mediterranean Sea in October 2016 - January 2017, a military-diplomatic source in Moscow told TASS on Saturday."

A military and diplomatic source told TASS earlier that the aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov would arrive in the eastern part of the Mediterranean Sea in autumn. The ship is currently undergoing shipbuilders’ trials in the Barents Sea after repairs.

Image
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-10-14/russia-sends-aircraft-carrier-syria-marking-ships-sixth-deployment-history


If I understand correctly, the Kuznetsov is an old soviet design and the USSR only built one.. it was designed as more of a aircraft carrying CRUISER.

AgentR11 wrote:If you fire on the jet, the Russian forces will return fire.

That is the point of the jet being in the air.


Well Agent, if it ever gets that bad that the President and Pentagon and Navy greenlight that has to be done, then I have confidence in the Pentagon and President Obama.

I guess we all have different opinions, but in my opinion the US military and the white house doesn't do ANYTHING like that, except by utter last resort.

The Russian government should take John Kerry's protest seriously. Nobody has anything against Russia, darn Finland doesn't want to "invade Russia," and I'm sorry but Russia won't push us out of the Med or middle east either -- it's the USA that has almost the entire ME allied to it, except for Iran. Of course the Navy needs to be there.

It is an odd situation overall, Russian and Western forces both doing a buildup around Syria, and sort of working together most of the time, yet they're also on opposing sides of geopolitical blocs in the ME. With Russia on Iran, and Syria's side.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Subjectivist » Tue 05 Jul 2016, 07:01:38

Six you have no clue how quickly a battle group with thousands of lives and tens of billions of dollars worth of equipment would be erased in a shooting natch. Your ignorance of real world military capabilities is embarrassing.
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Re: Russian ship too close to US War vessel

Unread postby Cog » Tue 05 Jul 2016, 07:43:59

The Russian navy has proved more hazardous to their own seamen then has the US navy. It should probably be sunk as a hazard to navigation.
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