Page 4 of 5

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Sun 15 Apr 2018, 22:14:19
by careinke
pstarr wrote:Watson finally beat a Grand Master at chess in 1997. And Jeopardy (it original mandate) in 2011. This of course is no big deal. Nothing since.



So what about the game of "Go." I'd probably classify that a something since.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 00:37:38
by pstarr
careinke wrote:
pstarr wrote:Watson finally beat a Grand Master at chess in 1997. And Jeopardy (it original mandate) in 2011. This of course is no big deal. Nothing since.



So what about the game of "Go." I'd probably classify that a something since.

If you knew what a recursive hierarchical tree search was, then you wouldn't ask the question. Because it is meaningless.

"Go: requires the same technology as chess . . . try every permutation of every move at very very high speed. Easy to program I assume, though I have never tried.

As for the Jeopardy win? Sounds like a high-speed internet search. Also no big deal program-wise

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 05:38:31
by Newfie
STARVING LION

Your signature line is inappropriate and contrary to board rules. Please change it.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 09:22:36
by asg70
PStarr, as usual, spouting off about topics in which he's not an authority.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 09:25:03
by asg70
onlooker wrote:
Well, how did animals evolve consciousness?

Well ordinarily, I would defer to you on this subject K, since you are the expert.


Given your linking history, shouldn't you be answering that question with this?

Image

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 12:57:03
by kublikhan
Pstarr your information on AI is incorrect. AI is not confined to recursive hierarchical tree search. You also continue to show binary thinking on this matter: "If AI doesn't directly improve my little sphere of the universe, there has been no progress for decades." Ignoring all of the significant progress AI has made in recent decades.

Deep learning is part of a broader family of machine learning methods based on learning data representations, as opposed to task-specific algorithms. Learning can be supervised, semi-supervised or unsupervised.

Deep learning models are loosely related to information processing and communication patterns in a biological nervous system, such as neural coding that attempts to define a relationship between various stimuli and associated neuronal responses in the brain.

Deep learning architectures such as deep neural networks, deep belief networks and recurrent neural networks have been applied to fields including computer vision, speech recognition, natural language processing, audio recognition, social network filtering, machine translation, bioinformatics and drug design, where they have produced results comparable to and in some cases superior to human experts.

Applications
Drug discovery and toxicology
A large percentage of candidate drugs fail to win regulatory approval. These failures are caused by insufficient efficacy (on-target effect), undesired interactions (off-target effects), or unanticipated toxic effects. Research has explored use of deep learning to predict biomolecular target, off-target and toxic effects of environmental chemicals in nutrients, household products and drugs. AtomNet is a deep learning system for structure-based rational drug design. AtomNet was used to predict novel candidate biomolecules for disease targets such as the Ebola virus and multiple sclerosis.

Bioinformatics
An autoencoder ANN was used in bioinformatics, to predict gene ontology annotations and gene-function relationships. In medical informatics, deep learning was used to predict sleep quality based on data from wearables and predictions of health complications from electronic health record data. Deep learning has also showed efficacy in healthcare.

Reliability of infrastructure systems
Natural disasters can have catastrophic impacts on the functionality of infrastructure systems and cause severe physical and socio-economic losses. Given budget constraints, it is crucial to optimize decisions regarding mitigation, preparedness, response, and recovery practices for these systems. This requires accurate and efficient means to evaluate the infrastructure system reliability. Deep neural networks have been used for accurate, efficient, and accelerated infrastructure system reliability analysis.

Automatic speech recognition
Large-scale automatic speech recognition is the first and most convincing successful case of deep learning.

Image recognition
Deep learning-based image recognition has become "superhuman", producing more accurate results than human contestants. This first occurred in 2011. Deep learning-trained vehicles now interpret 360° camera views. Another example is Facial Dysmorphology Novel Analysis (FDNA) used to analyze cases of human malformation connected to a large database of genetic syndromes.

