[DesuMaiden]

...it is the underlying basis of cheap energy coming from coal, natural gas and oil that runs the world. All economic activities are dependent on natural resources and energy (I.e uranium, wood, water, food, oil, coal, and top soil). The economy is never run by money. Economic collapses never happen when money is the issue. Economic collapses always happen when resources and energy become an issue.

The bottom line is natural resources and energy are the only things that really matter to the economy...not money. The bottom line is natural resources and energy run the economy and not money. Money is just a medium for the exchange of natural resources and energy. Nothing more. Without natural resources and energy, money is worthless because money's inherit value is based on natural resources and energy.

[vtsnowedin]

Who said it did?

[DesuMaiden]

Who said it did?

A lot of people apparently think that money runs the world.

[vtsnowedin]

Who said it did?

A lot of people apparently think that money runs the world.

"God must love fools. He made so many of them"!
Your correct that it is productivity and military might that runs the world. Money is just how the bean counters keep tabs on who is winning and losing.

[DesuMaiden]

Who said it did?

A lot of people apparently think that money runs the world.

"God must love fools. He made so many of them"!
Your correct that it is productivity and military might that runs the world. Money is just how the bean counters keep tabs on who is winning and losing.

That is correct.

[GregT]

"Money doesn't run the world..."

Correct. The people that print the money out of thin air, run the world. They have done so for centuries.

[DesuMaiden]

"Money doesn't run the world..."

Correct. The people that print the money out of thin air, run the world. They have done so for centuries.

The people, who run the monetary system, always wanted to mystify money, and make you think only an expert in the priesthood of money can possibly understand the mombo jumbo of the monetary system.

There are really only three things you need to know about money.

1) fiat currency
2) fractional reserve banking
3) compound interest

[SeaGypsy]

Economists are among the most mystified people in the world. They are the people who have the job of convincing everyone that economic growth is mandatory. Like most people with a job selling something, they have to believe in their product.

[DesuMaiden]

Economists are among the most mystified people in the world. They are the people who have the job of convincing everyone that economic growth is mandatory. Like most people with a job selling something, they have to believe in their product.

You got to be a madman to believe that infinite growth is possible on a finite planet. It simply isn't possible to have infinite growth on a finite planet.

[SeaGypsy]

Yep. Every sensible human being on the planet knows that. Try finding an economist who does. Try finding a mainstream or government economist who does. First challenge, difficult. Second challenge, impossible.

[GregT]

"You got to be a madman to believe that infinite growth is possible on a finite planet."

Or a genius that makes everyone else believe so, while you capitalize on every dollar they make, borrow, or spend.

[SeaGypsy]

LMFAO!

[DesuMaiden]

"You got to be a madman to believe that infinite growth is possible on a finite planet."

Or a genius that makes everyone else believe so, while you capitalize on every dollar they make, borrow, or spend.

Anyone, who believes infinite growth is possible on a finite planet, is just plain stupid. It is really that simple.

[SILENTTODD]

May not run it, but it makes it go round. Ask these guys .

http://youtu.be/rkRIbUT6u7Q

[SeaGypsy]

I think you missed the point Desu. Think of the metaphor of a used car salesman. S/he may believe the clunker they are selling you, the one you have wanted since you were a kid, is a beauty; or a total piece of junk. However what the salesman believes doesn't matter, their job is to sell you the car. Your eyes tell the story of which clunker you like, the salesman reads your desire to hear good things about the car, tells you what you want to hear, minimises the warranty, away you drive in your brand new second hand piece of junk.

[ralfy]

Economists are among the most mystified people in the world. They are the people who have the job of convincing everyone that economic growth is mandatory. Like most people with a job selling something, they have to believe in their product.

If most sales people aren't economists, then the implication is that there is no need to convince everyone that growth is needed. Rather, almost everyone believes in that for one reason or another, and it's usually to maintain and increase income in order to buy both necessities and wants, and to maintain and increase income by making sure that others spend.

Given that, there is likely no mystery involved in this issue. Governments want more economic activity (which is what growth involves) because it means more tax revenues. Businesses want the same because it means more profits, investors more returns, households more income, etc.

[ralfy]

Yep. Every sensible human being on the planet knows that. Try finding an economist who does. Try finding a mainstream or government economist who does. First challenge, difficult. Second challenge, impossible.

Not just economists but also various government officials, businessmen, employees, and generally anyone who earns money. That's because money is a means to draw on future production of goods and services made possible through increased extraction of resources and use of energy.

[ralfy]

I think you missed the point Desu. Think of the metaphor of a used car salesman. S/he may believe the clunker they are selling you, the one you have wanted since you were a kid, is a beauty; or a total piece of junk. However what the salesman believes doesn't matter, their job is to sell you the car. Your eyes tell the story of which clunker you like, the salesman reads your desire to hear good things about the car, tells you what you want to hear, minimises the warranty, away you drive in your brand new second hand piece of junk.

Not just used cars but even new cars, and especially new cars. And not just car salesmen but all citizens who are dependent on the economy for wages, profits, and returns on investment.

[DesuMaiden]

So let me rephrase the question...what is more important...the money supply in the bank or the oil supply in the ground? I think everyone will arrive at the conclusion that the oil supply in the ground is more important because oil is the edifice upon which our modern economy was built on. Money is just an exchange medium for goods, but without any goods to exchange, money has no inheritant value...money is worthless. Oil has inheritant value because it is used to manufacture countless products and used to transport all of our goods.

Oil was used to build modern civilization. Money's worth is essentially imaginary. It has no real worth.

[SeaGypsy]

Oil in the ground.... Mmm... You do realise the difference? A hundred years ago there were lots of places you could pick it up from a spring with a bucket. These days, miles underwater, miles under the sea floor. Production costs anywhere from $10 to upwards of $100 a barrel. It's not worth anything until it's extracted. It's not worth extracting if you can't get what it cost to get it out at market. So money is very important in relationship to oil. No money, no oil.