[DesuMaiden]

Please tell me. I live in Kitchener, Ontario. I am moving to Hamilton, Ontario next spring. Are those bad places to be when we run out of oil?

[Ibon]

Desu, physical place is less important than the place in your head. Ontario is alright. Canada has low population, has great resources, fresh water, southern ontario grows lots of tomatoes and food and has good soils. The two places most important is the place in your head and the place in your community. Geographical location is secondary.

You are now in the early panic stage of understanding peak oil. Chill out, things aren't going down overnight. You have lots of time to focus on learning life skills that will make you self reliant. Focus on that and just let peak oil hum in the back ground at low intensity, always know its there but do not obsess, otherwise it will mess up your head.

[JuanP]

Canada is one of the best places in the world to be after collapse, particularly far away from major population centers.
I just posted the following on the news section and it is about a possible answer to your question. I nominate Singapore as worst place to be post fossil fuels.
In a post peak collapsing world with no energy imports available, what percentage of Singapore’s population would survive?
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore
Singapore is the second most overpopulated country on earth. With 5.47 million people in 277 square miles. That is 19,750 people per square mile.
Macau(China) and Monaco are the two most densely populated places in the world, Singapore is third, but the only one of these with millions of people and an island archipelago geography that makes for difficult evacuation in a post collapse catastrophe scenario with only two coonections to the Malaysian mainland.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ ... Main_table
Singapore may just be the worst place in the world to face what’s coming.
If you live there, get out while you can!

[Guthrum]

Good Places: anywhere on a watercourse with some south facing, arable garden land will be just fine - but put your house higher than 25 ms. above the mean water line; Gulf Islands in BC.; Thousand Islands in Gananoque; Niagara peninsula; Fraser river valley in BC.
Bad Places: a suburb house miles from where you work or where you shop for food. An apartment tower downtown no where near a grocery store; northern Ontario; northern Quebec, basically any of Canada's northlands (unless you revel in seal meat and whale blubber).
But Ibon is right - peak oil is a process, not an event. And, like all other historical processes, it will play out slowly. The "fall" of Rome took two centuries. The "discovery" of the Americas took three to four centuries. "Modern medicine" took two centuries. Don't get suckered into the Hollywood "apocalypse" view, or the modern desire for "instant" knowledge and instant results. But be aware of the ever growing, ever heightening, ever tightening risk and make your moves over time to ensure you're safer than most other people. No one will ever guess or estimate Peak Oil's impact right, except in the very broadest strokes - so be slow, be smart and be deliberate. To repeat: it's a process, not an event. So pay attention to what's occurring, be thoughtful, listen much more than you speak, and use your knowledge and your time wisely to be as independent as you possibly can of petroleum.

[Longtimber]

Lots to think about.... perhaps a start
http://www.amazon.com/Strategic-Relocat ... d_cp_mov_0

[Newfie]

Statistic Relocation is OK, but focuses on nuclear attack stuff.

Still it is a start and provides a method for analysis.

But I doubt there will be ONE really good or really bad place, with some obvious exceptions such as Mumbai.

The city may be a good place early on, but as things set in then a move to a rural area might be better.

[Shaved Monkey]

Ive been to Mumbai and into the slums,their expectations and oil use are so low they might not even notice a change.
I would more worried about first world people with higher expectations, less survival skills and easy access to weapons.
Avoid food importing nations,Singapore, Middle east.

[MD]

Please tell me. I live in Kitchener, Ontario. I am moving to Hamilton, Ontario next spring. Are those bad places to be when we run out of oil?

We aren't going to run out of oil, and Hamilton sits on top of the greatest freshwater resource left on the planet.

So no, you aren't in a bad place at all.

[careinke]

I would avoid the Pacific Northwest. Volcanoes, earthquakes, Tsunamis, forest fires, and too many cloudy days. In addition, the population is growing too fast and being populated by people who think it's the governments job to be their mother.

Stay away, it's awful here.

[basil_hayden]

Mom's basement.

[MikeB]

Stay where you are. We aren't going to run out of oil.

[dolanbaker]

Stay where you are. We aren't going to run out of oil.

Exactly!
It'll get more expensive relative to income, fewer will be able to afford to heat large houses using oil boilers and will move to more fuel efficient cars while reducing unnecessary journeys.
The transition to a low oil use economy started in the mid 1970s (was temporarily paused in the 1990) has since restarted and is gaining momentum.