Natural language processing
Neural networks have been used for implementing language models since the early 2000s. LSTM helped to improve machine translation and language modeling. Google Translate uses a large end-to-end long short-term memory network. GNMT uses an example-based machine translation method in which the system "learns from millions of examples." It translates "whole sentences at a time, rather than pieces. Google Translate supports over one hundred languages. The network encodes the "semantics of the sentence rather than simply memorizing phrase-to-phrase translations"

Image restoration
Deep learning has been successfully applied to inverse problems such as denoising, super-resolution, and inpainting. These applications include learning methods such "Shrinkage Fields for Effective Image Restoration" which trains on an image dataset, and Deep Image Prior, which trains on the image that needs restoration.
Deep learning

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 14:08:55
by pstarr
kublikhan wrote:Pstarr your information on AI is incorrect. AI is not confined to recursive hierarchical tree search. You also continue to show binary thinking on this matter: "If AI doesn't directly improve my little sphere of the universe, there has been no progress for decades." Ignoring all of the significant progress AI has made in recent decades.
No. Not really.

Hierarchical representation whereby multiple levels of mapping are employed so as to eventually find high-level features. This is the concept of deep learning (DL). Given that there are n such mapping functions we can arrange them such that the first function feeds into the next one and so on up to the last function. These functions then develop different levels of abstraction depending on how far up the hierarchy they are.

Ultimately what makes ML different is the speed and abundance of fast processors. They can try any and all solutions-paths on the tree, and then find the average least stupid solution. ML algorithms are glorified curve fitting algorithms with some modern twists

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 15:14:47
by kublikhan
pstarr wrote:Ultimately what makes ML different is the speed and abundance of fast processors. They can try any and all solutions-paths on the tree, and then find the average least stupid solution. ML algorithms are glorified curve fitting algorithms with some modern twists
It's not just about faster and more processors. It's also about an abundance of digital data used to teach the machines instead of having everything hardcoded.

As technology, and, importantly, our understanding of how our minds work, has progressed, our concept of what constitutes AI has changed. Rather than increasingly complex calculations, work in the field of AI concentrated on mimicking human decision making processes and carrying out tasks in ever more human ways.

Two important breakthroughs led to the emergence of Machine Learning as the vehicle which is driving AI development forward with the speed it currently has.

One of these was the realization – credited to Arthur Samuel in 1959 – that rather than teaching computers everything they need to know about the world and how to carry out tasks, it might be possible to teach them to learn for themselves.

The second, more recently, was the emergence of the internet, and the huge increase in the amount of digital information being generated, stored, and made available for analysis.

Once these innovations were in place, engineers realized that rather than teaching computers and machines how to do everything, it would be far more efficient to code them to think like human beings, and then plug them into the internet to give them access to all of the information in the world.

Much of the exciting progress that we have seen in recent years is thanks to the fundamental changes in how we envisage AI working, which have been brought about by ML.
What Is The Difference Between Artificial Intelligence And Machine Learning?

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 15:28:46
by onlooker
Umm, then it seems the Terminator and such is not so far fetched. If computers can learn and adopt, then theoretically they will be able to do almost anything humans can. They are already employing some of the human senses.

So, I guess what can circumvent the parameters or range of their actions is their "prime directives" ie Thou shall not kill humans. Is this accurate?

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 15:42:34
by kublikhan
Don't get too excited onlooker. Most AI's are application specific, not general AIs. IE, they learn to do their particular task very well. However they lack common sense. The kind of skynet AI you are envisioning is still a long way off, if ever.

Most of today’s AI is designed to solve specific problems. Today’s artificial intelligence is certainly formidable. But if AI does steal your job, it won’t be because scientists have built a brain better than yours. At least, not across the board. Most of the advances in artificial intelligence have been focused on solving particular kinds of problems. This narrow artificial intelligence is great at specific tasks like recommending songs on Pandora or analyzing how safe your driving habits are. However, the kind of general artificial intelligence that would simulate a person is a long ways off.

“At the very beginning of AI there was a lot of discussion about more general approaches to AI, with aspirations to create systems…that would work on many different problems,” says John Laird, a computer scientist at the University of Michigan. “Over the last 50 years the evolution has been towards specialization.”
There are two kinds of AI, and the difference is important

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 15:45:26
by onlooker
Nice to hear. The perceived excitement is more like trepidation haha. Thanks for the primer Kub.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2018, 16:15:41
by Newfie
Kiblikan,
I don’t know that AI is or is not a long way off. I used to discredit to as a threat until recently. My Wife came across an article regarding AI and self learning programs. In the test base the program moved along at a certain learning speed and was fairly predictable. However, when the team added some functionality such as manipulators, a feature they expected to not alter the learning pattern, they discovered the AI units were learning faster and in new ways. Somehow, it appears, an unexpected feedback loop was created that changed the learning in unexpected ways.

That made me rethink that perhaps there is something of interest going on.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Tue 17 Apr 2018, 11:22:13
by dohboi
We're getting rather off topic, but since others, including mods, are taking part, I might was well pitch in too with my tuppence.

A friend of mine pointed out...how would we know if the 'singularity' has already past?

Would the whole global economic system re-gear itself to primarily support machines over people and the living planet?

But how would that be different than the modern industrial society we have now?

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Tue 17 Apr 2018, 15:24:44
by Yonnipun
dohboi wrote:We're getting rather off topic, but since others, including mods, are taking part, I might was well pitch in too with my tuppence.

A friend of mine pointed out...how would we know if the 'singularity' has already past?

Would the whole global economic system re-gear itself to primarily support machines over people and the living planet?

But how would that be different than the modern industrial society we have now?


At some point AI needs fusion.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Tue 17 Apr 2018, 16:18:43
by KaiserJeep
Look folks, I spent an entire career advancing the state of computing. I started in an industry that had mainframe computers with ferrite core memories and magnetic tapes, punched card readers, and massive spinning magnetic drum memories. I rode it all the way to today's world of humans hybridized with personal mobile devices.

This "singularity" is not happening. Machines are not replacing humans. Nor will there be a Terminator-style apocalyptic war. The one condition which exceeds either the capacity of humans alone or machines alone is when both are together, and their complementary skills and capabilities benefit both.

From now on, what benefits computers is more humans, and what benefits humans is more computers. Every other scenario that can be conceived is simply worse than that.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Tue 17 Apr 2018, 21:11:54
by dohboi
"Machines are not replacing humans"

Maybe not universally, but machines have, of course, been 'replacing human' labor for quite some time now, and few occupations today are immune from being 'outsourced' to ever more clever computers, robots, self-driving cars and trucks...

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Tue 24 Apr 2018, 18:43:23
by KaiserJeep
Yes, machines have been replacing, eliminating, and reducing human labor since the wooden machinery of the Middle Ages. That's the whole purpose of machines, to free humans from labor. The result long term has always been a brief period of readjustment and redeployment of the labor force, then an overall quality of life improvement for the larger society which can now purchase the goods or services cheaper.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Tue 24 Apr 2018, 22:32:32
by dohboi
Not quite. The purpose of machines it to make the most money/power for those in control of them. Those in power don't give a rat's tuccus for what happens to those displaced.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Wed 25 Apr 2018, 01:36:58
by KaiserJeep
Niether should you. The purpose of automation is to make goods and services cheaper to all. That way, more people can buy more stuff.

The person who hangs around a dead town with no jobs is a loser.

The person who does not get retrained for another job is a loser.

The person who insists that what he wants to do is a job that no longer exists is a loser.

Here's a clue: They call it work for a reason. They are going to pay you to do something they need done. It might not be what you want to do, or where you want to do it, or in the company of people you want to associate with. You are pretty lucky if you have any of those things.

You take the money and do the job, or quit and please yourself. It's not slavery, you have a choice.

Technological change continues, and always will. Be flexible and willing to learn, or live on the dole, or become homeless, those are the choices.

Re: It's time to choke off the supply of fossil-death-fuels

Unread postPosted: Wed 25 Apr 2018, 06:37:28
by Ibon
KaiserJeep wrote:
Be flexible and willing to learn, or live on the dole, or become homeless, those are the choices.


You lived by these choices KJ and you found peace being an employee to a corporation with all the compromises this entails as you mentioned in your post. You left out though the most important choice and option of all.

One that Baha chose to do.