As to the original question, I would say an isolated rural community with high unemployment and poor quality land that is dependent on deliveries from a small time company who will charge the full price for delivering the goods. In other words if the community can't pay the delivery charge, the goods won't get delivered.

Such a community will simply become a ghost town!

[Lore]

Your delusional if you think an oil transition to alternatives has or will take place.

[Shaved Monkey]

As to the original question, I would say an isolated rural community with high unemployment and poor quality land that is dependent on deliveries from a small time company who will charge the full price for delivering the goods. In other words if the community can't pay the delivery charge, the goods won't get delivered.

Such a community will simply become a ghost town!

That describes my town and yet I think it is a great place to be.
A ghost town in paradise sounds even better.
Currently tourism is the major employer and thats limited by its isolation.
Tourism dies the town gets quieter, we get more fish,crabs and prawns ,the shops and businesses have to cater to locals or die and get re-purposed at a cheaper rate.
Business men obsessed with constant growth and their profits leave, people interested in a relaxed lifestyle stay.
No reason for zombies to be here.
Surrounded by beef stations, dairy farms and down the road from massive market gardens,orchards and lots of wild game and plenty of ocean and rivers.

[Keith_McClary]

Stay where you are. We aren't going to run out of oil.

Exactly!

How about an oil producing region - they may still be relatively prosperous when oil is scarce and expensive.

[GregT]

How about an oil producing region - they may still be relatively prosperous when oil is scarce and expensive.

Ask the people living in the oil producing regions, how well living in those areas is working out for them. Prosperity does not immediately come to mind.

[Keith_McClary]

How about an oil producing region - they may still be relatively prosperous when oil is scarce and expensive.

Ask the people living in the oil producing regions, how well living in those areas is working out for them. Prosperity does not immediately come to mind.

I was thinking Texas, Norway, Alberta.

[GregT]

The more scarce and expensive oil becomes, the more of a target places like Texas, Norway, and Alberta will become.

Best to learn how to be self sufficient, reduce ones reliance on a finite resource, and as much as possible, to live under the radar.

[dolanbaker]

Your delusional if you think an oil transition to alternatives has or will take place.

A lot of the transition has already taken place, just think about home insulation and the better fuel economy of the current generation of vehicles.
Then just try to imagine how much extra oil we would have needed today if those transitions had not taken place.
Then think about what state we would have been in now!


Just by looking at a typical oil forecast chart and you'll see that production could halve over the next couple of decades, that still leaves 50% of oil available to consumers. Don't forget that Europeans on average use about 50% per capita of oil relative to US consumers. Europe isn't an oil starved wasteland!

The only areas that will suffer are those that require above average use of oil to function.

[Pops]

Pretty interesting comments, sounds like something on a motorhead forum, 'quit whining you tree hugging pansy, oil ain't gonna run out.' Two things you can be sure of tho; there are no atheists in a foxhole and there are no "undecideds" on a message board, LOL

But it is interesting how the opinions have changed. Pull up any snapshot from '07 and the question; "where?" - is right at the top of the list. At that time overnight PO armageddon was all the rage, so what is different now? Has the meme turned to Grandkids Boiling In Their Skin Armageddon? Or is it Ebola Armageddon that's getting all the press? Or is it the opinion of the board that the markets have found perfect price discovery and manufactured "Liquids" will replace pressurized reservoirs tapped by errant musket balls?

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Let me clue you all in, oil is always running out.

If it didn't I'd have been raised on a Oklahoma "Southfork" paid for by the eternal royalty checks from the oil my folks found on the homestead back in the 19-teens. But alas I can assure you I'm no JR and oil does indeed run out.

But the bigger question isn't answered by tossing out a production number, my personal economy isn't dependent on whether there is 33 billion barrels extracted this year or 32, any more than another Trump bankruptcy depends on a particular property making $101 million per year or $99 - all that matters is what is the breakeven point; if it is $100 million then the difference is everything. All that really matter is the breakeven point of your particular economy - and I'm not talking about the cost of fuel or MPG, it doesn't matter if you can walk to work if the er is no work.

The only real question then is not when will oil run out but when will my ability to pay run out? Not when will the global economy crash, but when will mine?

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As well, if you think we are somehow well on the way to transitioning away from FFs you's been reading too many of Greame's press releases:



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So after that bit of pontification, I'd answer the question by saying the best place to live when oil eliminates your ability to pay is somewhere you can get by without the ability to pay.
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